Naylor's Natter Podcast 'Just talking to Teachers'

Cath Murray  now slays dragons for @csjthinktank leading on alternative provision. Content producer for @EducationFest. Formerly@SchoolsWeek&@FEWeek . We are in conversation about alternative provision and exclusions.  What is IntegratED? The IntegratED programme aims to reduce preventable school exclusions and improve the quality of alternative provision (AP) for pupils being educated outside of mainstream schools. Our work is broadly divided into two areas: Raising the profile of AP and exclusions; and Piloting models in schools and AP settings that prioritise whole-child development. Change The social change we want to see eventually is a reduction in the number of children excluded from schools, an increase in early remedial interventions for pupils who require them, and a greater focus on whole-child development across the school system. If AP is the best place for a child, we want to ensure they are given high-quality provision that helps them achieve their full potential. In all cases we wish to see young people graduate from secondary level to a positive tertiary destination, with sufficient skills, values, aptitudes, and capabilities to enable them to contribute to the common good. We are not saying that all exclusion should be stopped. We are saying: exclusions should be fair, and with the best interest of the child at heart; and if removed, children should be placed somewhere that can offer them a high-quality education that meets their needs. The natter  Firstly tell us about your career to this point and how you moved from schools week to slaying dragons!   What is integratED and which organisations are part of this coalition?   Tell us about your work for integratED and your vision for fewer exclusions and better alternative provision   The unexplained pupil exits from school published in October from the education policy institute is an important read , could you take listeners through the report and it’s key recommendations (policy, guidance etc)   The AP census is incredibly opaque as you state in the integratED blog , what constitutes AP? Why is there such huge disparity in different LAs ?   You recommend that the government should publish alongside its exclusion rates , a combined figure that accounts for all AP , tell listeners why this is important.  Is a managed move to AP better than a perm ex ?   How can we improve education for children removed from mainstream?   You are out presenting your work at conferences , where can listeners see you next ?   Could you signpost us to blog / twitter / website etc ? Exciting news!  Naylor's Natter in association with TDT is now sponsored by John Catt Edu. This means even more high quality interviews and for you the listeners , a chance to benefit with discounts on John Catt books . The sponsorship will also help move NN into America!  This weeks code: Here is a code for the first week: POD30. If listeners enter that where prompted on the SHOPPING CART page (not the CHECKOUT - people often slip up with that!), they will get 30% off any order from JohnCatt.com until the next week’s show. Next week: Omar Akbar on Bad School Leadership 

In this week's extended half-term special, we have Emma Turner interviewing Sam Twiselton OBE on Early Career Framework and much more. We also have Jude Hunton 'live' from Educating Lincs which took place earlier this month. TDT Section We have Maria and David in discussion about the Education Policy Institute's new research, commissioned by Wellcome,  The effects of high-quality professional development on teachers and students is published today. The report can be found at https://epi.org.uk/document-type/report/. This review of the evidence on teacher professional development informs a wider EPI research project on CPD, also commissioned by Wellcome. The research, which is to be published later in the year, will examine the costs and benefits of a proposed policy entitling all teachers to thirty-five hours of high-quality professional development every year.  Podcast pedagogy section I look at 'Indistractable' in books by Nir Eyal, 'The Slow Rush' by Tame Impala on vinyl and 'Sonic The Hedgehog' in films. Next week Cath Murray 

Chris Moyse is a nationally acclaimed trainer and consultant with over 30 years of experience in education. A teacher for 18 years, he was a successful Head of Physical Education and went on to become a Teaching and Learning consultant for Somerset Local Authority. He was then a senior leader in a highly successful all-through 3-16 school for 7 years and is now Head of Staff Development for Bridgwater College Trust – a 3-19 multi academy trust in Somerset. He is also managing director of a successful education and leadership consultancy business; TLC Education Services Ltd, as well as being senior SLE for North Somerset Teaching Alliance.  Chris is also an ambassador for Leadership Matters; a movement designed to give all schools access to the high quality leadership development that ultimately improves pupil educational outcomes.  Chris was also the only associate teaching trainer with Ginnis Training Ltd – an education consultancy company led by the late, great Paul Ginnis, author of The Teachers’ Toolkit. He has worked in over 600 schools across England and Wales. The natter  Tell listeners about your career to date , your journey and what you are working on at the moment ?    I wanted to start by asking about your blog of November last year , entitled RIP performance management. You use the famous insanity quote at the end of the blog , tell me why performance management is dead?    Tell us about the professional growth policy you have devised for your trust .  What are the key drivers for staff development?    Going into your professional growth policy , what advantages does continuous professional growth have for teachers and students/pupils ?    What is effective personal reflection? Are teachers good at establishing our levels of competence?    I’m very pleased to see the data target ditched , what quality assurance processes do you employ to ensure pupils receive the best teaching possible ?    How will you use the teachers standards to help teachers reflect on their success, strengths and areas for development?    What is a challenging focus script and how will this be used by line managers ?    I’m very excited by the professional growth plan , how will training, opportunities and time be factored into this ?    What support will be provided for teachers and what feedback will be given ?    How will observations be used to support teachers to grow professionally ?    Could you signpost listeners to your website /twitter etc and your excellent podcast with the talking teachers ?    Where will you be speaking next about this? Podcast pedagogy Again based on #teacher5aday #notice , I will be looking at The Lighthouse in film , Foolish Loving Spaces by Blossoms in vinyl and The Prisoner by Jack Worth in books  Next week  Emma Turner interviews Sam Twisleton OBE. 

Tom Rogers is an experienced teacher and middle leader, having worked at schools in the UK for 9 years and internationally for 4 as a history teacher, head of history and latterly assistant headteacher. He is now back in the UK. Toms passion is in making schools better places for teachers to work in. This passion has inspired him to write more than 100 blogs for the TES and share with the profession through his own twitter account; @rogershistory. Tom has also produced videos for his youtube channel, has his own podcast and more than 20,000 students use his online courses. In 2015, Tom set up the teachmeet network “teachmeet icons” which now hosts free annual events for teachers across the UK. Teachmeeticons has expanded significantly and has become a notable force for teacher CPD in the UK. We discuss: Tell us about your journey to this point and what you’re working on at the moment .  Could we ask about your journey  through classroom teaching into leadership and whether your think good teachers make good leaders? Teachmeet icons was a real force for good in the profession , tell us about the genesis of this idea and where we are up to with this now? Your resources have been used by thousands of teachers and students . Tell us how important sharing resources can be and it’s impact on workload , an issue I know you are passionate about.  Recently I met you on your tour of interviewing school leaders . What were your biggest takeaways from that experience and could you share some gems from the leaders? I am a huge fan of your blogs . My first experience going back some time was the nightmares and dreams blog .....how relevant is that still for new teachers? I love your podcast! Doing it live was just amazing and so brave . Will this be coming back? Your most recent 2 blogs ‘the journey’ and ‘the dark side of international teaching’ have been hugely emotive and gripping . Could you share your thought process in deciding to work abroad and what you gained from the experience . Where do you see yourself in teaching next?   You do so much good for the profession so on behalf of teachers thank you ! Where can we see you on the speaking circuit next ?   Thank you ! Podcast pedagogy This week I am looking at 'The ragged trousered philanthropists' by Robert Tressel, 'Everything Else Has Gone Wrong' by Bombay Bicycle Club and 'A Beautiful Day in the Neighbourhood' . This is all part of #teacher5aday #notice.  Next week - Chris Moyse

This weeks special edition is presented by the Chief Executive of (our friends and podcast partners) The Teacher Development Trust, David Weston. David is in conversation with Jack Worth, Jack is an education economist at the NFER. Jack is the School Workforce Lead and is researching how to improve teacher recruitment, retention and development. David and Jack are discussing NFER’s new research on teacher autonomy, developed in partnership with the Teacher Development Trust (TDT),  which will be released on Wednesday, 29 January 2020. You can find it here: https://www.nfer.ac.uk/teacher-autonomy-how-does-it-relate-to-job-satisfaction-and-retention/ Next week Tom Rogers 

This week I am joined by Sam Strickland, Principal of The Duston School . Sam describes himself as:Principal, martial artist, historian, believer in knowledge. Organiser of ResearchED Northampton.  In this weeks podcast we chat about Sam's new book 'Education exposed' . The book is described as: The ultimate guide to understanding how a school can be led, managed and run, written by an author with extensive experience, and drawing heavily on research around knowledge-based curricula. Clearly and honestly stating the challenges of leading a school, Samuel Strickland focuses on approaches to the curriculum, teaching and learning, teacher workload, behavior, staff morale, leadership and Ofsted. The book is designed to serve as a dip in and dip out guide to a wide array of varying aspects of whole-school life, though it can be read in one full sitting, and the author is not afraid to challenge some of the suggested norms that educators are expected to accept as a profession or to consider how things can potentially be otherwise done. <P> Each chapter is self-contained, providing a short and sharp insight into a specific aspect of school improvement. The book is divided into five sections, with each section taking a major driver for school improvement. Section 1 focuses on leadership, Section 2 on behaviour, Section 3 on the curriculum, Section 4 on teaching and Section 5 on workload and professional development. The natter: This was the first ever, unscripted natter with Sam more than happy to answer any questions I had! Podcast pedagogy This week, I revisit the seminal 'The Road to Wigan Pier' by George Orwell. I recommend More.Again.Forever by The Courteeners and in film we look at 1917.  PS EDIT Lowborn is by Kerry Hudson, Kerry Ellis is a singer .......apologies!

There is a significant problem in our schools: too many boys are struggling. The list of things to concern teachers is long. Disappointing academic results, a lack of interest in studying, higher exclusion rates, increasing mental health issues, sexist attitudes, an inability to express emotions.... Traditional ideas about masculinity are having a negative impact, not only on males, but females too. In this ground-breaking book, Matt Pinkett and Mark Roberts argue that schools must rethink their efforts to get boys back on track. Boys Don’t Try? examines the research around key topics such as anxiety and achievement, behaviour and bullying, schoolwork and self-esteem. It encourages the reader to reflect on how they define masculinity and consider what we want for boys in our schools. Offering practical quick wins, as well as long-term strategies to help boys become happier and achieve greater academic success, the book: offers ways to avoid problematic behaviour by boys and tips to help teachers address poor behaviour when it happens highlights key areas of pastoral care that need to be recognised by schools exposes how popular approaches to "engaging" boys are actually misguided and damaging details how issues like disadvantage, relationships, violence, peer pressure, and pornography affect boys’ perceptions of masculinity and how teachers can challenge these. With an easy-to-navigate three-part structure for each chapter, setting out the stories, key research, and practical solutions, this is essential reading for all classroom teachers and school leaders who are keen to ensure male students enjoy the same success as girls. Questions: Gentle introduction- tell listeners a bit about you and your career to date .   Tell us about the genesis of this book and how it started with you blog ‘balance for boys’    In chapter 2 on disadvantaged students , could you start with your definition of disadvantaged students then tell listeners why you feel our education system is ventured on middle class values?    What solutions do you offer for school leaders and teachers particularly around setting?   In the final thought of the chapter , you say the main thing holding back working class students is attitude. What do you mean by this?  In chapter 4 on mental health , you set up the chapter with an insight into how Romeo and Juliet is about male mental health, how do you link this to 21st century Britain?    Could you outline some of the key research on suicide , anger and self-harm   What advice would you offer to school leaders ?    In chapter 6 on sex and sexism , the stories at the start of the chapter paint a depressing picture about the harassment that female teachers face daily , what does the research say in the area of sex and sexism?    Why does there need to be absolute clarity for school leaders on the issue of sexism and sexist behaviour?   In chapter 8 on violence tell us the story about the remnants of a half-eaten kebab.  What is the testosterone fairy tale and why is testosterone such a complicated beast?    Again what advice do you give to school leaders and teachers?   In the last chapter ‘what next’ , You tell readers that years of gender socialisation cannot be undone by reading your book but we have all made a positive change by picking up the book . What next then for school leaders and NQTs?   Finish off by telling us where we can find out more about you and where you will be speaking next . Podcast pedagogy is featuring Sarah Mullin's excellent 'What they didnt teach me on my PGCE" 

Matthew Evans is a headteacher, author and blogger. Leaders With Substance: An Antidote to Leadership Genericism in Schools is available now on Amazon. Follow @head_teach on Twitter. Gentle introduction- tell us about your journey to this point and how you came to write this book .   As you say at the start , despite the millions of words written on the subject , is leadership even a thing?    What remains of leadership and where does that leave this book?    Does a belief in generic (hollow) leadership skills serve as a false set of expertise?   Do we need need clever leaders and how robust is the evidence in this area ?    In the chapter on transient turnarounds , you outline some questions that leaders should be asking teachers right now ? Could you share some of this?    How do we lead best in distracting times ?    In chapter 7 what do you mean by curricular genericism?   How do we leave genericism behind?    Are schools led by experts? Should they be?    In portraying purpose you talk about vision citing martin Luther king . Tell us about the good and bad of vision    Outline what you mean by scripts and cultural memes . I was particularly struck by the deputy and the nqt in the car park .   How important is the duning-kruger effect in leadership?    How do we develop the next generation of leaders ? What skills should leadership programs develop?    In the indicators of change chapter why should school leaders have their finger on the pulse and not the trigger .   Could you tell listeners where they can find out more about you and where you will be speaking next ? Leadership literature is drowning in abstract theories and models of heroic leadership, but an agreed definition of the term is elusive. School leadership suffers from this lack of clarity and consensus. Generic approaches to school improvement dominate the sector, which have left the workforce feeling anything but 'well led'. What exactly should school leaders know and do? How do we put 'substance' back into school leadership? This book draws on research evidence to explore the specific things that expert leaders know and do, arguing for a notion of school leadership rooted in the realities of leaders' daily experiences. It presents a case for how school leaders can develop their expertise and, in doing so, places domain-specific knowledge at the heart of school improvement efforts. Leaders With Substance is not a handbook. It sets out to change the way we think of leadership and school improvement. It is both a critique, a manifesto, and a call to arms. Podcast Pedagogy Lowborn- Kerry Hudson and so much more this week! TDT Section Bethan and Polly talk about pedagogical coaching. 

Welcome to the first Naylor's Natter of 2020. This is also our 1 year anniversary so a great opportunity to thank those of you that have been on the journey since 4th January 2019 and to welcome those of you new to the podcast. This weeks sees the introduction of our new format to sustain the podcast moving forwards.  We will still have the excellent valued input from the team at TDT to kick off the show each week (once they are back in the office) . This will be followed up with our main interview which will be presented by me or our team of presenters , including Kathryn Morgan, Emma Turner (TBC) and members of team TDT (David,Maria,Bethan, Ian or Michelle) . This will increase our capacity, diversify our interviews and interviewees and hopefully make this even more interesting for you the listeners.  I will be continuing with the podcast pedagogy section and I still very much welcome listeners reflections on what you are reading this year . So  if your New Years resolution is to read more , why not share this with a community of supportive educators? There is a button on the anchor app to send this directly . Alternatively , why not email p3nay91@gmail.com or via the website: www.naylorsnatter.co.uk The interview: Kathryn Morgan makes her debut , interviewing Vivienne Porritt on a range of topics from #womenEd and #10%braver to leadership and the importance of professional learning and development. Podcast pedagogy I discuss my takeaways and questions from the marvellous Leaders with Substance from Matthew Evans who will be a guest on the podcast very soon Shameless plugs  BrewEd Science 28th March  BrewEd Ossy 1st February  rED Birmingham March ***sold out*** rED Blackpool March ***sold out*** I am also taking bookings to speak at conferences for 2020 so please get in touch via the website listed above

This week I am in conversation with Director of Teaching School partnerships at the Alliance for Learning Lisa Fathers. Lisa has taught English and Drama for a number of years in several schools and was a middle leader, senior leader and Deputy Headteacher then Associate Headteacher. In this wide ranging interview , we talk about my favourite subjects namely professional learning and culture . We also have a a natter about the huge importance of mental health and Lisa's work in this area. We also discuss the importance of School to School support , the use of SLE's and of course Alliance for Learning's links with Research Schools and the use of evidence in their work.  At the end of the podcast Lisa turns the tables on me and we finally present our big reveal! Stay tuned. The questions: 1. Tell me career journey to date  2.How important was creating professional learning culture when you were deputy head  3.Tell us about mentally healthy schools Pilot   4. How important was collaboration to this programme?  5. How does school to school support work fit into the teaching school work ? 5B and what about SLEs? 5c and what about deploying SLEs  6. What experience of research work have you had etc?  7. Finally - why are you so passionate about PE when you are an English teacher ? Shameless plugs SSA Teach Meet, rED Brum and Blackpool . We also give a very early plug for 'Insights from 2 men in a cupboard' , our new book coming 2020! Also plug for https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/brewedscience-liverpool-tickets-86610457209 #BrewEdScience  Happy New Year!