Two by Two

Srinath Mallikarjunan, CEO and chief scientist at Unmanned Dynamics, and Nitin Pai, co-founder of the Takshashila Institution, delve into India's AI landscape. They discuss the challenges faced by local startups in competing with global giants, highlighting missed opportunities in foundational AI models. The duo critiques the government's plans for data centers and subsidies while stressing the need for sustained innovation. They also explore how cultural factors hinder India's tech potential and emphasize the importance of long-term thinking over quick gains in the ever-evolving AI sector.

Abhijeet Anand, Founder and CEO of Abcoffee, and Deepak Shahdadpuri, Managing Director and founder of DSG Consumer Partners, dive into India's evolving coffee culture. They discuss how India's cafes balance food and coffee, the struggle for profitability, and shifting consumer behaviors, especially among younger generations. The role of quick commerce and innovative strategies for attracting customers is also highlighted, emphasizing a transformation in how coffee is consumed and experienced in modern-day India.

Vikas Bardia, the co-founder and CEO of Shoffr, and Arpit Agarwal, an investment partner at Blume Ventures, delve deep into the rise and fall of Blusmart, a once-prominent player in India's electric vehicle ride-sharing market. They explore funding challenges, emphasizing the shift from venture capital to debt financing for sustainability. The duo discusses lessons from Blusmart’s collapse, the importance of reliable service models, and the emergent opportunities for new entrants. Insights on driver welfare and the evolving transportation landscape make this conversation a thought-provoking listen.

This episode of Two by Two was first published on 24th April 2025.Premium subscribers of The Ken have full access to ALL our premium audio. They are available exclusively via The Ken’s subscriber apps. If you don’t have them, just download one and log in to unlock everything. Get your premium subscription using this link.Not a Premium subscriber? You can subscribe to The Ken Premium on Apple Podcasts for an easy monthly price (Rs 299 in India). The channel includes ALL our premium podcasts.-Stage is an interesting, counter-intuitive, and extraordinary company.It’s a company you’ve probably heard little about and know almost nothing about.Vinay Sighal, co-founder and CEO of Stage, describes it as a Netflix for Indian cultures. It is a company that’s on the verge of something big. Stage is an OTT company that, in Singhal’s words, offers premium, sensible content in three cultures. Yes, cultures, not languages—Haryanvi, Bhojpuri, and Rajasthani.At a time when OTT platforms and consumer content companies are figuring out how to make their business work, Stage is an outlier.It has 4.2 million subscribers and nearly 150 crores in revenue. Stage has also figured out a way to do this sustainably by reducing its burn by nearly 70% from last year to this year.In today’s episode, Vinay tells the story of how Stage was created, how he built a company and lost it overnight, and how he then re-emerged from it by doing the exact opposite of all the things that brought him success earlier.He switched from advertising to subscriptions, from going for international markets to local markets and from depending on platforms like Facebook to direct distribution.To do this, he did not just have to build a company; he had to build entire movie industries. Stage is a story you must listen to if you want to understand how entrepreneurs and founders are building companies for Bharat in ways most of us cannot understand or even imagine.In this episode of Two by Two, hosts Rohin Dharmakumar and Praveen Gopal Krishnan are in discussion with Vinay Singhal, CEO and co-founder of Stage.–This episode of Two by Two was produced by Hari Krishna. Rajiv CN, our resident sound engineer, mixed and mastered this episode.If you liked this episode of Two by Two, please share it with your friends and family who would be interested in listening to the episode. And if you have more thoughts on the discussion, we’d love to hear your arguments as well. You can write to us at twobytwo@the-ken.com.

Anurag Sinha, Managing Partner at Milestone Search Capital, and Rehan Netarwala, Founder of Okintek Capital, dive into the fascinating world of search funds. They discuss how this innovative model allows professionals to acquire and manage small businesses in India. The conversation covers the challenges and nuances of transitioning from entrepreneurship to leadership, the intricacies of raising capital, and the overlooked opportunities in traditional Indian businesses. Insights on the governance structures and success stories reveal a new path for aspiring CEOs and investors alike.

In this discussion, Mohit Satyanand, an entrepreneur and economy-watcher, shares insights on the impact of Trump’s tariffs on India. He emphasizes the challenges that Indian entrepreneurs face in a competitive global market, highlighting the need for transparency in economic policy. The conversation delves into the complexities of India's trade relations with the U.S., including the implications for sectors like textiles and pharmaceuticals. Satyanand also explores the balancing act between protectionism and the growth opportunities within India's evolving economic landscape.

In this engaging discussion, Abhishek Madan, former VP at Paytm, and Aditya Suresh, head of India equity research at Macquarie, dive into the phenomenon of 'enshittification' in Indian consumer tech. They explore how apps are sacrificing user experience for profit, tackling issues like chaotic redesigns and misleading subscription models. Personal anecdotes reveal the disconnect between marketing promises and actual service delivery. They also examine emerging challenges in the competitive tech landscape, emphasizing the need for transparency and user trust.

“The future of consultants is intricately linked to the future of consulting”That’s what one of the guests had to say about the future of consultants and the promise of consulting careers.Being a consultant at any of the big three consulting firms—McKinsey & Company, Bain & Company, and Boston Consulting Group(BCG)—meant one thing: The opportunity to work on cutting-edge projects with big, innovative companies. It allowed the people who worked at these companies to have career opportunities, which would allow them to be prepared for even more challenging and rewarding roles in the world of startups.The accelerated learning, prestige, community and great pay packages that these companies offered ensured the best talent lined up to work for them.The first two years of a career in consulting are gruelling, demanding and difficult and often involve “low-value work”, like making presentations, data analysis and sending requests for proposals to really annoying clients.However, people still rush and fight to do it with the expectation that the payoffs compound later. It gives them a broader view of how companies work and operate.It acts as a training ground for building startups and laterally jumping into senior executive roles at fast-growing companies or even going higher up the consulting ladder.Today, that trade-off equation looks a bit distorted for students because it’s never been easier to start a company.It’s also been very easy to find post-MBA roles in companies that are more strategic in nature, and ESOPs look much more real and valuable because companies are going public.So the question becomes: Will students continue to chase consulting firms as a lucrative and promising career option? And does a career in consulting hold the same promises as it used to?Joining hosts Praveen Gopal Krishnan and Rohin Dharmakumar for the episode are Rahul Chaudhary, co-founder of Treebo, ex-McKinsey & Company and Pragya Batra, co-founder of Quirksmith, ex-Bain & Company.Welcome to episode 35 of Two by Two.–Help us find interesting women guests by filling out this survey – https://theken.typeform.com/to/KH0EOLGo–Additional listening:If B-schools were invented today, would students run placements? – https://the-ken.com/podcasts/two-by-two/if-b-schools-were-invented-today-would-students-run-placements/AI comes to annihilate India’s SaaS companies – https://the-ken.com/podcasts/two-by-two/ai-comes-to-annihilate-indias-saas-companies/–This episode of Two by Two was produced by Hari Krishna. Rajiv CN, our resident sound engineer, mixed and mastered this episode.If you liked this episode of Two by Two, please share it with your friends and family who would be interested in listening to the episode. And if you have more thoughts on the discussion, we’d love to hear your arguments as well. You can write to us at twobytwo@the-ken.com.

You could, in many ways, picture India’s tech businesses venturing into the global stage in waves. First, there were the services companies. Your Wipros and Infosys and the like. Then, startups such as Zomato, Oyo, and Ola took their shot. The third wave was headlined by SaaS companies like Zoho and Freshworks. What does the fourth wave look like? What does the future hold for companies making the jump? This week’s episode of Two by Two was our attempt to answer some of those questions. Our guests for the podcast ended up adding quite a bit more. Mohit Kumar is founder and CEO of Ultrahuman, best known for its smart rings which compete with the likes of Oura and Samsung, but also offering a wide range of other devices and products for health-conscious buyers.Lal Chand Bisu is the co-founder and CEO of Kuku FM, a mobile-first premium audio platform hosting content in multiple Indian languages.Two very different companies, with one bold bet in common: they chose to take their products global. Welcome to episode 34 of Two by Two.–Book your tickets for The Ken’s first subscriber event – https://the-ken.com/event/beyond-the-first-order/–Additional reading:Kuku FM chooses not to be the hero in its own storyPocket FM had 10 million listeners in India. Yet it hit pay dirt elsewhere–This episode of Two by Two was produced by Hari Krishna. Rajiv CN, our resident sound engineer, mixed and mastered this episode.If you liked this episode of Two by Two, please share it with your friends and family who would be interested in listening to the episode. And if you have more thoughts on the discussion, we’d love to hear your arguments as well. You can write to us at twobytwo@the-ken.com.

Free-range eggs and chicken have been gaining popularity for a while. The practices involved in producing and raising them are considered more humane. The market for humane meat has been growing slowly but steadily. Reports suggest that a majority of the country eats eggs, chicken, or meat. Shouldn’t we care about how the animals that reach our plates are raised and killed? It’s not a question with easy answers.Today, consumers are becoming more aware of the conditions in which the eggs and meat they consume are produced. They are making a conscious choice to seek out spaces that treat these animals well before they become a means of our sustenance.Should meat and fish eaters be willing to pay a premium to ensure the animals that we consume – or whose products we consume – are treated as ethically and humanely as possible? How big is this market? How fast is it growing? How should we think about it? Or should we take the lazy route and laugh it off as an oxymoron?Episode 33 of Two by Two, hosted by Rohin Dharmakumar and Praveen Gopal Krishnan, aimed to find an answer and explain how it makes sense.And they were joined by four wonderful guests for the discussion.Our first guest is Dineshkumar Shanmugam, the co-founder and CEO of Earthy Origins, a Tamil Nadu-based farm-to-table startup that grows, raises, and sells organic food products and ethically raised chickens and free-range eggs.Our second guest is Sandeep Reddy, the CEO of India Animal Fund, a nonprofit that brings together a diverse mix of leaders from the corporate and animal welfare sectors to take a strategic look at ending all forms of animal harm. They believe that doing the most good means minimising the suffering of the most vulnerable, that is, animals. Our third guest is K Vijay, the Bengaluru-based founder of another meat startup, Meatright.Our final guest is Shan Kadavil, co-founder and CEO of Freshtohome, one of the leading online sellers of meat and fish in India. We’ve interviewed Shan for First Principles, The Ken’s leadership podcast. His clarity of thought around setting up and scaling an online meat business in India was amazing. You should listen to it if you haven’t.–Additional reading:Famine, affluence and morality – https://rintintin.colorado.edu/~vancecd/phil308/Singer2.pdfFood, a question of ethics – 5 principles of ethical eating – https://kindredmedia.org/2007/09/food-a-question-of-ethics-5-principles-of-ethical-eating/Animals and choices – https://the-ken.com/newsletter/first-principles/animals-and-choices/How many Indians eat meat? – https://www.thehindu.com/data/data-how-many-indians-eat-meat/article65299234.eceAdditional listening:Shan Kadavil of Freshtohome on selling fish, building moats, encouraging bottom-up “shots on goal”, and being honest with boards – https://the-ken.com/podcasts/first-principles/shan-kadavil-fresh-to-home/Peter Singer – The ethics of what we eat – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHzwqf_JkrA–Help us find interesting women guests by filling out this survey – https://theken.typeform.com/to/KH0EOLGo–This episode of Two by Two was researched and produced by Hari Krishna. Rajiv CN, our resident sound engineer, mixed and mastered this episode.If you liked this episode of Two by Two, please share it with your friends and family who would be interested in listening to the episode. And if you have more thoughts on the discussion, we’d love to hear your arguments as well. You can write to us at twobytwo@the-ken.com.