
That Hoarder: Overcome Compulsive Hoarding
Hoarding disorder is stigmatised and people who hoard feel vast amounts of shame. This podcast began life as an audio diary, an anonymous outlet for somebody with this weird condition. That Hoarder speaks about her experiences living with compulsive hoarding, she interviews therapists, academics, researchers, children of hoarders, professional organisers and influencers, and she shares insight and tips for others with the problem. Listened to by people who hoard as well as those who love them and those who work with them, Overcome Compulsive Hoarding with That Hoarder aims to shatter the stigma, share the truth and speak openly and honestly to improve lives.
Latest episodes

Dec 22, 2023 • 45min
Remix: Dehoarding: where to start
The host reflects on unique holiday shopping methods to reduce home clutter. They discuss the emotional challenges of dehoarding, stressing the right mindset as essential for starting this journey. Practical steps are shared, focusing on manageable tasks and personal decision-making rules. The importance of seeking support and celebrating small victories is highlighted, alongside therapeutic strategies. Finally, resources for listeners are provided, including connections to community support and intriguing media recommendations.

Dec 15, 2023 • 33min
#121 Can virtual reality help to treat hoarding disorder? With Dr Hannah Raila
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In today's episode, I look at the intriguing use of virtual reality in treating hoarding disorder with our guest, Dr. Hannah Raila. Dr. Raila, a psychology researcher at UC Santa Cruz, shares her insights on how virtual reality can help individuals desensitise to distress and practice discarding virtual possessions. She discusses the immersive nature of the VR experience, the potential for the technology to attract more male research participants, and so much more. Join us as we explore the innovative possibilities of virtual reality in the treatment of hoarding disorder.
Novel treatment for hoarding using virtual reality
VR sessions focus on virtual discarding practice
Virtual reality to create distress for phobia treatment
Practice desensitization to discard and declutter effectively
Novel approach due to existing treatments not working for everyone
Study methodology including recruiting participants with hoarding disorder for buried in treasures group and virtual reality sessions
Creating a virtual world of participants' rooms and practicing discarding items in a psychologically immersive environment
New treatments for hoarding needed, virtual reality tested for hoarding, based on successful use in anxiety and PTSD
In-home visits helpful for reducing clutter but often not feasible
In VR therapy, practice discarding virtual objects to desensitise to distress
Virtual exposure therapy principle: Desensitise to distress by simulating real experiences
There is a debate about hoarding disorder prevalence and gender participation in research and treatment. More women seek treatment, but the disorder may be even across genders
The Stanford lab's community presence may influence gender participation
Testing novel intervention with existing treatments, attracting more patients, need for RCT before nationwide administration
Practice desensitisation by rating distress, discarding and tracking feelings to tolerate and declutter home
Preparing new study on contamination fears for OCD at UC Santa Cruz lab
Description of the virtual donation box, recycling, and trash bin in VR sessions
Facilitating repeated rehearsal of discarding virtual possessions for real-life application
Reported improvement in hoarding symptoms due to VR treatment
Time and technology challenges in programming and designing virtual worlds for the intervention
Practical Applications and Takeaways
Monitoring and tracking distress levels when discarding items
Applying desensitisation without a virtual space
Starting with easy-to-discard items and gradually progressing to more difficult ones
Potential of virtual reality to help people move up the ladder of difficulty in discarding
Dr. Raila's plans to continue virtual reality work
Conducting a study on difficulty discarding in the normative range
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Dec 8, 2023 • 40min
#120 What a crooked church spire can tell us about failure and flaws and weirdness
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In this episode, I delve into the weird world of imperfections, flaws, and uniqueness. Drawing inspiration from the Crooked Spire of Chesterfield, I share personal struggles with self-criticism and acceptance. It's a round-about look at authenticity and self-acceptance, via imperfections and community. I also share a hoarding secret from a listener and a top tip. Join me!
Chesterfield's Crooked Spire
Folklore and reality behind the Crooked Spire's twist
We often judge ourselves harshly
Old churches, old books, imperfections, universal struggles
Authenticity and honesty in safe spaces
Embracing self-acceptance and confidence
Challenging societal expectations leads to self-acceptance
Embracing imperfection, finding strength in community
Folklore and history intertwine at Chesterfield's Crooked Spire church
We tend to see flaws in ourselves, not in loved ones
Impact on self-esteem varies with mental health and stress
Struggling with self-judgment
Need spaces for self-expression, honesty, and mental health to avoid internal conflict and damage
Often start with difficulty, but ultimately reach a point of empowerment
Not conforming to societal expectations
Changing Faces charity for people with visible differences
Personal struggles with hoarding behaviour
Encourages self-acceptance and appreciation
Resilience and community embrace of imperfections
Personal growth and acceptance related to societal norms
Struggles with conforming to expectations
The beauty of imperfections
Old books with folded corners and underlined passages
The podcast as a place of honesty and authenticity
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Dec 1, 2023 • 45min
#119 Homelessness and hoarding with Dr Jan Eppingstall of Stuffology
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In today's episode, Dr Jan Eppingstall and I will be diving into a topic that is rarely discussed - homelessness and hoarding. We will explore the limited research available on the connection between these two issues and the complex factors that contribute to both. We uncover the connections between trauma, loss, and mental health issues that can lead to both homelessness and hoarding behaviours as well as the instincts associated with hoarding and the difficulties in interrupting these instincts.
Homelessness and hoarding: connections and similarities
Lack of hoarding-related academic articles
Homelessness can be caused by hoarding
Lack of support, finger pointing, no understanding
Excessive stuff brings hope for normal future
A sense of safety motivates us to accumulate possessions
The physical barrier between us and the chaotic outside world is important
Excess stuff can be seen as hope for a better future
Society pressures us to make a perfect home
Epigenetics, trauma, and genes influence hoarding behaviour
Poverty pushes some to become hoarders
Humans want to share during crises
Neurodivergence, brain injuries, schizophrenia
Homelessness and hoarding have similarities, including trauma, mental health issues, and fear of scarcity
Possessions may be portable but excessive saving behaviour persists
Homelessness caused by hoarding; trauma leads to hoarding in new home
Need to ask "What do you need?"
The comfort of material possessions
Possible evidence of neurodivergence or organic brain injuries, schizophrenia, depression, obsessive-compulsive disorder, complex post-traumatic stress disorder
The importance of asking the right questions and providing appropriate support
Approach problems from various angles and keep iterating to find what works
Short-term focus of government hinders this
Homeless individuals trading stuff and the instinct to hoard when they find secure housing
Difficulty in interrupting the primal hoarding instinct
Strategies for interrupting the instinct, such as calculations and sharing with others in need
Need for a holistic approach and joined-up thinking to address hoarding and homelessness effectively
Lack of resources and understanding to support hoarders once they are housed
Treating hoarders with dignity and respect
Importance of appropriate questions and support due to the complexity of hoarding behaviours
Lack of support and assistance in addressing the root causes of homelessness
Sense of control and safety that possessions offer
Importance of addressing the additional traumas faced by homeless individuals
Study finding higher hoarding prevalence (18.5%) among homeless individuals compared to the general population (1.5-5%)
Oversampling technique used to study rare subpopulations
Overlapping risk factors of hoarding and homelessness (trauma, grief, brain injury, neurodivergence)
Sense of safety and need to create a home driving the accumulation of possessions
Scarcity mindset and stockpiling items due to homelessness
Epigenetic processes potentially turning on genes associated with hoarding as a coping mechanism
Poverty and uncertainty about basic necessities contributing to hoarding behaviors
Importance of listening to frontline practitioners and individuals in order to understand their needs
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Nov 24, 2023 • 32min
#118 Can we use AI to help us dehoard? Is it just hype or a promising solution?
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In today's episode, I dive into the topic of using AI to help us dehoard. I have some skepticism about AI and its ability to assist with decluttering. However, after exploring various AI options I share my findings and experiences with these tools. From providing tips and schedules to even taking on personas like Dolly Parton, AI can offer some assistance in the decluttering process. I also discuss the use of AI voice assistants and AI-driven coaching, discussing their potential benefits and my concerns. Join me as I explore the strengths and weaknesses of using AI as a tool in decluttering and dehoarding.
Mixed results with AI
AI voice assistance for dehoarding tasks.
Privacy concerns, limited effectiveness of chatbots.
Fact-checking is better done personally.
AI decluttering apps listed by Bard didn't exist
Bard provided good breakdown of timings in real-world context
ChatGPT and Bard can expand on previous answers.
Streamline decluttering, prioritise tasks, and explore personas with Chat GPT and Bard.
I used an AI tool to mimic Dolly Parton's style for a video.
AI voice assistants like Siri, Google, and Alexa can help with tasks like playing music and organizing, allowing users to have conversations and make requests
AI chatbots cannot provide the same support as humans
Privacy concerns and lack of trust.
Not ruling them out completely,but cautious about therapy-oriented bots
Asking specific questions can yield better results.
Skepticism about using AI for dehoarding
Not wanting to just repeat what others have said
Description of AI bot
Conversation with the AI bot
Critique of the AI bot's advice
Description of ChatGPT and Bard as AI tools
Tips for using ChatGPT and Bard effectively
Comparison of their capabilities with decluttering
Limitations and challenges with specificity and relevance to hoarding
Benefits of using voice assistants for organizing and task management
Examples of tasks voice assistants can help with
AI-driven coaching and therapy
Potential benefits and use cases
Concerns about privacy, emotional support, and effectiveness
Strengths and weaknesses of using AI for dehoarding
Personal observations on specific tasks AI is good at, such as scheduling
Mention of AI's limitations, imaginary recommendations, and the need for skepticism
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Nov 17, 2023 • 58min
REMIX: Perfectionism and hoarding with Dr Jan Eppingstall of Stuffology
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The topic for today is perfectionism and its connection to hoarding. I talk with Dr Jan Eppingstall about perfectionism and its impact on hoarding behaviour. We share personal experiences and struggles with perfectionism, discussing the fear of failure and the tendency to give up if something cannot be done perfectly.
We also touch upon the importance of psychological flexibility, being present in the moment, and living by our values. Dr. Eppingstall enlightens us with insights on challenging rigid thought patterns, breaking free from the demands of perfection, and embracing personal growth.
Perfectionism and fear of failure drive hoarding.
Perfectionism linked to hoarding and obsessive personalities.
Rigid thinking
Surprised by others' flexibility
Children with insecure attachment blame themselves for parents' problems.
Curiosity, experimentation, and flexibility lead to growth.
Encouraging exploration leads to personal growth.
Regretting inaction is a bigger regret.
Relax, do it wrong, get more done.
Perfectionism and fear of failure relate to hoarding.
Concerns over mistakes and parental criticism are prominent.
Being creative with limited resources to find solutions and not being rigid in following rules or plans.
Turtle mode hinders logic, self-criticism hampers progress.
Children with insecure attachment due to a parent's mental illness or preoccupation tend to believe they cause their parents' problems
They feel pressured to help their parents and seek validation through achievements and obedience to alleviate their parents' sadness or anger.
Perfectionism linked to trauma response, family expectations.
Fear of negative emotions, regret of not pursuing dreams.
People are adaptable and inventive
Give yourself permission to make mistakes, relax, and get more done
The reluctance to start or complete tasks to avoid an imperfect outcome
Self-criticism and lack of confidence as common problems with perfectionism
Overcoming perfectionism and embracing flexibility
Psychological flexibility: being present, taking action guided by values
The importance of curiosity and challenging behaviours
Living by values rather than solely focusing on goals
The role of a support system in venturing outside the comfort zone
Taking small, cautious steps outside the comfort zone
Opening up slowly leads to personal growth and a sense of accomplishment
Breaking rigid thought patterns through repeated challenging
Recognising triggers and behaviours associated with perfectionism
Cognitive-behavioural therapy (CBT) and acceptance and commitment therapy (ACT) as helpful approaches
Perfectionism as a manifestation of people-pleasing and trauma response
Perfectionism leading to feelings of not being enough or worthy
Using perfectionism as a coping mechanism for emotions and relationships
Addressing perfectionism through therapy and exploring its underlying reasons
Progress and success can still be achieved even if things don't go perfectly or as planned
Regretting not doing the things we wanted to do in life rather than letting go of physical possessions
Challenging negative "what if" scenarios and highlighting potential positive outcomes
Demanding standards, self-criticism, fear of wasting or making mistakes in hoarding behaviour
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Nov 10, 2023 • 50min
#117 The dark side of conscious consumerism: when shopping feels like activism, can you save the world and promote your values by acquiring stuff?
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I've always believed in making positive change through my purchases. Recycling, supporting local businesses, and buying eco-friendly products have been my way of feeling like I'm making a difference, saving the world one shopping trip at a time. But I had a revelation. In today's episode, I'll explore the common belief that shopping can be a form of activism, that it is positive to support or promote whatever values are important to us. The struggles of aligning hoarding tendencies with ethical and environmental values are not lost on me. I'll delve into the difficulties of ethical purchasing and provide some insights to help you navigate through the clutter.
Expressing beliefs through items can lead to clutter
False advertising misleads consumers with "natural" claims
Some environmentally friendly products are more toxic
Resource extraction required for "ethical" consumption too
Choose green options but be mindful of unnecessary consumption
Individual actions won't save world; collective action needed
Systemic change
Believing we've done our part hinders change
Hoarders struggle with ethical purchasing decisions; advice appreciated
Although we can make ethical shopping choices, society convinces us that spending money on stuff is a form of activism
Supporting local businesses is beneficial, but it doesn't negate the negative consequences of buying something
Supporting recycling and shopping in charity shops can lead to excessive clutter and prevent others from purchasing
Buying items to display or share beliefs/values can lead to clutter; shopping won't save the world
Companies can mislead consumers by labelling products as "natural" or eco-friendly, leading us to believe we are making a positive impact
Electric car batteries release significant amounts of CO2 before being purchased
It's important to strive for better socially, environmentally, and personally, and to make informed choices when purchasing necessary items
Stocking up on unnecessary items is problematic
Collective action and societal change are needed for significant global change, not individual shopping habits
Boycotts may not be effective in changing company practices if they are still profitable
Changing to unleaded petrol required a law change
Believing shopping solves problems hinders impactful change; focus on reducing consumption, reusing, and finding real solutions
The hoarder's perspective on making positive change through purchases
Recognising flawed thinking and greenwashing
People believing they are saving the Earth through shopping
Greenwashing and misleading consumers with eco-friendly claims
Ethics of shopping and the reality of consumerism
Contribution of consumerism and resource consumption to environmental damage
Interconnection between social and environmental issues
Pitfalls of feel-good consumerism and the importance of reducing consumption
How buying green products can lead to complacency and less virtuous behaviour
Eco junk
Emphasis on consuming less and reducing consumption as a more effective solution
Shopping cannot solve issues like climate change, racism, inequality, or homophobia
Aligning ethical values with challenging hoarding tendencies
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Nov 3, 2023 • 44min
#116 Hoarding vs squalor vs Diogenes Syndrome with Dr Jan Eppingstall
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In this episode, we're diving into the topic of squalor. Is it the same as hoarding? Can you have a squalid environment without hoarding being present? Compulsive hoarding and living in unsanitary conditions can have a profound impact on us. We'll explore the key factors and distinctions between hoarding and squalor, as well as the underlying causes that contribute to these behaviours. From acquired brain injuries and cognitive impairments to mental health disorders, we'll delve into the intricate web of reasons why people find themselves in these challenging situations. We'll also touch on the impact of substance misuse, the role of physical disabilities, and the link between hoarding and conditions such as dementia, schizophrenia, and OCD.
Join us as we explore the different characteristics, challenges, and possible solutions for hoarding and squalor. Whether you're facing hoarding tendencies yourself or seeking to understand these behaviours better, this episode is for you.
Differentiating Hoarding, Squalor, Clutter, and Collecting
Hygiene practices determined by culture.
Unsanitary living caused by physical disability, dementia, illness, brain injuries, psychiatric disorders
Long-term substance abuse damages brain's command centre
Hoarding and squalor pose health risks
Seek help for environmental neglect without shame
The definition of unsanitary is determined by cultural hygiene practices, varying across cultures
It relates to the reasonable person's judgment of cleanliness based on cultural norms.
Obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD) and contamination fears
Substance abuse impairs decision making and damages the prefrontal cortex
Hoarding and squalor pose health risks due to unhygienic living conditions and food safety issues.
Prefrontal cortex damage explains dementia-related hoarding
Unsanitary environments can result from socioeconomic factors such as poverty and limited access to sanitation services
Lack of access to rubbish removal and funds for disposal
Hoarding behaviours can lead to unsanitary living conditions due to hoarding severity, clutter volume, and difficulty discarding items. This attracts vermin and causes shame
Living alone can lead to higher risk of unsanitary conditions
Seek professional help, consider NDIS support for disabilities
Clutter makes cleaning difficult
Impairment in decision-making due to substance abuse
Acquired brain injuries and neglect of personal and environmental hygiene
Impairment of the command centre of the brain
Deteriorating eyesight and its effect on recognising unsanitary areas
Isolation and lack of support for seniors
Loss and depression leading to neglect of hygiene
Self-neglect among hoarders
Characteristics of squalid living environments
1. Lack of purposeful clutter
2. Absence of emotional attachment to objects
3. Fear of objects that have touched other objects
Root causes of squalid environments
Waste management and food storage
Socioeconomic Factors
Access to education, poverty, and sanitation services
Challenges faced by people living in public housing
Role of support systems in overcoming squalor
Seeking help from mental health professionals and GPs
Overcoming shame
Challenges Faced by Aging Hoarders
Influence of injuries or loss on hoarding behaviours
Avoiding unhelpful and meaningless labels
Squalor cannot be overcome by willpower alone
Emotional and functional purposes driving hoarding behaviour
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Oct 27, 2023 • 42min
#115 Is selling your stuff worth it? The pros and cons of selling your clutter: a hoarder’s perspective
This podcast explores the pros and cons of selling your clutter, including the challenges of the selling process, the emotional difficulty of letting go, and the financial and environmental benefits. It also highlights the common trap of using selling potential as an excuse to hold onto things and provides resources for further support.

Oct 20, 2023 • 37min
#114 What if I regret dehoarding? Overcoming the fear of regret and letting go
The podcast discusses the fear of regret in dehoarding and the negative impact it can have on our homes and lives. It provides practical tips for navigating the journey towards a clutter-free life and emphasizes the importance of reframing our mindset. The speaker also explores the experience of regretting decluttering and how it can be used for personal growth. They discuss the importance of prioritizing one's own needs, having professional support, and accessing online therapy for hoarding.