Fuchsia Dunlop, an acclaimed expert on Chinese cuisine and author of "Invitation to a Banquet," discusses the rich history and innovation of Chinese culinary traditions. Joined by Lydia Chang, owner of Mama Chang restaurant, and Dan Wang, a visiting scholar, they dive into the underappreciated diversity of Chinese food in the West. The conversation includes why technique matters, how cultural contexts shape culinary appreciation, and even tips for perfecting a stir fry. Their lively discussion unfolds over a captivating banquet, showcasing the art of Chinese cooking.
Chinese cuisine is incredibly diverse, incorporating influences from neighboring countries like Vietnam, Thailand, and Laos.
The classification of Chinese cuisine into the eight great cuisines is a recent scheme that doesn't fully capture the regional diversity.
The need for a more inclusive representation of Chinese food that goes beyond certain culinary traditions and incorporates folk traditions and everyday home cooking.
The popularity of Sichuan and Hunan cuisines reflects the demand for flavorful and non-elitist Chinese food.
The challenge in Chinese cuisine lies in striking a balance between maintaining authentic flavors and ingredients while adapting to the evolving tastes of customers.
The ability to assemble a well-planned menu with contrasting flavors, textures, and cooking methods is crucial in Chinese culinary traditions.
Deep dives
Introduction and Support Request
The podcast host Tyler introduces the episode and asks for donations to support the production costs of the podcast.
Interview with Fuchsia Dunlop
Tyler interviews Fuchsia Dunlop, an expert on Chinese cuisine and author of several highly regarded books. They discuss the difference between real soy sauce and mass-manufactured soy sauce, the best regions in China for artisanal soy sauce, and the impact of different cultures on Chinese food.
Insights from Fuchsia Dunlop
Fuchsia discusses her latest book, 'Invitation to a Banquet: The Story of Chinese Food', which focuses on the history of Chinese food. She emphasizes the extraordinary continuities in Chinese cuisine, stretching back thousands of years, but also highlights the multicultural and innovative nature of Chinese food.
Observations on Chinese Food
Tyler and Fuchsia share their observations on recent changes in Chinese food, including the decrease in foreigners in China, the rise of delivery robots, the trend of semi-prepared dishes in restaurants, and concerns over the erosion of culinary skills.
Chinese Food in Different Countries
The guests discuss the differences in Chinese food in various countries, such as the influence of Cantonese cuisine in Canada, the dullness of Chinese food in Barbados, and the more authentic flavors of Chinese food in Panama.
Cultural Influences on Chinese Cuisine
Fuchsia explores the lack of recognition and acknowledgement of Chinese cuisine compared to other culinary traditions. She highlights the historical reasons for this, such as the perception of Chinese food being limited to American Chinese food and the prestige associated with Japanese cuisine. She emphasizes the need for a fresh look at the diverse and sophisticated nature of Chinese cuisine.
Chinese Food Techniques
Fuchsia and the guests discuss the intricate techniques and artistry involved in Chinese cuisine, including the importance of cutting ingredients evenly for stir-frying, the difficulty of stir-frying as a cooking method, and the emphasis on texture and physicality in Chinese gastronomy.
Regional Differences in Chinese Food
The guests discuss regional differences in Chinese food, including the influence of staple crops like rice and wheat, the diversity of Sichuan cuisine, the impact of Manchu cuisine on Northern Chinese food, and the popularity of hot pot restaurants.
The Michelin Guide and Social Media
The influence of the Michelin Guide on Chinese food is debated, with some recognizing its identification of excellent restaurants but also noting the limitations of the single inspector approach. The impact of social media on Chinese food is also discussed, with a focus on visually appealing dishes and the pressure to create Instagrammable meals.
Conclusion
The episode concludes with the guests enjoying a variety of Chinese dishes and appreciating the balance of flavors, textures, and techniques in Chinese cuisine.
The Diversity of Chinese Cuisine
Chinese cuisine is incredibly diverse, with various regional culinary traditions, such as the heavy stews and soups found in the Northeast and the spicy dishes of Sichuan that are said to help combat the humid environment. Chinese cuisine goes beyond the eight great cuisines and incorporates influences from neighboring countries like Vietnam, Thailand, and Laos.
Challenges in Representing Chinese Food
The classification of Chinese cuisine into the eight great cuisines is a recent scheme that doesn't fully capture the regional diversity. There is a need for a more inclusive representation of Chinese food that goes beyond the elitist bias of certain culinary traditions and incorporates folk traditions and everyday home cooking. The popularity of Sichuan and Hunan cuisines among people reflects the demand for flavorful and non-elitist Chinese food.
Seeking Authenticity and Balance in Chinese Food
The balance between tradition and innovation, authenticity and modern ambiance, is a key consideration in Chinese cuisine. Restaurants strive to offer both classic dishes and modern reinterpretations to cater to different preferences. The challenge lies in striking a balance between maintaining authentic flavors and ingredients while adapting to the evolving tastes of customers. The ability to assemble a well-planned menu with contrasting flavors, textures, and cooking methods is crucial in Chinese culinary traditions.
In her third appearance on the show, Chinese food expert Fuchsia Dunlop joins Tyler and a group of special guests to celebrate the release of Invitation to a Banquet, her new book exploring the history, philosophy, and techniques of Chinese culinary culture. As with her previous appearance, this conversation was held over a banquet meal at Mama Chang and was hosted by Lydia Chang.
As they dined, the group discussed why the diversity in Chinese cuisine is still only just being appreciated in the West, how far back our understanding of it goes, how it’s represented in the Caribbean and Ireland, whether technique trumps quality of ingredients, why certain cuisines can spread internationally with higher fidelity, what we can learn from the different styles in Indian and Chinese cooking, why several dishes on the table featured Amish ingredients, the most likely mistake people will make when making a stir fry, what Lydia has learned managing an empire of Chinese restaurants, Fuchsia’s trick for getting unstuck while writing, and more.
