2Bobs—with David C. Baker and Blair Enns

Blair interviews David on his recent article in which he was very open and honest about his struggles with depression and anxiety. LINKS "I Struggle With Mental Health. Maybe You Do Too." mentally-healthy.org Mentally Healthy 2020 Results

For the last time—ever—David and Blair discuss client-side marketing departments, their struggle to be entrepreneurial and what we can learn from them.

Blair combines a few of the deeper topics he and David have already covered to provide a larger view of the overall pricing journey he recommends creative firms take.

In-house creative departments aren't going anywhere, so David wants agencies to be mindful of the unique value they bring to the projects for which their clients still need them.

David asks Blair some awkward questions to get inside his head about his successful book, The Win Without Pitching Manifesto.

Most of us haven't sold one firm that we've owned, and those principals who have formerly sold their firm aren't always...ahem...telling the truth.

In a nod to the Walt Whitman line, Blair believes successful sales people - as well as agency principals - often need to present themselves as different personalities in different situations. And David believes sales trainers are actually therapists.

As we've seen independent creative marketing and digital firms experience rapid growth over this past year, David offers five factors that principals should consider in order to avoid growing for the wrong reasons and/or mismanaging that growth.

Exploring the nuances of saying 'no' can be revolutionary for businesses. It emphasizes the importance of boundaries and how it fosters genuine client relationships. Discover the psychological dynamics at play during sales interactions, advocating for pressure-free conversations. Learn why timing is crucial in rejections and how inviting 'no' can actually enhance communication. The discussion highlights how effectively saying 'no' can enrich credibility and create space for growth, challenging creatives to balance enthusiasm with restraint.

When people from other industries learn about what goes on inside your firm, are they awe-struck in a good or bad way? Blair and David come up with a list of things that are unique to the creative firm biz and how they've seen outsiders react to them.