The Marketer’s North Star is Myth

Apr 9, 2025

Lewis Pugh, an endurance swimmer and environmental activist, shares inspiring stories of pushing boundaries, like swimming at the North Pole, and what brands can learn about purpose from such feats. Ria Chin-You, VP of CRM at DAZN, discusses the challenges of personalizing marketing for 200+ global markets with a small team, while exploring the integration of AI in marketing workflows. Both guests emphasize the importance of emotional drive, agility in marketing, and the cultural nuances that influence effective global communication.

Ask episode

AI Snips

Chapters

Transcript

Episode notes

ANECDOTE

Lewis Pugh's Swimming Lessons

Lewis Pugh has accomplished only three failed swims in a nearly 40-year career due to inadequate preparation.
He emphasizes practicing until you can't get it wrong, not just until you get it right.

INSIGHT

Great vs Epic Swims

Lewis Pugh distinguishes between "great" and "epic" swims, aiming for the latter to make a lasting environmental impact.
Epic swims shift thinking and inspire protection of the environment.

ADVICE

Value of Listening in Campaigns

Listen actively to opposing views to find common ground for environmental campaigning.
Changing minds isn’t mandatory; offering a different perspective can inspire dialogue.

Get the Snipd Podcast app to discover more snips from this episode

Get the app

Brian goes live from Optimove Connect in London to explore how the idea of “positionless marketing” is revolutionizing the way we think about team structure, agility, and creativity in marketing. He chats with endurance swimmer and environmental activist Lewis Pugh, as well as DAZN’s Ria Chin-You and Optimove’s Paul O’Shea, about marketing’s future and how AI is shaping it.

Strive for Epic

Key takeaways:

[12:25] Lewis Pugh shares how emotional drive and preparation fuel extraordinary feats—like swimming across the North Pole—and what brands can learn from that level of purpose.
[20:29] “Epic” vs. “great”: Pugh discusses how to distinguish good work from game-changing campaigns.
[33:42] Environmental justice, consumer justice, and the universal value of doing what's right—and what this really means for global brands today.
[46:05] DAZN’s Ria Chin-You discusses managing CRM across 200+ markets with a team of nine—and the challenges of scaling personalization with limited resources.
[50:48] Integrating GenAI into real-world workflows is still a challenge, especially for resource-strapped teams—but the potential is there.
[58:24] Paul O’Shea explains Optimove’s vision for creating “super workers” through native AI integration and simplifying marketers’ jobs.
[1:01:08] Cultural nuance is key—global messaging isn’t just about translation, it’s about resonance.
[1:07:49] In fast-moving industries like sports, being agile isn’t optional. AI could be the key to real-time, reactive marketing at scale.
“Practice until you can’t get it wrong, not until you get it right.” — Lewis Pugh
“We need tools that help us scale personalization without sacrificing cultural authenticity.” — Ria Chin-You
“AI isn’t replacing you, it’s your new teammate.” — Brian

In-Show Mentions:

Learn more about Optimove’s positionless marketing platform at Optimove.com/futurecommerce
Discover Lewis Pugh’s environmental work at lewispughfoundation.org
Find Ria Chin-You’s work via DAZN and LinkedIn

Associated Links:

Check out Future Commerce on YouTube
Check out Future Commerce+ for exclusive content and save on merch and print
Subscribe to Insiders and The Senses to read more about what we are witnessing in the commerce world
Listen to our other episodes of Future Commerce

Have any questions or comments about the show? Let us know on futurecommerce.com, or reach out to us on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, or LinkedIn. We love hearing from our listeners!