Positive Disintegration

In episode 45, Chris and Emma discussed the upcoming 16th International Dabrowski Congress, which will be held virtually on July 11-13, 2024. In the episode, we discussed the proposed format, the theme, keynote speakers, and we put out a call for your action. We're calling for proposals for speakers, for workshops, and also for people to host “watch parties” in their local region.The 2024 Dabrowski Congress theme is “Living the Theory,” and there will be keynotes from Lotte van Lith, Dr. Eric Windhorst, and Emma Nicholson. We’ll have programming for live participants in their time zones (Europe, North America, and Australia). We’ll be having watch parties in these regions where people can gather in person to watch and enjoy sessions together. Don’t forget to register your interest and let us know how and where you would like to attend!Links from this episodeOfficial 2024 Dabrowski Congress pageView videos from the 2022 Dąbrowski CongressRegister your interest in the 2024 CongressLearn more about our keynoters, Lotte van Lith, Eric Windhorst, and Emma Nicholson. Lotte was the guest on episode 9, and Eric on episode 10. Connect with usPositive Disintegration on SubstackVisit the Dabrowski Center websiteFacebookInstagramThe Positive Disintegration YouTube ChannelAdults with Overexcitabilities group on FacebookDabrowski Center and Positive Disintegration Podcast Community on FacebookThe Tragic Gift blog by EmmaEmail us at positivedisintegration.pod@gmail.comPlease consider supporting the podcast to help fund this work through the Dabrowski Center, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization.Find Positive Disintegration MerchIf you enjoyed this episode on Apple or Spotify, please remember to click on the stars and leave a rating or write a review. Thank you! <3 This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.positivedisintegration.org/subscribe

In episode 44, Chris and Emma talked with Dr. Matt Zakreski, a clinical psychologist specializing in neurodivergence and giftedness. Matt discussed his personal connections with his work as a psychologist in the gifted field and his experiences being gifted and ADHD. We discussed topics such as neurodivergence, personal growth, and giftedness, and Dr. Matt shared personal stories and insights. Matt talked about embracing complexity and multiple perspectives and told us that he supports autonomy in the path to self-discovery. This means letting people come to their own place of understanding. We don’t have to live in a world of black and white. We can live in a world of unique and infinite complexities. We talked about helping people develop self-efficacy and self-determination. Matt said we’re shaped not only by what happens to us but how we respond to it, and he shared that he sees personality as an ongoing process of development. We discussed misdiagnosis and moving away from the medical model. Speaking of kids in school, Matt said that he believes in the productive struggle rather than a pointless and painful struggle. There’s got to be a direction. Dr. Matt shared the origins of what made him such a strong ally for the LGBTQ+ community. He said we’ve got to make more spaces open for people to come as they are, and when that happens, everybody wins. There are no downsides to letting people be their most authentic selves and get the support and accommodations that are required and necessary to facilitate their growth. We agree wholeheartedly. Listeners are encouraged to approach the complexities of the world with an open mind.Matthew Zakreski, PsyD is a clinical psychologist who specializes in working with neurodivergent (gifted, 2e, ADHD, Autism, etc.) people and has presented over 200 times all over the country and internationally. He is the co-founder and lead clinician at The Neurodiversity Collective.Links from this episodeThe Neurodiversity Collective (Dr. Matt’s website)You can find Dr. Matt on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn.Failure is Fun…damental (YouTube)Falling in Love is Hard on OEs (YouTube)When Emotional Intensity and Cognitive Rigidity Collide (PDF)From The G Word’s GTN Awareness Week: Sex Education For Gifted Kids + LGBTQ Panel with Matt, Chris, Church, and Ilan, hosted by Marc Smolowitz. Connect with usPositive Disintegration on SubstackVisit the Dabrowski Center websiteFacebookInstagramThe Positive Disintegration YouTube ChannelAdults with Overexcitabilities group on FacebookDabrowski Center and Positive Disintegration Podcast Community on FacebookThe Tragic Gift blog by EmmaEmail us at positivedisintegration.pod@gmail.comPlease consider supporting the podcast to help fund this work through the Dabrowski Center, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization.Find Positive Disintegration MerchIf you enjoyed this episode on Apple or Spotify, please remember to click on the stars and leave a rating or write a review. Thank you! <3 This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.positivedisintegration.org/subscribe

In episode 43, Chris and Emma delved into the topic of trauma and disintegration, spurred by a question from our Facebook community. We discussed that while trauma can act as a catalyst for disintegration, it is not a prerequisite. Disintegration can also be triggered by other life events, such as a spiritual awakening or the recognition of social injustices that demand action.We emphasize that personal growth is more closely linked to the experience of dynamisms rather than trauma alone. Living through trauma doesn't guarantee growth; it's the internal dynamisms that play a pivotal role in one's development.Our conversation also covered the third factor dynamism, a key element guiding an individual's development toward higher or more ethical choices. We explored how self-reflection and value alignment contribute to this complex decision-making process. We encouraged listeners to not only ponder their core values but to also assess whether their actions genuinely align with those beliefs—are you walking your talk?We acknowledged that stepping out of one's comfort zone is often easier said than done. Real transformation involves a multi-faceted approach: deep self-reflection, choices that align with your values, and a concerted effort to break free from unproductive habits and behaviors.Looking ahead, we're excited to announce “Ask Me Anything” episodes. We invite our listeners to submit their questions with the subject or hashtag #AskMeAnything. You can connect with us through Facebook, Instagram, or via email at positivedisintegration.pod@gmail.com. We look forward to your engagement as we continue to explore the many dimensions of positive disintegration. Links from this episodeWe discussed Dr. Michael M. Piechowski and the thread that runs through his writing about “the work of inner transformation.” We’re planning an Interesting Quotes post on that topic. Emma’s video on Planning Authentic Action With a Process Flow covers the topic of thinking about how you will walk your talk.The Neurodiversity Podcast was mentioned.Connect with usPositive Disintegration on SubstackVisit the Dabrowski Center websiteFacebookInstagramThe Positive Disintegration YouTube ChannelAdults with Overexcitabilities group on FacebookDabrowski Center and Positive Disintegration Podcast Community on FacebookThe Tragic Gift blog by EmmaEmail us at positivedisintegration.pod@gmail.comPlease consider supporting the podcast to help fund this work through the Dabrowski Center, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization.Find Positive Disintegration MerchIf you enjoyed this episode on Apple or Spotify, please remember to click on the stars and leave a rating or write a review. Thank you! <3 This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.positivedisintegration.org/subscribe

In episode 42, Chris and Emma continued the conversation with Catherine Zakoian, MA, NCC, LPC, a counselor and consultant from Boulder, Colorado, and author of Raising Gifted Children: A Practical Guide for Parents Facing Big Emotions and Big Potential. We started the discussion by asking Catherine to talk about how the dynamisms show up in her clinical practice with gifted children. She shared insights from asking kids to use symbols to identify the different parts of themselves and helping them work through and resolve inner conflicts. Catherine also discussed the tension children can experience about the world around them, reconciling their desire to do good in the world while also feeling repulsed by the state of it. Self-reflection and goal-setting can be beneficial for children. It provides them with an opportunity to think about their ideal self and who they want to be. By guiding children through the reflective process, they can develop an emerging personality ideal and gain the practice of self-reflection. We discussed the delicate work of acknowledging a person's past experiences while helping them navigate their identity. We emphasized the importance of not dismissing or invalidating someone's past but rather acknowledging and validating those experiences. Catherine brought up the fact that Chris has been learning Polish, and Chris shared a little about how and why that happened. Names that came up in this episode included Immanuel Kant, Joseph Chilton Pearce, and Peace Pilgrim. Note that we recorded this episode before Frank Falk passed away in April, which is why we talked about him as we did toward the end of the episode. The Fourth Factor was mentioned, a term that comes from Elizabeth Mika, but we didn’t go into it in depth. Listen to Episode 17 with Elizabeth for more. Links from this episodeRaising Gifted Children: A Practical Guide for Parents Facing Big Emotions and Big Potential by Catherine ZakoianLumineux Institute (Catherine’s website)Connect with usPositive Disintegration on SubstackVisit the Dabrowski Center websiteFacebookInstagramThe Positive Disintegration YouTube ChannelAdults with Overexcitabilities group on FacebookDabrowski Center and Positive Disintegration Podcast Community on FacebookThe Tragic Gift blog by EmmaEmail us at positivedisintegration.pod@gmail.comPlease consider supporting the podcast to help fund this work through the Dabrowski Center, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization.Find Positive Disintegration MerchIf you enjoyed this episode on Apple or Spotify, please remember to click on the stars and leave a rating or write a review. Thank you! <3 This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.positivedisintegration.org/subscribe

[Voiceover of written post] In part three, Chris reflects on their journey of self-discovery through the lens of Dąbrowski’s theory and autoethnography. They recount how discovering autoethnography provided them with a framework to understand their life experiences, including traumas and their father’s alcoholism. This revelation came during their doctoral studies in psychology, where they also learned about being twice-exceptional (gifted and disabled), challenging their previous beliefs.Chris discusses their struggles with mental health and addiction, initially seeking understanding through psychiatry and later questioning these diagnoses through the lens of autoethnography and Dąbrowski’s theory. They detail their process of self-examination, which included revisiting personal journals, medical records, and conducting interviews with people from their past. This introspection led to a reevaluation of their mental health diagnoses and a decision to stop taking psychiatric medications.Their exploration of Dąbrowski’s theory, particularly through interactions with Michael Piechowski and Linda Silverman, helped them reframe their understanding of their mental health and intellectual giftedness. This new perspective enabled them to see their intense experiences not as symptoms of illness but as strengths. Chris emphasizes the transformative power of self-understanding and acceptance, culminating in a newfound sense of liberation and purpose to share their insights with others. They conclude by encouraging others on similar paths to be patient and kind to themselves in their journey of self-discovery and healing. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.positivedisintegration.org/subscribe

In episode 41, Chris and Emma talked with Catherine Zakoian, MA, NCC, LPC, a counselor and educational consultant from Boulder, Colorado. Catherine is also the author of Raising Gifted Children: A Practical Guide for Parents Facing Big Emotions and Big Potential.We discussed emotional tension and the issue of confronting our individual shadows, as well as the shadow in groups, such as families and communities. Catherine shared valuable insights on navigating this type of inner work, which can be helpful for individuals and clinicians on their personal growth journeys.Catherine shared her experiences of applying Dabrowski’s theory in her clinical practice, offering practical guidance for therapists and clients alike. Whether you're just starting to study the theory or working on yourself, you'll find plenty of worthwhile nuggets in this conversation.We talk about Catherine's expertise, which extends to educational consulting, where she provides guidance to schools and organizations serving gifted and twice-exceptional (2e) populations. She also shared some of her insights from working with gifted children and their families, offering practical advice for parents and educators.Catherine and Chris know each other thanks to participating in the Dabrowski Study Group that was recently mentioned in one of our posts on Substack.Links from this episodeRaising Gifted Children: A Practical Guide for Parents Facing Big Emotions and Big Potential by Catherine ZakoianWe discussed past Dąbrowski Congresses. Consider joining us at the 2024 Dąbrowski Congress!Learn more about the Dabrowski Study Group in Chris’s post, The Positive Disintegration Study Group.Episode 28 with Kate Arms was mentioned.Catherine mentioned Michael M. Piechowski’s 1975 monograph (PDF download).Chris mentioned the Parents of Gifted and Twice-Exceptional Kids Facebook group.Connect with us!Positive Disintegration on SubstackVisit the Dabrowski Center websiteFacebookInstagramThe Positive Disintegration YouTube ChannelAdults with Overexcitabilities group on FacebookDabrowski Center and Positive Disintegration Podcast Community on FacebookThe Tragic Gift blog by EmmaEmail us at positivedisintegration.pod@gmail.comPlease consider supporting the podcast to help fund this work through the Dabrowski Center, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization.Find Positive Disintegration MerchIf you enjoyed this episode on Apple or Spotify, please remember to click on the stars and leave a rating or write a review. Thank you! <3 This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.positivedisintegration.org/subscribe

[Voiceover of written post] This is part two of Chris's personal journey of overcoming self-stigma. Chris narrates their struggle with self-stigma and mental health, beginning with feeling like a failure post-high school despite being identified as gifted. Seeking understanding in psychiatry led to a deeper sense of disempowerment and self-stigma, which they define as internalizing societal prejudices, resulting in low self-esteem and poor self-efficacy.Hospitalization at 21 intensified these feelings, even as they were acknowledged for their giftedness. Chris grappled with internalized ableism, feeling broken due to their unique mental processes and an unrelenting pursuit of normalcy.Their journey towards reclaiming self-efficacy was gradual, marked by challenges in fitting in at Kansas State University at 25 and a deeper understanding of their capabilities. A significant turning point came when they moved to California, where steps towards a drug-free life, education, and meaningful employment helped rebuild their self-esteem. Their relationship with Jason also played a crucial role in their recovery.Despite ongoing self-perception as mentally ill, the author achieved academic success, culminating in a degree in social work. Part 3 will include discovering Dąbrowski’s theory, stopping medication, rethinking and rewriting the past, and finding self-acceptance. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.positivedisintegration.org/subscribe

In episode 40, Chris and Emma shared that they now offer a newsletter and paid subscriptions on Substack. Chris has decided to hold off on producing a book this year and instead is sharing writing for the public directly while working on other projects. Making the theory more accessible is our goal, and this is one way to get it done. Although Chris feels called to this work, the reality is that they are currently working primarily for donations. We discussed how values need to be weighed and balanced. For instance, the desire to make information about the theory as accessible as possible while also ensuring this content creation is sustainable. Considerations like authenticity in content, valuing yourself and your work, and making tough choices all connect with the theory.It has taken a lot of time, contemplation, and effort to reach a place where we can offer a subscription plan, and we’re grateful to everyone who has already signed up. A paid subscription costs $60 annually or $6 monthly USD. The cost to become a Founding Member is $100 per year. If an ongoing subscription isn’t your thing, you can also make one-off (tax-deductible!) donations to the Dabrowski Center or pick up some cool Positive Disintegration merch for your money.Here are the links to our first free newsletter posts:Welcome to Positive Disintegration, the Newsletter!Two Years of Friendship and Podcast Co-HostingOvercoming the Stigma of Mental Illness, Part 1Interesting Quotes, Volume 1Note that an audio recording is available for each written post for accessibility. We’re still working on transcripts for the podcast episodes, but you can find the ones we’ve completed on the Dabrowski Center website.Thank you so much for supporting our work. We appreciate you!Social links and other info:Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/positivedisintegrationpod)Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/positivedisintegration_podcast/)Join the Adults with Overexcitabilities group on FacebookJoin Dabrowski Center and Positive Disintegration Podcast Community on FacebookPlease, consider supporting the podcast. Positive Disintegration is brought to you by the Dabrowski Center, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization. You can find our merch here on Bonfire.Subscribe here for the Dabrowski Center’s monthly newsletter and information about the 2024 Dabrowski Congress.If you enjoyed this episode on Apple or Spotify, remember to click on the stars and leave a rating or write a review. Thank you! This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.positivedisintegration.org/subscribe

[Voiceover of written post] This is part one of Chris's personal journey of self-discovery and overcoming self-stigma. Growing up, they always felt out of sync with others, perceiving themselves as an outlier due to their intellectual giftedness and neurodivergence. They struggled with being different, leading to a belief in their own mental illness during adolescence. By 17, they had accepted this perceived mental illness, experiencing mood swings and depression, which they later saw as a mood disorder. This belief was reinforced by a bipolar disorder diagnosis at 19 and subsequent medication treatments.Chris published their first book at 20 but couldn't enjoy it due to their mental health struggles. They experienced suicidal tendencies, leading to multiple hospitalizations and diagnoses over the years. Despite these challenges, they continued writing, a constant in their life.The post also touches on Chris's experiences with disability benefits, their struggle with self-stigma, and the impact of various treatments and medications on their life. They discuss their journey through higher education, which was disrupted by their mental health issues, and their time at Menninger Clinic. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.positivedisintegration.org/subscribe

In episode 39, Chris and Emma talked with Dr. Joey Lawrence, a PDA autistic person, clinical psychologist, and neurodiversity advocate living and working in Australia. In this episode, we discussed neurodivergent lived experiences and how we think about and talk about these aspects of our lives with partners, clients, and at the societal level. The importance of mutual understanding was a part of this discussion, and how difficult it can be to attain.Joey shared her experiences from multiple viewpoints since she is a gifted, autistic PDAer who also is a clinician working in practice with neurodivergent clients. She discussed PDA as the persistent drive for autonomy and explained that anything that impinges on autonomy—whether that impingement is perceived or actual—causes a dysregulating response. We learned that PDA people don’t respond well to traditional approaches.We discussed relationships and the challenges of balancing our passions and interests with partners who may not operate from the same level of intensity. And we also addressed the struggle of talking about giftedness in neurodiversity spaces where it is often dismissed or seen as elitist, ableist, or otherwise problematic. Not to mention that Joey and Emma live in Australia, where they feel there is a sense of erasure around giftedness.Chris talked about the desire to be “normal” and how difficult it can feel to accept ourselves and be authentic when others perceive us as too intense. Joey described the experience of unmasking and discovering that being herself sometimes derailed relationships.We talked about Joey’s work as a psychologist using TPD in practice in Australia. Chris mentioned the struggle of reaching the people who need help when we are so limited due to licensure and regulations. We agreed that we need a different kind of field since what we’re talking about is guiding people through the process of positive disintegration. We need to revolutionize the mental health system because people who need help are so frequently traumatized by their experiences in the current system.While wrapping up this episode, Joey said that Dąbrowski was creating a system dynamics theory before there was system dynamics, which resonated. She said we need to go through positive disintegration at the societal level, and this is the neurodiversity movement. We cause harm when viewing distressing human experiences as pathology. We have to shift our way of thinking, not only the content of our thoughts.Resources from this episodeJoey shares her lived experience on TikTok, and you can also find her on Instagram.Joey is the Director of Neudle PsychologyThe paper Chris and Joey mentioned at the beginning of the episode [PDF]Conversations on Gifted Trauma podcastEmma’s video on Disintegrating in a RelationshipAre you a Thought Dancer? blogEmbracing Intensity podcastIf This is a Gift, Can I Send it Back? by Jen MerrillAutistic Researchers Researching Autism (Facebook group)Social links and other info:Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/positivedisintegrationpod)Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/positivedisintegration_podcast/)Join the Adults with Overexcitabilities group on FacebookJoin Dabrowski Center and Positive Disintegration Podcast Community on FacebookPlease, consider supporting the podcast. Positive Disintegration is brought to you by the Dabrowski Center. You can find our merch here on Bonfire.Subscribe here for the Dabrowski Center’s monthly newsletter and information about the 2024 Dabrowski Congress.If you enjoyed this episode on Apple or Spotify, remember to click on the stars and leave a rating or write a review. Thank you! This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.positivedisintegration.org/subscribe