Mormon Discussion Podcast

RFM and Bill sit down with a former BYU Professor to discuss the experience of losing your faith while working for the Lord’s University. RESOURCES: https://www.louisakillian.com/ www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpUN29orJmM www.youtube.com/watch?v=tg36L1989Ss&t mylifebygogogoff.com/2020/08/how-a-new-instagram-page-is-exposing-apostate-byu-professors.html The post Mormonism LIVE: 056: Apostate BYU Professors appeared first on Mormon Discussion by Bill Reel.

Bill Reel and RFM take a look at the Historical Jesus and hit on the main points that Biblical criticism brings into focus and once they are done, your Christmases may never be the same. Jesus son of Mary – Illegitimate birth. Mark infers. The early church theologian Origen (d. 251 CE) has a polemical tract in which he writes an apologetic for Jesus’ virgin birth against Celsus, a pagan skeptic of Christianity (around 178 CE). Celsus was a proponent of the idea that the virgin birth story was a fiction invented by Jesus, when the truth was (as he apparently believed) Jesus was the biological product of his mother and a Roman soldier named Pantera. Also Virgin births were a common trope and polemic device in ancient mythology. Manger – ACU scholar Stephen Carlson writes that the word “kataluma” (often translated “inn”) refers to guest quarters. Most likely, Joseph and Mary stayed with family but the guest room was too small for childbirth and hence Mary gave birth in the main room of the house where animal mangers could also be found. use the links below from Dan McllellanManger/Inn – Scripture Translation Supervisor for the LDS Church, PhD in theology and religion https://www.tiktok.com/@maklelan/video/7037619189456358703?lang=en&is_copy_url=1&is_from_webapp=v1   More on the nativity – Daniel McClellan https://www.tiktok.com/@maklelan/video/7037685245172256046?lang=en&is_copy_url=1&is_from_webapp=v1 Traditional Account of the nativity – Daniel McClellan Scripture Translation Supervisor for the LDS Church, PhD in theology and religionhttps://www.tiktok.com/@maklelan/video/7040144974750731566?lang=en&is_copy_url=1&is_from_webapp=v1 Inconsistencies in the narrative – Matthew and Luke, the only Christian gospels which give us the virgin birth story, contain problematic details-both internally and in comparison to each other. For example, it’s been pointed out often that Luke’s dating of the census (while Quirinius was governor of Syria) in Luke is problematic. There are also difficulties when the accounts are compared to each other. The two genealogies don’t exactly reinforce each other and there are a number of striking differences when compared alongside each other–in particular the migration to Egypt in Matthew (2:13-14) which is completely absent from Luke. In Luke’s account, Mary and Joseph take Jesus home immediately to Nazareth (2:39-40), with no reference to a flight to Egypt or a conflict with Herod. Live in Bethlehem? – According to the Matthean infancy narrative, Joseph and Mary are natives to Bethlehem! They live in their house there! Houses would be part of patriarchal compounds with as many as 50 to 100 people.  There is no Lukan manger mentioned, and definitely no stables! The author “Matthew” expects his audience to understand this, being that he writes for people equipped with culturally-appropriate auxiliary background information. We Western Christians, reading with spurious familiarity, are blind to this. Did the Holy Family go from Bethlehem to Jerusalem and then straight back to Nazareth, as “Luke” tells us? Or did they reside in Bethlehem, give birth to Jesus there, live about two years there until the magi come, then flee to Egypt, then some years after go to a place they’ve never been to before and take up residence there, as “Matthew” says? (No need to read the following but in case someone asks why 2 years – Notably, the magi visit Jesus in a house (not an inn or stable) and their visit is as late as two years after the birth. Matthew 2:16 records King Herod’s orders to kill baby boys up to the age of two based on the report about Jesus’s age from the magi. This delay is why most Christian churches celebrate the visit of the magi on “Epiphany” or January 6) the slaughter of the innocents – given that Bethlehem probably had fewer than 1,000 residents, it’s possible the slaughter of the innocents involved just three or four babies, Witherington said. “We’re not talking about streets lined with dead babies,” Witherington told Live Science. In a world full of brutality and violence, it’s not clear the death of a few no-name babies in a sleepy village would have made the history books. Erroneous History about a Census – A similar situation exists with the Lukan census of the whole world when Quirinius was governor of Syria (Luke 2:1–2). This census was presumably made when Herod the Great reigned over Judea (1:5), and who was alive when Jesus was born and for some time after. Copious records exist from the time of Caesar Augustus’ reign (27 BCE—14 CE). These records describe many events during that reign, particularly the most important. None of them mention anything about a worldwide census. And consider how “Luke” describes this census: people must return to the home of their ancestors. Consider what the Empire would look like in order to accomplish that—throngs of millions migrating all over for the census. And yet all historical records remain silent on it? In his own history, Augustus himself fails to mention this achievement! That’s simply not credible.   RESOURCES: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/messyinspirations/2019/12/history-discrepancies-jesus-birth/ https://www.patheos.com/blogs/unsystematictheology/2016/03/six-problems-with-the-virgin-birth-biblical-and-historical-perspective/   https://theconversation.com/what-history-really-tells-us-about-the-birth-of-jesus-89444   http://www.paulonpaul.org/jesus/narr_2_birth.htm   https://www.livescience.com/49228-nativity-story-facts-history.html https://tabletalkmagazine.com/posts/the-controversial-birth-of-jesus/ https://www.patheos.com/blogs/messyinspirations/2019/12/different-jesus-birth-stories/   The post Mormonism LIVE: 055: Christmas & The Historical Jesus appeared first on Mormon Discussion by Bill Reel.

RFM & Bill Reel explore Missions and how an LDS Mission can contain some strange experiences and difficulty. They accomplish this by sitting down with with someone who had just that sort of Mission. The post Mormonism LIVE: 054: Mission Impossible appeared first on Mormon Discussion by Bill Reel.

Mormonism LIVE: 053: One Year Anniversary RFM and Bill Reel kick of the second year of Mormonism LIVE with a look back of the past 52 weeks since Mormonism Live’s inception. We look at the favorite episodes of both us and the viewers. We look back at any funny moments, and wonder where the next 52 episodes might take us The post Mormonism LIVE: 053: One Year Anniversary appeared first on Mormon Discussion by Bill Reel.

On November 12, 2021, Dallin H. Oaks, a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints’ First Presidency addressed the community in a meeting. The meeting included Question and Answer on the University of Virginia Campus. In that Q&A Elder Oaks is asked about his treatment and his own development of views on LGBT folks over the course of his life. In his answer he denies that Electroshock therapy was used during his time as BYU President. In tonight’s episode we review the evidence that says otherwise and wrestle with Elder Oaks seeming to be directly lying about such an atrocious process under his administration.   RESOURCES: https://youtu.be/5F92V-P9msQ?t=294 https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/interview-oaks-wickman-same-gender-attraction Anxiety in Stressful Times https://youtu.be/5F92V-P9msQ?t=294   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIJ6gL_xc-M&t=1490s   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsSlnNx7mgY   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXbl4iuBLN4   https://www.mormonstories.org/podcast/did-dallin-h-oaks-lie-about-byu-electroshock-therapy/   https://www.losangelesblade.com/2021/11/17/mormon-leader-denies-byu-used-electroshock-therapy-on-gay-students/   https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2021/11/16/dallin-oaks-says-shock/   https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallin_H._Oaks   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biGQs20JhW0   https://www.reddit.com/r/mormon/comments/qsusr4/elder_oaks_states_electroshock_therapy_never/   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brigham_Young_University_LGBT_history#Aversion_therapy_at_BYU   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biGQs20JhW0   https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1u3K43P-3JoY2Q5NDY3ZjYtNWUyMi00YWJiLWFhM2EtYTE4MjViNWVjOGEz/view?sort=name&layout=list&num=50&pli=1&resourcekey=0-hCSFHXaW9-fct0G1CTYPDw   https://affirmation.org/in-gods-name-the-treatment-of-homosexuals-by-the-christian-church/   https://abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/mormon-gay-cures-reparative-therapies-shock-today/story?id=13240700   https://m.imdb.com/title/tt0402338/   https://abcnews.go.com/Health/mormon-gay-cures-reparative-therapies-shock-today/story?id=13240700   https://www.exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,1337886http://www.mormonthink.com/glossary/electroshock-therapy-at-byu.htm   https://catalog.lib.byu.edu/uhtbin/pcnum/387154 (Smoking Gun)   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallin_H._Oaks#BYU_president   https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/interview-oaks-wickman-same-gender-attraction  ( Oaks and Wickman –  suggest shunning your gay kids)   https://affirmation.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/oaks_paper_02.pdf (Oak’s initial paper telling the church how to handle the LGBT issue) – it has been their blueprint since the beginning   “The church denounces any therapy, including conversion and reparative therapies,” the Mormon Church wrote. “That subjects an individual to abusive practices, not only in Utah, but throughout the world.” – Official statement from the Church “‘BYU will respond to homosexual behavior rather than to feelings or attraction, and welcomes as full members of the university community all whose behavior meets university standards,” said Jenkins. “Members of the university community can remain in good standing if they conduct their lives in a manner consistent with Gospel principles.'” Official Statement from BYU   “Dallin H. Oaks  had Gerald J. Dye over the HCO. Dye stated that part of the “set process” for homosexual BYU students referred to his office was to require that they undergo some form of therapy to remain at BYU, this included “electroshock and vomiting aversion therapies.”   https://web.archive.org/web/20131021171348/http://www.affirmation.org/therapy/with_all_thy_getting.shtml (During Oaks Time) http://www.connellodonovan.com/images/harker.jpg (Later BYU President can’t confirm\   https://www.fairlatterdaysaints.org/answers/Mormonism_and_gender_issues/Same-sex_attraction/Aversion_therapy_performed_at_BYU#Question:_Did_the_Church_of_Jesus_Christ_of_Latter-day_Saints_.28Mormons.29_ever_conduct_aversion_therapy.3F Fairmormon Denies   https://www.lds-mormon.com/legacies.shtml/   The Values Institute http://www.connellodonovan.com/images/BYU_9_15_77.jpg https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/1l08kq/mormons_use_electroshock_therapy_to_cure/ In March of 1979, Marion G. Romney asked Thomas S. Monson to get a concrete budget for the Values Institute. (Which they did, and I might add that all of the money to fund the Values Institute and its projects were received directly from tithing funds paid by LDS members).” http://exposingmormonism.blogspot.com/2008/02/thomas-s-monson-new-president.html https://affirmation.org/in-gods-name-the-treatment-of-homosexuals-by-the-christian-church/   http://signaturebookslibrary.org/the-abominable-and-detestable-crime-against-nature/   https://lattergaystories.org/download/4223/   https://www.reddit.com/r/mormon/comments/qsusr4/elder_oaks_states_electroshock_therapy_never/   The post Mormonism LIVE: 052: Elder Oaks’ Electroshock Hoax appeared first on Mormon Discussion by Bill Reel.

Wednesday Nov. 24th, RFM and Bill sat down with Denver Snuffer and discuss his life and the happenings around the Christian fellowships of “the Remnants” movement. Denver Snuffer is an author of Restorationist devotional books, a lecturer, a speculative theologian, and a revelator to fellowships of the remnants movement, a spiritual movement in schism with The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church). The movement has a few thousand adherents, many of them members or former members of the LDS Church. He was excommunicated by the LDS Church in 2013 for refusing to cease publication of his 2011 book, Passing the Heavenly Gift which challenges many points of LDS orthodoxy. He subsequently has been identified as a prophet by many, and several of his teachings have been canonized as scripture. RESOURCES: https://denversnuffer.com/ https://medium.com/the-seer-stone/mormonism-has-a-new-religion-and-it-has-a-prophet-named-denver-snuffer-282f5e24df1e https://kutv.com/news/local/lds-church-holds-special-meeting-to-denounce-false-prophet http://ldspioneerarchitecture.blogspot.com/2016/02/architecture-highlights-prayer-circle.html The post Mormonism LIVE: 051: Denver Snuffer appeared first on Mormon Discussion by Bill Reel.

Preparing on a short week with our focus on Thrive & the Midnight Mormon’s Debate with RFM has us selecting an interesting topic that is light and fun. So Wednesday November 17th RFM and Bill Reel dive into the old folklore surrounding Bigfoot being none other than Cain. The origination story, and how Prophets, Seer’s, and Revelators have turned a strange story into some sort of pseudo doctrine, How FairMormon really screwed the pooch, and how Mormonism’s and Sasquatch’s narratives intertwine in other strange places you may not have seen coming. RESOURCES: Is Cain Bigfoot? The Truth Behind 5 Mormon Folklore Stories – https://www.ldsliving.com/is-cain-bigfoot-the-truth-behind-5-mormon-folklore-stories/s/64534 Awareness of racism eased Mormon folk tales regarding Cain, Bigfoot https://www.standard.net/lifestyle/2015/oct/18/awareness-of-racism-eased-mormon-folk-tales-regarding-cain-big/ Bigfoot In Mormon lore … is Bigfoot Cain? https://utahstories.com/2019/07/bigfoot-in-mormon-lore-is-bigfoot-cain/ Journal of Mormon History Vol. 33, No. 3, 2007 (pg 74) https://digitalcommons.usu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1051&context=mormonhistory Question: Does Cain still roam the earth, and does this account for stories about “Bigfoot”? – FAIR https://www.fairlatterdaysaints.org/answers/Question:_Does_Cain_still_roam_the_earth,_and_does_this_account_for_stories_about_%22Bigfoot%22%3F Mormon theory of Bigfoot traces monster to Garden of Eden https://www.syracuse.com/strangecny/2008/02/morman_theory_of_bigfoot_trace.html The Mormon Bigfoot Genesis Theory – 10 Zen Monkeys http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/2008/02/05/the-mormon-bigfoot-genesis-theory/ When Cain Appeared to Joseph Fielding Smith’s Brother & Talked with an Apostle https://www.ldsliving.com/when-cain-appeared-to-joseph-fielding-smiths-brother-talked-with-an-apostle/s/83424 The Mark of the Curse: Lingering Racism in Mormon Doctrine? https://www.jstor.org/stable/pdf/45228364.pdf Poems 476–507 – Eliza R. Snow Lexicon https://erslexicon.wordpress.com/poems-476-507/ https://mormondiscussionpodcast.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2021/11/Cain-Bigfoot-Mathew-Bowman.pdf https://archive.org/details/lifeofdavidwpatt00wilsrich/page/44/mode/2up https://www.jstor.org/stable/pdf/45228364.pdf http://www.boap.org/LDS/Early-Saints/DPatten.html (nothing about Cain) https://catalog.churchofjesuschrist.org/assets/c7b775e0-ef6c-4ebe-b205-f159d8f4cdd7/0/1 https://www.dropbox.com/s/d5811ffxhgbph5v/MS_603-David_W_Patten_journal-ORIGINAL.pdf?dl=0 (Nothing about Cain) https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/51730/p The post Mormonism LIVE: 050: Bigfoot, Cain, & Prophetic Mormon Mythmaking appeared first on Mormon Discussion by Bill Reel.

We sit down with author and Illustrator of the book “The Glass Looker”, Mark Elwood and discuss how he incorporated Joseph Smith’s Treasure Digging into a beautiful animated book. We discuss how he decided what to include and what impact he hopes this book has RESOURCES: How the Project Came Together – https://theglasslooker.com/behind-the-scenes/ Order the Book – https://theglasslooker.com/product/volume1/ Mormon Discussion “168: Seer Stones, Folk Magic, and Alvin’s Hand” – https://mormondiscussionpodcast.org/2015/09/seer-stones-folk-magic-and-alvins-hand/ Mormonism LIVE !: 016: Peek Stones, Sheep’s Bones, and Gold Thrones all on Miner’s Hill – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4qiP2hZtcA The post Mormonism LIVE: 048: Mark Elwood & The Glass Looker appeared first on Mormon Discussion by Bill Reel.

Radio Free Mormon & Jonathan Streeter (Filling in for Bill Reel) deliver a special Halloween Episode fielding live phone calls where listeners can share their spooky tales. The post Mormonism LIVE: 047: Spooky Halloween Call In Show appeared first on Mormon Discussion by Bill Reel.

WARNING: We will be dealing with the sensitive topic of Self Harm. If you have self harm ideation and are triggered by discussion around such, please skip this episode in lieu of another. In Tonight’s Episode Bill Reel and RFM will take a deep historical dive into the topic of Suicide within Mormon Theology and take a look at how the LDS Church has approached this issue giving historical context. What we learn is that LDS Leaders and Mormon Doctrine have had some ups and downs dealing with approaching such in a healthy way with healthy attitudes. Like everything else in Mormonism, this issue too is messy. RESOURCES: https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/liahona/1988/03/suicide-some-things-we-know-and-some-we-do-not?lang=eng https://www.deseret.com/2018/7/2/20648210/lds-apostle-totally-false-that-suicide-leads-to-permanent-hell https://eom.byu.edu/index.php/Suicide https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/suicide?lang=eng https://www.heraldextra.com/news/2015/sep/20/church-teachings-on-suicide-have-changed-through-the-years/ https://kutv.com/news/local/lds-apostle-speaks-about-church-responsibility-in-mormon-lgbt-suicides-for-first-time https://www.mrm.org/suicide-and-mormonism https://www.pewforum.org/2013/11/21/religious-groups-views-on-end-of-life-issues/ https://deseretbook.com/p/suicide-some-things-we-know-do-not-m-russell-ballard-437?variant_id=112173-paperback http://mormonscholar.org/an-old-sectarian-notion-lds-teachings-on-suicide-sin-and-damnation/ https://mormonleaks.io/wiki/documents/6/6b/1958-Mormon_Doctrine-Bruce_R_McConkie.pdf (Agency & Suicides) https://lds365.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Preventing-Suicide-Responding-After-Loss-LDS.pdf https://childfriendlyfaith.org/2019/06/the-homophobic-teachings-of-the-mormon-church-killed-my-son/ https://www.dropbox.com/s/24uta1hgckvtzk0/MStar_19213.pdf?dl=0 (Millenial Star) https://archive.org/details/juvenileinstructor1993/page/352/mode/2up?view=theater&q=juvenile+instructor https://www.deseret.com/opinion/2021/10/13/22672169/are-latter-day-saint-lgbtq-youths-less-suicidal-a-new-study-asks-the-question-mormon https://dsamh.utah.gov/pdf/sharp/2019/State%20of%20Utah%20Report.pdf https://discussmormonism.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=154136&start=10 https://suicidepreventionlifeline.org National Suicide Prevention Lifeline We can all help prevent suicide. The Lifeline provides 24/7, free and confidential support for people in distress, prevention and crisis resources for you or your loved ones, and best practices for professionals. 1-800-273-8255 Tonight’s Episode will be dealing with the sensitive topic of suicide. If this topic might be triggering or such ideation is present. Please skip this episode and return back for next week’s. While we have consulted best practices National Suicide Prevention Lifeline We can all help prevent suicide. The Lifeline provides 24/7, free and confidential support for people in distress, prevention and crisis resources for you or your loved ones, and best practices for professionals. 1-800-273-8255   https://suicidepreventionlifeline.org/talk-to-someone-now/ The post Mormonism LIVE: 046: Suicide Within Mormon History & Theology appeared first on Mormon Discussion by Bill Reel.