
This Is Not Church Podcast
This Is Not Church podcast offers a compelling and thought-provoking exploration of the intersections between deconstruction, activism, spirituality, and the LGBTQIA+ community, as well as vital issues like Black Lives Matter and First Nations' rights. Hosted by passionate individuals who are dedicated to fostering open and inclusive conversations, this podcast delves into the complex journey of deconstructing one's faith, while simultaneously embracing and advocating for the rights and stories of the LGBTQIA+ community, as well as the fight for racial justice within the Black Lives Matter movement and the preservation of First Nations' cultures and rights. With a focus on examining the evolving landscapes of faith and identity, "This Is Not Church" provides a safe and informative space for listeners to engage with narratives of self-discovery, resilience, and transformation, ultimately encouraging a more empathetic and understanding society.
Latest episodes

May 1, 2023 • 1h 15min
Asian American Apostate: A Conversation With Scott Okamoto
This Quoircast Podcast episode is brought to you by Letting Go(d) by Aaron Simnowitz published by Quoir. The book is available now on Amazon.
In this episode we chat with Scott Okamoto
Scott is a 4th generation Japanese American writer and musician who grew up in Southern California. He grew up in a conservative Christian family and church community but deconstructed his faith culminating in a complete loss of all religious belief while teaching English at an evangelical university. His debut book, Asian American Apostate: Losing Religion and Finding Myself at an Evangelical University tells this story of faith deconstruction while simultaneously building an identity as an Asian American in community with artists and activists which included beloved tv stars, comedians, writers, and rock stars.
You can connect with Scott on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok
You can find all things Scott Okamoto related on his website
You can purchase Asian American Apostate on Amazon.com
You can connect with This Is Not Church on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok YouTube
Also check out our Linktree for all things This Is Not Church related
Please like and follow our Quoircast Partners:
Heretic Happy Hour Messy Spirituality Apostates Anonymous
Ideas Digest The New Evangelicals Snarky Faith Podcast Wild Olive
Each episode of This Is Not Church Podcast is expertly engineered by our producer The Podcast Doctor Eric Howell. If you’re thinking of starting a podcast you need to connect with Eric!

Apr 24, 2023 • 1h 27min
Too Much And Not Enough: A Conversation With Karen Shock
This Quoircast Podcast episode is brought to you by The Messy Spirituality Podcast who is all about finding God in unexpected places.
In this episode we chat with Karen Shock
Karen Shock’s love for writing began when she received her first diary as a young girl. The lock and key made it easy for her to tell the diary some honest, dramatic truths about herself. All these years later, she still loves to put pen to paper and write out her deepest longings, wildest dreams, and biggest fears. The only difference now is there is no longer a lock and key on her thoughts. As time went on, she began to understand that putting the truth out there for the whole world to read might be scary, but the vulnerability was worth the risk. She wants readers to know that they are not alone. Karen lives in Fort Wayne, Indiana with her husband Kevin. They have four adult children, 4 grandchildren and one on the way. She is currently a writer for Patheos and has her first book, Too Much and Not Enough, coming out on April 18th.
You can connect with Karen on:
Facebook Twitter Instagram TikTok
You can find all things Karen Shock related on her website
You can purchase Too Much and Not Enough on Amazon.com
You can connect with This Is Not Church on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok YouTube
Also check out our Linktree for all things This Is Not Church related
Please like and follow our Quoircast Partners:
Heretic Happy Hour Messy Spirituality Apostates Anonymous
Ideas Digest The New Evangelicals Snarky Faith Podcast Wild Olive
Each episode of This Is Not Church Podcast is expertly engineered by our producer The Podcast Doctor Eric Howell. If you’re thinking of starting a podcast you need to connect with Eric!

Apr 17, 2023 • 1h 13min
Drugs And Jesus: A Conversation With Joshua Lawson
This Quoircast Podcast episode is brought to you by The Story Of Christianity Told As Good News For All by Ric Machuga published by Quoir. The book is available now on Amazon.
In this episode we chat with Joshua Lawson
Josh Lawson lives with his family in Wheelersburg Ohio, where he serves his community in a variety of roles as recovery program coordinator for the Shawnee State University Kricker Innovation Hub. He works to connect people in recovery with entrepreneurial skills and services that will help them succeed in life. He also chairs the faith-based sub community of Scioto Connect the counties local opioid consortium where he consults with faith communities on how to support people who use drugs and those in recovery. As an author he recently published his first book The Face of Addiction which tells the story of 12 people in Southern Ohio who have been impacted by the opioid overdose crisis. In his follow up book Drugs and Jesus which is set to release in 2022 will be the first of its kind to present a call to action for people of faith to engage in the work of harm reduction.
You can connect with Joshua on:
Facebook LinkedIn YouTube
You can find all things Joshua Lawson related on his website
You can purchase Drugs & Jesus on Amazon.com
You can connect with This Is Not Church on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok YouTube
Also check out our Linktree for all things This Is Not Church related
Please like and follow our Quoircast Partners:
Heretic Happy Hour Messy Spirituality Apostates Anonymous
Ideas Digest The New Evangelicals Snarky Faith Podcast Wild Olive
Each episode of This Is Not Church Podcast is expertly engineered by our producer The Podcast Doctor Eric Howell. If you’re thinking of starting a podcast you need to connect with Eric!

Apr 10, 2023 • 1h 6min
God The Best Seller: A Conversation With Stephen Prothero
This Quoircast Podcast episode is brought to you by Drugs And Jesus by Joshua Lawson published by Quoir. The book will be available April 11, 2023 on Amazon
In this episode we chat with Stephen Prothero
Stephen Prothero is the New York Times bestselling author of Religious Literacy and chair of the religion department at Boston University. His work has been featured on the cover of Time magazine, Oprah, The Daily Show with Jon Stewart, National Public Radio, and other top national media outlets. He writes and reviews for The New York Times Magazine, Wall Street Journal, Boston Globe, Washington Post, USA Today, Los Angeles Times, Salon, and other publications. He holds degrees in American Religion from Harvard and Yale.
You can connect with Stephen on:
Facebook Twitter
You can find all things Stephen Prothero related at his website
You can purchase God The Best Seller at Amazon.com
You can connect with This Is Not Church on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok YouTube
Also check out our Linktree for all things This Is Not Church related
Please like and follow our Quoircast Partners:
Heretic Happy Hour Messy Spirituality Apostates Anonymous
Ideas Digest The New Evangelicals Snarky Faith Podcast Wild Olive
Each episode of This Is Not Church Podcast is expertly engineered by our producer The Podcast Doctor Eric Howell. If you’re thinking of starting a podcast you need to connect with Eric!

Apr 3, 2023 • 1h 3min
Christianity, Good News For All: A Conversation With Ric Machuga
This Quoircast Podcast episode is brought to you by The New Evangelicals: Pushing the Evangelical Church forward and to re-think how it approaches key cultural issues.
In this episode we chat with Ric Machuga.
Ric Machuga has taught philosophy and in the Honor Program at Butte College for thirty-five years. He is the author of In Defense of the Soul (2002), Life, the Universe, and Everything (2011), and numerous pieces for Books & Culture.
You can connect with Ric on:
Facebook
You can purchase Ric's latest book The Christian Story Told As Good News For All on Amazon.com
You can connect with This Is Not Church on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok YouTube
Also check out our Linktree for all things This Is Not Church related
Please like and follow our Quoircast Partners:
Heretic Happy Hour Messy Spirituality Apostates Anonymous
Ideas Digest The New Evangelicals Snarky Faith Podcast Wild Olive
Each episode of This Is Not Church Podcast is expertly engineered by our producer The Podcast Doctor Eric Howell. If you’re thinking of starting a podcast you need to connect with Eric!

Mar 27, 2023 • 1h 26min
The First Nation Version: A Conversation With Terry Wildman
This Quoircast Podcast episode is brought to you by Drugs And Jesus by Joshua Lawson published by Quoir. The book will be available April 11, 2023 on Amazon
In this episode we chat with Terry Wildman
Terry Wildman, born and raised in Michigan, is of Ojibwe and Yaqui ancestry. Terry is an author, recording artist, songwriter, storyteller, and public speaker.
He is the Lead Translator and Project Manager of the First Nations Version New Testament published by IinterVarsity Press and the "Chief" of Rain Ministries, a nonprofit organization based in Arizona, Terry has also been the Director of Spiritual Growth and Leadership Development with Native InterVarsity since June of 2020.
Beginning in the year 2000 Terry and his wife Darlene have invested their lives in sharing the message of Jesus with the First Nations people of Turtle Island (North America).
You can follow Terry on:
Facebook Twitter LinkedIn YouTube
To find all things First Nations Version check out the website
You can purchase the First Nations Version on Amazon.com
You can connect with This Is Not Church on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok YouTube
Also check out our Linktree for all things This Is Not Church related
Please like and follow our Quoircast Partners:
Heretic Happy Hour Messy Spirituality Apostates Anonymous
Ideas Digest The New Evangelicals Snarky Faith Podcast Wild Olive
Each episode of This Is Not Church Podcast is expertly engineered by our producer The Podcast Doctor Eric Howell. If you’re thinking of starting a podcast you need to connect with Eric!

Mar 20, 2023 • 1h 3min
The Wisdom Of Hobbits: A Conversation With Matthew Distefano
This Quoircast Podcast episode is brought to you by Safer Than The Known Way by Maria Francesca French published by Quoir. The book is available now on Amazon.
In this episode we chat with Matthew Distefano
Matthew J. Distefano is the author of multiple books, including the wildly popular Heretic! and From the Blood of Abel. He is an audio engineer, the producer of the Heretic Happy Hour podcast, cohost of Apostates Anonymous, and is a regular columnist for Patheos. He holds an undergraduate degree in Education from California State University, Chico, and has been in social work for over a decade, currently working as a Professional Service Coordinator in Butte County, California. In addition to his professional life, Matthew enjoys gardening, bicycling, and European football. He is a huge Tolkien nerd who one day hopes to live in Bag End with his wife and daughter.
You can connect with Matthew on:
Facebook Instagram TikTok
You can find all things Matthew Distefano related on his website
You can purchase Matthew's new book The Wisdom Of Hobbits on Amazon.com
You can connect with This Is Not Church on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok YouTube
Also check out our Linktree for all things This Is Not Church related
Please like and follow our Quoircast Partners:
Heretic Happy Hour Messy Spirituality Apostates Anonymous
Ideas Digest The New Evangelicals Snarky Faith Podcast Wild Olive
Each episode of This Is Not Church Podcast is expertly engineered by our producer The Podcast Doctor Eric Howell. If you’re thinking of starting a podcast you need to connect with Eric!

Mar 13, 2023 • 1h 6min
The Unfolding: A Conversation With Arielle Estoria
This Quoircast Podcast episode is brought to you by The Wisdom Of Hobbits by Matthew Distefano published by Quoir. The book will release March 14, 2023
In this episode we chat with Arielle Estoria
Born and raised in foggy Northern California and now residing in Los Angeles CA, Arielle Estoria (she/her) is a Poet, Author and Actor. Her motto, "Words not for the ears but for the soul" stems from her dedication to remind anyone who encounters her and her work that words are meant to be felt and experienced not just heard. With a specific heart in empowering, encouraging and making space for audiences of women to feel at home in their own bodies.
Arielle has shared her work through custom spoken word pieces, workshops and themed keynote talks with companies such as Google, Sofar Sounds, Lululemon, Dressember, Tedx, the SKIMS campaign by Kim Kardashian and more. She has consecutively emceed annual conferences and has led various writing, embodiment and self-acceptance workshops in various settings ranging from students to professional development spaces.
Arielle's latest book The Unfolding: An Invitation To Come Home To Yourself was released on March 7, 2023
You can connect with Arielle on:
Facebook Twitter Instagram TikTok YouTube
You can find all things Arielle Estoria related on her website
Check out one of the movie shorts Arielle is in on Youtube
You can purchase Arielle's latest book The Unfolding on Amazon.com
You can purchase Hearts Ablaze at Amazon.com
You can connect with This Is Not Church on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok YouTube
Also check out our Linktree for all things This Is Not Church related
Please like and follow our Quoircast Partners:
Heretic Happy Hour Messy Spirituality Apostates Anonymous
Ideas Digest The New Evangelicals Snarky Faith Podcast Wild Olive
Each episode of This Is Not Church Podcast is expertly engineered by our producer The Podcast Doctor Eric Howell. If you’re thinking of starting a podcast you need to connect with Eric!

Mar 6, 2023 • 1h 3min
Hearts Ablaze: A Conversation With Rolf Nolasco
This Quoircast Podcast episode is brought to you by The Reconstrucionist by Jonathan Foster published by Quoir. The book is available now on Amazon
In this episode we chat with Rolf Nolasco
Dr. Rolf R. Nolasco, Jr. is Rueben P. Job Professor of Spiritual Formation and Pastoral Theology at Garrett-Evangelical Theological Seminary in Evanston, Il USA. As a queer person of color whose country of origin is the Philippines, Rolf works at the intersection of critical and liberative psychology, theology, spirituality, and affective neuroscience to address the complexity of the human condition and the potential for human flourishing. He is the author of The Contemplative Counselor: A Way of Being, Compassionate Presence: A Radical Response to Human Sufferings, God’s Beloved Queer, and Hearts Ablaze: Parables For The Queer Soul. He lives in Evanston, Illinois.
You can connect with Rolf on:
Facebook Twitter Instagram TikTok
You can find more info on Rolf Nolasco at the Garret Website
You can purchase Hearts Ablaze at Amazon.com
You can connect with This Is Not Church on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok YouTube
Also check out our Linktree for all things This Is Not Church related
Please like and follow our Quoircast Partners:
Heretic Happy Hour Messy Spirituality Apostates Anonymous
Ideas Digest The New Evangelicals Snarky Faith Podcast
Each episode of This Is Not Church Podcast is expertly engineered by our producer The Podcast Doctor Eric Howell. If you’re thinking of starting a podcast you need to connect with Eric!

Feb 27, 2023 • 1h 14min
Returning To Eden: A Conversation With Heather Hamilton
This Quoircast Podcast episode is brought to you by Returning To Eden: A Field Guide For The Spiritual Journey by Heather Hamilton. The book releases Feb. 22, 2023, but is available for pre-order now.
In this episode we chat with Heather Hamilton
Heather Hamilton received her B.A. in Journalism from Georgia State University and spent many years doing video production before discovering her love of writing. After filming and editing stories with people from all over the world—celebrities, orphans, religious leaders, royal family members, political figures, and everyday people—Heather recognized the common threads and themes intertwining all humans across religions, cultures, classes, and demographics. She is passionate about fostering human connection through storytelling, writing, art, and exchanging ideas. She lives in Atlanta with her husband and three children. Heather's new book Returning To Eden was released by Quoir on Feb 22, 2023.
You can connect with Heather on
Facebook Instagram TikTok
You can find all things Heather Hamilton on her website
You can purchase Heather's book on Amazon.com
You can connect with This Is Not Church on:
Facebook Instagram Twitter TikTok YouTube
Also check out our Linktree for all things This Is Not Church related
Please like and follow our Quoircast Partners:
Heretic Happy Hour Messy Spirituality Apostates Anonymous
Ideas Digest The New Evangelicals Snarky Faith Podcast
Each episode of This Is Not Church Podcast is expertly engineered by our producer The Podcast Doctor Eric Howell. If you’re thinking of starting a podcast you need to connect with Eric!