

Lunch Hour Legal Marketing
Legal Talk Network
Are you hungry for more clients? Tired of wasting time (and money) on marketing that doesn’t work? This podcast serves up real-world tips and proven digital marketing strategies that actually drive results for law firms.Hosted by Gyi Tsakalakis and Conrad Saam—two legal marketing pros who’ve been in the trenches. You’ll get practical advice on client acquisition, website teardowns, and what’s actually working for lawyers today—all with a touch of mirth.Congratulations, you found it—THE podcast for lawyers who want to grow their practice! So, if you’re ready to take your business to the next level, pull up a seat and dig in with Lunch Hour Legal Marketing.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Sep 14, 2022 • 45min
What’s That Shiny New Marketing Toy You’ve Got There? || Google’s Out Of Home Ads
First Gyi and Conrad dig through the giant heap of legal marketing news that somebody left here since the last episode. Then, the guys help you avoid over-investing in every “cool new thing” right before they encourage you to invest in Google’s “cool new thing”.-----Second Life! Pokemon Go! Clubhouse! (gasp) Whatever other nonsense you think might work to market your firm. Yes, there’s always cool new tech to play with, and maybe you feel like you can be early to this new thing, but sometimes it’s important to step back and make sure you’re not overinvesting in the next nothingburger. DO: keep up with the latest trends and tech. DON’T: be a sucker for the next shiny thing.And, we’ve all seen it in the movies; a “delightful” future of humanity where everywhere you walk there is a personalized hologram trying to sell you the latest, hottest new thing or turkey dinner in a cup. Well, good news! Google is taking the first steps to that utopia with their new offerings with Out of Home ads. The gents share their takes on our bright future, brought to you by Google, and how (and why) you’d use Out of Home to promote your law firm.A Giant Pile of News:
Is Google’s new Helpful Client Algorithm a big yawner?
MyCase accounting and document automation platform is making some interesting leaps. A one-stop shop, maybe It’s possible.
It's Conference season! Clio Con, Hubspot, etc.
Did Gyi kill Amazon Medicine?
Twitter tweet editing may finally be here.
TikTok and Instagram are shaping the way search and Google operates. Wave of the future or waste of time?

Aug 24, 2022 • 40min
You’re F#¢%ing Up LinkedIn || How To Do LinkedIn Right
You need to be on LinkedIn. Yes, it can be kind of painful, but it’s still the de facto social media platform of the business world. So if you HAVE to be on it, don’t f#¢% it up. Tune is as the guys share the best ways to make LinkedIn work for you.-----Odds are, your LinkedIn profile is not working for you the way you’d like it to. Gyi and Conrad spell out the worst mistakes lawyers make on LinkedIn. They break down the common mistakes you should avoid; like ‘engagement pods,’ sabotaging your own SEO, and more. Learn the key things you CAN NOT DO if you want to avoid being just another junky LinkedIn profile.Next, learn how to best leverage LinkedIn to maximize its potential for your business. Just like every other social media platform, LinkedIn is an algorithm, so the guys teach you the tricks to maximize its effectiveness. Now, set up your profile the right way, and put yourself out there, your authentic self. Learn how to be truly “LinkedIn”, not left out.The News:
Coming soon, “Lawyers By Amazon?” Why not?
The American Bar Association takes a stand against new competition in the legal industry.
And Lead Docket ventures deeper into automation.
Examples of good LinkedIn profiles:
Ruky Tijani
Ben Glass
Joshua Baron
Olga Mack

Aug 10, 2022 • 42min
Hubspot: Top Marketing Trends You Need to Know in 2022 || Wait, Google Wants What Now?
Weed, cookies, Google, TikTok; this episode has it all! Gyi and Conrad sort through the latest and greatest in the world of law firm marketing, and help you stay ahead of the curve. Hope you’re hungry.-----The new Hubspot Marketing Trends Report, The State of Inbound Marketing Trends is out. And you know what? Short videos, TikTok, and “reels” are hot. Social Media might be the new king, but is it better than search engine Marketing? A look at what’s new in 2022. Hack your way through today’s digital jungle. Then the guys take a look at the Google Search Quality Rater Guidelines Update. What’s working in Google search results? And what are you wasting your time on? YMYL, E-A-T, and all the big changes. The things you need to know—and put to work—today.The News:
Google slow rolls their rollback of third-party cookies. What’s a third-party cookie?
Canna Law Blog cited by Congress
References mentioned: Lunch Hour Legal Marketing is now on YouTube! Mockingbird.Marketing.com/benchmarks Google Ending Third-Party CookiesCanna Law Blog Cited by Congress China Law BlogNew Hubspot Marketing Trends Report: Law By MikeJoshua D. Hodges, EsqGoogle Search Quality Rater Guidelines Update: What Has Changed 2022 Update for Google Quality Rater Guidelines – Big YMYL Updates Clio Cloud ConferenceClio Legal Trends 2021 Report

Jul 27, 2022 • 47min
Is Link Building Worth It Anymore? || Top 10 Link Building Tips
Meh, links. A recent article claims that the hard work of building backlinks to drive traffic to your law firm’s website isn’t worth it. Is that right? Spoiler alert: No; no it is not. The guys break down the fundamentals of link building and share their top ten tips to improve your search ranking.-----Conrad and Gyi debate whether the Siege Media article is relevant to the legal industry, in their continued quest to find the best ways to connect your practice with prospective clients. Then they dive into the foundations of link building. Anchor text! Paid links! Link Sculpting! Oh, my!Now that you’ve been schooled on the fundamentals of link building, let’s get you started right. Here are the guys’ 10 top tips you can put into action today. Building a solid backlink profile takes work, but—when it’s done right—it can be remarkably effective.The News:· Smith.ai, the virtual receptionist service, now offers automatic call recording and transcription.· CallRail and Clio integration? What it is and what it isn’t.· Google showing TikTok video shorts inSERP. Time to dust off your fancy dance moves.· Internet Brands raises more money, now at a$12 billion valuation.Mentioned in This Episode:Lunch Hour Legal Marketing now on YouTubeABA Tech ShowSmith.aiClio and CallRail IntegrationNear MediaInternet Brands valuation recapRoss Hudgens, Siege Media, on Link BuildingRoss Hudgens, Link Building webinarGoogle Maps blogScreaming FrogAhrefsFollow/No FollowClio Cloud ConferenceClio Legal Trends 2021 ReportPlus, the Texas Hammer!

Jul 13, 2022 • 39min
Viral Customer Service || What Does Dobbs Have To Do With Law Firm Marketing?
Chewy’s eating your marketing lunch straight outta the bowl, and Supreme Court rulings may seem removed from legal marketing, but this could be the moment to serve your community with empathy and a bit of humanity.-----You want to see great customer service? Take a look in your pet’s food bowl. Gyi and Conrad discuss the recent virality of Chewy’s exceptional customer service and highlight, comparatively, how maybe—just maybe—your clients should expect more humanity from their lawyer than from a dog food company. Can adding a touch of empathy (hard for lawyers, we know) to your customer service make you go viral? Maybe not, but this is the genesis of referral marketing at its finest.And, yeah, it’s been talked about a lot lately, but the elephant in the room is the end of Roe v. Wade. The guys talk about what this means not only to the country, but for cause marketing in the legal world. Don’t worry, the show’s not shifting into political punditry, nor advocating for cheap or showy opportunism; this is about lawyers being humans. Lawyers have to stand for something, so the guys discuss why it is OK to wear your cause, whatever it may be, on your marketing sleeve.The News:
Bob Ambrogi spotlights Mighty’s unique approach to serving victims of personal injury.
A look at Aira’s “State of Link Building 2022” about building connections on the web.
LeadFerno’s chat and texting capability now connects to your Google Business Profile.
Mentioned in This Episode:Lunch Hour Legal Marketing now on YouTube: Bob Ambrogi, “Uneasy About Billboard Lawyers?” Mighty.comState of Link Building 2022, from AiraChewy Tweet Agencies for Reproductive RightsDobbs v. Jackson Women’s Health Organization, Supreme CourtClio Legal Trends 2021 Report

Jun 22, 2022 • 46min
Your Law Firm’s Intake Needs You || Legal Marketing LARPing: Level Up Your SEO
There’s no way around it, prospective clients want to talk to a lawyer, so get into your intake! Then the guys go LARPing—a little role play to quickly up your SEO game. Also, the return or Dear State Bar Regulator.As a lawyer, how involved should you be in the intake process? You’ve got people to handle that, right? After all, you’ve got better things to do. Gyi and Conrad discuss intake best practices and what really turns phone calls to clients.In the return of a fan favorite segment, Dear State Bar Regulator, Gyi pens a letter to those weirdly nitpicky South Carolina regulators. Let’s be honest, how much can a potential client really infer from a 3rd-party’s URL?And then, it’s time for some legal marketing LARPing! No, the guys aren’t donning wizard gowns and medieval attire; rather, they take on their respective roles as lawyer and marketer and dive deeper into the realm of SEO expectations. With a few quick tweaks, you can unlock the quick wins that will level up your magical powers, or at least your internet footprint.The News:
LawPay acquires MyCase: Case management meets payment services. Good for the consumer? We’ll find out.Mentioned in this Episode:Lunch Hour Legal Marketing now on YouTubeJoe Patrice, “MyCase Acquired by LawPay Parent,”LawNext: Conversation with LawPay and MyCaseLaw Firm Intake Fundamentals, Facebook Group (Private)South Carolina State Bar Regulators 22-02MyCaseLawPayClio Legal Trends 2021 Report

Jun 8, 2022 • 41min
SEO: It’ll Be a Minute, or Will It? || How to Get 28,529 Five-Star Reviews
Why you shouldn’t just play the SEO long-game. Plus, a law firm’s surprising (and sketchy) use of Google review numbers.-----Most marketing agencies tell you that SEO is going to take time. Well yeah, maybe, but it doesn’t ALWAYS have to. Gyi and Conrad reevaluate traditional “tempered” expectations and discuss how long SEO should take and whether marketers are just using SEO to lock you into long-term contracts. Then the guys dig into one of the cringiest law firm slogans, “Size Matters,” Morgan & Morgan’s new Google reviews marketing campaign. Is it legit, is it ethical, and does it breach Google’s rules?The News:
Legal marketing podcast ranks own podcast #1. I guess that’s settled then.
Big news: Google core update, get on it.
Wordpress Update: a speed and security change that may affect your plugins.
Mentioned in this Episode:Lunch Hour Legal Marketing now on YouTubeEverest Legal MarketingDoug Bradley, how long should SEO take? Gyi: SEO Expectations for Law Firms Size matters, Morgan & MorganGoogle Structured Data GuidelinesClio Legal Trends 2021 Report

May 25, 2022 • 44min
How Not To Use TikTok For Your Law Firm || 5 Tips to Increase Referrals
Conrad and Gyi tackle an (ahem) unusual marketing move by an attorney using TikTok video streaming. Plus, five big referral tips.-----Wouldn’t it be great if your clients left you a good review online? Why wait? Why not just videotape them as you’re coming out of the courtroom? It’s “Marketing vs the Client’s Best Interest” in the bizarre case of a lawyer using the video streaming platform TikTok. The attorney in question is getting lots of views and attention, but is he using his client? The guys vigorously debate whether these short videos might cross an ethical line. But, even if kind of skeezy, maybe it’s generating a referral network of sorts, so…worth it?Plus, five big tips on building business through referrals. Still waiting for new clients to be breaking down your door? Sometimes you need to give to get, so start putting yourself out there and reap the rewards of good business karma.The News:
MyCase buys Docketwise.
Google Analytics 4 is coming soon—update your analytics now!
How’s that Johnny Depp and Amber Heard trial going?

May 11, 2022 • 41min
Supercharge Conversions with Text || Google Performance Max
You want to boost your conversions but only have so much bandwidth doing it all yourself. Stop thinking that tech equals cold and impersonal. Simple technologies like auto-response emails and text messages (done right!) can afford a personal touch for your clients, bring more prospects into your funnel, and convert those opportunities you’re currently missing out on.And has Google ended the era of the ad agency? The guys explore Google's new Performance Max campaigns and whether they’re really the biggest change to Google in 10 years.PLUS: IMPORTANT NEWS! Conrad adopts a puppy! A desperate play for social media attention, of course, because Lunch Hour Legal Marketing is now on YouTube (and puppies are cute).And In Less Puppy-Filled News:
Google is offering certification for SEO.
In a new survey of how people find lawyers, surprise, the answers are Google, “the internet,” and referrals.
Special thanks to our sponsors Alert Communications, LawYaw, Posh Virtual Receptionists, and Clio.

Apr 27, 2022 • 36min
What Is Dark Social and Why It Matters
Dark Social — it just sounds nefarious, right? But there’s no need to break out a Tor browser and dive into the depths of the dark web; this stuff is legit. And once you understand and leverage it, it can be the difference between your marketing just “working” and blowing up. Gyi and Conrad explain what Dark Social is, why it can be difficult—nay, impossible—to track through your traditional attribution channels, and why it is nonetheless one of the most powerful weapons in your arsenal you may not have even known you had.Also, CallRail’s marketing outlook for law firms in 2022 is out. In the latest edition of By the Numbers, the guys dig into the findings and share not only the most important takeaways but also highlight what these findings mean for you and your practice.In the Clio Legal Trends Report, it turns out law firms with growing revenue are twice as likely to use financial reporting tools. Understanding your firm’s financial performance helps you boost revenue. More at the Clio Legal Trends Report.The News:
Sterling Sky and “Review Spam” - Lawyers are among the top spammers of review spaces, and law firms could be liable for this kind of behavior
Search Ads Soaring - Search ad revenue hits $78 billion.
Inflation and how it impacts our industry - Are you pulling back on your ads? Should you? And what about adjusting pricing?
Special thanks to our sponsors Alert Communications, LawYaw, Posh Virtual Receptionists, and Clio.