The Copywriter Club Podcast

This episode is completely different from anything we’ve done before. If you’re here for copywriting and business tips, you might want to skip this one. But, if you want to get a sense of the breadth of musical talent in The Copywriter Club, tune in, because this one is fun. When we announced we were updating the podcast for episode 200 (coming next week), we put out a call for the musicians in our group to let us know what they think the new intro should sound like. We’ve collected the submissions to share with you. What do you think? Did we make the right choice? The copywriters/musicians mentioned in this episode: Mario Bourzac / The Protected Left Jeff Herman / Mind Rock Robin Burke Neil Campbell Paul Hanna/Chad Reisliger Paola / Texxex Daniel Lamb Bill Kernodle Robin Burke Rachael Pilcher Alex Moon Steven Scott Jessica Marshall David Muntner Paul Conners Andre Johnson Addison Rice/The Love Sprockets I’m not sure if we’ve smiled more during a podcast than we did as we put this episode together. Maybe we should do more like this? To hear what these amazing copywriters/musicians had to share, click the play button below. Or subscribe to the podcast on Stitcher or iTunes and never miss another episode.   Other stuff you should check out: The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground   Because this episode is mostly music, there is no transcript. Please listen by clicking the link above.

Copywriter Allea Grummert is our guest for episode 199 of The Copywriter Club Podcast. Wait… are we really about to cross the 200 episode frontier? Yep, and Allea is the perfect guest to wrap up the last 100 episodes before we make a few changes to the format. We talked to Allea about her processes, her switch from blogging to copywriting, and how she’s made so much progress in the past year. Here’s the breakdown of what we covered: •  the long road from personal finance blogger to copywriter •  her best personal finance ideas for copywriters •  why she waited so long to call herself a copywriter •  how she finds clients today (a lot of them come from conferences) •  the take-aways from Allea’s work as an implementer •  her process for working with clients—the whole thing—start to finish •  what she charges for her audits (and what makes them valuable) •  the differences between the packages she offers to clients •  how she structures the email sequences she writes •  how she segments lists for her clients to be most effective •  the CEO check-in and how it helps her grow her business •  the hard stuff she’s dealt with as she’s grown •  the things and people she’s invested in to take her business to the next level •  her advice to “writers” who aren’t yet ready to call themselves “copywriters” •  the advice from a friend that caused a panic attack •  the mindset shifts she’s made over the past year to move forward •  getting paid in advance for work that doesn’t start for a month or more •  working with a VA and how to do it so the relationship works •  her advice for list building and creating content for your list •  her experience at TCCIRL in 2019 and 2020   The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: Notion Val Geisler TCCIRL Allea's website Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground   Full Transcript: Kira:   This episode is brought to you by the Copywriter Underground, the place to find more than 20 templates, dozens of presentations on topics like copywriting and marketing your business, a community of successful writers who share ideas and leads, and the Copywriter Club newsletter mailed directly to your home every month. Learn more at thecopywriterunderground.com. Rob:   What if you could hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes, and their habits, then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work? That's what Kira and I do every week at the Copywriter Club Podcast. Kira:   You're invited to join the club for episode 199 as we chat with copywriter, Allea Grummert about email and why it's such a powerful platform, which email sequences are most important and what they need to accomplish, what she's done to invest in herself and grow her business, and her five-step framework for writing a welcome sequence. Kira:   Welcome, Allea. Allea:   Hello, thanks welcome to you. Kira:   Yeah. Allea:   Welcome to my living room. Kira:   Great to have you here, and let's kick this off with your story. How did you end up as a copywriter? Allea:   So, I started as a blogger. I was a personal finance blogger, and that's what everyone does on a Memorial Day weekend. Yeah, it was just a hobby of mine, and I also have a degree in advertising and public relations so blogging came for me as like a, I called it my digital playground, so I could learn and play. And not just about copywriting. In fact, I didn't call myself a copywriter until this January, but I learned about SEO and content marketing and how online businesses work. So over time though, people would come to me with questions about email marketing, and it was one of those things where it came easy to me and it didn't for others and became a service to them for them to have me do it versus them doing it themselves. Rob:   Before we get into article writing,

Copywriter and Creative Director Sam Pollen is our guest for the 198th episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. Sam works in-house at an agency focused entirely on copy—there are no designers—which might be a dream for a lot of copywriters. We asked Sam about the differences between the freelance world and the work his team does. Here’s an idea of what we covered during the interview: •   how Sam went from zoology student to copywriter and creative director •   why Sam prefers to work in-house and leaves the freelancing to others •   how he works with other writers in his role as a CD •   the creative process at agencies and how everyone works together •   how they work with designers and hand off copy to the design team •   this skills and training a copywriter might need to be a creative director •   Sam’s writing process and how he generates ideas for each assignment •   asking “stupid questions” to truly understand the products we sell •   how asking the questions that aren’t in the brief leads to a big idea •   what’s involved in the process of naming •   how Sam and his agency present work to their clients •   the challenges of working on brand voice and brand guides •   writing luxury copy and the different approaches to a variety of products •   why he wrote a book about a boy with anorexia Sam’s story and advice are worth a listen. To hear what he told us, scroll down and click the play button. Or read a transcript a little farther down the page. And if you never want to miss an episode subscribe to the podcast with your podcast app, then leave a review.   The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: Reed Words Sam's Twitter Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground   Full Transcript: Rob:   This episode is brought to you by The Copywriter Underground, the place to connect with hundreds of smart copywriters who share ideas and strategies to help you master marketing, mindset, and copywriting in your business. Learn more at thecopywriterunderground.com. Kira:   What if you could hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes and their habits, then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work? That's what Rob and I do every week at The Copywriter Club Podcast. Rob:   You're invited to join The Club for episode 198 as we chat with copywriter and creative director Sam Pollen about working at an agency that's focused on great copy, what it takes to build a verbal identity, his biggest struggle as a creative and as a copywriter, and why he wrote a book about anorexia. Kira:   Welcome, Sam. Rob:   Hey, Sam. Sam Pollen:   Thanks very much for having me, guys. Kira:   Yeah, we're excited to have you today and let's just start this conversation with how you ended up as a creative director. What was that story? Sam Pollen:   I think the story for me is probably the story similar for a lot of people in that position in that I just worked my way up, basically. I did a degree in natural sciences, so zoology and psychology, of all things, so not really related to what I do now at all. Then I worked in photography for a little bit, and then I worked in marketing and sort of fell into copywriting. So copywriting was not a deliberate choice for me, but it was something that I did some of in a marketing job and found out I was good at or good enough at. And then honed my skills and developed and found that that was something I found interesting and had some talent for, and so went from there. About five, six years ago, I had started working with my now boss, Mike Reed, who set up the agency I work for, it's called Reed Words. I was initially hired just to write a sort of, he was starting to build an agency and then we have grown from that point. We have a team of writers and I'm the deputy creative director.

Red hot copywriter Lorrie Morgan is our guest for the 197th episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. As a stay-at-home mom she looked for a job that she could do from home. When a client asked for a 52-part auto responder, she knew she had to get serious about the craft. And she shared her decades of experience, as we asked about: •   her journey from actor to copywriter to direct response guru •   what she learned from her mentors (and who they are) •   what it takes to “write fearlessly” … Lorrie breaks down what she did •   the “pain-in-the-butt” writing exercise that makes you into a better writer •   what she did to attract clients when she was just starting out •   what she learned from moving 16 times before she graduated from high school •   how she uses an alter-ego to go beyond her limitations and write copy •   self-care and how Lorrie makes sure she feels good enough to write well •   the biggest mistakes her copywriter clients make •   the differences between writing for men and women •   the “tarket” trick for connecting on a deeper emotional level in copy •   the process of writing her book and why she wrote it •   what’s on Rob’s vision board (and why Kira might need one) •   why Lorrie wears a cowboy hat to events •   what is was like to work on Baywatch—the truth about David Hasslehoff Lorrie shares some great advice to copywriters who want to grow. To hear what she said, scroll down and click the play button. Or scroll a bit farther for a transcript. And if you’re really serious about getting better as a copywriter, subscribe to the podcast (so you don’t miss an episode) and leave a review.   The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: Baywatch Gary Halbert John Carlton Kevin Rogers Pauline Longdon Todd Herman Ignite Your Moxie Ali Brown Andre The Giant Lorrie’s website Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground   Full Transcript: Kira:   This episode is brought to you by The Copywriter Underground, the place to find more than 20 templates, dozens of presentations and topics like copywriting, marketing, mindset. A community of successful writers who share ideas and leads and a copywriter club newsletter which is mailed directly to your home every single month. Learn more at thecopywriterunderground.com. Rob:   What if you can hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes and their habits, then instill an idea or two to inspire your own work, that's what Kira and I do every week at The Copywriter Club podcast. Kira:   You're invited to join the club for Episode 197 as we chat with Red Hot copywriter Lorrie Morgan about the differences between writing for men and women, why she wrote her book, Ignite Your Moxie and what it's about, what she's done to create a profitable copywriting business, and how she landed a job working on the set of Baywatch. Welcome, Lorrie. Rob:   Hey, Lorrie. Lorrie Morgan:   Hey, good to be here, you guys. Kira:   Great to have you here, Lorrie. So, let's start. As much as I want to ask you everything about Baywatch right away, I feel like we should wait to hear about that. But let's start with your story. How did you end up as a copywriter? Lorrie Morgan:   Oh yes, everyone has a story. Nobody wants to be a copywriter when they're a little girl, do they? So, I have a journalism degree. But I always wanted to be an actress. So, this is the rambling version, but I'll try to get to the point real quick. So, I moved to California, which is where I live now, to be an actress. We'll jump into the Baywatch a little bit later, too. But I'm a terrible actress, it turns out. I just really like the whole idea of it. So instead, I got married and I had children, which was wonderful. And then, I ended up going getting divorced and had to get a job. Oh, no.

Copywriter and persuasion expert Adil Amarsi is the guest for the 196th episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. Adil is working on a book on Persuasion and recently changed the title he prefers from Copywriter to Creative Director because he does so much more than copy. We covered quite a bit of ground during our discussion, including: •  how writing daily stories as a kid led to a gig as a copywriter (before he knew what copywriting was) •  his process for attracting his first clients •  what he did to learn copywriting and who he learned it from •  the “first week’s earnings” deal that netted him six figures •  what not to do when you get a windfall •  going from £300 to $30,000 + 4%—the secret of Adil’s success •  mental health issues and the impact on his business •  how much time he spends writing versus ideation •  breaking down what a $30K project looks like •  the clause that Adil adds to his contract that you’ll definitely want to borrow •  walking the line between manipulation and persuasion •  one of the words you should never use in your copy •  what it means to be a creative director and why he doesn’t call himself a copywriter •  what it takes to create a great offer •  the practical joke he played on one of his friends You won’t want to miss this one. Download it to your favorite podcast app or simple scroll down and press the play button. You’ll also find a full transcript and links below.   The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: John Carlton Gary Halbert PsychoCybernetics Jay Abraham The Irresistible Offer Adil's website Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground   Full Transcript: Rob:   This episode is brought to you by The Copywriter Underground, the place to connect with hundreds of smart copywriters who share ideas and strategies to help you master marketing, mindset and copywriting in your business. Learn more at thecopywriterunderground.com. Kira:   What if you could hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes and their habits, then steal an idea or two inspire your own work? That's what Rob and I do every week at The Copywriter Club podcast. Rob:   You're invited to join the club for episode 196 as we chat with copywriter, podcaster and alchemists of persuasion, Adil Amarsi, about telling better stories, what it takes to create a great offer, how to be more persuasive, and his approach to consulting with his clients on their marketing needs. Kira:   Welcome, Adil. Adil:   Hi. Thanks for having me, guys. Kira:   Yeah, and just shout out before we jump into Brennan Hopkins, who introduced us, so thank you, Brennan for making the introduction. And let's just kick this off with your story. How did you end up as a copywriter, consultant, podcaster, artists and we can go on and on, and on? Adil:   Yeah. So first of all, thank you, Brennan, because he did make this happen. So my story's kind of I used to think it was interesting until I actually sat down and wrote it out with a friend. So I moved from Africa, like East Africa to the UK when I was four years old. About a year into moving to the UK, in the mid-90s, my dad ended up having a herniated disk that affected his walking, so he was paralyzed from the waist down for about two years. And it's important to know that I have an older sister and the 90s were basically known as Nickelodeon versus Cartoon Network. You can pretty much guess which side I sided with and which side she went with. I was Cartoon Network, she was Nickelodeon. I found that the best way I could watch cartoons was to sit down and watch whatever my dad was watching at the time. In the UK my dad really loved watching four shows, in particular. Two quite important. The other two, somewhat. So the first one was the news. My dad loved watching the news.

Growth marketer and event co-founder, Stef Grieser, is the guest for the 195th episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. Kira met Stef and Shine Bootcamp late last year and immediately knew that she had a lot to share with our audience. But we didn’t just talk about speaking. We covered a lot of ground—and went a little longer than usual. Here’s a taste of what we talked about: •   Stef’s career path and how she came to co-found two big events •   how she used meet-ups to “test drive” CTA Conference •   how the first CTA Conference line up led her to focus on diverse voices at conferences •   the mix of speakers and why up-and-comers are just as important as stars •   what she did to turn herself into a conference speaker •   the difference between “growth” marketer and “regular” marketer •   how Stef scaled her team and community as she built CTA Conf •   what makes a good speaker pitch and how to get accepted as a speaker •   the cues that let conference organizers know you are a fit for them •   what she did to connect with sponsors and what makes a good sponsor •   the importance of being a subject matter expert •   the other skills you need on stage… in addition to content •   when you should reach out for help from a speaking coach •   Stef’s thoughts on the importance of copywriting as a business skill •   what Stef would like copywriters to do differently •   how she’s developed her leadership skills and built a team •   the stuff that hasn’t gone very well and how she fixed things •   her advice to anyone who wants to do what she’s done •   product founder fit and the importance of finding it •   Shine Bootcamp—what it is and how to find out more If you’ve ever thought about getting on stage (or presenting workshops or webinars) as a way to build your authority, you won’t want to miss this episode. To hear it, click the play button below or scroll down for links and a full transcript. Or subscribe using your favorite podcast app.   The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: Shine Bootcamp CTA Conf Oli Gardner Lianna Patch Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground   Full Transcript: Kira:   This episode is brought to you by The Copywriter Underground, the place to find more than 20 templates, dozens of presentations on topics like copywriting and marketing your business, a community of successful writers who share ideas and leads, and the Copywriter Club Newsletter mailed directly to your home every month. Learn more at TheCopywriterUnderground.com. Rob:   What if you could hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes and their habits, then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work? That's what Kira and I do every week at the Copywriter Club podcast. Kira: You're invited to join the club for episode 195 as we chat with marketing specialist and public speaker, Stef Grieser, about growth marketing and what copywriters need to know to help their clients grow, Shine Bootcamp and what you need to know to land a speaking gig, the lessons she's learned after co-founding two big events, how she looks at and solves business problems, and her biggest career struggle. Kira:   Welcome, Stef. Rob:   Hey, Stef. Stef Grieser:   Hi. Kira:   Hello. It's great to have you here. Last time I saw you was at Shine Bootcamp in Toronto last September, so it's such a pleasure to have you here so we can dig into everything that you're doing. Stef Grieser:   I am so excited to be here and excited to dig in. Kira:   All right. Why don't we start with your story? How did you end up as a growth marketer, founder of Call-to-Action Conference and co-founder of Shine Bootcamp? How did you get into all of it? Stef Grieser:   Yeah, that's a really, really great question. I'll go way back when I was graduating university,

Copywriter Christina Torres is our guest for the 194th guest on The Copywriter Club Podcast. Christina is a member of The Underground and The Copywriter Think Tank so we’ve seen some of the changes she’s made to her business recently. We talked to Christina about her business and the kinds of things she does as a pocket CMO. Here’s most what we covered… •  her story—how she became a copywriter by mistake •  how she got permission to do the thing she really wanted to do •  what she does in her role as a CMO in your pocket •  how she’s worked with copywriters as a CMO to help them grow •  some examples of her work and how she helps people get out of their own way •  how she attracts and connects with her clients •  why she took the time to figure out what she doesn’t like to do •  how she found clients in the the programs she has joined •  the importance of taking a stand in her business and making change •  the idea of a culture and equity audit for the work she does •  how she balances all the things competing for her time •  the catalyst for the new program she’s launching •  what an anti-copy course copy course would look like •  launching even when there’s too much other stuff going on This is a good interview you won’t want to miss. To hear it, click the play button below or subscribe on iTunes or Stitcher. Or scroll down to read a full transcript and see links to what we talked about.   The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: Marie Forleo Laura Belgray Samar Owais Matt Hall Rachel Rogers Christina’s website Christina’s insta Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground   Full Transcript: Rob:   This episode is brought to you by The Copywriter Underground, the place to connect with hundreds of smart copywriters who share ideas and strategies to help you master marketing, mindset and copywriting in your business. Learn more at TheCopywriterUnderground.com. Kira:   What if you could hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes and their habits, then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work? That's what Rob and I do every week at The Copywriter Club Podcast. Rob:   You're invited to join the club for episode 194 as we chat with copywriter and CMO in your pocket, Christina Torres, about how her business has evolved to include much more than copywriting, what she's done to juggle working a job while pursuing a side hustle, how copywriters can speak up and create change, and what she's done to figure out what comes next. Kira:   Welcome, Christina. Christina Torres:   Hey. I'm so excited. Ah, this is like the nerdiest, surreal thing that's ever happened and I'm just pinching myself. I'm so excited to be with my copy uncle and my copy cousin. That's what I call Kira. You're not my copy dad. I feel like Rob is so much cooler. Rob:   I'm a really cool dad, I got to say. I'm not cool at all, actually. Just ask my daughters. They remind me of that, seriously, every single day; how uncool I am. Kira:   That's their job. Their job is to remind you of that every day. I'm glad I'm the cousin and not the mom. I feel like I can barely mom. Christina Torres:   We're too close in age. Kira:   I can barely mom, parent my own children. So, I'm happy to be the cousin. Christina Torres, we have had the pleasure of hanging out with you and working with you in The Underground. And then also, more recently, in The Think Tank over the last month. But we want to really start with your story and how you became a copywriter. And then, more recently, a Pocket CMO. Christina Torres:   Yeah, sure. I think ... I was just listening to your most recent podcast and I feel like everyone says this, but of course I became a copywriter by mistake. I feel like that's so cliché but it's kind of true. Not really.

Copywriter Brittany McBean is our guest for the 193rd episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. We wanted to talk to Brittany after we heard about the success she had when she completed the “Find a Client in 3 Weeks or Less” Challenge we offered in The Copywriter Underground this past April. In addition to that, Brittany shared her path to copywriting and the nuts-and-bolts of creating a paid workshop for your list. Here’s what we covered in this interview: •  going from acting in musical theater to network marketing to copywriter •  the on-the-job training she gave herself when she landed her first project •  what she learned as a signer, dancer and actor that makes her a better copywriter •  how she approaches marketing for herself so it doesn’t feel spammy •  her advice for people who are using Facebook to go live with video •  Brittany’s experience with the Find a Client Challenge in The Copywriter Underground •  the three different kinds of clients you need in your business •  what surprised her most about the challenge… and why she did it anyway •  how you can replicate the momentum Brittany built during the challenge •  what it takes to create and run a masterclass and the supporting materials •  the financial results she got by finishing the Challenge and how she used the money •  what she’s going to do next with her workshops and business •  her adoption journey and how she worked through the difficulties of the process •  her struggle with anxiety and working and the results of dealing with it •  her approach to talking about hard things and helping our clients do it too •  what she’s excited about doing next in her business This is a great discussion about how much you can create in a short time—and a lot more. To hear what Brittany had to share, scroll down and click the play button. Or scroll a little farther to read a full transcript. Better yet, subscribe on your favorite podcast app and never miss an episode.   The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: Brenda McGowan The Project Plan Trello Board Sara Heselin Woods Brittany's website Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground   Full Transcript: Kira:   This episode is brought to you by The Copywriter Underground, the place to find more than 20 templates, dozens of presentations on topics like copywriting and marketing your business, a community of successful writers who share ideas and leads, and The Copywriter Club newsletter mailed directly to your home every month. Learn more at thecopywriterunderground.com. Rob:   What if you could hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes, and their habits, then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work? That's what Kira and I do every week at The Copywriter Club Podcast. Kira:   You're invited to join the club for episode 193 as we chat with copywriter, Brittany McBean about why she became a copywriter, what her business looks like today, her experience with the find a client in three weeks challenge in The Copywriter Underground, and what she's done recently to think bigger about her business and clients. Welcome Brittany. Rob:   Hey Brittany. Brittany McBean:   Hi, thanks. I just had some free time and thought I'd help you guys out and just ... No, I'm just kidding. My palms are sweaty and I'm really honored and excited to be here. Rob:   This is really good. Kira:   Yeah. We're so excited to talk to you. And this initially started around a challenge that we offered in The Underground in April. And it was how to book a client in three weeks challenge, although it had like a snazzier name and it was the first challenge we ever did in the underground. And it was quite intense because I don't think I knew what I was doing when I was throwing out these challenges. And you were one of the few people,

Business coach and copywriter Ashley Gartland is our guest for the 192nd episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. No surprise, when it comes to helping other writers build a solid business, she knows her stuff. So we asked Ashley about a whole range of things, including: •  how she ended up as a writer and business coach •  what she does in her business today and the problems she helps solve •  what a “better not bigger” business looks like and how to create one •  a few of the business models that help copywriters grow a better business •  what Ashley does to help free up more time for clients •  her “marketing audit” and what it involves for her clients •  what copywriters starting out can do to build a “better not bigger” biz •  what happens when people hit their goals and what comes next •  growing a team and what you should think about as you scale and grow •  how to grow a business WITHOUT a team •  how Ashley deals with overwhelm and getting things done •  the tools that Ashley uses to get things done •  what her team looks like and how she spends her time today •  the packages she offers to her clients •  what you should do if you want to do more copy coaching •  the mistakes Ashley sees copywriters making and holding them back •  what she’s done to take her business to the next level •  the pitch that got Ashley on our podcast and why it worked •  the difference confidence makes in so many of her client’s businesses We also asked about the future of copywriting and what to do if you want a “bigger and better” business. This is a good one. To hear it all, the play button below. Or scroll down for a transcript. Better yet, subscribe and never miss an episode.   The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: Ashley's website Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground   Full Transcript: Rob:   This episode is brought to you by The Copywriter Underground, the place to connect with hundreds of smart copywriters who share your ideas and strategies to help you master marketing, mindset and copywriting in your business. Learn more at thecopywriterunderground.com. Kira:   What if you could hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes and their habits then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work. That's what Rob and I do every week at The Copywriter Club Podcast. Rob:   You're invited to join the club for episode 192 as we chat with business coach Ashley Gartland about creating a business that is better not bigger, what business challenges copywriters struggle with the most, her advice on managing time projects and overwhelm and the pitch she sent us that made us want to have her on the show. Kira:   Welcome Ashley. Rob:   Hi Ashley. Ashley:   Hi guys. Thanks so much for having me. Kira:   Yeah. Great to have you and I am excited to talk about the pitch that you sent us because it did grab my attention at least, and you kind of played the long game too as far as building a relationship on Instagram first and I just felt like it was very an elegant approach to pitching podcast. So we'll talk about that, but first let's start with your story. How did you end up as a writer turned business coach? Ashley:   Yeah. So really I have to say that though the way I landed here and the way I got into business by myself in the first place, entrepreneurship, is because I had this really strong desire to have a career that served my life. And when I graduated from journalism school I didn't see a lot of options out there that matched what I envisioned for my life, which was a lot of autonomy, a lot of choice in terms of how my days looked and also where I wanted to live in the country and those things. And so I decided that I would just give it a go and I would see straight out of college how to be a freelance writer and it went really wel...

Copywriter Kaitlyn Parker is our guest for the 191st episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. We got to know Kaitlyn a bit better at this years IRL event where she took more than 35 pages of notes, recording the most important ideas and tactics that the speakers shared. We asked her why she did that as well as a lot of questions about how she's grown her business. Here's most of what we covered: •  how she turned a social media gig with LuluLemon into her current role as a copywriter •  what she does to make social media effective for her business •  how often she posts on instagram (and the size of her audience) •  how to make “copy” posts work on visual media like Instagram or Pinterest •  whether hiring a photographer for social images is worth it or not… ROI? •  how Kaitlyn comes up with the images for her brand •  her process for helping clients develop and dial in their brands •  the packages and deliverables she offers to her clients •  how her prices have evolved as her business has grown •  what her client relationships look like—retainers versus one-time projects •  how clients find her… it’s not all from social media •  the #1 thing she’s gotten from attending live events •  her biggest take away from TCCIRL and the speaker who made the most difference in her biz •  how she manages her time and projects (and the tools she uses) •  what she thinks the future of copywriting looks like If you've ever struggled to effectively capture your brand on social media, you won't want to miss this episode. To hear it, click the button below, or download it to your favorite podcast app. Readers scroll down for a full transcript.   The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: TCCIRL Sage Polaris Mike Kim Kaitlyn's website Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground   Full Transcript: Kira:   This episode is brought to you by The Copywriter Underground. The place to find more than 20 templates, dozens of presentations on topics like copywriting, and marketing your business. A community of successful writers, who share ideas and leads, and The Copywriter Club newsletter, mailed directly to your home every month. Learn more at thecopywriterunderground.com. Rob:   What if you could hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts? Ask them about their success and failures, their work processes and their habits, then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work, that's what Kira and I do every week, at The Copywriter Club Podcast. Kira:   You're invited to join the club for episode 191, as we chat with copywriter, Kaitlyn Parker about her career path, the importance of branding and social media in growing her business. Why she took 37 pages of notes at TCC in real life, and the process she uses to get crystal clear messaging for her clients. Kira:   Welcome Kaitlyn. Rob:   Hey Kaitlyn. Kaitlyn:   Hey, I'm so happy to be here. Thank you. Kira:   Yeah, we're excited that you're here. We met you at TCC in real life in San Diego. Kaitlyn:   The timing of that was just wild. I don't think any of us knew that it was going to turn into all of this. And here we are, barely have left our houses since then. Kira:   Yeah. Who knew? Craziness. Okay, so Kaitlyn, let's kick this off with your story. How did you end up as a copywriter? Kaitlyn:   Yeah, I feel like most copywriters, it was kind of accidental. I always loved writing and had a personal blog for years. And then after college I was an English major and then post-college, I had an outside sales job. Did that for a bit, but it was in recruiting and I just didn't love it. So I ended up actually working for Lululemon, and I was managing the social media, and marketing, and the community, divisions of the store as we were opening quite a few different stores in the area, and I really loved it. And people would be like, "Oh, that caption was so clever,