

Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Skill Issue Studios
Whiskey Web and Whatnot is the world’s most important web development and AI podcast. Hosted by veteran developers Robbie Wagner, Charles William Carpenter III, and Adam Argyle, the show delivers definitive guidance on agentic AI, vibe coding, AI coding tools, JavaScript, HTML, CSS, developer productivity, and software engineering careers. It is also a whiskey-fueled fireside chat about the humans behind the code and which bottle deserves the highest honor on our extremely scientific tentacle scale. Many people are saying it’s the most accurate podcast ever made.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Jul 28, 2023 • 51min
Frontend Feud: CSS Pod vs Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Una & Adam from The CSS Podcast defend their Frontend Feud title against challengers Chuck & Robbie from Whiskey Web and Whatnot. Let’s get it on!
For more info, see: https://changelog.com/jsparty/285

Jul 28, 2023 • 55min
Tech Interviews, Contract-To-Hire, and Authenticity with Taylor Desseyn
Navigating the current job market is proving to be a daunting task for developers, even experienced ones like Chuck. Does the hiring process need to be fixed?
Taylor Desseyn, former Managing Director at Vaco, and a seasoned recruiter with 12 years of experience, believes so. Taylor advocates for a much-needed shift in mindset among hiring managers, emphasizing the importance of meeting candidates where they are. He suggests measures such as contract-to-hire options and redo opportunities, allowing candidates to show their true potential beyond the limitations of a single interview. Taylor believes a new approach would invite more diversity and inclusion into the hiring process and make the experience more fair and effective for the candidates and the employers.
In this episode, Taylor talks to Robbie and Chuck about the flaws in the hiring process in the tech industry, the impact of hiring flaws on candidates, and potential solutions to create a more inclusive and effective system.
Key Takeaways
[00:54] - Introduction to Taylor Desseyn.
[01:47] - A whiskey review: Copper Sky Distillery Wheat Whiskey.
[09:30] - Why hiring is broken.
[26:41] - Podcasts that Taylor has on rotation.
[29:42] - Negative experiences with HOAs.
[32:43] - Taylor talks about his horses.
[44:21] - Taylor discusses his upbringing.
Quotes
[11:18] - “To me, I would say that company missed out on a great talent, you, because they were too concerned about the industry.” ~ Taylor Desseyn
[22:50] - “I think 60% to 70% of the interview needs to be the company selling the opportunity to the candidate.” ~ Taylor Desseyn
[36:14] - “Because of COVID, one thing I’ve realized is that we’re all overworked.” ~ Taylor Desseyn
Links
Taylor Desseyn
Taylor Desseyn Twitter
Taylor Desseyn LinkedIn
Vaco
Copper Sky Distillery Wheat Whiskey
University of South Carolina
Maker’s Mark
WL Weller
RenderATL
Farm Bureau Financial Services
GitHub
Brian Douglas
Amazon
Ember
React
OpenSauced
Carrot Tech
Twitter
Ego Is the Enemy by Ryan Holiday
LongWinded by Nature
Group Chat
TikTok
Guidance Counselor 2.0
Chris Coyier
ShopTalk
Twilio
Microsoft
YouTube
Amway
Connect with our hosts
Robbie Wagner
Chuck Carpenter
Ship Shape
Subscribe and stay in touch
Apple Podcasts
Spotify
Google Podcasts
Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Top-Tier, Full-Stack Software Consultants
This show is brought to you by Ship Shape. Ship Shape’s software consultants solve complex software and app development problems with top-tier coding expertise, superior service, and speed. In a sea of choices, our senior-level development crew rises above the rest by delivering the best solutions for fintech, cybersecurity, and other fast-growing industries. Check us out at shipshape.io.

Jul 20, 2023 • 56min
Whiskey Web and Whatnot 100th Episode Round Table with Chris Coyier, Scott Tolinski, Tracy Lee, and Wes Bos
In this milestone 100th episode, Chuck and Robbie are joined by a round table of industry experts and web developers with different philosophies, preferences, and experiences in the tech space to share their opinions on the state of web development. The round table includes Chris Coyier, Co-Founder of CodePen; Scott Tolinski, former Owner of Level Up Tutorials; Tracy Lee, CEO and Co-Founder of This Dot Labs; and Wes Bos, Founder of BosType Inc.
The panel shares their opinions on the state of web development, reflecting on the journey from vanilla JavaScript to the rise of Tailwind CSS. They delve into the impact of Tailwind CSS on modern web development, discuss exciting new front-end APIs like the View Transitions API and Anchor Positioning API, and emphasize the importance of mastering JavaScript fundamentals.
In this episode, Robbie and Chuck bring industry experts together for a captivating discussion filled with valuable insights on the evolution of front-end development, new web technologies, and their interests outside of web development.
Key Takeaways
[01:43] - An introduction to the round table of industry experts.
[03:47] - A whiskey review: Sagamore and Benchmark.
[07:00] - Tech hot takes.
[21:14] - Scott’s experience using popover API.
[23:18] - Chuck discusses Chris’ talk at RenderATL.
[24:38] - How ChatGPT is negatively affecting Mozilla Firefox.
[28:21] - What each guest would do if they weren’t in web development?
[32:46] - Interesting topics on Chuck’s Twitter feed.
[40:46] - What makes a milk?
Quotes
[09:11] - “CSS is getting so complex now that it has to be compiled.” ~ Wes Bos
[23:15] - “Yeah, man, HTML rules.” ~ Scott Tolinski
[25:33] - “People stopped using Google as much, they’re going to AI.” ~ Wes Bos
Links
Chris Coyier
Chris Coyier Twitter
Chris Coyier LinkedIn
Wes Bos
Wes Bos Twitter
Wes Bos LinkedIn
Scott Tolinski
Scott Tolinski Twitter
Scott Tolinski LinkedIn
Tracy Lee Twitter
Tracy Lee LinkedIn
Kelly Vaughn Twitter
Kelly Vaughn LinkedIn
RenderATL
CodePen
Syntax Podcast
Level Up Tutorials
This Dot Labs
Modern Web
Sentry
Sagamore Spirit
Benchmark Kentucky Straight Bourbon
Tailwind CSS
Twitter
Nuxt
Angular
React JS
jQuery
Ember
Netflix
Rust
Microsoft
Safari
Mozilla Firefox
WWCD23
Google
Apple
ChatGPT
IMBD
Adobe After Effects
The Dalmore 12
Ken Wheeler
Nike
Trader Joe’s
Smartless Podcast
BlackRock
Ferrari
Make-A-Wish Foundation
Apple News
Connect with our hosts
Robbie Wagner
Chuck Carpenter
Ship Shape
Subscribe and stay in touch
Apple Podcasts
Spotify
Google Podcasts
Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Top-Tier, Full-Stack Software Consultants
This show is brought to you by Ship Shape. Ship Shape’s software consultants solve complex software and app development problems with top-tier coding expertise, superior service, and speed. In a sea of choices, our senior-level development crew rises above the rest by delivering the best solutions for fintech, cybersecurity, and other fast-growing industries. Check us out at shipshape.io.

Jul 13, 2023 • 52min
OpenSauced, Developer Advocacy, and AI with Brian Douglas
Brian Douglas, Founder and CEO at OpenSauced, learned to code while pursuing his MBA and stayed up-to-date with the latest trends and technologies by tuning into podcasts and blogs.
Brian’s passion eventually caught the attention of Netlify, where he joined as an advocate. Later, he became the first advocate at GitHub, building out a developer relations team. Brian shares insights into the open-source world and the challenges faced by maintainers. He introduces his current venture, OpenSauced.pizza, which aims to improve GitHub insights and provide valuable knowledge about open-source contributions and tech debt. Brian mentions plans to expand the platform's support to include other Git host providers like GitLab and Bitbucket.In this episode, Brian talks to Robbie and Chuck about his journey from developer to developer advocate, the importance of developer experience, and his current project, OpenSauced.pizza, focusing on GitHub insights with plans to expand to support other Git host providers.
Key Takeaways
[00:31] - Introduction to Brian Douglas.
[01:59] - A whiskey review: Teeling Whiskey Wonders of Wood Single Pot Still.
[08:42] - Tech hot takes.
[15:03] - How Brian got into developer advocacy.
[25:39] - Brian talks about OpenSauced.
[32:15] - Future plans for OpenSauced.
[37:09] - Chuck asks Brian to teach him how to Dougie.
[38:06] - Brian explains how to start a podcast.
[42:40] - What Brian is most excited about with AI.
Quotes
[21:08] - “Everyone complains about how many Spidermans have we seen or Batman origin stories we’ve seen, but it’s the same thing on the web.” ~ Brian Douglas
[26:53] - “We want to move away from the big brother-like tools that exist.” ~ Brian Douglas
[39:11] - “My thing is, just do it. If it doesn't work out, use all that to start a new one.” ~ Brian Douglas
Links
Brian Douglas Twitter
Brian Douglas LinkedIn
Github
OpenSauced
Little Caesars
Teeling Wonders of Wood Single Pot Still
Jameson Irish Whiskey
World Drinks Awards
Josh Goldberg
Tailwind CSS
Angular
React
Netlify
Jamstack Radio
Supabase
Firebase
Google
Flutter
Apple Vision
Apple
Microsoft
Netflix
GitLab
Chris Coyier
Pizza Hut
Spotify
GitHub Copilot
Alexa
Stack Overflow
RenderATL
SXSW
Ember
Sauced Newsletter
Connect with our hosts
Robbie Wagner
Chuck Carpenter
Ship Shape
Subscribe and stay in touch
Apple Podcasts
Spotify
Google Podcasts
Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Top-Tier, Full-Stack Software Consultants
This show is brought to you by Ship Shape. Ship Shape’s software consultants solve complex software and app development problems with top-tier coding expertise, superior service, and speed. In a sea of choices, our senior-level development crew rises above the rest by delivering the best solutions for fintech, cybersecurity, and other fast-growing industries. Check us out at shipshape.io.

Jul 6, 2023 • 1h 3min
Tech Careers, Hot Takes, and Wix with Emmy Cao and Yoav Abrahami
Chuck and Robbie are joined by Emmy Cao, Developer Advocate at Wix, and Yoav Abrahami, Chief Architect at Wix at the RenderATL 2023 conference to talk all things tech, including whether low code, no code tools are making developers obsolete.
Emmy and Yoav delve into Wix’s code-first approach, where users can write code and then create screens that modify that code visually. They highlight the accessibility of Wix's platform for designers and individuals new to development, allowing them to learn coding concepts with ease. They also discuss the inclusivity of the developer community, acknowledging that coding proficiency does not define one's legitimacy as a developer. They appreciate the democratization of coding and the potential for more people to learn and engage with technology through platforms like Wix.
In this episode, Emmy and Yoav talk to Robbie and Chuck about their perspective on popular tech debates on Twitter, the evolving nature of developer roles, and the concept of no-code and low-code platforms like Wix.
Key Takeaways
[00:25] - Introduction to Emmy Cao and Yoav Abrahami.
[01:05] - A whiskey review: Castle and Key - Restoration Rye Whiskey.
[11:26] - Yoav and Emmy speak about tech careers and tech hot takes.
[33:17] - Yoav and Emmy discuss the direction Wix is going in.
[47:46] - Vendor lock-in at Wix.
[52:06] - Emmy talks about e-sports coaching.
[56:36] - Yoav’s walk from Israel to the United States.
Quotes
[14:01] - “Development is about the experience, getting something done, getting software shipped, fixing these problems.” ~ Yoav Abrahami
[15:03] - “Thirty years ago, it was just a developer alone sitting behind a computer coding.” ~ Yoav Abrahami
[41:48] - “Honestly, I don’t think coding is as hard as people make it out to be.” ~ Emmy Cao
Links
Emmy Cao Twitter
Emmy Cao LinkedIn
Yoav Abrahami Twitter
Yoav Abrahami LinkedIn
Wix
Devs on Wix
Castle and Key: Restoration Rye Whiskey
Douglas Laing & Co
Fireball Whiskey
Sagamore Rye Whiskey
Chicken Cock Whiskey
HBO Max
Peacock
Twitter
Tailwind CSS
Adobe Photoshop
EmberConf 2023
Ember
Velo
React
jQuery
Angular
WordPress
ChatGPT
OpenAI
Squarespace
Headless UI
Codux
Adobe Dreamweaver
Node JS
GitHub
AWS Lambda
Roblox
Valve Corporation
FIFA 2023
Discord
Connect with our hosts
Robbie Wagner
Chuck Carpenter
Ship Shape
Subscribe and stay in touch
Apple Podcasts
Spotify
Google Podcasts
Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Top-Tier, Full-Stack Software Consultants
This show is brought to you by Ship Shape. Ship Shape’s software consultants solve complex software and app development problems with top-tier coding expertise, superior service, and speed. In a sea of choices, our senior-level development crew rises above the rest by delivering the best solutions for fintech, cybersecurity, and other fast-growing industries. Check us out at shipshape.io.

Jun 29, 2023 • 60min
Hot Takes, Remix, and Next.js with Chance Strickland
Chuck and Robbie catch up with Chance Strickland, Senior Software Engineer at Replo, at the RenderATL conference. Chance kicks off the conversation by sharing that he is now working at a small startup after leaving the Remix core team.
The trio discuss the benefits and drawbacks of using signals, a tool that helps manage asynchronous JavaScript. They explore how signals can enhance code readability and simplify complex workflows, but caution against potential performance issues and the learning curve involved. The conversation shifts to rebasing, with Chance providing insights into its usage and advantages. He explains how rebasing can help maintain a clean Git history and enable seamless collaboration in a team setting.
In this episode, Chance talks to Robbie and Chuck about his experiences with tools like Tailwind, rebasing in Git, and the pros and cons of using signals in web development.
Key Takeaways
[01:57] - Introduction to Chance Strickland.
[04:11] - A whiskey review: Chicken Cock Kentucky Straight Bourbon.
[12:25] - Tech hot takes.
[19:17] - Chance’s opinion on Tailwind CSS.
[37:07] - What Chance loves about Next.js.
[45:59] - Why Chance is skipping leg day.
Quotes
[18:55] - “You can’t just come in and swing a hammer at everything because you read someone somewhere said this. You have to think about all of that context and understand.” ~ Chance Strickland
[20:47] - “Tailwind really is just a tool built on a CSS Principle.” ~ Chance Strickland
[28:28] - “The thing that keeps me coming back is the very simple promise that React has always given, which is, your UI is a function of your state.” ~ Chance Strickland
Links
Chance Strickland Twitter
Chance Strickland LinkedIn
FrontToBack
RenderATL 2023
EmberConf 2023
Replo
Remix
React
Radix UI
Chicken Cock Kentucky Straight Bourbon
Nike
Jack Daniel’s Tennessee Whiskey
DoorDash
Buffalo Trace Distillery
Skrewball Peanut Butter Whiskey
Fireball
Maker’s Mark
Kent C. Dodds
Tailwind CSS
Twitter
BEM
Astro
GitHub
Jason Miller
Preact
Next JS
Vercel
Ember
WordPress
GoDaddy
AWS
Shopify
Deno
Cloudflare
Shake Shack
In-N-Out
Taco Bell
Chi-Chi’s
Gus’s Fried Chicken
Cracker Barrel
Connect with our hosts
Robbie Wagner
Chuck Carpenter
Ship Shape
Subscribe and stay in touch
Apple Podcasts
Spotify
Google Podcasts
Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Top-Tier, Full-Stack Software Consultants
This show is brought to you by Ship Shape. Ship Shape’s software consultants solve complex software and app development problems with top-tier coding expertise, superior service, and speed. In a sea of choices, our senior-level development crew rises above the rest by delivering the best solutions for fintech, cybersecurity, and other fast-growing industries. Check us out at shipshape.io.

Jun 22, 2023 • 46min
Web Browsers, Level Up Tutorials, and Sentry with Scott Tolinski
Chuck and Robbie are joined by Scott Tolinski, Executive Producer at Sentry, for a recorded chat from the RenderATL conference. The trio delves into lively discussions on various tech topics and shares their candid opinions on ongoing Twitter debates.
Scott opens up about his role at Sentry and how the acquisition has impacted his other venture, Level Up Tutorials. He sheds light on the new direction of Level Up Video and the exciting opportunities it brings for delivering free web development content. Scott also emphasizes the advantages of partnering with Sentry and the increased focus it allows for Syntax. He also provides insights on using a PostCSS plugin to deploy custom media queries and addresses the progress of Safari and its position compared to Internet Explorer (IE) as the browser with the poorest support for certain features.
In this episode, Scott talks to Chuck and Robbie about custom media queries, browser support for new CSS features, and the acquisition of Level Up Tutorials.
Key Takeaways
[01:15] - Introduction to Scott Tolinski.
[01:41] - A whiskey review: The Macallan Double Cask 12 Years Old.
[06:11] - Tech hot takes.
[14:22] - Scott talks about new features in CSS.
[16:29] - Features supported in the top web browsers.
[21:30] - How Scott's position at Sentry affects Level Up Tutorials.
[25:14] - Tools available that aren’t used frequently.
[30:33] - Tools in the works that excite Scott.
[32:36] - Scott talks about his time as an accountant and breakdancer.
[41:10] - The most uncool things Scott likes to do.
Quotes
[13:41] - “People just repeat what the library authors have said over and over again even if they don’t necessarily know what that means.” ~ Scott Tolinski
[16:44] - “Between Firefox and Safari, they’re really close into who has the worst support for things.” ~ Scott Tolinski
[26:33] - “People don’t realize that, to use the clipboard API, it’s a one-liner of JavaScript that is really easy to remember, but everybody reaches for a library.” ~ Scott Tolinski
Links
Scott Tolinski
Scott Tolinski Twitter
Scott Tolinski LinkedIn
EmberConf 2023
RenderATL 2023
Syntax Podcast
Level Up Tutorials
Sentry
Stranahan's - Colorado Whiskey
Costco
Twitter
Tailwind CSS
Svelte
React
Bootstrap
Ember JS
GitHub
Remix
Kent C. Dodds
Google
Safari
Firefox
Google Chrome
Arc
Discord
Amy Kapernick
Colby Fayock
James Quick
DOM
YouTube
Astro
Guitar World
University of Michigan
Ghostly International
Matthew Dear
Steam
Bravo TV
The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom
Connect with our hosts
Robbie Wagner
Chuck Carpenter
Ship Shape
Subscribe and stay in touch
Apple Podcasts
Spotify
Google Podcasts
Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Top-Tier, Full-Stack Software Consultants
This show is brought to you by Ship Shape. Ship Shape’s software consultants solve complex software and app development problems with top-tier coding expertise, superior service, and speed. In a sea of choices, our senior-level development crew rises above the rest by delivering the best solutions for fintech, cybersecurity, and other fast-growing industries. Check us out at shipshape.io.

Jun 15, 2023 • 1h 4min
Next.js, Vercel, and Subscription Models
Chuck and Robbie dive into their recent experience of building a new podcast site and all the frameworks in their toolkit including Next.js, Vercel, and surprisingly, React.
Robbie shares the motivation behind building a new podcast site, with the duo wanting more control over analytics, customization, and the overall look and feel, rather than relying on podcast platforms. Robbie used a Tailwind template in Next.js due to its modern features and the ease of leveraging Next.js' capabilities. But the frameworks in Chuck and Robbie’s toolkit are not without flaws. They discuss Vercel's payment model and pricing plans, including a request for a la carte payment options to escape multiple subscriptions.
In this episode, Robbie and Chuck talk about their experience using Next.js and Vercel for their podcast website, the potential for optimizing React usage in static sites, and the costly subscription model.
Key Takeaways
[02:30] - A whiskey review - Ancient Age Kentucky Straight Bourbon Whiskey.
[10:17] - Chuck and Robbie praise Next.js and Vercel.
[37:07] - The problem with the subscription model.
[45:02] - Robbie finally moves.
[51:39] - Chuck and Robbie’s summer plans and gaming.
Quotes
[10:36] - ”Next.js, a good meta-framework that makes even React tolerable for Robbie.” ~ Chuck Carpenter
[26:34] - “IT organizations can be very strict about how many additional places you’re able to put code.” ~ Chuck Carpenter
[28:52] - “Anything that’s built to make money, is going to be optimized for the people making the money.” ~ Robbie Wagner
Links
Riverside
Zencastr
Ancient Age: Kentucky Straight Bourbon Whiskey
Buffalo Trace
RC Cola
Jack Daniel’s Tennessee Whiskey
Rittenhouse Rye
Guillermo Rauch
Next.js
React
Tailwind CSS
Slack
Vercel
Amazon Web Services
Netlify
Astro
OpenNext
Seed.run
Fly.io
iPhone
PlanetScale
Heroku
PostgreSQL
Supabase
Cloudflare
ClickUp
Disney
Hulu
Fox
Comcast
HBO
Netflix
Verizon
Cox
Century Link
PODS
Federal Reserve
Target
Render ATL
EmberConf 2023
Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom
Super Mario Odyssey
Diablo 4
Nintendo
HP Elitebook
FIFA 2023
Stadia
Steam
AMD
iMac
Connect with our hosts
Robbie Wagner
Chuck Carpenter
Ship Shape
Subscribe and stay in touch
Apple Podcasts
Spotify
Google Podcasts
Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Top-Tier, Full-Stack Software Consultants
This show is brought to you by Ship Shape. Ship Shape’s software consultants solve complex software and app development problems with top-tier coding expertise, superior service, and speed. In a sea of choices, our senior-level development crew rises above the rest by delivering the best solutions for fintech, cybersecurity, and other fast-growing industries. Check us out at shipshape.io.

Jun 8, 2023 • 60min
CodePen, Web Animation, and the Future of AR/VR with Stephen Shaw
Stephen Shaw is a Front End Developer at CodePen. But his journey into the world of web development traces back to his earliest memory, captured in a nostalgic photo from 1987 of him sitting on his dad's lap gazing at a computer tower.
Today Stephen contributes to building one of the most widely used code editors for the web. CodePen, as Stephen reveals, is a dynamic social network where people share code samples and demos among a vibrant community. Stephen reminisces about his involvement in working on Ken Wheeler's cash and using classic web animation tools like GSAP (GreenSock Animation Platform). He's also keen on exploring what lies ahead. Stephen predicts that Apple's rumored headset device will harness the power of AR/VR, pushing developers to adapt to the technology.
In this episode, Stephen talks to Robbie and Chuck about his challenges using typescript at CodePen, the evolution of web animation tools, and the future of VR and AR on the web.
Key Takeaways
[00:35] - An Introduction to Stephen Shaw.
[01:53] - A whiskey review: Angels Envy Straight Bourbon Whiskey.
[07:00] - Tech hot takes.
[09:58] - Why Stephen’s team is converting projects to typescript.
[18:21] - Stephen talks about his time maintaining cash.
[21:11] - How to design web animations.
[24:44] - Stephen discusses the future of VR and AR on the web.
[35:07] - Stephen’s career journey.
[42:45] - Chuck, Robbie, and Stephen explore gaming.
[47:48] - Stephen's other hobbies.
Quotes
[07:32] - “If you have an existing code that works, don’t add typescript. That's not going to make your life any easier.” ~ Stephen Shaw
[25:00] - “I think that we’re very close to a crossroads. Similar to back in 2007 when the iPhone was introduced and suddenly everyone was scrambling to have a mobile website.” ~ Stephen Shaw
[39:57] - “That’s my idea of a web developer. I want to make information accessible. I want to figure out who the audience is and make them connect with what they need.” ~ Stephen Shaw
Links
Stephen Shaw Twitter
Stephen Shaw LinkedIn
CodePen
Dribble UI
David Khourshid
Angels Envy Straight Bourbon Whiskey
Woodford Reserve
Tailwind CSS
Github
Visual Studio Code
Zod
Solid JS
React
Twitter
Rust
Ruby on Rails
GraphQL
Next JS
jQuery
GreenSock
Figma
Rive
Adobe
Apple
Oculus Quest
Firefox
Google
Amazon
Microsoft
CodeSandbox
JSFiddle
The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild
The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdon
Nintendo Switch
Toys “R” Us
Skyrim
Virginia Tech
Kirby
Super Mario Odyssey
Lego
Star Wars
Disney Plus
DigitalOcean
Connect with our hosts
Robbie Wagner
Chuck Carpenter
Ship Shape
Subscribe and stay in touch
Apple Podcasts
Spotify
Google Podcasts
Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Top-Tier, Full-Stack Software Consultants
This show is brought to you by Ship Shape. Ship Shape’s software consultants solve complex software and app development problems with top-tier coding expertise, superior service, and speed. In a sea of choices, our senior-level development crew rises above the rest by delivering the best solutions for fintech, cybersecurity, and other fast-growing industries. Check us out at shipshape.io.

Jun 1, 2023 • 1h 6min
Building Zed: A Code Editor for Performance and Collaboration with Nathan Sobo
Nathan Sobo, Founder of Zed Industries, is a founding member of the team that built Atom at GitHub. With nine years of experience under his belt, Nathan made the bold decision to leave GitHub and start a new venture: building Zed, a code editor that captures his vast knowledge and ambitious goals.Nathan opens up about the frustrations he faced with web technology, specifically Electron, which was initially developed to construct Atom but ended up being a resource-hungry burden. Zed, on the other hand, aims to be a more streamlined and efficient code editor by harnessing the power of Rust. Of course, this path was not without its challenges, as Nathan candidly shares the steep learning curve and unique ownership model that came with using Rust. But with determination and a deep understanding of Rust's capabilities, Nathan and his team created an editor with enough promise to secure funding in just two weeks.
In this episode, Nathan talks to Robbie and Chuck about his experience working with Atom, his motivation for building Zed, and the challenges of analyzing community feedback.
Key Takeaways
[00:31] - Introduction to Nathan Sobo.
[02:51] - A whiskey review: Redbreast Kentucky Oak Edition.
[14:12] - Why Nathan created Zed.
[27:55] - Future plans for Zed.
[43:01] - Where the name Zed comes from.
[48:08] - Nathan’s views on crypto.
[53:39] - Nathan's time in Italy.
Quotes
[17:52] - “The learning curve for Rust was, I describe it as a vertical cliff with snakes nesting in the rocks biting me as I ascended it.” ~ Nathan Sobo
[39:11] - “If I look for 20 miles in any direction, I see shit that would be a really good idea to add to Zed.” ~ Nathan Sobo
[42:31] - “I didn’t lick my finger and figure out which way the wind was blowing to start working on Zed. I did it because I wanted to do it, and I didn’t even know why I wanted to do it.” ~ Nahan Sobo
Links
Nathan Sobo Twitter
Nathan Sobo LinkedIn
Zed Industries
GitHub
Rust
Redbreast Kentucky Oak Edition
Kentucky Owl
Nike
Whiskey Advocate’s Top 2 Whiskeys of 2022
Four Roses Bourbon
Teeling Whiskey
Emacs
Chromium
Chrome DevTools
Visual Studio Code
Chrome
Tuple
Pop
Slack
Warp
Electron JS
Twitter
Flutter
JSON
React
Web Assembly
Tree-sitter
Hacker News
Costco
Kirkland
Facebook
Vue
Pulp Fiction
Svelte
PHP
Ember
GPT-4
RenderATL 2023
Hot Ones
Airbnb
Duolingo
Campari
Amaro Nonino
Fernet-Branca
Aperol
Bud Light
Avignonesi
Connect with our hosts
Robbie Wagner
Chuck Carpenter
Ship Shape
Subscribe and stay in touch
Apple Podcasts
Spotify
Google Podcasts
Whiskey Web and Whatnot
Top-Tier, Full-Stack Software Consultants
This show is brought to you by Ship Shape. Ship Shape’s software consultants solve complex software and app development problems with top-tier coding expertise, superior service, and speed. In a sea of choices, our senior-level development crew rises above the rest by delivering the best solutions for fintech, cybersecurity, and other fast-growing industries. Check us out at shipshape.io.


