Dr. Megan Anna Neff and Patrick Casale discuss the concept of Autistic masking, its impact on mental health, identity, and privilege. They explore the benefits and complexities of masking, as well as strategies for unmasking safely. The podcast also addresses the challenges faced in advocacy spaces, the correlation between masking and mental health issues, and the importance of building supportive autistic communities.

Neurodivergent professionals discuss the challenges of routine disruptions, sensory stimulation, and emotional regulation. They share personal experiences, provide strategies to cope with anxiety, and address the shame associated with strong reactions to routine changes. They also explore the difficulties of diminished executive functioning and the struggle of balancing commitments. Additionally, they discuss productivity variations throughout seasons and reflect on the impact of mispronouncing words on others' perception of intelligence.

In this episode, we explore demand avoidance, a common experience among neurodivergent people. We delve into the factors contributing to demand avoidance, including executive functioning challenges, sensory issues, and a desire for autonomy. Additionally, we take a closer look at Pathological Demand Avoidance (PDA), also known as Pervasive Drive for Autonomy, a complex and often misunderstood subtype of autism. Join us as we navigate this important topic, gaining a deeper understanding of demand avoidance and its impact on neurodivergent lives.Dr. Megan Anna Neff, an AuDHDer psychologist and mother of a child with PDA, describes it as "anything that comes at the person that threatens autonomy invokes an extreme fight-flight response," and says that it can be seen through a lens of "nervous system through stress response," making it different than something like oppositional defiant disorder or conduct disorder.Individuals with PDA sometimes develop sophisticated and subtle masking strategies to appear compliant and cooperative on the outside, even though they may struggle internally, which can involve imitating expected social behaviors and responses while suppressing their genuine feelings of overwhelm and resistance.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Neff speak with Tara Holmquist, PsyD, about PDA and her personal experience as an AuDHDer with PDA.If you're interested in learning more about PDA, trauma, and demand avoidance, this episode is for you.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Understand how PDA shows up in the lives of those who have it and how it both internally and externally impacts their lives. See how demand avoidance is often a coping mechanism rooted in trauma. Learn coping strategies and skills for managing demands. PDA can be a painful and overwhelming internal struggle that also manifests in ways that aren't always received well on the external side of things when the pressure of demands just becomes too much. This episode aims to shed some light on the complex world of demand avoidance and PDA to gain a deeper understanding. More about Tara Holmquist:Tara is a clinical psychologist licensed in CA and WI. She has been in private practice for about 5 years working with adults with relational/attachment trauma, as well as addiction/substance use. Her practice is exclusively telehealth, and her practice values include a heavy examination and challenge of implicit biases, internalized capitalism, and patriarchal leanings. Her practice is trauma and social justice informed. And she's a pretty cool regular human too. Tara's Facebook: facebook.com/tmhpsych Tara's Instagram: instagram.com/tmhpsychotherapy Additional Resources: Dr. Neff's blog post on "Autism PDA Explained: The Core Characteristics of Pathological Demand Avoidance" PDA MasterClass: For an in-depth clinical definition of PDA, check out Neurodivergent Insights MasterClass featuring Dr. Donna Henderson. ——————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast here🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube—————————————————————————————————— Mentioned in this episode:Hurricane Relief for WNC communitiesThis money will go to nonprofits who are boots on the ground. It will go to struggling individuals who do not have enough money for gas to get out, or who do not have enough money to provide their basic needs right now. Donate to Patrick's GoFundMe to help provide urgent aid for WNC communities affected by Hurricane Helene. Visit: atppod.com/wnc

Socializing in groups can feel exhausting and often adds an entirely different level of complexity to the sensory experience and challenges for autistic individuals.Patrick Casale, an AuDHD mental health therapist, shared his thought processes and some of the questions that run through his head when in group conversations, such as, "When do I interrupt? When do I not? When do I jump in? When do I not? When do I stay quiet? When do I avoid adding commentary?"Dr. Neff shared that she shows up differently in conversations with people one-on-one than in group settings, and gave the example that in her one-on-one conversations with Patrick during the podcast episodes, her "analytical brain is able to pretty much go offline" and she gets immersed in the conversation, but said that she can very rarely do that in groups.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, share their experiences around communication in various social settings.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Understand what tracking is and how it plays a role in social interactions and regulation for autistic individuals. Identify ways to reduce stress and overwhelm that is related to social interactions and sensory overload in group settings. Learn how to balance the personal needs of autistic individuals with the needs of other members of their inner circle who are allistic. It's important to find ways to support mental well-being through the struggles of emotional overwhelm and sensory overload that many autistic individuals face on a daily basis. Social interactions and experiences can be different for everyone, so we encourage you to make the effort to find ways to do restorative self-care and prioritize social activities that align with your values and needs.——————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast here🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube—————————————————————————————————— Mentioned in this episode:Hurricane Relief for WNC communitiesThis money will go to nonprofits who are boots on the ground. It will go to struggling individuals who do not have enough money for gas to get out, or who do not have enough money to provide their basic needs right now. Donate to Patrick's GoFundMe to help provide urgent aid for WNC communities affected by Hurricane Helene. Visit: atppod.com/wnc

Picture the immense amount of energy invested in analyzing your emotional responses to every social interaction, striving to decipher not only your own feelings but also how the other person perceived the conversation. Or imagine navigating through life with a constant undercurrent of irritability and anxiety, yet lacking a clear understanding of their origin.These experiences only represent a small fraction of what people with alexithymia may experience.Alexithymia, which in simple terms is difficulty identifying and describing emotions, is a trait that is often associated with autism and ADHD, however despite the fact that one-in-ten people in the general population have this trait (not just Autistic people), there are still many misconceptions about what it is, who it really impacts, and how it shapes their experiences and relationships.Dr. Megan Anna  Neff, an AuDHD psychologist with alexithymia, states that a lot of things that have been attributed to autism, for example, difficulty with emotion recognition on faces or voice, are actually due to alexithymia, not autism.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, talk with guest, Thomas Henley, an Autism consultant, public speaker, workplace trainer, and podcast host of “Thoughty Auti Podcast”, about all things alexithymia.3 reasons to listen to the episode: Understand what alexithymia is, how is it related to autism and ADHD, and some common attributes associated with autism that are strongly linked to alexithymia. Identify the ways that alexithymia affects emotional regulation and the ability to connect with others on a deep emotional level. Learn what strategies and therapeutic approaches individuals with alexithymia can use to help facilitate emotional regulation and deeper connections with others. Alexithymia affects many individuals in the general population, so taking the time to recognize and understand the traits, challenges, and experiences associated with alexithymia, can help facilitate deeper connections with others, self-acceptance, and healthy ways to manage overwhelming emotions and situations.Resources Alexithymia articles on neurodivergent insights Alexithymia workbook Dr. Neff’s Alexithimia Training About Thomas HenleyMy name is Thomas Henley, I’m an Autism consultant, public speaker & workplace trainer running the Worlds Top podcast ‘Thoughty Auti Podcast’, all about Autism & Mental Health - independently presented, edited & promoted by my Autistic self.I was diagnosed Autistic at 10 years old & later developed severe mental health conditions at the age of 14 due to trauma at Secondary School - Clinical Depression, GAD, Bulimia & multiple Dissociative disorders.Most of my content focuses on low quality-of-life statistics for autistic people, such as mental health, social isolation, unemployment, education, relationship difficulties & self-harm in all forms. I’ve delivered this information to the government, leaders in SEN education, & the general public through my outreach & social media work.I also studied & researched Autism, Mental Health, Sociology, Psychology, Socialising, Relationships & Philosophy. I also used to be Special Needs TA, I work alongside charities regularly, talk to researchers, Autistic influencers, authors & parents regularly on my podcast, & currently work full-time for a National Inclusion charity.Thomas’ resources: Website: thomashenley.co.uk Thoughty Auti Podcast (Spotify) Twitter: ThomasHenleyUK YouTube: Thomas Henley Instagram: thomashenleyuk TikTok: @thomashenleyuk ——————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast here🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube—————————————————————————————————— Mentioned in this episode:Hurricane Relief for WNC communitiesThis money will go to nonprofits who are boots on the ground. It will go to struggling individuals who do not have enough money for gas to get out, or who do not have enough money to provide their basic needs right now. Donate to Patrick's GoFundMe to help provide urgent aid for WNC communities affected by Hurricane Helene. Visit: atppod.com/wnc

Travel and the act of experiencing people and places is something that is generally talked about with excitement, but for Autistic people, it can be a much more complex experience.Patrick, who hosts entrepreneurial retreats for therapists all over the world and travels often for extended periods of time, shared that despite loving to travel, the experience of hosting retreats and being away from home could also feel torturous at times, like having exposed nerves that were shocked by all things sensory.When talking about travel and social interactions, Dr. Neff expressed that it "feels like the decision is to have a really small life or to lean into experiences, but to be constantly confronted with the too-muchness of the world."In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, both AuDHD mental health professionals, share their diverse experiences and feelings about travel, social interactions, and sensory overload.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Understand the challenges and experiences of neurodivergent individuals while traveling and in stimulating social spaces. Identify ways that travel can provide positive stimulation for Autistic individuals through new experiences. Learn ways to manage and do self-care and self-advocacy when feeling sensory overload during travel. Travel and social situations can be challenging for neurodivergent individuals, but through vulnerability and a commitment to self-care, it is possible to find strength and joy in the pursuit of exploring new places and experiences.——————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast here🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube—————————————————————————————————— Mentioned in this episode:Hurricane Relief for WNC communitiesThis money will go to nonprofits who are boots on the ground. It will go to struggling individuals who do not have enough money for gas to get out, or who do not have enough money to provide their basic needs right now. Donate to Patrick's GoFundMe to help provide urgent aid for WNC communities affected by Hurricane Helene. Visit: atppod.com/wnc

Being an Autistic human often pairs with a complex relationship with emotions.Just the question, "How do you feel," can feel so uncomfortable and spark anxiety, panic, and avoidance, often resulting in pre-planned responses or an answer that makes you think, "What the hell am I saying right now?"In her initial session with a new therapist, Megan Anna, an Autistic psychologist, unintentionally exposed her genuine feelings about emotions, inadvertently confessing, "I hate emotions."In this episode, you'll hear the personal experiences and realizations of both Patrick and Megan Anna around emotions, communication, and navigating relationships.If you or someone you know struggles with expressing emotions or feeling understood and connected to others, then this episode is for you.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Understand how Autistic people may display emotions differently and the challenges we face in navigating and expressing our emotions. Identify signs of sensory overload, what can trigger it, and some methods to help self-soothe and regulate. Learn how and which tools and technologies to use to improve and aid in communication  By gaining a deeper understanding of Autistic emotions, we gain the potential for greater self-awareness which can empower us to embrace our authentic selves, and foster meaningful connections. 💻 Dr. Megan Anna Neff's Website: https://neurodivergentinsights.com 💻 Patrick Casale's Website: https://www.allthingspractice.com  Resources:Resources for Emotion Identification (blog posts): The Emotion Matrix: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/blog/arousal-valence-model The Feeling Wheel: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/blog/the-feelings-wheel Increasing Emotional Identification: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/blog/emotional-identification Resource (Workbook): The Alexithymia Workbook: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/neurodivergentstore/p/alexithymia-workbook Emotions 101: If you’re a nerd like me and enjoy learning the science of emotions this workbook is for you: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/neurodivergentstore/p/emotions-101 ——————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast here🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube—————————————————————————————————— Mentioned in this episode:Hurricane Relief for WNC communitiesThis money will go to nonprofits who are boots on the ground. It will go to struggling individuals who do not have enough money for gas to get out, or who do not have enough money to provide their basic needs right now. Donate to Patrick's GoFundMe to help provide urgent aid for WNC communities affected by Hurricane Helene. Visit: atppod.com/wnc

Exploring the challenges of finding a neurodivergent affirmative therapist, embracing special interests in therapy, understanding therapy misconceptions, and discussing therapeutic modalities like IFS and plural systems. Highlighting the importance of authentic connections, personalized approaches, and navigating therapist wait lists for successful outcomes.

There can be a lot of stigma around autism and especially being an autistic therapist, which can make it even harder for autistic individuals to step into this career.They may even be told that they can't be empathetic or relate to others in a way that could help their clients, which is just NOT TRUE.If you are autistic and have been hesitating to step into the mental health field because of the stigma around autism, then this episode is for you.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Understand how being autistic can make you a better therapist for other neurodivergent clients, often more so than an allistic (not of the autism spectrum) therapist. Identify ways to combat the notion that autistic people can't make good therapists, as well as how to navigate grad school when you are receiving a negative perspective on autism from professors or supervisors.  Learn how to structure a private practice to support your needs and create a stable work environment for more longevity in your career as a therapist. When Dr. Megan Neff was asked why they became a therapist, the answer was "because I'm autistic." This episode can help you explore in what ways autism can help you succeed as a therapist, as well as in what ways you might struggle and how to face those times.Check out the resources on Megan's website to learn how you can find a Neurodivergent Affirming Therapist: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/resources——————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast here🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube—————————————————————————————————— Mentioned in this episode:Hurricane Relief for WNC communitiesThis money will go to nonprofits who are boots on the ground. It will go to struggling individuals who do not have enough money for gas to get out, or who do not have enough money to provide their basic needs right now. Donate to Patrick's GoFundMe to help provide urgent aid for WNC communities affected by Hurricane Helene. Visit: atppod.com/wnc

For many adults who are diagnosed later in life, their diagnosis story often begins with a misdiagnosis story.It's not uncommon for these adults to go through childhood and some adult life just feeling like they are a bit more weird or different than a lot of the people around them.It can even be a somewhat painful experience as they try to find answers and explore the reasons why they just don't seem to fit in and why they present themselves the way they do.If you have been exploring the possibility that you might be undiagnosed or misdiagnosed autistic, ADHD, or another neurodiverse diagnosis and want to explore more about what that might look like, this episode is for you.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Understand some signs of autism and ADHD in early childhood and teen years, and how they can be misdiagnosed or misunderstood. Identify ways that undiagnosed autism and ADHD can impact development around and interactions with environments and people and manifest self-soothing habits, as well as how to identify what grounds you and helps you regulate and cope with things that cause you discomfort. Hear the personal stories of Megan and Patrick prior to diagnosis and how they showed up in their childhood and teenage years. Undiagnosed autism and/or ADHD can have a huge impact on the way an individual shapes their behavior, beliefs, and relationships in the world, and finding answers to a lifetime of questions only in adulthood can feel frustrating and confusing but also offer a sense of relief and comfort. It's important to explore what helps you regulate your body, find comfort, self-soothe, and cope with stress to live a life that is designed around your uniqueness.——————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast here🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube—————————————————————————————————— Mentioned in this episode:Hurricane Relief for WNC communitiesThis money will go to nonprofits who are boots on the ground. It will go to struggling individuals who do not have enough money for gas to get out, or who do not have enough money to provide their basic needs right now. Donate to Patrick's GoFundMe to help provide urgent aid for WNC communities affected by Hurricane Helene. Visit: atppod.com/wnc