139. Two Towering Redwoods in the Research of How We Learn: John Hattie and Tony Frontier

Back in June of last year, listeners, my daughter, Emma got married in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada Mountains in California. The day after her wedding my wife and I got coffee and breakfast at a Nevada City coffee joint. While I was in the restroom Cheryl spotted a guy wearing a floppy hat reading and writing at one of the shop’s tables. The book he had open was John Hattie’s Visible Learning. She rushed to get me as I emerged from the restroom and excitedly shared what she had spotted. We sashayed over to the guy and struck up a conversation about his reading of Hattie. As it turned out, the gods were watching over me that morning because the gentleman, Tony Frontier, was and is a colleague of John Hattie. Tony and I traded contacts and later, at my request, asked Mr. Hattie if he would be on my show. Long story short, John Hattie and Tony Frontier are my first guests of the 2025 season. I could not be more stoked, honored, pleased and privileged.

Professor John Hattie is a researcher in education. His research interests include performance indicators, models of measurement and evaluation of teaching and learning. Hattie became known to a wider public with his two books Visible Learning and Visible Learning for Teachers. Visible Learning is a synthesis of more than 800 meta-studies covering more than 80 million students. Visible Learning is the result of 15 years of research about what works best for learning in schools. He has been called “possibly the world’s most influential education academic.” 

I asked ChatGPT for a quote about John Hattie and it came with this: “John Hattie is a beacon of educational insight, illuminating what truly works in the classroom with unparalleled clarity and evidence. His groundbreaking work in Visible Learning has redefined how we understand impact, empowering educators to transform learning outcomes worldwide.” Thanks, ChatGPT, and I could not agree more. You can find more on John Hattie at the website of the Melbourne Graduate School of Education, University of Melbourne, in Australia. 

Tony Frontier is an award-winning educator who works with teachers and school leaders nationally and internationally to help them prioritize efforts to improve student learning. With expertise in student engagement, evidence-based assessment, effective instruction, teacher reflection, data analysis, and strategic planning, Frontier emphasizes a systems approach to build capacity and empower teachers to improve each student’s schooling experience. Prior to his work as a consultant, Frontier served as an associate professor of doctoral leadership studies at Cardinal Stritch University in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, where he taught courses in curriculum development, organizational learning, research methods, and statistics. As a former classroom teacher in Milwaukee Public Schools, an associate high school principal, and the director of curriculum and instruction for the Whitefish Bay School District, Frontier brings a wealth of experience to his writing and research. His latest book, AI with Intention: Principles and Action Steps for Teachers and School Leaders will be published later this year through ASCD. As a professional musician and photographer, Frontier is always listening and looking for metaphors in the arts and humanities to help participants make authentic connections to the opportunities and challenges teachers and school leaders face each day.

As always, our episodes are edited by the talented Evan Kurohara, and our theme music comes from the catalog of pianist, Michael Sloan. Please leave us a review wherever you get your podcasts!