

Curious Minds at Work
Gayle Allen
Want to get better at work? At managing others? Managing yourself? Gayle Allen interviews experts who take your performance to the next level. Each episode features a book with insights to help you achieve your goals.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Aug 28, 2023 • 45min
CM 247: Thomas Curran on the Perfection Trap
Aiming for perfection seems like a noble goal. It’s like we’re holding ourselves to a higher standard or standing out from the crowd.
But striving for perfection means working toward the impossible. And the cost to our mental and physical health can be enormous.
London School of Economics Professor, Thomas Curran, experienced the impact of perfectionism firsthand. As a recovering perfectionist, he’s made the field the focus of his research.
Curran’s research led to his book, The Perfection Trap: Embracing the Power of Good Enough. In it, he explains the psychology behind it, calls out cultural messages that reinforce it, and shares steps we can take to overcome it.
Episode Links
Perfectionists Need to Embrace Failure
The Rise of Perfectionism – and the Harm It’s Doing Us All
Understanding Perfectionism and Impostor Syndrome with Dr. Thomas Curran
Norwegian Wood by Haruki Murakami
The Team
Learn more about host, Gayle Allen, and producer, Rob Mancabelli, here.
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If you like the show, please rate and review it on iTunes or wherever you subscribe, and tell a friend or family member about the show.
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Aug 14, 2023 • 45min
CM 246: Simone Stolzoff On Our Relationship With Work
Simone Stolzoff, author of "The Good Enough Job: Reclaiming Life from Work," challenges our expectations of work and its role in our lives. He explores the rise of work as our primary identity and its impact on our well-being. Stolzoff discusses the challenges faced by professionals, vocational awe, and the transformation of workplaces. He also redefines the relationship between work and identity, emphasizing the importance of rest, relationships, and diversifying our sources of meaning. Finally, he offers strategies for improving our relationship with work.

Jul 31, 2023 • 52min
CM 245: Sally Jenkins on Elevating Your Performance
Winning athletes and coaches have a lot to teach us. They’re asked to perform at the highest level, day in and day out, and they face enormous pressure to succeed.
Faced with these expectations, the most successful ones must continually elevate their performance. But how?
That’s a question Sally Jenkins has spent a career trying to answer. Through her work as a sportswriter at The Washington Post, she discovered the formula great players use to succeed, and she shares it with us in her latest book, The Right Call: What Sports Teach Us about Work and Life.
It’s a fascinating set of insights that will help you elevate your own performance.
Episode Links
Bitter Rivals. Beloved Friends. Survivors.
Another Side of Dad
This Time Tomorrow by Emma Straub
The Team
Learn more about host, Gayle Allen, and producer, Rob Mancabelli, here.
Support the Podcast
If you like the show, please rate and review it on iTunes or wherever you subscribe, and tell a friend or family member about the show.
Subscribe
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Jul 17, 2023 • 44min
CM 244: Jonathan Rhodes on Getting the Life You Want
There’s a lot to be said for the excitement we feel when we first set a goal for ourselves. The sense of exhilaration can give us the momentum we need to get started.
But when the exhilaration wears off – and it usually does – we’re faced with a choice. Will we revert to old habits or develop new ones?
These moments are what Jonathan Rhodes calls choice points, and the decisions we make can really add up. Ultimately, how we manage ourselves in these moments can be the difference between the life we have and the life we want.
That’s why I wanted to interview Jonathan Rhodes, author of the book, The Choice Point: The Scientifically Proven Method to Push Past Mental Walls and Achieve Your Goals. His Functional Imagery Training provides a concrete roadmap to help us stay the course.
Episode Links
Tokyo 2020: Simone Biles’ Withdrawal is a Sign of Resilience and Strength
How to Overcome Self-Limiting Beliefs
The Good Life: Lessons from the World’s Longest Scientific Study of Happiness by Robert Waldinger and Marc Schulz
The Team
Learn more about host, Gayle Allen, and producer, Rob Mancabelli, here.
Support the Podcast
If you like the show, please rate and review it on iTunes or wherever you subscribe, and tell a friend or family member about the show.
Subscribe
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Jul 3, 2023 • 46min
CM 243: Sheena Iyengar on How to Be An Innovator
Coming up with good ideas is hard. But it’s not because we’re not creative or smart enough. It’s likely we just haven’t learned how.
Fortunately, Sheena Iyengar, Professor at Columbia Business School, has written a playbook that answers the question, how can I get my best ideas? It’s her latest book, Think Bigger: How to Innovate.
Sheena’s approach leads us, step by step, from generating ideas to assessing which ones are innovative enough to act on. It’s a method informed not only by others’ successes but the science behind them. It’s a book you’ll return to again and again.
Episode Links
Sheena Iyengar Wants Us to Understand How Humans Come Up with Big Ideas
Does Brainstorming Actually Generate Great Ideas?
If There are No New Ideas, How Do We Keep Innovating?
Antonio Canova
The Team
Learn more about host, Gayle Allen, and producer, Rob Mancabelli, here.
Support the Podcast
If you like the show, please rate and review it on iTunes or wherever you subscribe, and tell a friend or family member about the show.
Subscribe
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Jun 19, 2023 • 49min
CM 242: Rainesford Stauffer on Reimagining Ambition
Ambition is complicated. Yet the messages we receive from an early age are simple: “Winners never quit.” “Reach for the stars.” “Follow your dreams.”
But like most simple messages, reality often paints a very different picture. Long hours that lead to burnout, or individual striving that results in loneliness.
Rainesford Stauffer ran up against these realities. And, in her work as a journalist, she spoke to others who did, as well. That’s what led her to rethink what ambition could be, and to write about it in her book, All the Gold Stars: Reimagining Ambition and the Ways We Strive.
In this interview, we talk about the roles history and religion have played in our ambition. We also discuss times when embracing ambition is a good thing. Ultimately, we try to uncover unexamined assumptions that can drive how we live our lives.
Episode Links
There’s No Such Thing as Getting Ahead by Rainesford Stauffer
Seeking Self-Esteem: Construction, Maintenance, and Protection of Self-Worth by Jennifer Crocker and Lora E. Park
Too Much of a Good Thing: The Effect of Contingency of Self-Worth on Goal Setting by Xi Chen
Properties of Thirst by Marianne Wiggins
The Team
Learn more about host, Gayle Allen, and producer, Rob Mancabelli, here.
Support the Podcast
If you like the show, please rate and review it on iTunes or wherever you subscribe, and tell a friend or family member about the show.
Subscribe
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Jun 4, 2023 • 41min
CM 241: Hal Hershfield on Creating Your Tomorrow
We’ve all had the experience of working toward goals today that would benefit us in the future. Goals like exercising more, losing weight, or saving for retirement.
Yet when faced with early-morning alarms or tempting desserts, we may lose sight of our goals.
But what if the answer to sticking with them was to form a relationship with a very special person – future you?
Hal Hershfield, author of the book, Your Future Self: How to Make Tomorrow Better Today, has spent his career studying what happens when we build a closer relationship with our future self. His work reveals how this relationship can have an outsize impact on our success, one that extends beyond weight loss, fitness, and a comfortable retirement.
Episode Links
Nina Strohminger and Elizabeth W. Dunn and Kate Christensen and Paola Giuliano
End-of-History Illusion
Here There Are Blueberries
The Team
Learn more about host, Gayle Allen, and producer, Rob Mancabelli, here.
Support the Podcast
If you like the show, please rate and review it on iTunes or wherever you subscribe, and tell a friend or family member about the show.
Subscribe
Click here and then scroll down to see a sample of sites where you can subscribe.

57 snips
May 22, 2023 • 49min
CM 240: Adam Alter on Simple Ways to Get Unstuck
At some point, we all get stuck. Maybe it’s in a job or career. Maybe it’s a relationship or business venture.
Though it’s something we all experience, when it happens, we can feel alone and out of our depth. Emotions may overwhelm us. Mental traps lure is in. In no time at all, we can’t see a way out.
Award-winning professor, researcher, and author, Adam Alter, has spent decades studying how successful people get unstuck. In his latest book, Anatomy of a Breakthrough: How to Get Unstuck When It Matters Most, he shares what we can do to move forward. Adam’s recommendations can help us with what might be the most important times in our lives.
Episode Links
Life is in the Transitions: Mastering Change at Any Age by Bruce Feiler
How the ‘Creative-Cliff Illusion’ Limits Our Ideas by David Robson
Americanah by Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie
The Team
Learn more about host, Gayle Allen, and producer, Rob Mancabelli, here.
Support the Podcast
If you like the show, please rate and review it on iTunes or wherever you subscribe, and tell a friend or family member about the show.
Subscribe
Click here and then scroll down to see a sample of sites where you can subscribe.

May 8, 2023 • 45min
CM 239: Rina Bliss on Why IQ is a Myth
There’s never been a better time to question how we measure intelligence. With ChatGPT and other forms of artificial intelligence pushing the boundaries of what it means to be smart, there’s an opportunity – even an urgency – to reconsider everything we know.
That’s why I wanted to talk to Rina Bliss, author of the book, Rethinking Intelligence: A Radical New Understanding of Our Human Potential. A sociologist and genetics expert, Rina brings a fresh perspective to the discussion that expands what’s been, for far too long, a reductive numbers game.
In this interview, Rina offers a new model for assessing aptitude, one that extends beyond test results and mistaken assumptions about genetics. Instead, she explains how intelligence is far from fixed and how it’s deeply influenced by the degree of stress, connection, and play in our lives.
Her book is filled with insights on how to rethink what it means to be smart, along with steps we can take to protect and deepen our intelligence.
Episode Links
AI Can’t Teach Children to Learn. What’s Missing?
Conceptualizing Race in the Genomic Age
DNA Tests for Intelligence Ignore the Real Reasons Why Kids Succeed or Fail
The Secret Life of Groceries by Benjamin Lorr
The Team
Learn more about host, Gayle Allen, and producer, Rob Mancabelli, here.
Support the Podcast
If you like the show, please rate and review it on iTunes or wherever you subscribe, and tell a friend or family member about the show.
Subscribe
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5 snips
Apr 24, 2023 • 41min
CM 238: Rob Cross and Karen Dillon on How to Handle Microstress
Small things add up. And, for the most part, that’s a good thing. Like taking the stairs to get more exercise or swapping out something sugary for a piece of fruit. Over time, small actions like these can add up to a healthier lifestyle.
Yet there are times when the small things that add up work against our well-being. Every time your boss shifts your priorities. Each time you have to cancel connecting with a friend.
Rob Cross and Karen Dillon take a closer look at these moments in their book, Microstress: How Little Things Pile Up and Create Big Problems – and What to Do about It. They explain how these seemingly small stresses can, over time, have a damaging effect on our physical and emotional well-being. They also share effective ways to handle them.
Episode Links
The Hidden Toll of Microstress
The Microstress Effect
Fight Back Against Microstress
Narrative Economics with Robert Shiller
The Team
Learn more about host, Gayle Allen, and producer, Rob Mancabelli, here.
Support the Podcast
If you like the show, please rate and review it on iTunes or wherever you subscribe, and tell a friend or family member about the show.
Subscribe
Click here and then scroll down to see a sample of sites where you can subscribe.