The Greg McKeown Podcast

335. Leading Through: Activating the Soul, Heart, and Mind of Leadership with The Clark Family (Part 2)

Sep 19, 2024

Kim Clark, a former Dean of Harvard Business School, and Jonathan Clark, a PhD and professor, delve into the heart of effective leadership. They emphasize the crucial shift from controlling styles to fostering individual empowerment and collective well-being. The discussion highlights the importance of love, genuine listening, and authentic connection in leadership. They also tackle the moral pitfalls of totalitarian approaches and the necessity of transforming toxic leadership behaviors for a healthier organizational culture.

35:33

Episode guests

Jonathan Clark

Kim B. Clark

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Episode notes

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Quick takeaways

Transitioning from self-serving leadership to one that empowers others is crucial for fostering collective growth and well-being.

Effective leadership hinges on love and connection, emphasizing the importance of understanding and prioritizing the needs of team members.

Deep dives

The Importance of Agency in Leadership

Every individual possesses intrinsic agency that cannot be wholly relinquished, though it can be overlooked. Cultivating this agency is essential for effective leadership, as it empowers individuals to influence positive change within organizations. Leaders are urged to utilize their power not for personal gain or control, but to foster environments that encourage growth, collaboration, and well-being for all members. This perspective shifts the focus of leadership from self-serving motives to creating lasting improvements that benefit future generations.

Intro

3min

Redefining Leadership: Agency and Responsibility

7min

The Moral Costs of Control in Leadership

8min

Authentic Leadership and Connection

11min

Transforming Toxic Leadership

6min

About the Guests:

Kim Clark: Former Dean of Harvard Business School and President of BYU Idaho. He has an extensive career in academia and leadership, shaping and leading renowned educational institutions.

Jonathan Clark: A PhD from Harvard and currently a professor at the University of Texas. Jonathan brings a wealth of knowledge from both his executive education experiences and extensive fieldwork.

Erin Clark: Managing Director and US National Leader for Deloitte’s Human Capital Consulting's leadership offerings. With over 20 years of experience as an executive coach, Erin specializes in fostering leadership and driving organizational change.

Episode Summary:

Greg and his guests continue to tackle the profound differences between superficial leadership tactics and truly ethical, value-based leadership. With real-world examples ranging from historical contexts to modern organizational behavior, the discussion sheds light on the internal battle between self-interest and collective well-being. The Clarks share actionable insights on empowering others, recognizing the dangers of conflating control with good outcomes, and creating environments where people can thrive.

Key Takeaways:

The Essence of Leading Through: Transitioning from a controlling mindset to one that fosters collective growth and individual empowerment.

Importance of Love in Leadership: Making other people your primary focus and building deeper connections through attention, affection, and genuine listening.

Competence as Protection: How being exceptionally good at your job can shield you from toxic leadership and help you excel.

Handling Power Over Dynamics: Strategies for identifying and addressing controlling behaviors in leadership while maintaining your integrity and effectiveness.

Moral and Ethical Leadership: The necessity of aligning leadership decisions with fundamental values that promote long-term organizational success and individual well-being.

Notable Quotes:

"You can choose to use your agency in ways that continue the control or choose something different." - Greg McKeown

"The continuum is desires and appetites and passions that lead you to damage or hurt other people." - Kim Clark

"Every person sort of comes into the world the agency, starting at zero." - Greg McKeown

"If you're mediocre, there's no recourse. But if you're really good at what you're doing, then the power over is still there, and you're not worried." - Kim Clark

"Leadership is moral and it is about making things better for as many people as we can." - Erin Clark

Resources:

Buy The Clark's Book "Leading Through"

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