Mark asked Dave Gerhardt to play 9 holes of golf with him with the promise that he wouldn't ask him any questions he'd ever been asked before.One catch: he’d be bringing a film crew.Dave said game on.This is The Long Game.

When we launched our original research report, The Evidence Gap, we thought we’d get 150 downloads in the first 30 days. The actual results? Blew that goal out of the water. Original research is the secret weapon for cutting through the noise in B2B marketing. In this episode of The Proof Point, we dive into UserEvidence’s Evidence Gap Report with UserEvidence co-founder and CEO Evan Huck, exploring the growing need for credible proof in today’s high-stakes buying environment. The big takeaway? Marketers often think their content is crushing it, but sales teams and buyers see major gaps—especially in relevance and competitive differentiation. With budgets tighter than ever, buyers are looking for more than opinions—they want statistically backed proof that shows a solution works for their unique needs.Listen to the full episode, and you’ll get a behind-the-scenes process of creating the report, including why testing your survey hypothesis is a lifesaver and how to frame questions for actionable insights. They make the case for going beyond generic case studies and testimonials to deliver content that’s specific, credible, and trust-building.Things to listen for:(00:00) Introduction(00:28) Why credible proof outshines opinions in B2B content(01:12) What is the "evidence gap" and why it matters?(02:04) The role of original research in modern go-to-market strategies(05:24) Case studies vs. customer evidence(08:43) Why marketers overestimate the impact of their content(13:20) Designing surveys to uncover actionable customer insights(17:05) How statistical evidence builds trust with skeptical buyers(23:29) Why specific, relevant evidence is critical for closing deals(39:37) Rethinking customer marketing: Beyond case studies and testimonialsSubscribe to Mark’s newsletter, Evidently: https://evidently.beehiiv.com/subscribe Learn more about the customer evidence platform that B2B teams at Gong, HackerOne, Sendoso, and more trust at userevidence.com.

In this raw, brutally honest episode, we’re pulling back the curtain on The Proof Point’s first season with host Mark Huber, VP of Marketing, and newly minted Jillian Hoefer, Senior Content Marketing Manager at UserEvidence. We’re sharing exactly how our metrics went (spoiler alert: our downloads plateaued), the tactics that worked (and the ones that definitely didn’t), and everything we’ve learned along the way. Think of this as an episode on content evidence, not customer evidence. And yes, we’re telling you exactly what we wish we’d done differently, including a breakdown of our actual results. Plus, we’re giving you a sneak peek at what’s coming in Season 2: new tactics, better strategies, and—yes—real listener questions! What You’ll Get: The proof of Season 1: What worked, what didn’t, and whyWhy distribution, not creation, is the key to scaling podcast contentOur top takeaways for improving Season 2 with some sneak peeks Things to listen for:(00:00) Why proof beat opinions every time(01:50) Jillian’s evolution from podcast partner to UserEvidence marketer(06:30) Breaking down The Proof Point’s season one wins(12:10) Lessons learned: Distribution pitfalls and the magic of relationships(20:00) How to think about “killing your marketing darlings”(24:30) How UserEvidence leverages podcast content beyond downloads(31:00) Tackling the challenge of LinkedIn’s algorithm(36:40) What the shift of strategy means for Season 2(42:00) The power of in-person interviews for engaging podcast content(50:10) Listener Q&ASubscribe to Mark’s newsletter, Evidently: https://evidently.beehiiv.com/subscribeLearn more about UserEvidence: userevidence.com

Kyle Coleman, CMO of Copy.ai, joins The Proof Point to share his refreshing take on the future of the SDR role and the impact of AI on go-to-market teams. Kyle, who began his career as an SDR, shares why so many companies get the SDR model wrong and how AI can be integrated without compromising the authenticity of customer evidence.From "SDR AI sandwiches" to avoiding “spam cannons,” this episode shows how AI can enhance—not replace—the SDR role by providing actionable insights and trustworthy customer evidence that supports meaningful sales conversations.Subscribe to Mark’s newsletter, EvidentlyLearn more about the customer evidence platform that B2B teams at Gong, HackerOne, Sendoso, and more trust at userevidence.com.Things to listen for:(00:00) Introduction (00:28) Why proof, not opinions, drives go-to-market success(02:20) Kyle’s role at Copy.ai – redefining sales tools(04:33) Copy.ai’s workflow magic: podcasts to blog posts(05:33) Tackling “go-to-market bloat” with streamlined solutions(07:17) Bridging SDR skill gaps with AI efficiency(09:39) Kyle’s wildest SDR fail – lessons learned(10:05) AI SDRs? Why buyers want human connections(11:27) The future SDR: more strategy, less spamming(13:08) How Copy.ai helps execs meet strategic goals

Bitly’s CMO, Tara Robertson, shares her customer-centric playbook for transforming Bitly from a link shortener to a full connections platform. From leveraging QR codes to merging physical and digital experiences to using customer evidence, Tara explains how Bitly’s retention-focused marketing impacts every user touchpoint. This episode shares insights on building authentic customer connections while highlighting the metrics that matter in the B2B landscape.Things to listen for:(00:00) Introduction (01:15) Tara’s journey from Sprout Social to Bitly(03:02) Building a customer marketing playbook at Sprout(04:27) Measuring retention and adoption with sub-KPIs(06:37) Bitly’s new direction(07:54) QR codes to 2D barcodes(09:39) Expanding Bitly’s target market - SMBs to enterprise(11:29) Showcasing use cases to support varied customers(13:24) Using customer stories to build trust(17:02) Overcoming challenges in gathering authentic evidenceSubscribe to Mark’s newsletter, Evidently: https://evidently.beehiiv.com/subscribe Learn more about the customer evidence platform that B2B teams at Gong, HackerOne, Sendoso, and more trust at userevidence.com 

Allyson Havener, SVP of Marketing at TrustRadius, shares her expertise on the disconnect between B2B buyers and sellers. She highlights how skepticism from modern buyers demands transparency and real customer evidence. Discover the importance of original research and authentic peer reviews in building trust. The discussion reveals that traditional marketing tactics can lead to decision paralysis. Havener emphasizes aligning sales strategies with buyer expectations for upfront pricing and minimal pressure to enhance trust and shorten sales cycles.

Brendan Hufford, founder of Growth Sprints, and Jess Cook from Island, along with Brooklin Nash of Beam Content, explore the pitfalls of traditional B2B marketing. They urge listeners to ditch 'checkbox marketing' and focus on purposeful content that truly connects with audiences. The trio emphasizes solving real customer problems rather than merely pitching products, and highlights the importance of developing a clear content POV. Engaging storytelling and leadership buy-in are vital for building lasting trust and impactful communication.

Pranav Piyush, CEO of Paramark, specializes in proving marketing's worth, while Megan Boone, VP of Demand Generation at Redis, focuses on balancing measurable goals with innovative approaches. Jason Widup, a seasoned Fractional CMO, provides valuable insights into fostering leadership trust in marketing. Together, they tackle the struggle of measuring marketing effectiveness. They emphasize the need for a blend of data-driven metrics and intuitive judgment, stressing that not all successful strategies yield immediate results. Building trust through early wins and clear communication is crucial for long-term growth.

The TL;DRStruggling to show the real value of customer marketing?Mark Huber (UserEvidence) is joined by Jane Menyo (Gong), Cache Walker (Trellix), and Leslie Barrett (Tipalti) to reveal how top B2B SaaS companies are finding proof points that matter.What’s working in customer marketing:THINK LIKE A CONSULTANTTreat customer marketing as more than just a department. Act like a consultant—balance short-term wins with long-term impact by building solid relationships, both inside and outside your organization.What’s not working in customer marketing:LACK OF PROOFToo many teams are operating without clear metrics. To show the real business value of customer marketing, you need data-driven results. This helps break the myth that it’s just a "feel-good" function.Key takeaways: Customer marketing goes beyond quick wins: It’s not about just driving immediate results or running feel-good advocacy programs. Think of it as a long-term, consultative approach—you're providing strategic guidance rather than just being another team member.Proof is everything: Real customer evidence is at the heart of credibility. In B2B, marketers are seeing the shift to data-backed customer feedback, much like how consumer reviews drive decisions in companies like Uber and Airbnb.Tracking engagement isn’t straightforward: It can be tricky for customer marketers to demonstrate the value they bring. Traditional metrics don’t always capture the relationship-building efforts. However, creating solid frameworks and using the right tools to track engagement helps bridge that gap.Scaling with creativity and AI: AI tools, like bots that learn from customer feedback and thoughtful multichannel campaigns, can streamline customer marketing. This not only saves manual effort but also leads to genuine, meaningful engagement.Getting executives on board: Engaging with top-level executives is one of the toughest aspects of customer marketing, but it’s vital. Identifying the right stakeholders and crafting specific initiatives for them can make all the difference.The things to listen for:(00:00) Intro (01:17) Why proof points are crucial for go-to-market teams(02:07) Common mistakes in customer marketing(03:01) Initial missteps in the field of marketing(04:02) Why customer marketing is misunderstood (07:13) Why customer feedback is important(09:55) Influences in customer marketing(14:16) The challenges and pitfalls of customer marketing(25:28) Leveraging technology and automation(36:17) Measuring the impact and ROI of customer marketing efforts

Mark Huber from UserEvidence, Liam Moroney of Storybook Marketing, Sydney Sloan at G2, and Sam Kuehnle from Loxo dive into the nuances of brand awareness versus demand creation. They emphasize that understanding customer problems fosters authentic connections. The podcast highlights the critical need for clear messaging over jargon and using evidence to build trust. Moreover, the guests stress targeting genuine demand creation while avoiding the trap of confusing it with mere brand awareness for sustained growth.