Copywriters Podcast

Top copywriter Mike Pavlish discusses the effectiveness of personal stories in sales, the importance of urgency and average order value in customer acquisition, the power of headlines, and strategies to encourage more sales. He also explores transitioning between content modes and promotes his website for interested hosts.

Copywriters Podcast welcomes superstar copywriter Mike Pavlish who shares his secrets about VSLs that sell like crazy. They discuss the effectiveness of VSLs compared to traditional sales letters, the challenges of selling through this medium, and the importance of market research and customer experiences in copywriting. They also cover crafting a compelling lead and transitioning from short to long video content.

For a lot of us, the hardest part of writing copy is getting started. Today we’re going to dive into some very handy tips from Old Master John Caples. He is, of course, famous for his ad which has the headline, “They Laughed When I Sat Down at the Piano… but When I Began To Play… ” Caples was what we would call today a data-driven marketer. He made his choices based on test results as much as anything else. He was highly successful and author of some of the best books every written on direct response marketing. In “Tested Advertising Methods,” he has an entire chapter devoted to seven proven ways to start your copy. Imagine how much easier it will be to write if you have some sure-fire ways to get started. That’s what today’s show is about. Now, to come up with these seven techniques, John Caples didn’t brainstorm a bunch of ways to start copy. He didn’t even draw on his massive, successful experience as a copywriter and a copy chief for six of them. No, for this chapter, he did something better. He found the best source of leads where the words HAD to work. And that was the Reader’s Digest. Now you may not be familiar with Reader’s Digest, but if you are as old as I am, you probably are. If for no other reason that you remember copies of the magazine lying around the waiting room of the dentist’s office. Reader’s Digest was the largest-circulation magazine in the United States until 2009. Millions and millions of people would read these articles each month. And so the editors had to make sure that every word counted. They couldn’t take risks or allow flights of fancy. Every article needed to make sense to every reader. From the first word, and all the way through. When you’ve got millions of readers, you’ve got to be a simple, straightforward and yet as compelling as humanly possible. It was against that backdrop that Caples began his research. He thought: If editors use something to start articles in the Reader’s Digest over and over again, it’s not by accident. They have to KNOW that it works. So he started cataloguing and counting the different ways the articles started. He figured, if it will work in editorial, it will also work in advertising. I think he was absolutely right, and it was a brilliant way to show copywriters proven ways to start their copy. He came up with six ways that were repeated over and over, and added a seventh one. All of this is from Chapter 9 of “Tested Advertising Methods.” I’m going to summarize what he found and then we’ll bring it into the 21st Century. And, along the way, give you a little toolkit to get your copy started faster and with more confidence. Link to get “Tested Advertising Methods”: https://www.amazon.com/Advertising-Methods-Prentice-Business-Classics/dp/0130957011 Download.

Guest Jason Strachan, direct marketer and expert in increasing conversions after prospect opt-in for a lead magnet, discusses the importance of thinking outside the box in direct marketing. Topics include using lead magnets and upselling techniques, promoting breakthrough copywriting, the effectiveness of the upsell formula, and determining the success of promos and pricing strategies.

Most everyone accepts that stories are THE best way to grab and hold someone’s attention. But does that mean ANY story you use in your copy will help you with your sales? A lot of people seem to have never asked or considered that question. Today we dig into it. You see, Joseph Campbell’s 1949 book “The Hero with a Thousand Faces” eventually launched a revolution in storytelling. Especially among professional storytellers. Campbell’s idea of The Hero’s Journey has become accepted truth as THE way to tell a story for many people. Is that really true in copy? We take a careful look at this question today. And we come up with some answers so you don’t make the mistake I’ve seen so many copywriters make with their stories. I want to say up-front that I am not against Hero’s Journey stories. I have spent a large part of my life studying them and an even larger part of my life reading, watching and enjoying them. My main point today is that you should use them as they were intended to be used, and where they work. I like hand-held power drills, but I don’t think you should use them to open a can of chili. It’s interesting, for example, that a typical movie is a two-hour hero’s journey. It starts with an ordinary person on an ordinary day, who gets thrown into a long and complicated challenge that changes the person’s life. Tests, discoveries, friends and foes abound. As you watch the story, or read the story, at more than one point you say, “How is he going to get out of this one?” or “Is it even possible she can make it through this problem?” And while, for example, the studios MAKE two-hour stories in the form of a hero’s journey, they don’t SELL them that way. Studios sell movies with little movies of 30 seconds to two minutes called “trailers.” A trailer has high points from the movie, called “moments,” and one overriding question or theme to get you intrigued enough to buy a ticket or pay for a view on your TV and devote two hours of your life to watching the movie. That’s a hint right there on one major difference between dramatic stories and sales stories. Now, this is not to say that there are no similarities between the two types of stories. One thing they have in common is that they cause emotional responses in the viewer or reader. Sometimes huge ones. All good stories have an emotional impact of some kind. Another thing they have in common is that they are about people, not things or ideas. Usually, one main person. Of course there are other people in a story, too. But usually it’s about one person. Sometimes a tight-nit group of people, or a pair of people -- like a buddy movie. But, that said, there are a lot more differences than similarities. We to talk about five of the key differences today. Download.

Our guest today is a true A-List Copywriter. Doug D’Anna has written for just about about any major direct mail publisher you can think of. His client list includes Agora, Boardroom, Forbes, Prevention Health Books, Personal Finance, and dozens of other big-ticket clients. Like just about every other copywriters starting out, Doug was severely underpaid for his work at first. He turned that around on a project that earned him one-quarter million dollars in royalties about 30 years ago. He kept on going from there, and he’ll tell us all about that today. What does it take to bring in the big bucks in copywriting? Doug has figured it out. He’s also discovered how to get some pretty impressive public endorsements, like this one from legendary copywriter Gary Bencivenga: “Writers who can consistently create powerful direct marketing campaigns are as rare as trumpeter swans. I know of only about six in the entire country. Doug D'Anna is on that short list of star writers I never hesitate to recommend.” Today, Doug has agreed to share with you vitally important information about how to get paid what you are worth, which, as you can see by now, he made a lot of effort to learn and profit from himself. I also have some vitally important information for you: Copy is powerful. You’re responsible for how you use what you hear on this podcast. Most of the time, common sense is all you need. But if you make extreme claims... and/or if you’re writing copy for offers in highly regulated industries like health, finance, and business opportunity... you may want to get a legal review after you write and before you start using your copy. My larger clients do this all the time. Doug took us right back to the beginning, when he was struggling to get paid enough to make copywriting worth his while. It all changed when a man named Richard Stanton-Jones at Phillips Publishing hired Doug to write a promotion for a publication called Retirement Letter. Stanton-Jones put a lot of time into working with Doug, and did it ever pay off! Doug’s promo got double the response of the current control — and it launched his career. Discovering what he was worth came to Doug in phases. The more he found out, and the more successes he racked up, the more he raised his fees — even once doubling it in a one day! Doug shared some of his best secrets and strategies in this action-packed, value-rich show. He’s also offering a $51 discount ($299 instead of $350) to podcast listeners on his powerful home-study course: “How to Sell Yourself as a Copywriter. Just use this link: https://dougdanna.gumroad.com/l/nmufa/DAVIDGDownload.

Joshua Lee Henry, a former pastor turned high-powered copywriter, discusses a mind-boggling lead structure for captivating prospects' attention. He shares strategies for creating compelling leads, improving conversions with copy critiques, and balancing urgency in financial promos. Joshua emphasizes teasing customers with mechanisms and proof in copywriting, offering valuable insights for aspiring copywriters.

The podcast discusses tips to add more impact to sentences, emphasizing clarity and momentum. It highlights the importance of simplifying writing and utilizing picture words. Maximizing reader engagement and overcoming the curse of knowledge are also explored. The struggle of experts in technical fields to explain their work is discussed, emphasizing the significance of effective communication in copywriting.

If you’ve been a copywriter, a media buyer, or a business owner for a while, you have probably realized there are things that happen in this business that people don’t talk about a lot. At least publicly. I’m talking about stuff that you kinda wished you knew about ahead of time, so you wouldn’t be so floored when it happened to you. Copywriting and direct marketing make up a great business, and I’ve found most people, most of the time, are pretty decent. But not everybody all the time. And I know we generally like to be constructive and optimistic on this podcast. But I think it’s also valuable to know how things can go upside down or sideways. You can’t always avoid it, but you may be able to stop it or fix it before it gets worse. Or at least deal with it better than you might have before you knew about what we’re going to talk about today. Sometimes I think the best background for being a copywriter is having a previous life as a firefighter, an ER surgeon, or a hostage negotiator. Because on those occasions when things start to go sideways or upside down, it’s good to have crisis-management skills in the real world. I wanted to put this show together because I thought about some of the things I wish I had known about before I became a copywriter, a direct response business owner, and later a coach. To be sure, there are a number of annoying, disrespectful, and sometimes sheerly incomprehensible things that do happen. I don’t think it’s a good idea to believe you can wish it all away just by keeping a positive mindset. You know, because… some days are just better than others. One of my favorite success writers, Robert Ringer, has a “Theory of Sustenance” which says, “Keep a Positive Attitude Through The Expectation of a Negative Result.” A lot of fancy words, right? What does his elaborate theory mean? It basically means: Shit happens. Do not worry about this, or let it throw you off balance. Sometimes, you’ll find that negative results are simply an inevitable part of the process of success. Including great success. With practice and intention, you can learn to let go of the pain after a bit of time, and hold onto the lesson. Because there’s always a lesson. I figured, we might as well talk about problems, just to be prepared for them before they happen. Everything I’m going to talk about today has happened to me or to someone I know. Download.

This is a unique edition of our Old Masters Series, because I knew this copywriter personally. It’s Joe Sugarman, and Joe passed away in March of this year. I was sad to see him go, as were thousands of others. Outside of the direct marketing world, Joe is known for his BluBlockers sunglasses, which he took to great success using infomercials. Joe also came up with the Batman credit card. He printed up a huge number, only to find DC comics wasn’t interested in selling them. So he gave them away at events. Joe was a fun guy. And as you’ll hear about in today’s show, quite a prankster from early in his life. Joe wrote a book called Triggers in 1999, and we looked at a few of the most powerful ideas in the book. The information in this value-packed book is familiar on a surface level to most copywriters and marketers, but Joe brings it to life in a unique way with some great stories. Each trigger, by the way, is a powerful copy element that will increase your conversions. I think the reason he calls them triggers is that they trigger action on the part of the prospect. We took a deep dive on 5 triggers in today’s show. Here’s what we covered: Trigger 1: National Hermits Convention: Desire to Belong Trigger 2: The Snowmobile That Bit Me: Exclusivity Trigger 3: Our President Drives A Rabbit: Proof of Value Trigger 4: Instilling Authority In The Men’s Bathroom: Authority Trigger 5: Help, It’s A Fire: Sense of Urgency Link to get Triggers: https://www.amazon.com/Triggers-Prospect-Motivate-Influence-Persuade-ebook/dp/B00O3QEFSKDownload.