Neurodiversity Podcast

School refusal and distress are the subject of the day, as Emily Kircher-Morris welcomes child psychologist and former school psychologist, Dr. Emily King. They discuss the importance of understanding the underlying causes of anxiety, the need for neurodiversity-affirming approaches, and the balance between structure and flexibility in educational settings. The also discuss the importance of grace, connection, and individualized strategies when helping children navigate their emotional experiences. TAKEAWAYS School refusal is often a response to anxiety, not an active choice. Understanding the difference between school refusal and school distress is crucial. Patterns of anxiety can vary based on environmental factors. Children may need different levels of support depending on their emotional state. Co-regulation is essential for helping children manage anxiety. Predictability in routines can help reduce anxiety for neurodivergent children. Flexibility within structure is important in educational settings. Parents should focus on what is necessary in their routines to reduce stress. Exit plans can empower children and reduce feelings of being trapped. Every child's experience is unique, and strategies should be individualized. Register here for a free one-hour continuing education webinar entitled The Cost of Camouflage: Exploring Masking and Burnout in Neurodivergent Clients. It’s a free service of the Neurodiversity University! Dr. Emily King is a child psychologist and former school psychologist with over 20 years of experience working with neurodivergent children and teens. She began her career specializing in school-based mental health in K-12 public schools in Houston, Texas, before transitioning to private practice in North Carolina, where she now supports the mental health needs of neurodivergent youth, their families, and educators. Dr. Emily is the creator of The Neurodiverse Classroom, a professional development curriculum for educators, and hosts Learn with Dr. Emily on Substack, where she shares blogs, live workshops, and insights on neurodiversity and education. Her upcoming book, The Neurodivergent Learner, will be available for presale in early 2026. Her expertise has been featured on MSNBC’s Morning Joe, The New York Times, The Washington Post, and Parents.com. BACKGROUND READING Facebook, Instagram, Threads, LinkedIn

Today, Emily Kircher-Morris and Meredith Polsky look into the complexities of selective mutism, exploring its definitions, the importance of language in understanding it, and the personal experiences that led Meredith to specialize in this area. They discuss the myths surrounding selective mutism, and its manifestation as an anxiety disorder rather than a choice or a form of shyness. Meredith shares her journey as a parent of children with selective mutism and the challenges she faced in finding appropriate treatment, ultimately leading her to become a clinician herself. They explore the challenges of diagnosis, and provide effective therapeutic techniques. This is a must-listen for adults supporting children with selective mutism. TAKEAWAYS Selective mutism is often misunderstood as a choice. Language matters in discussing selective mutism. The term 'situational mutism' is gaining popularity. Parents play a crucial role in treatment. Selective mutism is an anxiety disorder, not shyness. Pushing children to speak can increase anxiety. There is a lack of awareness among clinicians about selective mutism. Selective mutism can complicate the diagnosis of autism. Children with selective mutism may not exhibit typical anxiety responses. Effective communication strategies are crucial for children with selective mutism. Register here for a free one-hour continuing education webinar entitled The Cost of Camouflage: Exploring Masking and Burnout in Neurodivergent Clients. It’s a free service of the Neurodiversity University! Meredith Polsky, LCSW is a licensed clinical social worker specializing in Selective Mutism through her private practice, Counseling Out Loud. With a career dedicated to supporting children with diverse needs, she also serves as the Senior Director of Programs and Partnerships at Matan, Inc., an organization she co-founded in 2000 to promote inclusion in education. Meredith is the co-author of the award-winning I Have a Question children’s book series (Jessica Kingsley Publishers), which helps children—both with and without disabilities—navigate complex topics. She holds a BA in Psychology from the University of Michigan, an MA in Early Childhood Special Education from Bank Street College, an MA in Clinical Social Work from Columbia University, and a graduate certificate in Early Intervention from Georgetown University. BACKGROUND READING Counseling Out Loud, Matan, I Have a Question, LinkedIn, Selective Mutism Association

On episode 266, Emily Kircher-Morris discusses the critical role of executive functioning in education with Mitch Weathers, author of Executive Functions for Every Classroom. They explore how these skills are essential for student success, and discuss incorporating them into teaching practices, rather than treating them as an afterthought. The conversation also covers the importance of clarity, modeling, and routine in teaching these skills, and the challenges posed by the digital era. TAKEAWAYS Executive functioning is a core part of learning. Teaching executive functioning skills should be explicit and integrated into the curriculum. Clarity, modeling, and routine are essential for teaching these skills. Students need daily practice to develop executive functioning skills. The digital age may hinder the development of these skills. Organization is a transformative skill that grounds students. Self-assessment empowers students to reflect on their learning. Teachers struggling with executive dysfunction can impact their students' learning. Accountability involves collaboration between teachers, students, and families. Neurodivergent students benefit from tailored strategies and workarounds. Register here for a free one-hour continuing education webinar entitled The Cost of Camouflage: Exploring Masking and Burnout in Neurodivergent Clients. It’s a free service of the Neurodiversity University! Mitch Weathers is an educator, author, and expert in executive functioning. He is the founder and creator of Organized Binder, an evidence-based, MTSS Tier 1 universal solution designed to help students develop essential executive functioning skills such as goal setting, time management, reflective learning, and organization. His book, Executive Functions for Every Classroom, became a #1 bestseller, highlighting his structured approach to fostering academic success through clear expectations and routines. Mitch’s work emphasizes the importance of hands-on, analog strategies to build resilience and independence in students, ensuring they develop the foundational skills needed to thrive in an increasingly digital world. BACKGROUND READING LinkedIn, Facebook, X/Twitter, Instagram The Neurodiversity Podcast is on Facebook, Instagram, BlueSky, and you’re invited to join our Facebook Group. For more information go to www.NeurodiversityPodcast.com.

Emily Kircher-Morris talks with Barbara Pape, Senior Director of the Learner Variability Project, about the concept of learner variability. The conversation touches on the importance of recognizing each student's unique strengths and challenges. They explore how educators can support neurodivergent learners through personalized instruction, they cover the role of technology in education, and talk about the need for a sense of belonging in the classroom. The discussion also touches on the barriers educators face in addressing learner variability and the evolution of educational policy to better support diverse learners. TAKEAWAYS Learner variability is the recognition that each student has unique strengths and challenges. Teaching to the middle does not effectively reach any student. Understanding learner variability allows educators to see design challenges rather than student problems. The Learner Variability Navigator is a tool for educators to understand and support diverse learners. Creating a sense of belonging is crucial for student engagement and success. Students should have agency in how their accommodations are presented to peers. Belonging in the classroom requires a whole child approach. Educational policy must evolve to provide adequate support for neurodivergent learners. Barbara Pape is the Senior Director of the Learner Variability Project at Digital Promise, where she led a national survey on learner variability, edtech, and teacher practice, authored the defining paper on learner variability, and co-developed the IEP Project, which emphasizes strength-based, whole-child approaches to writing IEPs. She also hosts a monthly edWeb webinar series and previously served as executive producer of the award-winning Teaching & Learning conference for the National Board for Professional Teaching Standards. Her background includes roles in public policy, having worked on former U.S. Senator Paul Simon’s Senate and Presidential campaign, as well as in the U.S. Senate on the Education and Labor Committee. Barbara has contributed to numerous publications and was the editor and publisher of the first electronically delivered education newsletter, The Daily Report Card. She serves on the boards of Benetech and The Riley Project and is involved in multiple education and learner variability working groups. Previously, she was an advisor for the Kennedy Center’s Intersection of the Arts and Special Education and a strategic planning committee member for Montgomery County Public Schools. She is currently pursuing a PhD at University College London, holds an EdM in reading and literacy from Harvard University’s Graduate School of Education, and began her career as a middle school language arts teacher. BACKGROUND READING Facebook, Twitter/X, LinkedIn, YouTube, The Learner Variability Project, The Learner Variability Navigator The Neurodiversity Podcast is on Facebook, Instagram, BlueSky, and you’re invited to join our Facebook Group. For more information go to www.NeurodiversityPodcast.com

On episode 264, we’re sharing our sister podcast’s conversation about the double empathy problem. In Creating Neurodiversity-Affirming Schools, Emily Kircher-Morris and Amanda Morin explore a concept that challenges the assumption that neurodivergent individuals lack empathy, and instead highlights how misunderstandings happen between different neurotypes. They share personal stories, real-world classroom scenarios, and strategies to help educators bridge the communication gap with their neurodivergent students. TAKEAWAYS The double empathy problem—what it is and why it matters in schools. How educators can shift from assuming misbehavior to seeking understanding. The difference between cognitive empathy (perspective-taking) and affective empathy (emotional connection). Why curiosity and asking the right questions can prevent conflict and improve student-teacher relationships. Strategies for making classroom environments more emotionally safe for neurodivergent students. BACKGROUND READING The Double Empathy Problem (Damian Milton, 2012)  Neurowild by Em Hammond – Visual resources explaining neurodiversity concepts  Neurodiversity University Educator Hub: Join the Community Neurodiversity-Affirming Schools: Transforming Practices So All Students Feel Accepted and Supported - Order here The Neurodiversity Podcast is on Facebook, Instagram, BlueSky, and you’re invited to join our Facebook Group. For more information go to www.NeurodiversityPodcast.com

Today, Emily Kircher-Morris welcomes Natalia Aíza, a therapist and advocate, to talk about the complexities of Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder (OCD). They debunk common myths and misconceptions, and talk about what OCD actually is. It's important to understand the OCD cycle, be able to identify the various types of OCD, and understand how it often coexists with other neurodivergent conditions like ADHD and autism. They also talk about the impact of reassurance seeking, the nuances of Just Right OCD, and the challenges of school refusal. The conversation includes insights into how parents and therapists can better support individuals with OCD, and help them on the journey towards a better life. TAKEAWAYS OCD is often misunderstood, with many believing it only relates to cleanliness. The OCD cycle involves triggers, obsessions, and compulsions that reinforce fears. Moral scrupulosity and harm OCD are common types that are often overlooked. OCD is distinct from generalized anxiety. ADHD and OCD can coexist, leading to unique challenges in diagnosis and treatment. Autism can complicate the presentation of OCD, requiring specialized understanding. Reassurance seeking can inadvertently reinforce OCD behaviors. Just Right OCD reflects a perfectionism that can manifest in various aspects of life. School refusal can be a manifestation of OCD, leading to avoidance patterns. Episode featuring Eli Lebowitz Check out our Neurodiversity University courses, including Strategies for Supporting Twice-Exceptional Students. This episode was edited to add clarity to the subject of school avoidance or refusal, to indicate they aren’t exclusive to OCD. For some neurodivergent kids, it is a matter of a lack of accommodations and supports that make educational settings traumatic environments. School avoidance or refusal is a nuanced subject, and a deeper dive is planned for an episode in the near future. Natalia Aíza, LPC, is a therapist, parent trainer, and advocate dedicated to increasing awareness and improving treatment for individuals with OCD. She co-founded Kairos Wellness Collective, a therapy center specializing in OCD and Anxiety Disorders, where she works to enhance competency among mental health practitioners and support individuals on their healing journey. In addition to her clinical work, Natalia provides free psychoeducation and advocacy through her Instagram platform, @letstalk.ocd, helping to destigmatize OCD and promote evidence-based treatment. She earned her BA in Literature from Harvard University and an MA in Clinical Mental Health Counseling from Palo Alto University. BACKGROUND READING Instagram Kairos Wellness Collective The Neurodiversity Podcast is on Facebook, Instagram, BlueSky, and you’re invited to join our Facebook Group. For more information go to www.NeurodiversityPodcast.com

Today Emily Kircher-Morris welcomes Leah Kuypers, developer of the Zones of Regulation framework, to discuss self-regulation skills. They talk about the importance of emotional awareness, the practical applications of the framework in educational settings, and how it provides a common language for expressing feelings. Leah shares insights from her experience as an occupational therapist and educator, including the impact of the framework on students' ability to communicate their emotions and navigate their environments effectively. They discuss the need to move away from labeling emotions as good or bad, and explore practical strategies for implementing self-regulation tools in educational settings. TAKEAWAYS Self-regulation challenges significantly impact students' well-being and success. The Zones of Regulation framework provides a common language for expressing feelings. All zones are valid; there are no good or bad zones. Visual supports can help neurodivergent students communicate their feelings. The framework is designed to foster emotional intelligence and self-awareness. Teaching self-regulation skills can reduce reliance on punitive measures. The framework can be adapted for various age groups and needs. Emotional intelligence can be difficult to articulate, even for older students. Co-regulation with adults can help children identify and manage their emotions. Understanding the neurobiological aspects of regulation can inform better support strategies. Check out the Strategies for Supporting Twice-Exceptional Students course, and all of the others available now in the Neurodiversity University. Leah Kuypers, MA Ed., OTR/L, is an occupational therapist, autism resource specialist, and educator, dedicated to helping individuals develop self-regulation skills. While working in public schools, she recognized the profound impact that regulation difficulties had on learners’ overall well-being and daily functioning. This led her to develop The Zones of Regulation, a systematic and practical framework designed to foster emotional and sensory regulation. Since its initial publication in 2011, The Zones of Regulation has sold over 300,000 copies worldwide and has been widely adopted in educational and therapeutic settings. In 2024, Leah launched The Zones of Regulation Digital Curriculum, which has already been implemented in 40 countries. Her team trains more than 8,000 educators and practitioners annually around the globe, equipping them with tools to support learners in developing essential self-regulation skills. BACKGROUND READING Zones of Regulation Facebook Instagram YouTube The Neurodiversity Podcast is on Facebook, Instagram, BlueSky, and you’re invited to join our Facebook Group. For more information go to www.NeurodiversityPodcast.com

Today Emily Kircher-Morris talks with Gestalt language processing expert Ali Battye about the nuts and bolts of Gestalt, and why it's useful and important in understanding and supporting neurodivergent communicators. They talk about the barriers faced by Gestalt language processors, the role of augmentative and alternative communication (AAC), and the need for a strengths-based approach in communication. There are some common misconceptions about Gestalt language processing, and they explain and dispel them in this conversation. TAKEAWAYS Echolalia has become a helpful part of the learning process in Gestalt. Understanding the child's intent is crucial for effective communication. AAC can support children who struggle with verbal communication. Communication should be viewed as a connection-based approach. Misinformation about Gestalt language processing is prevalent. Real-life communication is complex and multimodal. Valuing a child's unique communication style fosters growth. Research on language acquisition should include lived experiences. Be notified when the Therapist Hub opens for new members. It's a great opportunity to transform your practice into a more neurodiversity-affirming place, using tools and methods that benefit all clients. It's also a great resource for accredited CE! Ali Battye is a highly experienced speech and language therapist with 25 years of practice in the UK and Australia. She specializes in neurodiversity-affirming therapy for autistic and neurodivergent children, with a focus on supporting Gestalt Language Processing (GLP) through Augmentative and Alternative Communication (AAC). Ali is also an accomplished author, having written books on AAC and, most recently, on GLP, advocating for joyful therapy that prioritizes genuine connection. Ali’s expertise is rooted in her extensive clinical experience and commitment to creating inclusive, supportive therapeutic practices that empower neurodivergent individuals. BACKGROUND READING Instagram Ali Battye’s book

Today we're discussing the concept of whole body listening, and its evolution to whole body regulation. Elizabeth Sautter joins Emily Kircher-Morris to talk about that evolution, and what it means to neurodivergent people and those who support them. They discuss emotional regulation and co-regulation, the role of educators and parents in modeling emotional awareness, and the impact of shame on neurodivergent learners. Also, the complexities of vulnerability, and the significant difference between calling someone out, and calling them in. TAKEAWAYS The shift from whole body listening to whole body regulation is crucial. Co-regulation is foundational for emotional regulation. Adults must model emotional awareness for children. Understanding individual needs is key to effective learning. Shame can hinder the learning process for neurodivergent kids. Brene Brown's work highlights the importance of discussing vulnerability and shame. Calling in promotes understanding and change more effectively than calling out. The stages of grief can be applied to the process of unlearning harmful practices. Self-reflection is essential for educators and parents to shift their approaches. Be notified when the Therapist Hub opens for new members. It's a great opportunity to transform your practice into a more neurodiversity-affirming place, using tools and methods that benefit all clients. It's also a great resource for accredited CE! Listen to Emily's other podcast, Creating Neurodiversity-Affirming Schools, co-hosted by Amanda Morin. Elizabeth A. Sautter, MA, CCC, is a speech-language pathologist, speaker, author, and trainer, with expertise in social communication, emotional regulation, and executive functioning. She is the author of Make Social and Emotional Learning Stick! Practical activities to help your child manage emotions, navigate social situations & reduce anxiety, along with many other resources, including an online course and community for parents. Elizabeth collaborates with the Zones of Regulation team as a trainer and is a coauthor of the Zones children’s books, card decks, and games. BACKGROUND READING Elizabeth Sautter’s website Instagram Facebook

On this episode, Emily Kircher-Morris and Dr. Daniel Ansari discuss the complexities of math education, including the anxiety it can cause in students, the challenges of teaching methods, and the importance of understanding learning difficulties like dyscalculia. They talk about the importance of explicit instruction in math, the role of neuroscience in understanding how children learn math, and the significance of working memory and attention in math learning. Educators and parents will also get suggestions for practical strategies that will help them support students struggling with math. TAKEAWAYS Math anxiety affects both children and adults. Explicit instruction is crucial for teaching math. Dyscalculia is often misunderstood and underrecognized. Teaching methods should align with children's developmental levels. Neuroscience reveals links between spatial and numerical processing. Math anxiety does not equate to a lack of ability. Timed practice should be engaging, not competitive. Working memory plays a significant role in math learning. Multisensory approaches can enhance math instruction. Parents should seek community and resources for support. Assisting Students Struggling with Mathematics from the Institute of Education Sciences The Think Inclusive Podcast episode Emily talked about - Saving ED: Why the U.S. Department of Education is Essential for Students with Disabilities This episode is sponsored by The Council for Exceptional Children, getting ready for their Convention & Expo in Baltimore, March 12-15th. Go to cecconvention.org to register! Dr. Daniel Ansari is a Professor and Canada Research Chair in Developmental Cognitive Neuroscience & Learning at Western University. He leads the Numerical Cognition Laboratory, where his research focuses on how children develop numerical and mathematical skills, as well as the cognitive factors contributing to difficulties in learning mathematics. Dr. Ansari and his team are dedicated to bridging the Science of Learning with K-12 education, working to translate research findings into classroom practice. He has authored over 150 peer-reviewed research articles and is a Fellow of the Canadian Institute for Advanced Research (CIFAR), recognized for his contributions to the field of developmental cognitive neuroscience. BACKGROUND READING The Numerical Cognition Laboratory The Neurodiversity Podcast is available on Facebook, Instagram, BlueSky, and you can also join our private Facebook group.