The Resilient Recruiter

Imagine this: being so meticulous in your candidate screening process invites an unexpected face-to-face investigation from Federal Agents. That is what our special guest, Lee Ann Howard, had to go through when starting as a recruiter in her early 20s. The secret to her 'suspicious' expertise? Simply asking the right questions and listening carefully to candidates.   Lee Ann is the visionary Founder of Howard & O'Brien Executive Search. With a keen eye for identifying top talent in senior management roles and a specialization in HR, finance, and sales and marketing functions, Lee Ann stands as a beacon of excellence in the realm of executive search.   You will surely enjoy Lee Ann’s insights on how to build a continuous pipeline of senior management roles for your clients and what it takes to have long-lasting strategic client relationships.   Episode Outline and Highlights 01:18 How Lee Ann left broadcasting to get into recruitment.  05:05 What made Lee Ann stand out in her early years; Her astonishing story of why she had to be investigated by the government because of her recruitment activities. 12:05 Emphasizing learning and development. 20:04 From corporate to executive search - Lee Ann shares her transition.  27:15 Discussion on the board recruiting business model of Howard & O’Brien. 45:48 Lee Ann explains their Conversation with the Board program. 48:38 Discussion on their Reverse Placement program. 51:17 How to cultivate long-term strategic client relationships. 57:30 Making it a family business - how Lee Ann’s children eventually joined her in the business.   Unexpected Government Investigation for Doing a Thorough Job Lee Ann shared an astonishing story about being investigated by federal agents because of their extensive knowledge of security-cleared roles and positions.    “I ended up getting investigated by the government because they thought I was a spy because I knew too much … I literally got visited. I was visited by the government. It was unbelievable because I was sitting in my office and the receptionist came back and they said, there's somebody here from the government to see you. And I'm like, I've paid my taxes because that's the only thing I thought I could possibly do wrong. And I got taken into a conference room and they said, we believe you know too much about what's happening. And I'm like, no, I'm not a spy. I don't work for Russia.”   This made her realize that she was probably doing something right if she was getting information that other people were not getting in their industry. Indeed she was! Asking the right questions, and being meticulous in her job, contributed highly in her success as a recruiter and later on as a recruitment business owner. Some of the takeaways on Lee Ann’s success factors are as follows:   Instinctive Recruiting Ability Curiosity and Continuous Learning  Strong Relationship Building Commitment to Hard Work Personalized Approach  Client and Candidate Engagement Being Not Focused on Sales, But on Relationships    Which of the above success factors resonate most with you as a recruiter or business owner? Board Recruiting, Conversation with the Board, and Reverse Placement Programs Lee Ann also discussed key strategies that they implement in Howard & O’Brien with the focus of providing a continuous stream of C-level talents to their clients. The three main programs she discussed are Board Recruiting, Conversation with the Board, and Reverse Placement. Below are the key concepts of the programs:   Board Recruiting Board recruiting is the process of identifying and placing individuals in board positions for organizations. Unlike traditional executive search, it involves adding responsibilities rather than replacing someone. The process includes:   Engaging with CEOs, board chairs, or governance committees to define the board’s needs. Creating a strategic long-term plan for board composition. Ensuring cultural fit and alignment with the company’s strategic direction.   Conversation with the Board This is a program aimed at increasing diversity and exposing more candidates—particularly women—to board opportunities. It was developed as a way to help executives, who may not see themselves as board material, realize their potential for board service. It involves:   Facilitating networking opportunities between potential board members and current board leaders. Encouraging companies to consider non-traditional candidates who bring valuable perspectives.   Reverse Placement Programs This is a specialized career development service for executives looking to join boards. It is either funded by companies or individuals and serves as a way for leaders to continue their professional growth. It provides:   Guidance on positioning oneself for board roles. Strategic networking with board leaders.   These programs put Lee Ann’s team in a strategic position, providing them a long-term relationship-building with existing clients.    Cultivating Long-Term Strategic Relationships On this topic, Lee Ann summarized what can make you stand out with the following experience she had: “What makes you different is what you're trying to do. And I think it's the little things. There was a marketing person that I was interviewing for a job and she knew I'd just gotten a new puppy and she sent me this little assortment of stuff for my puppy. Now I still remember that because, I mean, she listened to what I was saying. It, you know, she probably spent $20 on it. But what an impact.”   It is indeed the little things you do. Some of the best practices that Lee Ann and her team have been doing over the years are as follows: Long-Term Value Over Transactions – They prioritize relationships rather than quick sales, consistently providing valuable insights, industry articles, and strategic advice.   Community Engagement – Each team member is involved in community initiatives, reinforcing their reputation as good corporate stewards and deepening trust with clients.   Personalized Touchpoints – They maintain relationships through handwritten thank-you notes, customized gifts (e.g., olive oil or cherry salsa), and small but meaningful gestures that make an impact.   Being Helpful Beyond Business – They go beyond recruitment by assisting clients in unexpected ways, like recommending a plumber and reinforcing their role as trusted advisors.   Their approach is centered on authenticity, generosity, and a long-term mindset, setting them apart from competitors. As Lee Ann concluded, “It is putting yourself second and putting others first.”   Lee Ann Howard Bio & Contact Info As Founder and Chief Executive Officer of Howard & O’Brien, Lee Ann Howard brings with her a passion for understanding people and dedication to following their journey in executive leadership. In her 25 years of connecting high-caliber candidates with her clients, she has solidified her reputation in driving quantifiable success for million and billion-dollar companies across North America.    Lee Ann leads a Women-Owned Business and carries this spirit into diversity, inclusion, and equitable placement strategies.    Lee Ann founded Conversations with the Board® in 2001 and continues to lead workshops for those who serve or have the desire to serve boards. She is currently on the board of the American Heart Association as Leadership Development Co-chair and past Board Chair as well as Case Western Reserve University (CWRU) Family Business Center Advisory Committee. She has served on the boards of MetroHealth Foundation Board - Membership Committee Chair; the John Carroll University Entrepreneur Association - Executive Committee; In Counsel with Women - Membership Chair, The Gathering Place, Women’s Community Foundation, and Business Volunteers Unlimited (BVU).   Lee Ann is especially passionate about and involved in the shared impact of individuals in greater Cleveland. Over the course of her career, she has received the National Association of Women Business Owners Top Ten Award in Northeast Ohio, the Athena Award, and the Medical Mutual Pillar Award for Community Service.   Lee Ann on LinkedIn Howard & O’Brien website link Howard & O’Brien on LinkedIn   Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.  

In this episode, we are joined by Rickard Fritjofsson. He’s the founder and CEO of a successful multi-brand recruitment company, Worldwiders, that has placed over 5,000 people in 40 countries.   Rickard discussed key elements of their company culture, influenced by sports principles, including clear career paths and collaborative goal-setting. As a recruitment business owner, it will also resonate with you how he addressed challenges such as downsizing due to market fluctuations which is a great business case of how being resilient will allow you to turn around unfavorable situations into learnings and advantages.   Episode Outline and Highlights   [03:48] How Rickard got into recruitment and how his role as the coach of Norway’s national Bandy team influences his leadership. [08:11] Why Rickard focuses on international jobs as his niche. [13:34] Growing from 0 to $5m in six years - discussion of Nordic Jobs Worldwide’s early days. [21:56] Trigger to decide on when to make the next hire in your recruitment firm. [23:35] Discussion about the business model and the management of portfolios. [26:46] Key success factors when rapidly growing their team. [36:42] Prioritizing career development of team members via progression and support projects. [45:30] Learnings that forced them to downsize and restructure.   Targeting International Jobs as a Niche   A unique selling proposition of Rickard and his team is their focus on international jobs as a niche. “So I did some research and figured out that no company in the world, even if the recruitment industry is big, is doing the niche of language recruitment of Nordics… So we were the first to step into that niche in 2016. So Norwegian, Swedish Danish, and Finnish were the specialization, and the business developed there. And we decided also to build it organically, like stone by stone.”    Being observant of industry needs, Rickard came up with an impactful solution and built their business from there. He shared their three main objectives when launching their recruitment business: build a company organically, scale the business, and be the best in what they do. So far, Rickard and his team are on track to achieving these three main goals since starting their business in 2016.   Key Success Factors Contributing to Rapid Growth   An astonishing feat that Rickard and his team have accomplished is the rapid sustainable growth of their company since its inception. He grew the company from 0 to $5m in just six years. They have placed over 5000 people in 40 countries and they have 400+ clients worldwide. What would Rickard consider as a success factor contributing to this growth? Here are some takeaways:   Core Values-Driven Culture – Embedding Courage, Trust, and Results into daily operations and decision-making. Clear Career Progression – Offering fast internal growth opportunities, and motivating employees to excel. Decisive Expansion Strategy – Rapidly opening offices in Barcelona and Lisbon, executing growth plans with confidence. Market-Aligned Scaling – Capitalizing on post-2022 industry demand to scale efficiently. Performance-Driven Mindset – Fostering a "best in the world" mentality, akin to elite sports teams (due to his background in Bandy) Client Partnership Approach – Positioning as strategic advisors rather than just service providers. Culture of Celebration – Recognizing achievements through company-wide events, awards, and gatherings.   Rickard said,  “From day one, when we started the business, we also put up core values and they are still active in the company. We also have three keywords: courage, trust, and result. So it's like having the courage to climb Mount Everest and call it taking strategic risks, putting the trust in the people we are hiring, and from that getting the results”   Overcoming Challenges - From Scaling to Downsizing   Rickard has also been very generous in sharing their resilience mindset when overcoming challenges. The last two years have been challenging: from scaling from 0-90 employees to downsizing to 60 again and cutting costs to meet the market situation is a scenario that Rickard is not used to.    However, you will hear in our conversation his resilient recruiter mindset and how getting out of his comfort zone makes him a strong CEO who can turn around unfavorable situations. He was specific in action points that they are doing differently such as implementation of stricter financial controls and a return to foundational recruitment practices, with plans to scale responsibly with improved processes.    If you are a recruitment entrepreneur and leader, you will surely be able to relate to what he shared in his experience. Have you navigated a similar scenario as a leader before?   Rickard Fritjofsson  Bio & Contact Info   Rickard Fritjofsson is a Swedish citizen living in Norway for the past 15 years, with an apartment in Málaga, Spain that allows him to enjoy both northern and southern European lifestyles. He is the founder of Worldwiders, a multi-brand recruitment company specializing in Language Recruitment, IT, and Executive Search, serving 400+ clients across 40+ countries. Passionate about the blend of sports and business. Former bandy player, now the national coach for Team Norway, leading them to a World Cup bronze medal.   Rickard on LinkedIn Worldwiders website link Nordic Job Worldwide website link Asian Job Worldwide website link IT Jobs Worldwide website link Multilingual Jobs Worldwide website link   Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

Not everyone is born to become a recruiter, but this may be the case for our special guest, Rachel Filby. When her father convinced her to pursue a career in recruitment, she never hesitated and firmly believed that it was one of the best decisions of her life. In her first year with Michael Page, she became a top biller, and she now runs her own recruitment agency, RF Recruitment. In this episode, you will hear about the very specific success factors that led to her becoming a top performer and how she successfully transitioned to becoming a consistently successful solopreneur. Rachel has 20 years of recruitment experience, initially working for one of the largest recruitment agencies in the world.  In the Financial Times Survey 2024, Rachel Filby was recognized as one of the top 150 recruiters in the UK.  Episode Outline and Highlights [01:09] How Rachel got into recruiting and how she became the number one biller at Michael Page. [11:21] Five success factors in becoming a top billing perm recruiter in the UK in her first year. [19:33] Thought process that motivates Rachel’s sense of urgency. [25:22] Discussion on rapid career trajectory and development as a leader. [32:00] Launching RF Recruitment agency during COVID and while integrating family life. [40:55] Rachel reveals her typical day-to-day process (past-present-future approach). [48:13] Best practices on lead generation and business development. [1:00:55] Rapid fire questions - business model, tech stack, etc.   Five Success Factors of Becoming the Top Biller in Her First Year as a Recruiter Rachel initially wanted a career in media, but her father recommended that she take recruitment as a career path. At 21, she started her career with Michael Page and became a top biller in her first year!  Although she primarily attributes her success to the great training she received from Michael Page, I found five success factors that could resonate well with many aspiring recruiters who also plan to become future recruitment business owners:   Commitment to Training and Preparation: Rachel took her training seriously, treating it with the level of commitment often reserved for seasoned professionals.  Strong Work Ethic and Dedication: Her willingness to work long hours and focus on her tasks set her apart.  Genuine Passion for People: Her empathy and listening skills allowed her to build meaningful relationships and understand individuals' unique needs, making her a trusted advisor during critical moments in their careers. Focus on High Activity Levels and KPIs: Rachel consistently met or exceeded her KPIs, which ensured a steady pipeline of candidates and opportunities. Sense of Urgency and Speed: Rachel’s natural inclination for urgency enabled her to act swiftly on opportunities.    Together, these factors, along with the right mindset and strategy, propelled Rachel to outstanding success in her first year as a recruiter. This also led to a strong career trajectory, with her getting an early promotion as a manager.   Using the Past-Present-Future Approach in Day-to-Day Business   As a recruitment solopreneur, it can be challenging for Rachel to handle the end-to-end process of her business due to capacity challenges. This is also on top of her duty as a mother, as she places high value on taking care of her kids. I wanted to know her day-to-day process and how she can sustain her momentum in successfully running her business with consistent billing and client acquisition.   She explained, “I kind of separate my, my thought process and on my business in kind of three areas. So it's past, present, and future.”   She elaborated that the “past” means protecting the money she made or existing relationships. This entails a lot of aftercare and ensuring that relationships are continuously maintained.   The “present” is explained as “Then I have kind of the present, which is jobs I'm currently recruiting, candidates I'm currently working with. That's my kind of here-and-now. So, you know, I guess there's a bit of a sweet spot of how many jobs, you know, you have that you can do a really good job on within the time that you have. And you don't really want too many more than that or too many less than that.”   The “future” refers to business development and lead generation to secure the source of the next job.   Do you also apply the same approach to your business?   Best Practices on Lead Generation and Business Development   When discussing the “future” principle, I wanted to pick Rachel’s brains on her approach to business development and lead generation as well as how much time she spends in this aspect of her business. Below are some takeaways:   1. Proactive and Low-Pressure Engagement   Rachel consistently monitors her niche market, staying updated on who’s hiring and when they might need her services. She engages early in the recruitment process with no expectation of immediately winning the job, allowing her to build rapport without pressuring the client.   2. Intentional Targeting and Tailored Communication   Her outreach is bespoke and personal—whether it’s a phone call, LinkedIn message, or email—avoiding generic marketing materials in favor of tailored communication that resonates with potential clients.   3. Prioritizing Connection Through Calls   Despite the prevalence of digital communication, Rachel emphasizes the power of phone calls as the foundation of strong client relationships. She supplements this with follow-ups via voicemail, email, and LinkedIn to ensure she remains on their radar.   Rachel Filby Bio & Contact Info   Rachel Filby has 20 years of recruitment experience working initially for one of the largest recruitment agencies in the world and now runs her recruitment agency specializing in Facilities Management Recruitment. Rachel Filby is recognized as one of the top 150 recruiters in the UK in the Financial Times Survey 2024.    Rachel on LinkedIn RF Recruit website link   People and Resources Mentioned  Firefish  Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter   If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.  

Mary Morton reveals how converting scientific research into strategic relationships revolutionized her recruitment approach. A biology major turned pharmaceutical recruiter, she leverages investor presentations and company pipelines to identify opportunities before her competitors.  This research-driven strategy and building deep client trust helped her agency thrive from its 2008 recession launch through today's market challenges. Episode Outline and Highlights [04:50] How Mary accidentally got into recruitment. [08:30] Critical foundations contributing to recruitment career longevity. [17:26] Building relationships and walking the talk: Mary’s ingredients to success. [29:37] Mary is a science nerd and how she uses this quality to connect with clients. [39:43] How preparation and research in advance make it easy for May to connect with decision-makers for potential clients. [42:21] Adding value in your niche as a recruitment organization. [45:20] Quick fire questions. [49:27] Why Mary launched her podcast, MSLead Chronicles. [53:27] Mary shared one of the biggest roadblocks she had to overcome.   Critical Foundations in Billing $10M  Mary's 30+ years of experience demonstrates how becoming an industry expert enables proactive rather than reactive recruiting. Her biology degree and pharmaceutical specialization became powerful advantages in building a $10M+ billing desk. Her longevity in the industry and accomplishments in the pharmaceutical niche can be attributed to several foundational elements: Curiosity and Science-Driven Approach: She emphasized the importance of being a "nerd" about the industry you work in, highlighting her drive to learn everything about the pharmaceutical space. People-Centric Focus: While being a people person is essential, Mary combined this quality with deep industry expertise and strategic focus to excel in recruitment, a role that requires more than interpersonal skills. Relentless Drive and Discipline: Mary's strong work ethic and determination were inspired by her father, a Marine Corps officer with a 31-year career. His values of accountability, responsibility, and perseverance deeply influenced her approach to work.   These factors, combined with her adaptability, niche specialization, and focus on continuous learning, have solidified her position as a leader in the recruitment industry.   How to Add Value to Your Niche as a Recruitment Organization   “Well, if they're already niched, I think they owe it to themselves as well as to the candidates and clients that they're serving to be an expert in the space that they're niched in or that they claim to be niched in. You know, I think that's where the value comes it.” This statement summarizes Mary’s mindset on adding value to your industry niche as a recruitment organization.   By investing in niche-specific knowledge and preparation, recruitment organizations can elevate their effectiveness and differentiate themselves in competitive markets. It also brings about the following benefits that Mary elaborated on in our discussion:   Enhanced Expertise and Credibility Anticipation of Objections Improved Candidate and Client Engagement Higher Placement Success Rates Efficiency in Communication Tailored Solutions Long-Term Industry Impact   One way Mary builds her credibility in her relevant niche (in addition to her longevity) is by hosting a podcast.   Comprehensive Information Gathering as Competitive Advantage  Mary's approach to information gathering goes far beyond standard job requirements. This thorough preparation becomes a key differentiator in her market. She can easily engage with potential clients' primary decision-makers, which results in optimum connection rates.   She shared the essential elements of her process:   Detailed initial client conversations beyond job descriptions Documentation of potential objections and prepared responses Collection of scientific/technical information candidates might question Market feedback about the company's reputation Preparation of selling points and challenge responses   These strategies directly contributed to Mary's ability to build a sustainable business that has thrived through multiple market downturns while maintaining premium fees averaging $50,000.   Mary Morton Bio & Contact Info   Mary began her recruiting career 30 years ago this coming March. For the last 25 years in the pharmaceutical industry. She owns SEMbio, a niche recruiting firm in field-based medical affairs, that she founded in 2008 with her longtime colleague and business partner, Nicole Evans. She has been a member of the Pinnacle Society for 7 years and runs a 360 desk that is primarily focused on account management, with personal billings above $10M over the last 15 years. (I only have billing records going back to 2011!)   Sembio website link MSLead Chronicles Podcast on YouTube   People and Resources Mentioned    Nicole Evans on LinkedIn Chad Fellers on LinkedIn Pinnacle Society PCRecruiter  Ring Central Hinterview  Swordfish Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn,  Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.  

Hugh has zero background in recruiting but extensive experience in agriculture. How did he leverage his industry knowledge and establish a recruitment firm that rapidly grew in five years?   You will most certainly enjoy learning about his mindset, strategies, and how he overcame several roadblocks when he founded Cultura Connect, a company specializing in recruitment within the agriculture, food, and forestry sectors.   Since its inception, the business has experienced rapid growth. They’re now a team of 13 with extensive knowledge and experience in agriculture and related fields.   Hugh is passionate about nurturing and developing talent in the agricultural, food, and forestry industries, leveraging his experience and unique insight into the challenges of building effective teams.   Episode Outline and Highlights   [02:11] Hugh’s background in the agricultural industry and recruitment. [11:30] Key stages in building Cultura Connect. [20:15] Overcoming the challenges of building your internal team. [26:58] Roadblocks and solutions that Hugh and his team have encountered in a remote setup. [38:42] Taking time to overcome other challenges in a new recruitment business. [44:41] Discussion on Cashflow Metrics and KPIs. [48:31] Hugh’s absolute keys to success. [51:48] Minimum standards that Hugh looks for members of his team. [54:28] Branding and marketing strategies.   Industry Knowledge is a Key Differentiator in Niche Recruitment   Hugh's story shows how deep industry expertise can become a recruitment agency's strongest differentiator. His agricultural background became a powerful business advantage, enabling Cultura Connect's rapid growth. His background in agriculture and tech became a critical differentiator in successfully bridging the gap between agricultural expertise and talent acquisition.    Focusing on his strengths and leveraging his background gave him the following advantages:   Niche credibility due to his agriculture experience. Accurate candidate assessments. Extensive network. A clear understanding of his client’s needs. Understanding of innovation and upcoming trends (ex. AgriTech).   Leveraging your field background and experience as a recruiter can be an invaluable key factor in your success when launching your recruitment business.   Choosing the Right People is the Main Key to Success   What Hugh and his business partner have accomplished in the past 5 years is phenomenal. Since its inception, the business has experienced rapid growth with now a team of 13! When I asked him to summarize his absolute key factors to success, he mentioned:    “Getting the right people, people that really understand the industry. That's allowed us to be seen as the Agricultural specialist, the forestry specialist, food specialist. Because we've got that team of individuals, all those individuals are passionate about that. They're passionate about doing a good job, they're committed and I guess ultimately they fit with our culture. So people will be one of the key things for us.”   Ironically, building an internal team can be challenging for recruitment business owners. Hiring the wrong person can reduce growth, profit, and cash flow. Hugh focuses on minimum brand values when identifying someone who will be part of their team. Some of these are:   Passion for the Industry Compassion Resilience Team Orientation Integrity Proactivity Quality over Quantity   These values highlight Hugh's emphasis on creating a team that is not only skilled but also aligned with Cultura Connect's cultural and ethical requirements.   Best Practices in Remote Team Management   Hugh also shared pragmatic approaches to managing a remote team. Cultura Connect's approach to remote work is a great example of maintaining team performance and culture without a physical office. Their success stems from a deliberate balance of virtual and in-person connections. However, there are critical elements and cadences that are present: Team rhythm: 6-weekly in-person work sessions combined with weekly virtual meetings Quarterly activities: Structured team-building events (from hiking to canoeing) Strategic onboarding: Initial 3-4 days in-person with ongoing mentorship Flexible workspaces: Supporting team members who prefer occasional office settings The model enables growth while reducing overhead costs, demonstrating how remote-first can strengthen rather than compromise recruitment operations. Hugh Pocock Bio & Contact Info   Hugh Pocock is the Founding Director of a recruitment business, Cultura Connect - specializing in recruitment for agriculture, food, and forestry sectors. The business was founded in 2020, with his business partner Tom Marsh, where they have successfully combined Hugh’s 20+ years of experience in agribusiness with Tom’s 20+ years of experience in recruitment. The business has grown rapidly since its inception with the development of a team of recruitment experts with in-depth knowledge and experience in agriculture and related sectors.   Born and raised on his grandparent’s dairy farm in Shropshire, a passion for agriculture was formed from Hugh’s early years. Heavily involved in Holstein Young Breeders in his youth, then going on to graduate with a degree from Harper Adams, Hugh pursued a career in cattle genetics and gained over 15 years of experience in a variety of high-level commercial roles.  In 2016 Hugh signed a farm tenancy, with his wife and two children, on a 100% grass-based 150 acre farm near Whitchurch, Shropshire. Here they farm New Zealand Romney sheep, Polled Dorset Sheep and Wagyu cattle. Sustainability and working closely with nature is their farming philosophy, managing the farm with multiple environmental stewardship initiatives.  Hugh is passionate about nurturing and developing talent in the agricultural, food, and forestry industries, and having the opportunity to work with a multitude of businesses across these sectors gives him a unique insight into the challenges of building and retaining high-performing teams.   Hugh on LinkedIn Cultura Connect website link Cultura Connect on Instagram   People and Resources Mentioned    Matt Walsh on LinkedIn Tom Marsh on LinkedIn Overdue Invoices? Here’s How to Collect Your Placement Fee!   Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.  

Few people have established the credibility and connections that Jessica Hamilton has when it comes to recruiting in the financial crime space. Jess is the go-to recruiter in London for financial crime roles, with over a decade of experience partnering with clients to build out their teams. In our conversation, Jess shares the fascinating story of how a discussion in a pub first got her interested in specializing in financial crime recruitment. She went on to launch and build highly successful teams, first at Robert Walters, then Investigo where she led the top-performing financial services recruitment team globally. Recently, Jess took her career to the next level by launching her own firm, FincSelect, with business partner Ian Christie. Jess reveals the keys to her success, including focusing on being a trusted advisor, not just a transactional recruiter. Her "soft sell" marketing approach, sharing valuable insights and building real relationships, has made her the recruiter of choice in her market.   Episode Outline and Highlights   [02:24] How Jess got into recruiting marketing roles to Financial Crime. [07:16] Key factors in building the biggest billing desk in Investigo. [12:58] Discussion of Jess’s power phrases: “The placement is the prize, not the program” & “The art of the soft sell” [16:15] Becoming a credible thought leader through LinkedIn. [24:36] How panels and other platforms can help establish your expertise in your niche community. [32:09] Video phone calls and LinkedIn messaging to get a “larger surface of luck.” [40:28] Doing BD daily - Jess shares their best practice. [43:45] How to drive and use referrals from clients and candidates as a primary metric. [53:25] Navigating work-life integration by prioritizing and being task-focused.   Nuggets of Wisdom from Jess   Jess shared insightful perspectives on her recruitment cadence and approach in our conversation. Below are the power phrases she shared that I am sure will resonate well to recruiters and business owners, both new and tenured:    "The placement is the prize, not the program"   Jessica stresses the importance of focusing on long-term outcomes rather than immediate successes. In her experience, success in recruitment comes from investing time and effort into understanding the market deeply, building expertise, and creating value for clients beyond merely filling roles.    "The art of the soft sell":   Jessica highlights the effectiveness of positioning oneself as a knowledgeable consultant rather than a traditional recruiter. She builds trust and credibility by demonstrating expertise, being genuinely curious, and consistently engaging with the market (e.g., hosting events, having insightful conversations, and creating content on LinkedIn). This approach fosters a natural demand for her services, emphasizing the value of being seen as an advisor who shapes team structures and strategies.   Using Referral as a Metric to Drive Growth   Another interesting approach shared by Jess is how they use referrals as a primary metric. She has created a sustainable practice by prioritizing the quality of relationships that generate ongoing referrals. Some key strategies she shared for building a referral-based business are outlined below: Tracking all referral sources meticulously in your CRM Using brief, personal outreach messages focused on relationship-building Leveraging WhatsApp (desktop) for efficient communication management Building strategic partnerships with complementary businesses Always asking for referrals in every conversation Treating candidates and clients with equal importance Focus on authentic relationships over formal referral schemes "How can you decide if you're the best if no one's referring you?" This mindset has enabled Jessica to build a business where quality relationships drive consistent growth rather than relying solely on direct business development efforts.   Brand Development as the new “BD” in Recruitment One of the most important takeaways from Jessica's approach is how she redefines BD—not as "business development," but as "brand development." Instead of relying solely on the usual cold calls and sales tactics, Jessica has carved out a thriving niche by positioning herself as a thought leader in financial crime recruitment. Her strategy shows that by consistently building your personal and professional brand, you can create a steady flow of inbound opportunities.   Some strategies she implements are as follows: Posting consistently on LinkedIn (3x weekly) between 10 am-4 pm Tuesday-Friday Sponsoring strategic industry events as the sole recruitment partner  Building credibility through association with industry leaders (ex. International Compliance Association) Jessica Hamilton Bio and Contact Info  Jessica is pretty much synonymous with financial crime recruitment in London. She is the most well-known recruiter in her space and is seen as a thought leader and industry expert. She has featured in a book of financial crime compliance experts "Financial Crime Fighter - Book of Mentors", alongside many global heads of banks and industry. She speaks on industry panels and is the recruitment expert on the new ICA course for new MLROs. Jess has been recruiting for just over 10 years and created her first financial crime desk from scratch initially at Robert Walters in London, after meeting a girl in a pub who did financial crime (Jess thought the role sounded interesting) Jess then went onto replicate this at another global recruitment agency, based in London (Investigo) where within 2 years, she had built it to the top billing desk in financial services, globally.  It was at Investigo she met her business partner, Ian Christie.  After the birth of her first son, Ian approached Jess to start out on there own, and after returning from maternity leave the founded FincSelect in 2022.  Jessica on LinkedIn FincSelect website   People and Resources Mentioned Ian Christie on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.  

If there is one thing more certain in marketing and branding, it is this: Making videos is no longer optional for building a successful recruitment business brand. How do you overcome the common barriers, misconceptions, and complexities of creating effective video content? What are the proven ROI and benefits of doing so? In this episode, we are joined by Sunjay Vyas, an accomplished videographer, video podcast producer, and content creator based in the UK. He prides himself on producing compelling video content. Episode Outline and Highlights: [01:50] Sunjay’s story of starting in recruitment at age 16 and becoming a sourcer at 18. [09:27] Realizing his passion: What made Sunjay shift to a different role from recruitment?  [15:21] Three biggest misconceptions of recruitment business owners on video and audio content creation. [20:09] Overcoming the fear of creating videos for branding: building an audience. [28:22] Becoming an authority in your space by putting yourself out there. [31:51] Outsourcing, keeping it simple, and the importance of starting small and being consistent. [38:48] Generating inbound leads by constantly creating content. [40:08] Advanced content strategies and repurposing for those who already host their podcast. [44:25] Information about "Behind the Mic" community resource The Three Common Misconceptions or Barriers to Creating Video Content   Some recruitment business owners find creating videos or audio content difficult when building their brand. Sunjay and I agreed on the three most common misconceptions, and if you can relate to any of these, then you will enjoy this episode as we explain why the benefits and return on investment outweigh the barriers.   It’s Too Complicated or Overwhelming   Why It’s a Misconception:   Recruitment business owners often see video production as a technical, complex, and time-consuming process. Many start as solopreneurs already juggling multiple roles, making video creation feel like an enormous task.   Why It Shouldn’t Be:   Modern tools and platforms have simplified video production. With minimal equipment and basic editing software, creating professional-looking videos is accessible and manageable even for beginners. Starting small and scaling up can reduce overwhelm.   It’s Too Expensive with Unclear ROI   Why It’s a Misconception:   The cost of video production can seem prohibitive, especially if the return on investment (ROI) is uncertain. Business owners might struggle to see how content creation directly translates into revenue.   Why It Shouldn’t Be:   Video content builds brand visibility, trust, and long-term customer relationships, indirectly boosting sales and recruitment opportunities. Even low-cost content can yield significant returns through consistent engagement and brand presence.   Feeling Uncomfortable or Experiencing Imposter Syndrome   Why It’s a Misconception:   Though confident in conversations, recruitment business owners might feel uneasy in front of the camera. Self-doubt creeps in, raising fears of judgment, embarrassment, or not being perceived as valuable.   Why It Shouldn’t Be:   Authenticity resonates more than perfection. Audiences appreciate real, relatable content. Over time, regular practice helps overcome camera shyness and builds confidence, making the process more natural.   The Three ROIs of Video Content and Podcasting   The three benefits below, which can bring an exponential ROI to your recruitment business, counter the three common misconceptions about creating video content. Many of our previous guests, as well as many from our existing coaching community, have proven and shared these benefits. 1. Building an Audience Video content and podcasting allow businesses to reach a broader audience beyond one-on-one interactions. By sharing valuable insights online, companies can connect with potential clients and candidates they might never meet otherwise. Even if viewers or listeners don’t engage directly, the content can still impact their decisions, creating a ripple effect. Consistency is key—regularly publishing content builds trust, credibility, and a loyal following, transforming businesses from being the best-kept secret to a well-known industry authority.   2. Becoming an Authority in Your Space Creating content positions businesses as experts in their field. Companies can demonstrate expertise by sharing knowledge, insights, and solutions to industry challenges rather than just claiming it. This visibility helps potential clients associate the business with industry leadership and up-to-date insights. People trust brands that consistently showcase their know-how, making them the go-to resource when prospects need help or advice.   3. Generating Leads Podcasts and videos serve as powerful lead-generation tools. They create touchpoints that nurture relationships and keep businesses top-of-mind for potential clients. A well-executed content strategy can convert casual listeners or viewers into paying customers. Testimonials from businesses gaining clients through podcasts illustrate this, showing how content can be a direct revenue driver and a long-term business development asset. Best Practices and Tips Sunjay shared a few best practices and pragmatic approaches to creating content without adversely affecting your day-to-day schedule. Some of the core practices he discussed are: Create consistent content (start with one post per week) Share your daily recruitment expertise through video Build trust through regular video presence Scale your one-to-one conversations into content   Sunjay said, "People want to see you... when you see this person, you see them interacting with someone else on camera and you see the engagement, I think that builds trust quicker than anything else."  One of our success stories is our coaching community member Jodi, who went from refusing to do videos to winning new business through her video content and podcast. Her story demonstrates how video content can transform a recruitment business's lead generation strategy from constant outbound activity to attracting pre-qualified, inbound leads. Sunjay Vyas Bio and Contact Info  Sunjay Vyas is an accomplished videographer, video podcast producer, and content creator based in the UK. He prides himself on producing compelling video content. Whether he's hosting his own show or working with clients, Sunjay brings creativity and professionalism to every project. He is passionate about leveraging the power of video to tell impactful stories and engage audiences. In addition to video production, Sunjay has experience managing, recruiting, and training teams earlier in his career. He spent several years in recruitment across London and the Middle East, specializing in financial markets technology. Sunjay studied Exercise and Sports Science and holds qualifications in personal training and fitness coaching. Outside of work, he enjoys staying active and spending time with his family. With his dedication to creating compelling content, strong technical skills, ability to connect with audiences, and over a decade working in recruitment Sunjay is an asset and we are happy to have him on board. Visit my Amazon storefront at Anisha & Sunjay. Remember, these are affiliate links - you don't pay any extra, but Amazon sends me a few pennies for the referral.   Sunjay Vyas on LinkedIn Behind the Mic - LinkedIn newsletter and community founded by Sunjay and Anisha.   People and Resources Mentioned Jodi Mayer on LinkedIn Circle  James Clear - Atomic Habits   Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.  

"Work hardest when times are best, not worst" - this counterintuitive philosophy helped Brock Boyd build a 25-year tech recruitment empire that's survived three major market crashes. When Brock Boyd started his recruitment firm in 1998, he ran his business from his bedroom in a shared house, where suited colleagues would show up to work daily - sometimes while he was still sleeping from late-night prospecting.  Today, 25 years later, he's a member of the prestigious Pinnacle Society leading an international tech sales recruitment practice. Through multiple market cycles - from the dot-com crash to 2008's recession to today's tech slowdown - Brock has built Career Management Inc. (CMI) into a sustainable business while developing wealth-building principles that have given him true financial freedom. Episode Outline and Highlights: [01:49] How a friend needing a ride to a job fair led to recruitment. [04:27] Taking the entrepreneurial leap after just 11 months! [10:47] Recalling the early days: Cold calling from his bedroom while colleagues showed up in suits. [15:26] Discussion of peak performance periods: 1999-2000 and 2021-2022. [18:17] Focus on resilience: Surviving 2002 and the $63,000 bankruptcy challenge [24:22] "I work by far the hardest in the best of times" - Brock's contrarian business philosophy [27:47] Smart financial moves most recruiters miss: The "two boulders" theory [38:51] How to retire early as recruiters: The three key factors [54:56] Tech stack deep dive: What works in modern recruitment [1:03:19] Understanding market cycles: "It's like winter and spring will come" Building a Recession-Proof Tech Sales Recruitment Practice After being hired by a staffing firm, Brock launched his own business after only 11 months! He had a fascinating story of finding his way into permanent staffing without really having much of a background before starting his recruitment firm. From solo operator to leading an international team, Brock has built Career Management Inc. (CMI) into a sustainable practice over 25 years. Starting with just three clients in 1998, he strategically evolved from general sales to specialized tech sales recruitment. Here is his firm’s current structure: 3.5 full-desk recruiters (US-based) 2.5 candidate-focused recruiters International support team across Argentina, Colombia, Philippines, and India Support staff handling administrative and database work Below are the key success factors that helped his business thrive over the years, through multiple market cycles, including the dot-com crash, the 2008 recession, and the current tech slowdown, while growing sustainably through each recovery. Early specialization in tech sales (higher fees vs general sales) Lean operations during growth years Strategic investment in revenue-generating tools Counter-cyclical work approach: highest effort during boom markets Maintaining core tools during downturns while cutting non-essential costs Personal Finance & Wealth Building for Recruiters A topic that resonates well with me is how Brock gives value to personal finance and wealth building for people in the recruitment industry. Most successful recruiters earn exceptional income, yet struggle to build lasting wealth in the long term. Brock has been a great example of turning his recruitment earnings into true financial freedom through disciplined investing and smart money management. He shared his mindset and strategies on how he balances his investment strategy with different instruments and risks.  Below are some core best practices he shared on the topic of personal finance: Keep lifestyle expenses well below earnings, especially in good years Never invest more than 10% of total assets in any single investment Maintain substantial cash reserves to buy assets during downturns Focus on three key areas: work earnings, investment earnings, and lifestyle costs "The further below your earnings your lifestyle and spending are, the faster you're going to get to financial freedom. And the closer they are, or God forbid they're overlapped in the wrong direction, then the further away that is." This disciplined approach has helped Brock build sustainable wealth through multiple market cycles while many recruiters, despite high earnings, struggle with long-term financial security. “Working Hardest in the Best of Times” "Work hardest when times are best, not worst" - this counterintuitive philosophy helped Brock Boyd build a 25-year tech recruitment empire that's survived three major market crashes.  Brock’s work ethic revolves around maintaining resilience through challenging times while recognizing the role of external factors. Uniquely, Brock works hardest during prosperous times, moderately during stable periods, and least during downturns. He views this approach as a strategic response to the opportunity cost, focusing energy where returns are likely highest. This pragmatic mindset helps him stay balanced and focused despite industry fluctuations. Disclaimer: This podcast does not provide financial or tax advice; listeners are encouraged to consult a qualified professional for personalized guidance.   Brock Boyd Bio and Contact Info  Brock has served as President/Chief Executive Officer since founding Career Management, Inc. in April 1998. His aggressive pursuit of face time with the staffing industry’s leading experts led him to become the youngest member on the Board of the National Association of Personnel Services in 2001. To date, Brock has completed over 500 successful searches. In May of 2000, he was featured in the NAPS newsletter for his accomplishments and vision.    In addition, he received his CPC (Certified Personnel Consultant) designation in 2003. He has also produced and delivered seminars on interviewing skills (for candidates seeking positions as well as hiring managers). He has been hired to deliver sales training to multiple companies as well as consulting several companies on the process of building/hiring a sales organization from scratch.   Brock graduated from Old Dominion University where he was a NCAA Division I Collegiate Wrestler. He lives in Vienna, VA with his wife and son. Brock Boyd on LinkedIn  CMI (Career Management Inc) website  People and Resources Mentioned Bullhorn (ATS) LinkedIn Recruiter LinkedIn Sales Navigator Prospect Ladder  Lusha  ZoomInfo  Pinnacle Society  S&P 500 Index   Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

From being laid off at 5 weeks postpartum to generating nearly $700K in 14 months, Julia Arpag demonstrates how embracing change can lead to extraordinary success. After launching Aligned Recruitment, she developed a unique retainer model that transformed client relationships and created predictable revenue while building a remote team that serves clients internationally. Julia founded Aligned Recruitment, specializing in tech recruitment for small and medium-sized businesses. Join us as she shares her journey from unexpected layoffs to building a thriving recruitment practice.   Episode Outline and Highlights [01:28] Journey into recruitment through college admissions. [03:17] The layoff that sparked entrepreneurship - 5 weeks postpartum. [08:11] Starting the business part-time during maternity leave. [16:49] Developing a unique monthly retainer model. [21:02] Creating trust through a generous partnership approach. [25:10] Building and structuring a remote team. [30:34] International recruitment strategy and market focus. [39:41] Handholding new clients. [49:26] Detailed breakdown of successful sales campaigns.  [54:14] Running multiple lead generation campaigns. [57:15] Faith, family, and building with purpose.   Reimagining the Recruitment Business Model Julia developed a distinctive monthly retainer model that transformed how she partners with clients: "A lot of recruiters only charge fee-based. So they're like, wait, you want me to pay you before you've given me a hire? Like, that's psychotic... I want to be your go-to recruitment partner for the entirety of the existence of your business." Julia's retainer model in recruitment operates on a monthly subscription-like approach, charging clients based on the number of roles they need to fill rather than per placement. Here's how it works and its unique benefits: How the Retainer Model Works: Flat Monthly Fee: Clients pay a monthly retainer based on the estimated time and effort required to fill their roles. Per-Role Pricing: The fee scales with the number of roles, offering discounts for higher volumes (e.g., five or more roles). Flexible Engagement: Clients can start with a single role to test the service and then expand based on their hiring needs. Transparent Estimation: Julia provides upfront estimates for time-to-fill, often under-promising and over-delivering. This approach translates to unique relationships, repeat business, and client trust building as summarized below: Cost Efficiency: Clients avoid paying steep, one-time placement fees, even if multiple candidates are hired for a single role. Trust and Partnership: The model fosters long-term relationships, positioning Julia as an extension of the client’s team rather than a transactional vendor. Predictability: Fixed monthly costs provide budget certainty, even for complex or ongoing hiring needs. Comprehensive Support: This option is ideal for smaller businesses without in-house recruiting teams. It offers a "fractional recruiter" who handles all hiring needs without the risks of permanent staff. This model balances generosity with strategic value, prioritizing trust and repeat business over short-term gains.   Building a Systematic Sales Campaign Despite never closing a deal before launching her business, Julia developed a systematic sales approach that helped her reach nearly $700K in 14 months. She shares her exact process: Lead Research: "I have someone on Fiverr... charges me 10 bucks for 50 lead needs" with clear parameters: Companies with under 200 employees Currently hiring software engineers Contacts from C-suite and engineering leadership Multi-Channel Campaign: Step 1: Sends personalized Loom videos via email (using Apollo) Step 2: Runs a parallel Dripify connection-only campaign on LinkedIn Step 3: After connection acceptance, follow up with LinkedIn selfie videos "My theory is it's more personal... I think LinkedIn selfies are reminiscent of more personal messaging platforms where people feel like it's like their buddy Julia just dropping in to check in how their Tuesday's going." When running active campaigns, Julia commits to sending 20 personalized outreach videos daily or 100 per week. She also runs a separate automated Dripify messaging campaign targeting past client contacts, doubling down on what's working since many of her clients come from previous relationships. This systematic approach, combined with genuine relationship building, has helped her consistently win new business without traditional hard-selling techniques.   Remote Team Building and International Recruitment From solo founder to a team of four, Julia has built a remote-first practice that serves clients internationally. Starting with contract recruiters during her maternity leave, she strategically evolved her team structure based on business growth. Today, her team includes a Director of Talent Acquisition managing client delivery, an Operations Manager, and a Sourcer based in South Africa (hired through Remote First as EOR), all working virtually. "I employ them through an employer of record, an EOR. And I use Remote First... my entire team is remote. No one else is based here in Atlanta." This flexible team structure allows Julia to scale based on client needs while maintaining quality delivery through specialized roles - proving you can build a successful recruitment business without a traditional office-based team. Are you also interested in building a remote setup for your recruitment business?   Julia Arpag Bio and Contact Info Julia Arpag is the CEO & Founder of tech recruitment firm Aligned Recruitment. We've been in business since August 2023, are fully bootstrapped, have closed over $500k in new business, and are scaling fast.    We specialize in hiring for SMBs (10-200 employees) in the tech industry. We have clients in custom software development, platform management, real estate investment, and security hardware, to name a few.  I'm also a foster parent to two teen boys, a mom to two little boys, a wife, and a proud transplant to Atlanta from upstate NY. Julia on Linkedin Aligned Recruitment Website link People and Resources Mentioned Dripify LinkedIn Recruiter LinkedIn Sales Navigator Recruiter Flow (ATS/CRM) RemoFirst (EOR platform) Apollo Fiverr Loom   Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn,  Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.

From working 90-hour weeks in tech recruitment to building a thriving healthcare practice that runs on 50 hours, Maddie Loomis discovered that sometimes doing less is the key to achieving more. After launching Advanced Scope, she specialized in orthopedics and sports medicine recruitment. She doubled her revenue by shifting from contingent to retained search and building the right team while working nearly half the hours. Maddie is the founder of Advanced Scope and the host of the Healthy Careers podcast. Join us as she shares her journey and the key decisions that transformed her business into what it is today.   Episode Outline and Highlights [01:58] From fundraising to recruitment - Maddie's unexpected path into healthcare recruiting [03:39] Why leave tech? Maddie’s decision to start Advanced Scope [03:52] Choosing healthcare and orthopedics specialization despite tech background [15:01] The game-changer: Moving from contingent to retained search [16:37] Innovative "dating period" approach to client relationships [27:39] Building the right team: Finding people who share your values [30:34] Unique co-working approach to testing team fit [35:56] Creating sustainability: Journey from 90 to 50-hour weeks [43:24] Leveraging the Healthy Careers podcast for business growth [45:23] Converting podcast guests into business relationships [47:21] Future vision: Creating a self-sufficient team How This Healthcare Recruiter Doubled Revenue with a Simple Shift in Business Model   When Maddie experienced the frustration of losing three months of work when a contingent client suddenly decided to hire internally, she knew something had to change. The reality of contingent recruiting meant competing with multiple agencies and often sending candidates to several practices to maximize placement chances.   "If I'm contingent working on your role, and I know that there's absolutely, you know, like a 15 to 20% chance that I'm filling this position, I'm going to type in where your practice is and look up every other practice within that region that I could send that candidate to."   Her solution? An innovative "dating period" approach that starts contingent on testing the relationship before transitioning to retained. This allows both parties to ensure fit while demonstrating the value of a committed partnership. The strategy proved transformative - doubling her income from year one to year two while improving client relationships and candidate experience.   When presenting retained partnerships, Maddie addresses common client frustrations with contingent recruitment head-on. She helps them understand that without mutual commitment, they're competing not just for candidates but with other opportunities their recruiter is pursuing. As she explains, "It's not about the money. I want you to show me that you're in this with me and that you actually want me to win."   The result? A more predictable business model, higher-quality client relationships, and the ability to focus deeply on fewer, more committed searches. Most importantly, it created the foundation for a sustainable business that serves both clients and candidates more effectively.   Building a Recruitment Business That Doesn't Depend on You    Working late nights and answering Slack messages on her wedding day wasn't what Maddie envisioned when starting her recruitment business. "I got to the point where it was like, okay, either I'm going to burn out and this is going to be short-lived, or I'm going to get the right people on the bus and give them the trust to do the things."   She realized that she had to hire the right team members for her business to be self-sustaining. Here are the key action points she took:   Created a unique "co-working" approach to test cultural fit before hiring Empowered team with up to 50% commission structure Built systems that allow people to run their own "mini-businesses" Reduced hours from 90 to 50 while doubling revenue Focused on being a visionary instead of doing everything herself   Today, her business thrives on trust, autonomy, and shared values rather than founder dependency. Do you envision your recruitment business to be the same?   Podcasting to Engage with Audience and Future Business Relationships   Madison effectively uses her podcast, "Healthy Careers," to engage with her audience and build business relationships. Here is a summary of how she is doing this:   Madison's podcast allows her to connect with her audience and potential clients on a personal level. She shares insights and experiences that give listeners a better understanding of her expertise and the market. By recording three to four podcasts a week, she ensures consistent engagement with her audience, providing valuable content and building rapport with listeners.   The podcast is a platform for developing long-term relationships with clients and partners. Through the podcast, Madison gets a feel for the market pulse, which helps in better conversations with clients. Madison's strategy of sending personalized gifts like engraved Yeti cups and gift cards to podcast guests fosters a sense of exclusivity and gratitude. This thoughtful gesture reinforces the relationship and keeps their brand top of mind. Business conversions may not be immediate, but the trust built over time through high-touch follow-ups and engaging content helps convert podcast guests into clients in the future.   Madison Loomis Bio and Contact Info   Maddie has a background in healthcare, finance, and technology as both a recruiter and HRBP. After 8 years in Corporate America, she set out to reshape the typical staffing approach. She is now the owner of Advanced Scope - a boutique search firm focused on permanent, direct hire for Orthopaedic & Sports Medicine private practices in hiring clinical and leadership positions.  Maddie on LinkedIn Maddie on Instagram Maddie on X Maddie on Youtube Healthy Careers Podcast Advanced Scope website Advanced Scope on Facebook   People and Resources Mentioned Wounded Warrior Project  Slack LinkedIn   Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn  Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter   If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please take two minutes to leave a review. Your review is greatly appreciated because it helps us attract a bigger audience and help more recruiters.