Humans of Martech

What’s up everyone, today we have the pleasure of sitting down with Ezra Fishman, VP of Growth at Wistia. About EzraEzra started his career as an engineer developing devices to help treat diabetes and obesity at GI DynamicsHe later had a short stint as an Operations Manager at an investment firm that was dedicated to funding health tech startupsAfter completing his MBA, Ezra joined a video tech startup called Wistia as their Director of Marketing and after 4 years he transitioned to leading Business IntelligenceToday Ezra is VP of Growth at Wistia where he’s now spent over 12 years, seeing the company grow from a handful of customers to over 375,000 and becoming one of the top vPaaS tools on the planetSummary: Ezra is a strategic and technical visionary at Wistia. He combines an audience-first content strategy with a data-informed approach to drive sustainable growth. He emphasizes the importance of genuine relationships over transactions and advocates for leveraging data to inform decisions while valuing human intuition. His journey from initiating a central data warehouse to implementing tools like Census, Fivetran, and dbt showcases how a single source of truth can enhance operational efficiency. Ezra's experience, from fostering a data-informed culture to embracing a scrappy startup mentality with a focus on high-impact ideas and rigorous A/B testing, reflects a commitment to strategic evolution and the balance between data and creativity. His insights offer invaluable lessons on growing and engaging with audiences in meaningful ways, advocating for a blend of strategy, intuition, and data-informed decisions in marketing.From Wistia’s First Customer to Early Team MemberImagine this: Ezra, initially just a fan from the sidelines, watching Wistia, a fledgling startup by his buddies Chris Savage and Brendan Schwartz, trying to carve its niche in the world of video. This journey from an intrigued observer to Wistia's first customer, and eventually, a pivotal team member, is nothing short of a cinematic twist.Back in the day, while Ezra was navigating the complexities of medical devices, Chris and Brendan were brainstorming Wistia's next big thing. The plot thickens when Ezra, amidst casual banter in their Boston living room, pitches a game-changing idea sparked by his own professional hurdles. Picture this: medical procedures generating heaps of video data, with the only sharing option being the archaic method of mailing DVDs worldwide. Enter Ezra's lightbulb moment—why not transform Wistia into a haven for secure, efficient video collaboration?Fast forward to Wistia marking its foray into uncharted territories. This wasn't just about ditching DVDs for digital; it was about reimagining how professionals could leverage video for learning and collaboration.The narrative takes a delightful turn when, over a lunch filled with reminiscing and future-gazing, Chris and Brendan propose a novel idea to Ezra. With a shared laugh over their collective naiveté in marketing and business management, they decide to join forces. This was the moment of serendipity, the kind that you'd find in tales of old, where the hero embarks on an unforeseen quest.Wistia's storyline evolves with a bold strategic pivot, transitioning from a focus on internal video sharing to mastering the art of video marketing. This wasn't merely a shift in services; it was a leap towards redefining Wistia’s essence. The introduction of video embeds and performance tracking was akin to discovering a new continent in the realm of video marketing. This pivot was the catalyst for an explosive growth, attracting a myriad of users and establishing Wistia as a beacon in the marketing universe.Ezra's saga with Wistia illustrates a kaleidoscope of lessons: the beauty of perspective, the strength found in adaptability, and the magic of seizing hidden opportunities. It's a testament to how internal insights can dramatically alter a company's course, steering it towards realms of untapped potential and success.Key Takeaway: Ezra's journey with Wistia showcases the power of leveraging personal experiences to spot unique opportunities in the professional sphere. His story teaches us the importance of staying open to unexpected career paths and the transformative potential of internal insights. For any professional, Ezra's narrative is a reminder to embrace adaptability and look beyond conventional boundaries, because sometimes, the next big shift in your career or business strategy could emerge from your own unique challenges and observations.Ezra's Audience-First Philosophy Beyond Funnel VisionEzra's reflections on Wistia's early content strategy are a testament to the power of foresight and the courage to challenge the status quo. In an era dominated by the lead capture mantra, the idea of prioritizing audience engagement over immediate conversions was nothing short of revolutionary. Ezra's insights into this paradigm shift reveal not just a tactical change, but a philosophical evolution in marketing.At the heart of this transformation was a simple observation: content that educates, engages, and entertains fosters a community of brand advocates. Ezra noticed early on that content about video production on a budget or maximizing video effectiveness wasn't just filling up space on Wistia's blog; it was actively drawing people into a conversation with the brand. This wasn't engagement that could be easily quantified by the number of leads generated, but its impact was undeniable. Website visits and signups surged post-publication, showcasing the tangible benefits of nurturing an audience.This observation led to a critical realization: gating content might boost lead numbers temporarily, but it dampens genuine engagement. The stark contrast between open access and restricted content provided clear evidence that the key to sustained growth was fostering an environment where quality trumped quantity. This approach required a commitment to producing stellar content that people didn't just stumble upon but sought out and shared.Ezra's philosophy underscores a critical marketing truth: building an audience is about cultivating relationships, not just capturing data points. This mindset shift from a focus on quantity to a dedication to quality was, at the time, a bold stance that set Wistia apart. It wasn't about bombarding people with sales pitches but about drawing them into a meaningful dialogue with the brand.This audience-first approach is not just about creating fans; it's about building a community that grows organically, powered by the quality of interaction and content. The lesson here is clear: when marketers prioritize genuine engagement over short-term metrics, they lay the foundation for lasting growth and brand loyalty.Key Takeaway: Ezra's strategic pivot to an audience-first approach at Wistia highlights the lasting value of building genuine relationships over transactional interactions. In today's content-saturated world, the brands that stand out are those that treat their audience not as leads to be captured but as a community to be cultivated. This philosophy doesn't just elevate a brand's marketing game; it transforms customers into advocates, ensuring sustainable growth and a competitive edge.Data-Informed Instead of Data-DrivenEzra's path through the diverse landscapes of marketing, business intelligence (BI), and growth at Wistia is a narrative about the confluence of data and human insight. His tenure, marked by wearing multiple hats across different roles, underscores a singular truth: the realms of marketing, BI, and growth, despite their distinctions, share a common core centered around attracting and engaging people, converting them, and leveraging data for informed decision-making.Ezra, self-...

Summary: Justin is a polished voice of reason in martech. In our conversation, he focused on the practicality of AI, highlighting its capability to transform data into actionable insights, aiding in a deeper understanding of customer needs. We also covered the shift towards flexible, composable tech stacks and the importance of diverse skills alongside a few Sci-fi references. He also proposed a transparent, Shark Tank-style approach for selecting martech vendors, underscoring the need for effective evaluation methods. This episode offers practical guidance for marketers aiming to navigate the rise of gen AI in marketing.Balancing Opportunity and Skepticism With AI in Marketing Justin's insights highlight a critical juncture in marketing technology: the integration of AI, specifically GPT-4, into daily practices. He acknowledges the prevalent fear of missing out (FOMO) among marketers, emphasizing the importance of staying abreast with AI advancements. Justin points out the dual nature of this fear: the anxiety about falling behind and the apprehension towards the implications of AI in marketing. His perspective reflects a cautious yet necessary embrace of technology.Interestingly, Justin positions himself as a technologist with a skeptical eye, wary of jumping onto the latest trend without due diligence. This approach is particularly relevant in a field bombarded with yearly hype cycles. His focus on adding value rather than noise is commendable. By mapping out AI's potential use cases in marketing, Justin contributes to a more structured understanding of this technology. He shifts the conversation from mere adoption to thoughtful integration, ensuring AI's relevance and applicability to marketing operations.The idea of mapping AI's role in marketing is not just about adoption but about understanding where and how it fits into the broader marketing strategy. Justin's approach of breaking down and analyzing different aspects of AI in marketing is crucial for its effective utilization. His methodical and analytical approach towards AI adoption in marketing is a testament to the need for balance - recognizing the potential of new technology while maintaining a healthy skepticism.Key takeaway: Marketers should balance the excitement of AI's potential with a thoughtful, structured approach to its integration into marketing operations. Understanding and mapping AI's practical applications in marketing can turn the fear of missing out into an opportunity for innovation and strategic advancement.Transitioning Rule-Based to AI-Driven Marketing StrategiesJustin delves into the complexities of transitioning from traditional rule-based automation to AI-driven approaches like next best action and propensity modeling in marketing. This shift, he points out, is not just a technological upgrade but a fundamental change in how marketing campaigns are conceptualized and executed. His insights are particularly relevant for marketing teams accustomed to rule-based systems and now facing the challenge of integrating more sophisticated, AI-powered models.The promise of AI in marketing, especially in next best action scenarios, is substantial. Justin notes that while the concept has been a long-sought 'Holy Grail,' it's now becoming a practical reality. However, he cautions against being swept away by the technological possibilities without considering their practical implications. The key, according to Justin, is to subordinate the technology to what works effectively as a marketer, always keeping the customer context in focus.For B2C scenarios or low-value product-led growth motions, AI-driven recommendations can be incredibly effective. However, Justin points out the limitations in complex B2B contexts, such as selling high-value products or services. These scenarios involve decision committees, contracts, and multiple stakeholders, where a simple AI-generated email is unlikely to clinch a deal. He suggests a more nuanced application of AI, perhaps integrating insights from sales calls or digital body language to tailor communications more effectively.Regarding quality assurance in AI-driven marketing, Justin highlights the potential pitfalls. He shares an example of an AI-generated email that was impressively detailed yet glaringly inaccurate, underscoring the brand risk associated with unmoderated AI content. This example illustrates the current necessity for a human in the loop, balancing AI's efficiency with the nuanced understanding that only human oversight can provide.Key takeaway: Justin's perspective on integrating AI into marketing strategies emphasizes a thoughtful, customer-centric approach. The shift from rule-based to AI-driven models demands not only technological adoption but also a strategic reevaluation of marketing practices. The balance between leveraging AI's capabilities and maintaining human oversight is crucial to navigate this transition successfully, ensuring that marketing efforts remain effective and resonate authentically with the target audience.Balancing AI Adoption with Practical Realities in MarketingJustin addresses the emotional aspect of adopting AI in marketing, acknowledging the tension between the excitement of AI's potential and the reality of its practical application. This emotional dimension is often overlooked in the rush to embrace new technology. Justin highlights the challenge of integrating AI without losing the human element, a concern particularly relevant in an era where personalization and authenticity are crucial.The key, according to Justin, is to find a balance between being at the forefront of AI adoption and ensuring that the technology genuinely enhances marketing efforts. He shares his strategy of assessing AI tools based on their feasibility and impact. Some applications, like AI-generated LinkedIn posts, might be feasible but not necessarily advisable due to their impact on authenticity and personal engagement. On the other hand, AI-generated imagery offers significant benefits, producing unique and compelling visuals that surpass traditional stock images.Justin's approach is driven by the practical benefits of AI, focusing on areas where AI can offer substantial support. For instance, processing large volumes of unstructured text, a tedious task for humans, is an area where AI can provide significant relief. His advice for listeners is to let their needs guide their adoption of AI, rather than succumbing to the pressure of forced adoption. By doing so, they can leverage AI where it truly adds value, enhancing their work while retaining the essential human touch.Key takeaway: In martech, the adoption of AI should be driven by practicality and real needs, rather than the pressure to conform to trends. Evaluating AI tools based on their feasibility and impact ensures that their integration enhances marketing efforts without compromising the human element that remains essential to effective communication.AI as a Tool for Enhancing Creative MarketingJustin discusses the role of AI in transforming unstructured data into actionable insights, particularly in the context of marketing and content creation. He touches upon an intriguing shift from the traditional focus on quantitative data to the exploration of qualitative insights through AI tools. This shift is significant, especially in an era where content creators and marketers have predominantly leaned towards quantitative analysis.Justin reflects on the unique nature of creative work and the essential human insights that drive its excellence. He is of the view that certain aspects of creativity and human consciousness are inherently unique and cannot be replicated by AI. In his analogy, AI is like a highly responsive paintbrush, capable of executing tasks based on verbal instructions, y...

What’s up everyone, today we have the pleasure of sitting down with Crissy Saunders, CEO and Co-Founder at CS2. Summary: Crissy takes us through the evolution from tactical management to strategic leadership, and the adaptation to changing marketing strategies. We discuss the significance of specialized platforms in marketing automation, the critical role of the sales funnel in revenue growth, the shift in email marketing towards 'inbox influence', and revitalizing outbound marketing strategies. This episode is a concise yet profound guide, offering actionable insights for martech professionals to navigate their careers and strategies effectively.About CrissyCrissy started her career at Marketo when the company was only 4 years old. She was quickly promoted to Marketing Ops manager where she led weekly training of internal users as well as lead management and technical execution for enterprise clientsShe then moved over to Jive Software as Global Marketing Operations Manager and later Agari as a Sr Demand Gen manager She co founded Walkzee, an app that connected sheltered dogs with dog lovers who needed a walking buddyShe also co-founded CS2 with her husband Charlie, a martech agency that powers efficient and predictable revenue which has grown to over 15 team members and has served some of the coolest brands including Gong, Sendoso, Coursera and SalesLoftShe also finds time to be a podcast co-host, a women in revenue co-founder, a partner at MKT1 and an advisor for Syncari and ChilipiperNavigating the Dual Dynamics of Marriage and Business in MartechCrissy's journey with her husband Charlie in the realm of marketing operations (martech ops) is a testament to how personal and professional relationships can synergize effectively. Their story began in a work environment, where they were assigned to different global roles. Crissy, based in Palo Alto, and Charlie, working from the EMEA office, quickly realized the need for a counterpart due to the time difference. This necessity sparked their collaboration.Their work dynamic evolved as they discovered not only their professional compatibility but also a personal connection. This dual relationship blossomed into marriage, and after a year of living apart, they decided to venture into consulting. The transition from employees to business owners was facilitated by their solid professional background and the initial success in acquiring clients. This success was a result of their extensive network and the burgeoning field of marketing and sales operations, which at the time, was not as recognized as it is today.Their business, initially named CSU Marketing, evolved to focus on revenue operations, reflecting their diverse expertise beyond just marketing ops. They attribute their successful business partnership to aligning on business goals, leveraging each other's strengths, and maintaining constant communication. Daily meetings help them stay connected and address priorities, a luxury not all business leaders share.However, blending personal and professional life has its challenges. Discussions about the business often spill into their personal time, but they view this as a constructive process. Differences in opinion are not seen as conflicts but as opportunities for 'storming' – a phase in the McKinsey framework – leading to innovative solutions. This approach underscores their ability to balance their roles as business partners and life partners.Key takeaway: Crissy and Charlie's experience highlights the importance of communication, alignment of goals, and leveraging individual strengths in a business partnership. Their journey from colleagues to spouses and business partners demonstrates that professional and personal relationships can coexist and thrive, provided there's a clear understanding of roles, constant communication, and a positive approach to resolving differences.Elevating from Tactical Manager to Strategic Leader in MartechCrissy sheds light on a crucial challenge in the martech sector: the transition from a tactical, technology-focused manager to a strategic, business-minded director. In her view, the key to success in operations roles lies in balancing tactical knowledge with evolving strategic approaches. Understanding the operational landscape and keeping abreast of technological possibilities are vital for leaders in this field.She emphasizes the importance of building a solid operational foundation rather than being mired in constant 'firefighting' mode. This foundation is crucial for moving beyond immediate tactical challenges and focusing on long-term strategic goals. Crissy advises against solely aiming for a position where one only manages people and devises strategies. A true leader in martech needs to grasp the practical aspects of the technology they oversee, even if not involved in the hands-on work.Her tips for professionals aspiring to advance include aligning with business goals and key metrics, particularly those of the revenue team. She advises creating a flexible roadmap that accommodates unforeseen challenges while ensuring that the team remains focused on impactful, long-term projects. Moreover, she underscores the importance of data analysis and insights in driving operational efficiency and informing higher-level decisions.Key takeaway: To progress from a tactical role to a strategic leadership position in martech, professionals need to balance their technical knowledge with an understanding of evolving business strategies. Building a solid operational foundation, aligning with key business goals, and emphasizing data analysis are essential steps. Success in this transition requires not just managing teams but also possessing a deep understanding of the technology and strategies that drive the business forward.The Challenges of Unbundling Marketing Automation PlatformsCrissy delves into the complexities of unbundling marketing automation platforms in the current martech environment. She identifies several issues that make this process challenging, particularly for established operations. The primary concerns include understaffing, high turnover, and the necessity for comprehensive training on these tools.Marketing automation platforms offer a wide range of functionalities, which can be both a blessing and a curse. While they provide a one-stop solution for various needs, Crissy points out that many features often go unused, leading to questions about cost-effectiveness. However, the real worry lies in the management and upkeep of these systems. The existing tech debt in marketing automation and CRM platforms complicates the situation further.Crissy suggests that while the idea of a more flexible, composable solution is appealing, especially for small and medium businesses (SMBs) focusing on profitability and investment appeal, the historical and operational challenges in B2B settings make it a difficult transition. She also highlights the potential benefits of having a single tool to master, simplifying contract management and expertise development within teams.The future of marketing automation, according to Crissy, lies not in the immediate unbundling of these platforms but in the advancements and specialization of these tools. She emphasizes the need for marketing ops professionals to choose platforms based on their specific use case...

Josh Hill, GTN operations and tech executive with 20+ years of experience, discusses integrating sales experience into marketing, hands-on martech tools, blending creativity with technical know-how, the importance of high-quality data for AI implementation, and maintaining work-life balance in martech.

What’s up everyone, today we have the honor of sitting down with a true martech Jedi Master: Paul Wilson, Founder and Chief Strategist at GTM Systems.Summary: Paul wielded his lightsaber of wisdom, skillfully navigating the nebula of modern marketing technology and the rise of generative AI. He shared insights on the strategic dance of early freelancing in martech during the dawn of marketing automation and how there are similar opportunities today with harnessing the Force of generative AI. We delved into marketing operations, where professionals are like astute navigators of starships, steering through the complex cosmos of data management and AI integration. Paul's approach emphasized the importance of emotional intelligence and human intuition in a digital marketing realm. This episode was a hyperdrive journey through the galaxy of martech, peering into the future and illuminating the path for marketers to balance the Force of technological advancement with the art of human creativity.About PaulPaul kicked off his career in software sales in cybersecurity and was later introduced to the intricate world of email and martech at an Ottawa-based startup that offered anti-spam and anti-virus email filtering softwareHe would also start his moonlighting freelance career, founding CRM Nerds where he would provide strategic leadership for martech implementations for a variety of brandsAfter a short stint at Bell as a PM for their CRM business solutions, Paul led martech and salestech at two startups, dna13 – an Ottawa-based brand reputation management tool and Klocwork – a Minneapolis-based developer productivity tool Paul also worked at two agencies, first at Shift CRM as a Salesforce Consultant in Ottawa and later at Perkuto as a Senior Solutions Architect in DenverHe then made the mega move to Marketo, first focusing on Partner Development and later as the Head of Martech and Innovation. After their acquisition by Adobe, Paul was one of the leads on the project to implement Marketo for all of Adobe’s B2B businessThe mega moves didn’t stop there though, Paul took on the role of Senior Director of Marketing Operations at Slack and was later promoted to VP after the Salesforce acquisitionFinally, after a short stint at OneTrust, Paul strapped on his jetpack and went out on his own to found GTM Systems, dedicated to preparing business to harness the power of gen AIFreelancing Early in Martech is a Strategic Choice for Career DevelopmentWe kicked off our discussion with Pau by asking him to take us back to his early days at CRM Nerds, where he undertook an independent consulting project with Chipworks, a small business in Kanata. Interestingly, this was Phil’s first tech job, marking a significant point in his career. Paul's work at Chipworks not only influenced Phil's interest in marketing operations but also raises an important question about the traditional career advice in martech. Typically, newcomers are advised to delay freelancing until they gain more experience and a larger network. However, Paul's experience suggests that for those with advanced skills and specialization, early freelancing could be a strategic advantage.During the nascent stages of martech, specifically around 2012-2013, Paul chose to freelance at a time when marketing technology was just beginning to take off. The industry was in dire need of experts who could navigate these new waters, and mature agencies were yet to build a team of experienced professionals. Paul's decision to freelance offered him a unique opportunity to work with diverse organizational structures and challenges, significantly enhancing his skill set and expertise.Paul's story serves as an example for those considering freelancing in the early stages of their career. The current state of martech and generative AI, according to him, mirrors the early 2010s. He observes a stagnation in marketing automation but anticipates a new wave of growth driven by generative technologies. As many professionals embrace independent consulting in 2023, Paul believes that their ability to adapt and apply their skills in this changing landscape will be crucial.Key takeaway: Early freelancing in martech, particularly for those with specialized skills, offers a strategic edge. It not only broadens experience but also hastens skill development. In the current martech landscape, similar to the early 2010s, adaptability is key. With generative technologies driving growth, professionals, especially independent consultants, must adapt and apply their skills to thrive in this evolving sector.Navigating Generative AI in the Martech LandscapePaul delves into the burgeoning realm of generative AI within martech, addressing the challenges and opportunities it presents for organizations. As an independent consultant, he shares valuable insights into integrating tools like ChatGPT and leveraging generative AI for enhancing marketing and sales strategies. This conversation is especially relevant considering our own experience with incorporating these technologies into our toolkit, including this podcast.The first key point Paul emphasizes is awareness. He illustrates this with the classic steps meme: a person with one foot on an escalator several steps higher than the other, symbolizing the disconnect between a CEO's perception of generative AI capabilities and the organization's actual position. This gap in awareness is where many companies struggle. Paul stresses the importance of understanding where an organization currently stands in its readiness to adopt these technologies.Paul touches on the necessity of a solid data foundation. He points out that fragmented data across silos impedes the effective implementation of generative AI. The quality, accessibility, and integration of data are crucial for creating a cohesive and scalable generative experience.Lastly, Paul discusses the organizational impact of adopting generative AI. He underscores the need for robust privacy and data governance policies. Organizations must evaluate how these technologies align with their existing structures and policies to avoid potential pitfalls like data leakage or misuse.Paul is currently focused on helping companies initiate their journey into this new era. He aids them in assessing their capabilities and readiness, a crucial first step in building a strategic roadmap for leveraging generative AI effectively.Key takeaway: Successfully integrating generative AI in martech hinges on three main factors: organizational awareness of current capabilities, a solid and integrated data foundation, and a thorough understanding of the organizational impact, including data governance and privacy policies. This strategic approach enables companies to navigate the complexities of generative AI and harness its full potential.How Marketing Operations Drives the Butterfly Effect in AI-Driven MartechPaul sheds light on the evolving role of marketing operations in the age of AI and generative technologies. The conversation pivots on the long-standing emphasis on data management in marketing, a topic now gaining widespread attention due to its critical role in AI integration. Paul agrees that the longstanding advice about the importance of clean, well-managed data is more relevant than ever, especially as businesses increasingly turn to AI and generative technologies.Paul observes that marketing operations professionals are now the custodians of digital experiences. He reflects on the evolution of the field, noting how roles and responsibilities have shifted over time. For instance, the emergence of platforms like Outreach and SalesLoft around 2...

What’s up everyone, today we have the pleasure of sitting down with the acclaimed Britney Muller, Founder and Consultant at Data Sci 101 and former Senior SEO Scientist at Moz. Summary: Britney takes us on a wild ride through the intersection of marketing and AI, emphasizing the importance of adaptability, continuous learning, and ethical considerations. Britney's journey from SEO to AI illustrates the need for data literacy and strategic decision-making in marketing. She delves into the ethical nuances of AI, discussing the limitations of LLMs and the importance of transparency and responsible development. Highlighting the human element in AI, Britney advocates for balancing technological advancements with human creativity and intuition, and underscores the transformative potential of AI across various sectors. This episode is a compelling call to action for professionals to harmoniously blend technical expertise with ethical mindfulness in the rapidly evolving martech landscape.About BritneyBritney started her career when she moved to Breckenridge Colorado chasing fresh snow and snowboard hills. She connected with a local realtor who introduced her to SEO and after discovering search data, she never looked backShe spent 7 months preparing to rank her personal site for the term “Burton US Open” and ended up ranking ahead of Burton.com and received a call from their marketing team who invited her to dinner This spurred her to start her own agency which she ran for several successful years but after being on the cutting edge of SEO and doing the speaking circuit at conferences around the world, Britney started getting hungry for a new challenge: enter Machine LearningShe stumbled upon Harvard’s Data Science 109 course after searching Github repos and dived super deep into this new field She was eventually poached by Moz where she spent 4 years as Senior SEO Scientist where she re-wrote the Beginner's Guide to SEO amongst a bunch of other content and continued her SEO researchShe later joined Hugging Face, the fastest-growing Machine Learning community & open-source ML platformToday Britney has returned to her entrepreneurial roots as a Machine Learning & SEO consultant and the Founder of Data Sci 101 with the goal of making LLMs like ChatGPT as accessible as possibleEmbracing Machine Learning: A Journey from SEO to AIBritney's journey from SEO expertise to machine learning is a testament to the power of curiosity and continuous learning. Nearly a decade ago, while most in the martech field were focused solely on traditional methods, Britney's unique passion for learning and experimentation led her to explore machine learning. This shift was fueled by her desire for a new challenge, as she felt she had reached the zenith of her SEO experiments.The pivotal moment came when she took the Harvard CS 109 course on machine learning. This experience opened her eyes to the transformative potential of feeding data to models and letting them learn patterns independently. The tangible results and potential applications she witnessed were not just intellectually stimulating but also professionally inspiring. As machine learning evolved, so did Britney's skills. She recalls the early days of TensorFlow, where complex lines of code were required for basic functions, which have now been simplified drastically.Britney's approach to machine learning is unique. She enjoys taking existing models and reengineering them for different applications, a process she describes as akin to being a 'Frankenstein developer.' This creative tinkering led to practical applications and fun experiments, like her first MNIST model, which could recognize handwritten numbers with high accuracy. Her pride in this achievement underscores her deep connection to her work and the joy it brings her.Key takeaway: Britney's transition from SEO to machine learning highlights the importance of pursuing passions and continuous learning in professional development. Her success stems from her willingness to embrace new challenges and innovate by reapplying existing technologies in novel ways. This story is a reminder that staying curious and adaptable is crucial in the ever-progressing field of martech.Data Literacy: Bridging the Gap in MarketingBritney's endeavor with Data Sci 101 aligns perfectly with her goals of educating the martech community and fostering a well-informed approach to AI and ML. She emphasizes the importance of statistical knowledge in marketing, a skill often overlooked in traditional marketing education. Britney's passion for sharing knowledge is driven by her discovery of the significant gap in data literacy within the marketing industry. This gap, she believes, hinders marketers from making more strategic decisions and finding better insights.Her approach to education in this field is both innovative and practical. Britney focuses on creating content that is engaging and accessible, breaking down complex topics into understandable segments. She draws inspiration from her friend Daisy Quaker's approach, emphasizing the need to repurpose extensive resources into more digestible formats - akin to turning a large turkey into multiple turkey sandwiches. This analogy perfectly encapsulates her method of making complex data science concepts more palatable for the average marketer.Britney's journey in educating others began with her own realization of the lack of statistical training in her marketing career. This led her to delve deeper into data science, allowing her to identify and address the gaps in knowledge within the marketing community. Her efforts are not just about imparting knowledge but also about empowering marketers to leverage data more effectively in their strategies.Key takeaway: Britney's initiative with Data Sci 101 highlights the critical need for data literacy in the marketing world. Her commitment to educating her peers about the importance of statistical knowledge and her innovative approach to content creation serve as a model for making complex subjects accessible and engaging. This endeavor not only enhances the skill set of marketers but also paves the way for more data-informed and strategic decision-making in the industry.Deciphering the Alien Nature of Large Language ModelsBritney's analogy of large language models (LLMs) as aliens provides a unique perspective on the intricacies of AI in the martech world. She recalls one of the more technical textbooks she read on LLMs and how the author compares LLMs to beings in a black cave, fed with the world's texts but lacking a true understanding of human experiences and languages' nuances. This vivid imagery conveys the idea that, while LLMs are proficient in processing and mimicking language patterns, they fall short in grasping the depth and context of real-world experiences and specialized knowledge.Britney's approach to explaining complex concepts through relatable analogies reflects her commitment to making the abstract more accessible. Her use of post-it notes to jot down everyday analogies like baseball references showcases her inventive method of communication. This approach is crucial in a field where the technology is often abstract and difficult for the average person to grasp.“LLMs are essentially aliens from a different universe: while they have access to all our world’s text, they lack genuine comprehension of languages, nuances of our reality, and the intricacies of human experience and knowledge.” - Britney Muller, Introduction to LLMs, part 1. This alien analogy underlines a significant limitatio...

What’s up folks. As we close in on episode 100 and the end of this season, one episode that’s been on the list for a while now is revealing how we do our AI images. Most of the comments we get on our social posts aren’t “wow amazing content, love the CDP topics, I learned so much about email deliverability…” It’s usually “that cover art is SO cool, what’s the prompt that you use, what tool are you using for these amazing images?”So without further ado, let’s go behind the curtain and walk you through the process that we use to repurpose our audio only podcasts into long form blog posts packed with eye popping AI images.Of note, this is a highly visual episode so check out the blog post here for all the images: https://humansofmartech.com/2023/11/21/98-revealing-the-secret-prompts-and-process-behind-our-ai-images/Here’s today’s main takeaway: Ditch your raw transcripts and transform your audio podcast into a visually engaging blog with unique AI-generated images. Ditch lame stock images and learn how to use Midjourney for standout visuals that elevate your content and captivate your audience. But a word to the wise: these AI tools are addictive. Use them at your own peril.Agenda for the episode:How to turn your audio-only podcast transcript into a long form blog post that you can then repurpose for social sharesHow to get started with Midjourney, setting up your Discord server and adding key bots. Picking a consistent styleBring your blog post social shares to life with eye-popping images and make your podcast stand out with a unique cover art that matches your featured guestsHow to turn your audio-only podcast transcript into a long form blog postJT: Alright so Phil, we’ve been using Otter.ai to transcribe every episode after you’ve edited them. What’s the first step to converting that long not so great raw transcript into the polished blog posts we have on the site today?PG: Yeah so step number 1 involves our trusty friend ChatGPT. Here’s the prompt I start with:I’ll provide podcast transcripts with [guest name], and I want you to convert each Q&A into a blog passage. Third-person only. No fluff or weird words. Remove 'ums' and 'likes.' Each passage gets an H2 title and ends with a key takeaway. Ready for the first question and answer?So I go through our transcript, I copy paste the question we asked and I copy paste the answer from our guest. Here’s an example from our episode with Scott Brinker.Naturally, the output isn’t always perfect. You’re asking ChatGPT to turn your raw transcript filled with ‘ummms’ and ‘likes’ and probably has several mistranscribed words. So it’s always worth going through it and looking for issues. JT: Yeah that’s a super cool use case for ChatGPT, the output is usually pretty solid and it doesn’t always have that generic GPT signature or style to it because it starts with something vs just asking it to generate something from scratch. So do you move to generating images for each section now?PG: Not yet haha. I actually use ChatGPT to help me write a summary of the episode and suggest variations of titles as well. I start with getting a list of all the takeaways from each section and paste them all into Chat GPT and ask it to come up with a summary based on those takeaways.JT: Very cool… okay now are we ready to move on to Midjourney haha?Getting Started in MidjourneyFirst step here is creating a Discord account if you don’t have one already. Then you’ll want to create your own server so you can generate images in your own private channels. Then you join the Midjourney Beta on their site, that’ll get you invited to the Midjourney Discord server. You can check out the #getting-started channel in there to get some startup instructions. You can start seeing what others are building in any of the #newbie channels. But I prefer building in private so you can hit the ‘Show Member List’, click on the Midjourney bot and then add it to the server you just created. JT: So it’s free up to certain point right?PG: Actually since the Pope Francis in a puffer jacket earlier this year blew up their servers and they now require paid plans for all subscribers.Well worth the $10 to start playing around though. You just need to hit the /subscribe command in Discord and you’ll get a link to sign up. JT: One thing I find fascinating playing with DALL-E myself is that a lot of your illustrations and images have a crazy likeness to our guests. Are you gonna share the secret sauce behind that?PG: Yeah this is a bit of trial and error and I can drop some screenshots in the blog post version of this episode but it all starts with another Discord bot. It’s called Picsi.AI by InsightFaceSwap Bot.It’s a highly realistic portrait creation tool that you can use for free with their Discord invitation, or head over to Patreon to subscribe and access more features and higher usage limits.The creators are InsightFace.ai, an open source Python library that offers 2D and 3D face analysis. It efficiently brings together top-notch face recognition, detection, and alignment algorithms. It's designed for performance, both in training and deployment phases. Both research institutes and businesses stand to benefit from using InsightFace. Picking your styleJT: Another thing that lots of people comment on that I think is awesome about your art is how consistent it is. You can just tell that’s Humans of Martech. That’s something I’ve struggled with playing around in DALL-E rarely can I come up with two things using the same prompt that feel the same. How do you accomplish that?PG: Yeah picking your style in Midjourney is one of the most important steps. At first you want to experiment and play around with a variation of style prompts and once you have something you like. Save it. There’s probably thousands of styling permutations and combinations that can give you a pretty unique style. You can reference specific styles like cyberpunk, 8-bit, cubism, pop art. You can reference styles from video games like Zelda, GTA or Firewatch. You can also reference famous artists like Picasso, Davinci, Warhol, Kubrick and Tolkien. You can stick to real life and even reference specific cameras and lenses.I went through a bunch of my favorite ones in my virtual talk at MOPSapaloza all using the same prompt, be sure to check out the blog post for these images.Adding images to your blog postJT: So are we comfortable having you reveal the prompt?PG: Yeah I mean I dropped it at MOPSapaloza and on the Martech Podcast. But folks can also take one of our images and using the /Describe command Midjourney can spit out a prompt that’s probably close to what I use. I’ve settled on 3 recurring keywords in my prompt:Flat illustration: simple, two-dimensional elements and bright colors. It avoids gradients, shadows, and textures to achieve a clean and straightforward lookModern: characterized by simplicity, function, and clean lines. It avoids excessive ornamentation and often embraces new materials and technologiesGeometric: clean lines and basic shapes like squares and triangles. It's minimal, precise, and oft...

In this conversation, Darrell Alfonso, Director of Marketing Strategy and Operations at Indeed.com and author of the MarTech Handbook, dives into the evolution of StratOps in marketing. He discusses the balancing act between technical and strategic skills vital for career growth. Darrell emphasizes the transformative impact of no-code tools and the importance of product management in martech. He also explores challenges related to technical debt, effective knowledge sharing, and aligning marketing functions with broader company goals, all while maintaining a passion for the profession.

Summary: Sara offers practical advice for martech pros: emphasizing data literacy for informed marketing decisions, advocating simple attribution models in B2B contexts, and highlighting the balanced integration of engineering expertise in martech strategies. She underscores the significance of AI in automating tasks while stressing the importance of human-centric skills like communication in an AI-enhanced marketing world.What’s up everyone, on today’s celebratory 100th episode of the podcast, we’re incredibly pumped to chat with the legendary Sara McNamara, Senior Manager, Marketing Operations at Salesforce.About SaraSara got her start at Cloud on Tap as a Salesforce Pardot Marketing Automation Consultant where she completed 30+ Pardot implementations in under 2 yearsShe took her Ops talents to Cheshire Impact, a Select Pardot and Salesforce Partner before moving to an in-house Automation Manager role administrating 3 instances of PardotHer journey led her to a pivotal role at Cloudera, an open-source data platform for enterprise where she was quickly promoted to Senior Marketing Operations Manager after leading 2 enterprise MAP migrations in 6 monthsShe’s advised marketing leaders at companies like Google and PayPal on how to find and attract the best MOPs talentShe’s also a Member of 3 key communities; RevGenius, Women in Revenue and PavilionShe holds over 30+ licenses and certifications across popular martech and her work has been recognized by Pardot, Salesforce, Drift, and othersWhen Cloudera was on the exit ramp, Sara made a mega-move to Slack. As Senior Manager of Marketing Transformation & Innovation, she had a big job shaping things up at a massive scale But after a year of making waves, Salesforce swept in and bought Slack. That meant Sara's SFDC/Pardot hot takes and spicy industry insights came to an end But let's be clear: Sara's brilliance hasn't dimmed one bit. If you're navigating the murky waters of MOPs or crafting your own career path, she's your north star. She's not just a source of marketing knowledge—she's arguably the finest guidepost out there for career insightsSara thanks so much for making our 100th episode extra special and taking the time to chat with us 🙏🙏🙏The Importance of Acquiring Practical Data Skills for MarketersData literacy is essential for modern marketing. Sara discusses how marketers can improve these skills and foster a data-informed culture. She emphasized the importance of understanding data beyond the hype of AI, suggesting that while AI may eventually play a significant role in analytics, marketers must first clearly define their objectives and strategies.Sara's perspective is that marketing should be run like a business, with a focus on practical data skills tailored to the specific tools and needs of the business. She advises against getting bogged down in learning specific languages or tools unless they are directly relevant to one’s business environment. For example, learning Tableau is beneficial, but only if it aligns with the tools used in one's specific business context.The key, according to Sara, is for marketers to be sufficiently skilled in data to not rely entirely on analytics teams for basic questions like campaign effectiveness or budget allocations. This approach doesn't mean replacing data scientists but rather complementing their work by being able to independently handle high-level data interpretations. This self-sufficiency in data handling can significantly streamline processes and reduce dependency on centralized analytics teams.Sara also touched on the ability to scrutinize and trust the outputs of AI-driven analytics. In an era where AI is increasingly creating dashboards and reports, the ability to critically assess these outputs is crucial. Marketers need to develop the skill to not just accept these data presentations at face value but to evaluate their accuracy and relevance.Key takeaway: For marketers in the martech era, developing data literacy is less about mastering specific tools and more about understanding and applying data in the context of their specific business environment. This involves a balance of acquiring practical data skills, fostering a data-informed culture within teams, and being critical of AI-generated analytics to ensure accuracy and relevance.Why Attribution Should be Used as a Directional GuideMarketing attribution, particularly in the context of B2B enterprises, presents a unique set of challenges. Sara, drawing from her experience in enterprise-level marketing and consulting for smaller teams, shared her insights on this topic. She believes that attribution should be seen as directional rather than a definitive science. Despite the allure of discovering a 'golden path' to customer conversion, Sara's experience reveals that such a path is elusive.In her journey, she observed teams of data scientists dedicating substantial resources to unravel the mysteries of the perfect marketing attribution model. The revelation, however, was quite different from what was expected. Instead of a single path, a few key channels emerged as significant, with webinars being a standout. The realization that customers who converted often attended a webinar before making a purchase was a critical insight, guiding strategic investment in effective channels.Sara's philosophy revolves around the question, "Is the juice worth the squeeze?" In her view, excessive focus on perfecting attribution is not just futile but also comes with an opportunity cost. She advocates for prioritizing experiments in new channels and enhancing campaigns in known, directionally effective channels over obsessing about perfect attribution.Sara cautions against using attribution as a tool for justifying marketing's existence within an organization. She perceives this as a cultural or relational issue rather than one that can be resolved through data. When attribution turns into a tool for internal blame games, it fails to contribute constructively to organizational goals. She emphasizes the importance of addressing trust and relational dynamics first before relying on data to prove a point.Key Takeaway: Marketers should view attribution as a directional guide rather than an exact science. Focusing on proven channels and experimenting with new ones can be more fruitful than striving for perfect attribution. Additionally, it's vital to recognize that attribution is not a panacea for underlying cultural or trust issues within an organization.How to Pick a Marketing Attribution ModelSo practically speaking, how do you actually go about attribution? Is it first touch, last touch, influence on pipeline, incremental reporting and experiments, multi touch, marketing mix modeling, self reporting… or something else? Sara’s take on this question is a breath of fresh air. Attribution, as Sara notes, is not an exact science but a directional tool. Her experience reveals that while specific marketing channels, like webinars, can be influential in the customer journey, there is no single path that guarantees conversion. This insight is crucial for marketers who might otherwise invest excessive resources in seeking a definitive attribution model.Her practical philosophy, summarized as "is the juice worth the squeeze?", suggests that the effort put into perfecting attribution should be proportional to the benefits it yields. Rather than obsessing over perfecting it, she advises focusing on areas with a clear, positive impact, such as experimenting with new channels or strengthening the ones that show directional success. This approach aligns w...

What’s up folks, if you follow the show you know that we wrap up each conversation by delving into how our guests manage to juggle their personal and professional lives while maintaining their well-being and career success. Our most popular episode continues to be our compilation of insights on this very topic. Due to its popularity, we've decided to revisit this format and bring you a fresh perspective with new voices and reflections. I’ve categorized all 23 of our guests’ answers into 7 categories:Passion and meaningful workValues and prioritiesPhysical health and routinesCuriosity and learningAppreciating what we have nowGiving backRelationshipsMain takeaway: Balance is a continuous journey rather than a final destination, involving passion alignment, personal recharging, and appreciation of life's path, including those who accompany us along the way. And never underestimate the power of a well-timed 'no' to maintain balance and propel your journey forward.Igniting Passion and Finding Meaningful WorkLet’s start with the internal flame that motivates all else. 3 of our guests emphasized passion and finding meaningful work as the key to happiness and success.Harnessing Passion for Professional and Personal FulfillmentLucie De Antoni, Head of Marketing at Garantmehttps://humansofmartech.com/2023/09/26/90-lucie-de-antoni-startup-alchemy-attribution/ The key to a fulfilling life, Lucie posits, is to weave one's passions into the fabric of their daily lives, both in personal and professional realms. While the notion might echo familiar sentiments, for her, it serves as the engine of daily motivation. This approach isn't about blindly following joy; it involves critical reflection and the transformation of lackluster experiences into positive ones.Lucie treats her engagement with AI not just as a job but as an integral part of her life's canvas, indicating a seamless integration of work with personal interests. This blend is increasingly rare in a world that often dichotomizes professional and personal life. Her strategy includes a pragmatic approach to time management, a learned skill that she has honed over her career. Lucie now exercises discernment in her work, asking whether late hours are truly necessary or if they encroach upon her personal time.Her journey towards finding balance has been iterative, a process marked by growth and the ability to prioritize more effectively than she could just months before. Lucie attributes part of this evolution to the people she surrounds herself with, suggesting that a supportive network can significantly influence one's ability to maintain equilibrium.Building a career that resonates with one's values is not without its challenges. Lucie acknowledges that recognizing one's strengths and facing obstacles head-on is essential, yet she also stresses the importance of choice. It's about alignment—ensuring that professional actions and personal values are in concert.Key Takeaway: True happiness emerges from the intersection of passion, self-reflection, and the prudent management of one's time and choices. Lucie’s experience underlines the importance of integrating personal passions with professional endeavors, the power of a supportive network, and the continuous journey towards balancing various aspects of life. In essence, fulfillment is about doing what you love, prioritizing what matters, and sometimes, having the wisdom to say no.Embracing the Momentum of Passionate WorkMichael Katz, CEO and co-founder at mParticlehttps://humansofmartech.com/2023/09/05/87-michael-katz-the-evolution-of-packaged-cdps/ At the heart of a fulfilling life, according to MK, is the enjoyment of one's endeavors. He prioritizes his roles not by societal standards, but by personal significance, with fatherhood at the pinnacle. His career, while varied and demanding, trails behind his family in his list of priorities. This clear hierarchy is the cornerstone of his contentment, allowing him to approach his other roles with a grounded perspective.MK's experience has taught him that the objective isn't merely to become adept at riding the rollercoaster of entrepreneurship but to reach a state where the highs and lows no longer dictate his emotional landscape. The concept of equanimity emerges as a desired state—one where external circumstances lose their grip on one’s inner peace. This is not an attitude of disengagement, but rather a refined approach to emotional investment in the business world.His philosophy is crystallized in a dinner conversation with a friend, echoing Lupe Fiasco's words. The common adage of pursuing happiness is, in his view, a misguided one. Instead, MK posits that the pursuit itself ought to be happiness. Finding joy, meaning, and growth in one's work is the real measure of whether one is on the right path. It's a subtle but profound shift from happiness as a goal to happiness as the journey.MK gauges his alignment with his work through his emotions—the excitement of starting a new week and the anxious drive at the week's end, fearing time was not maximized. The day these feelings invert is the day he’ll reconsider his commitments. This barometer of passion versus productivity serves as his compass, keeping him engaged in work that fuels rather than drains him.Key Takeaway: Defining success on your own terms involves identifying what brings you intrinsic joy and pursuing it with relentless passion. MK’s reflections remind us that true happiness in our professional lives is achieved when we relish the journey itself, not just the milestones along the way. When work aligns with our values and excites us consistently, we find ourselves exactly where we need to be.Harnessing Passion as the Antidote to BurnoutJuan Mendoza, the CEO of The Martech Weeklyhttps://humansofmartech.com/2023/07/04/78-juan-mendoza-the-ethics-of-generative-ai-trust-transparency-and-the-threat-of-dehumanization/Juan draws his inspiration from an unconventional yet stirring source—Steve Irwin, the iconic Crocodile Hunter. Irwin's fervent commitment to wildlife conservation becomes a beacon for Juan, illustrating how unwavering passion can fuel both happiness and success. Like Irwin, Juan is energized by a mission that transcends mere occupation; for him, it's about making sense of the tangled web of technology and marketing, aiming to illuminate paths for others within this intricate maze.Juan's dedication to his work keeps him up into the wee hours, not out of obligation but from a deep-seated enthusiasm for discovery and education. This zeal parallels Irwin's approach, who was not merely a television personality but a fervent educator and conservationist. Juan recognizes that to be successful and fulfilled, one must be driven by a cause that ignites a “red hot passion,” much like the one that powered Irwin's every action.The notion that such passion is “kryptonite to burnout” encapsulates Juan's philosophy. It's this intensity that sustains him, allowing for extended work hours without the usual fatigue. However, he doesn’t neglect the fundamentals—adequate sleep, healthy eating, exercise, and maintaining relationships. These are the building blocks that support the demands of a passiona...