Discourse in Magic

In this episode, Jonah Babins is joined by corporate magic legend Bill Herz to unpack a career that spans summer camps, corporate boardrooms, and headline features in The Wall Street Journal. From his early days performing with Paul Cummins to founding Magicorp and representing world-class talent, Bill shares the highs, the hustle, and the hilarious behind-the-scenes of building a career in corporate magic. You’ll learn what makes a magician bookable, how to navigate pricing, and why a magician’s greatest asset might be understanding the client better than they understand themselves. How Bill Got Started in Magic Like many magicians, Bill’s journey began with a magic set at eight years old. But what set him apart was a unique blend of showmanship, business sense, and a willingness to perform for anyone, anywhere—from birthday parties to summer camps and community centers. The Creation of Magicorp What started with teaching a CEO one simple trick became a revolutionary corporate entertainment concept. Bill realized the power of using magic as a tool in business communication, eventually founding Magicorp to help executives shine and manage bookings for the best in the industry. What Makes a Magician Corporate-Ready Bill breaks down what he looks for in the performers he books—hint: it’s more than a good show. From being able to describe what makes you different in one sentence, to being professional, personable, and ego-free, he outlines the traits that help magicians thrive in the corporate world. Understanding Your Value and Pricing Pricing is more than picking a number—it’s about asking the right questions and understanding what the client needs. Bill shares how he approaches pricing based on value, logistics, and market perception, and why being flexible (but smart) is essential to getting booked and respected. Social Media, Managers, and Magician Mistakes Bill doesn’t hold back when talking about magicians on social media and their obsession with “busy bragging.” He also dives into why having a manager or being repped by a big agency can sometimes hurt more than help—and how magicians can avoid sabotaging their own careers. Endless Chain At the end of the episode, Bill recommends magician Derek Hughes as a future guest. A brilliant performer and a friend of Bill’s, Derek brings a unique blend of comedy and magic that works exceptionally well in the corporate space. Mentions Bill Herz’s Website Magicorp – Corporate Magic Booking Agency David Copperfield Mac King Ben Seidman Colin Cloud   The post Pioneering Corporate Magic with Bill Herz appeared first on Discourse in Magic.

In this episode of Discourse in Magic, Jonah Babins sits down with magician, circus performer, and entertainer Leah Orleans to discuss her unique journey in magic, her experiences blending circus arts with illusion, and how she pushes the boundaries of traditional performance. Leah shares insights into how she found her place in the magic world, her approach to creating engaging and original performances, and the lessons she’s learned along the way. Finding Magic in the Circus Leah’s entry into the world of magic was anything but conventional. She started as a circus performer, mastering aerial arts, juggling, and acrobatics before discovering how magic could enhance her performances. Her background in physical theater and movement helped her develop a distinctive performance style that captivates audiences in a way few traditional magicians can. Standing Out in a Male-Dominated Industry As a female performer in both circus and magic, Leah has navigated challenges and misconceptions while forging her own path. She discusses the importance of representation, the struggles of being underestimated, and how she has turned those obstacles into strengths. By bringing a fresh perspective and a multidisciplinary approach to her craft, she continues to inspire others to think outside the box. Creating Unique and Immersive Experiences Leah shares her process for designing routines that seamlessly blend magic with circus arts. From crafting new illusions to reimagining classic tricks, she explains how movement and storytelling play a crucial role in her work. She also dives into the creative risks she takes to ensure each performance is not only visually stunning but also deeply engaging for her audiences. Advice for Performers and Magicians For those looking to break into the world of performance, Leah offers practical advice on developing a distinct style, building confidence on stage, and continuously refining one’s craft. She emphasizes the importance of perseverance, experimentation, and finding one’s unique voice in an industry that often leans toward tradition. Endless Chain April Jennifer Choi Where to Find Leah Orleans To learn more about Leah Orleans, her performances, and upcoming projects, follow her on social media and check out her website: Website: Leah Orleans’ Website Instagram: @LeahOrleans Facebook: Leah Orleans Magic & Circus The post Leah Orleans: Pushing Boundaries in Magic appeared first on Discourse in Magic.

This week on Discourse in Magic, we’re bringing you a special repost of Jonah Babins’ appearance on the Penguin Magic Podcast, hosted by Erik Tait. Jonah, the long-time host of Discourse in Magic, takes the guest seat and shares insights on the world of magic, business, and podcasting. How Jonah Built Discourse in Magic  Jonah shares the journey of how Discourse in Magic has grown over the years. He discusses the evolution of the show, the challenges of maintaining a podcast in the magic space, and what has kept him going for nearly a decade. Jonah explains his strategy for selecting guests, emphasizing the importance of personal interest. He shares how being genuinely curious about a guest’s work leads to more engaging and meaningful conversations. The Evolution of His Magic Career  Jonah reflects on how his interests have changed over time. While Discourse in Magic initially focused on deep philosophical discussions, his passion has shifted toward the practical aspects of magic, especially business growth and performance.  Jonah shares insights into his Mastermind program, where he helps magicians grow their businesses. He talks about the structure of the program, its benefits, and the transformative results that many of his students have experienced. The Three Key Pillars of a Successful Magic Business Jonah breaks down the fundamental elements necessary to build a thriving magic business. He details how generating leads, improving sales techniques, and optimizing business systems can help magicians increase their income and efficiency. Jonah emphasizes the power of having a supportive network. He explains how magicians in his Mastermind program benefit from shared knowledge, accountability, and expert guidance to help them achieve their business goals. Mentions Jonah’s Magic Business Coaching Discourse in Magic Instagram Vote for Jonah in the FM Magic Podcast Awards  Enjoy the episode and don’t forget to subscribe for more deep dives into the art and business of magic! The post Jonah Babins: Magic’s Business Whisperer appeared first on Discourse in Magic.

In this solo episode of Discourse in Magic, Jonah Babins dives into the world of public shows, sharing his insights on why every magician should consider doing them. He also provides a sneak peek into his upcoming shows across North America and highlights a special event happening at the end of April. Why Do Public Shows? Promo Material: Public shows are an excellent opportunity to get high-quality promotional material. By hiring a photographer or videographer, you can capture footage of your performance that can be used to market yourself and book more gigs in the future. Friends and Family: Public shows provide a chance for your friends and family to see you perform. They are your biggest supporters, and this is a great way for them to experience your magic without the high cost of private or corporate events. Client Engagement: Offering free tickets to past and potential clients is a fantastic way to maintain relationships and generate new business. It gives you a reason to reach out and offer something valuable, which can lead to future bookings.  Upcoming Shows  Jonah shares his tour dates and locations for the next two months: – March 6th: Boston, performing at the Boston Magic Lab. – March 7th-9th: Connecticut, performing and lecturing at Mcon. – March 18th-20th: Austin, Texas, performing a show with Michael Rogerson. – March 25th-28th: Montreal, performing a show with John Elli. – April 8th-11th: St. Louis, performing a show with Josh Weidener. – April 28th-May 2nd: L Summit in Mexico, a special event for Mastermind members.  Mentions Boston Magic Lab Michael Rogerson John Elli Josh Weidener Toronto Magic Company     The post Public Shows and Upcoming Tour Dates appeared first on Discourse in Magic.

In this episode of Discourse in Magic, Jonah Babins sits down with Jonathan Levit to discuss his multifaceted career in the entertainment industry, from acting and hosting to creating innovative magic tricks and apps. Jonathan shares his journey, insights, and the magic behind his successful projects, including his Vegas show and The Stranger app. Early Magic Journey Jonathan discusses how he discovered magic through his father’s props and the magical community in St. Louis that shaped his early years. He reflects on the importance of mentorship and friendships in his development as a magician. Acting and Hosting Career Jonathan talks about his transition to acting and hosting in Los Angeles, sharing the challenges and rewards of working in front of the camera. He emphasizes the skills he gained from acting and hosting that have enhanced his magic performances. Consulting on Films Jonathan recounts his experience consulting on films like “The Incredible Burt Wonderstone,” working with actors like Steve Carell and Jim Carrey. He shares memorable moments from the set and the unique challenges of bringing magic to the big screen. Vegas Show  Jonathan provides insights into his current show at the Venetian in Las Vegas, describing its intimate and theatrical format. He discusses the journey of getting the show to Vegas and the dynamics of running a successful production in a competitive environment. The Stranger App Jonathan explains the creation and functionality of The Stranger app, a powerful magic trick that combines technology and community. He highlights the app’s impact on his performances and the global community of magicians it has fostered. Nexus Project Jonathan introduces his latest project, Nexus, which serves as a digital hub for creating innovative magic routines. He details the features of Nexus and how it allows magicians to integrate various inputs and outputs seamlessly into their performances. Endless Chain  Jonathan recommends Christopher Hart as a future guest for the podcast, noting his expertise and contributions to the world of magic. Mentions Jonathan Levit’s Website Jonathan Levit Instagram Twisting the Aces The Stranger App The post Magic and Mystery with Jonathan Levit appeared first on Discourse in Magic.

Welcome to another insightful episode of Discourse in Magic with your host, Jonah Babins! This week, Jonah shares his journey and lessons learned from running Google ads in his magic business. Unlike tactical episodes, this one dives deep into the mental game and personal experiences that paved the way for success. Perseverance and Mindset Jonah’s initial attempts with Google ads led to small gigs and disappointment, making him nearly give up on the idea. However, he emphasizes the importance of persistence and learning from failures. Understanding that hard things may not work the first time is crucial for growth. Learning and Commitment After a five-year hiatus, Jonah revisited ad campaigns with a dedicated effort to learn and improve. He spent significant time understanding the basics of running ads, leading to better results. The significance of investing time in learning cannot be understated. Hiring Experts Jonah’s decision to hire professionals transformed his ad campaigns and led to significant business growth. He highlights the value of expert knowledge and continuous improvement. Collaborating with experts allowed Jonah to scale and optimize his ad campaigns effectively. Scaling and Growth Taking successful ad campaigns to the next level involved hiring the right people. Jonah discusses the impact of mentorship and expert guidance in achieving business growth. He emphasizes the importance of investing in education and professional support to unlock new levels of success. Stay Connected: Website: Discourse in Magic Instagram: @discourseinmagic Facebook: Discourse in Magic The post Runnings Ads to Get Gigs appeared first on Discourse in Magic.

In this episode, Jonah sits down with Rachel Wax to discuss her journey from fashion to full-time magic, performing at Speakeasy Magick, and her creative process for developing new routines. Getting Into Magic Rachel’s introduction to magic came from her father, a surgeon with a passion for tricks. At 15, she learned a self-working card trick, sparking a lifelong fascination. Despite initially pursuing fashion design at FIT in New York, Rachel found herself drawn into the city’s magic scene, demoing magic kits at FAO Schwarz and Toys ‘R’ Us. This led her to The Magnets, a group of magicians who jammed and performed together, helping her refine her craft. The New York Magic Scene Rachel shares insights into what makes the New York magic scene unique, from its competitive nature to the high expectations of its audiences. She highlights how performing in such a dynamic city pushes magicians to be better and why close-up magic is having a moment right now. Speakeasy Magic and Performing in Immersive Environments As a regular performer at Speakeasy Magick Rachel describes the challenges and rewards of working in an immersive, up-close environment. She explains how the show is structured, what makes it special, and how it has shaped her as a performer. Creative Process and Mind Mapping Rachel breaks down her approach to creating new magic, including how she uses mind mapping to develop tricks that align with her character. She also walks through her process for refining routines, incorporating audience feedback, and continuously evolving her material. Being a Woman in Magic Rachel candidly discusses her experiences as a woman in the magic industry, from dealing with audience perceptions to navigating sexism at conventions. She shares how she turns low expectations into an advantage and the importance of fostering an inclusive and supportive magic community. The Business of Magic in New York Jonah and Rachel discuss the business side of magic, including how private gigs and ticketed shows shape a magician’s career in New York. Rachel also touches on why having multiple great magic shows in a city helps grow the industry rather than creating competition. Mentions Speakeasy Magic Vanishing Inc. (Mind Mapping project) Rachel Wax’s Website Instagram Endless Chain Rachel recommends checking out: Eli Bosnick   The post Magic and Mystery in New York with Rachel Wax appeared first on Discourse in Magic.

In this episode of Discourse in Magic, Jonah Babins sits down with magician, science communicator, and viral illusion creator Matt Pritchard. Matt’s unique approach blends his background in physics with a passion for magic, leading to mesmerizing optical illusions and science-based performances that captivate audiences worldwide. How Matt Got Into Magic Matt shares his journey into magic, starting with escapology as a teenager before evolving into a love for illusions. He discusses how his studies in physics and early performances in bars and student events led to a deeper appreciation for the overlap between magic and science. The Intersection of Magic and Science Jonah and Matt explore the shared sense of wonder in both disciplines. Matt explains how science and magic both challenge our understanding of reality—one by uncovering truths and the other by deliberately concealing them. He also touches on his work in science communication, where he teaches students using illusions to explain scientific concepts. The Rise of Matt’s Viral Illusions During the pandemic, Matt started sharing his optical illusions online, quickly gaining traction. He details how his illusions evolved through audience feedback and meticulous experimentation. One of his standout viral creations—an elephant disappearing from a moving train track—attracted major attention from magicians and illusionists worldwide. Creativity and Problem-Solving in Illusions Matt offers insight into his creative process, from finding inspiration in old magic books and science experiments to refining illusions through trial and error. He discusses the fusion of stage and close-up magic techniques in his work, making them especially deceptive—even to seasoned magicians. The Business of Science Magic Matt talks about transitioning from working in a science museum to performing independently in schools and festivals. He shares how word-of-mouth, smart branding (switching from “Lab Monkey Productions” to “Science Magic Shows”), and strategic partnerships helped grow his business. The Ethics of Magic and Social Media Jonah and Matt debate the challenges of posting illusions online, particularly dealing with exposure and explanations in comment sections. Matt embraces engagement, often encouraging audiences to theorize about his illusions while maintaining a sense of mystery. Final Thoughts and Recommendations Matt reflects on his favorite aspects of modern magic, emphasizing performances that focus on human connection and wonder. He also shares his least favorite trend: exposure videos that diminish the mystery and artistry of magic. Endless Chain Matt suggests two fascinating guests for future episodes: Ian Kendall – A highly skilled street performer from Edinburgh. Gaia Rossi – A talented stage magician and psychologist, offering insights into the psychology behind magic. Mentions Instagram & Twitter: @sciencemagician Website: Science Magic Shows Derren Brown’s Show – Derren Brown Twist Museum, London – Twist Museum Robert Harbin’s Work – Robert Harbin on Magicpedia Lawrence Hass’ Paper Ball Act – Lawrence Hass   The post The Art and Science of Illusions with Matt Pritchard appeared first on Discourse in Magic.

In this week’s episode of Discourse in Magic, Jonah Babins kicks off the new year with an insightful discussion about the January slump—a reality for many magicians—and how to turn it into an opportunity for growth. With the rush of holiday gigs behind us, Jonah explains how January offers a unique chance to focus on improving your magic business.  The January Slump: A Common Challenge As Jonah points out, January can feel like a shock after the busiest month of the year. December brings a whirlwind of gigs, inquiries, and emails, but when the clock strikes midnight on New Year’s Eve, everything seems to come to a halt. Jonah reassures listeners that this is entirely normal—not just for you, but for magicians everywhere. In fact, it’s the slowest month of the year for most performers, as evidenced by the revenue data he tracks for his mastermind group of magicians. Rather than feeling discouraged, Jonah invites you to see this slow season as a gift. Instead of scrambling to keep up with gigs and inquiries, you now have the time to work on your business rather than in your business. Three Big Projects to Tackle in January Jonah highlights three key areas to focus on during this quieter season to set yourself up for long-term success: Revamp Your Website January is the perfect time to improve your website. Whether it’s upgrading the design, adding a booking form, or updating images, this is the time to make changes. With less traffic coming in, you don’t have to worry about downtime, giving you the freedom to experiment and improve.  Create a New Promo Video If you captured video footage from your holiday gigs, now is the time to turn it into a standout promo video. Jonah emphasizes the importance of crafting a video that showcases your best moments—whether it’s a trick with fire, a big audience reaction, or a beautifully staged performance. With January’s slower pace, you can give this project the time and attention it deserves.  Set Up or Upgrade Your CRM If you’ve started booking gigs regularly, it might be time to implement a CRM (Customer Relationship Management) system to organize your client data. Jonah shares his thoughts on different CRM options and explains why this is a task best tackled during a slower season, rather than in the chaos of the holiday rush.  The One Thing You Must Do in January Planning your entire year is Jonah’s top recommendation for January. He explains how having a roadmap for your goals, projects, and marketing efforts can keep you on track throughout the year. Without a plan, it’s easy for big projects—like setting up Google ads or improving your SEO—to fall by the wayside. Jonah also encourages listeners to reflect on the previous year. What types of gigs did you enjoy most? What areas of your business could be improved? This self-assessment will help you prioritize your efforts and make 2025 your best year yet. Join the “Preloaded Year” Workshop To help magicians plan their year, Jonah is hosting a free workshop called The Preloaded Year on January 15th. In just 75 minutes, he’ll guide participants through creating a comprehensive plan for their magic business. Whether it’s marketing, business development, or personal goals, you’ll walk away with a clear strategy for the year ahead. Can’t make the live session? No problem! Jonah is offering a recording of the workshop for a limited time to those who sign up. Click the link in the episode description to secure your spot. Final Thoughts This episode is packed with actionable advice for magicians looking to make the most of January. By embracing the slower season and focusing on big-picture projects, you can set yourself up for success in 2025. Links and Resources Sign up for the Preloaded Year workshop here. Follow Jonah on Instagram: @JonahBabinsmagic We’d love to hear your thoughts on this episode. What projects are you tackling this January? Share your plans in the comments or on social media, and let’s make 2025 a year to remember! Be sure to subscribe to Discourse in Magic for more insights, tips, and strategies to elevate your magic business. The post The Preloaded Year appeared first on Discourse in Magic.

Join us for a unique twist as Eric Leclerc takes over as host to interview the usual host, Jonah Babins, on his own podcast, Discourse in Magic. This engaging conversation uncovers Jonah’s journey into the world of magic and podcasting, revealing how his love for both has enriched his life. Jonah shares his early experiences with magic, sparked by his uncle’s D lights, and reflects on how podcasts have become a source of daily inspiration and learning. Meanwhile, Eric, who is new to podcasting, talks about how this medium has transformed everyday activities like driving and working out into enjoyable experiences. Together, they explore the irresistible allure of magic and the power of podcasts. As we travel back in time, Jonah takes us through his formative years at the Sorcerer’s Safari Magic Camp in Canada, where he forged lasting friendships and found mentorship under Ben Train. These experiences, from summer camps to visits to magic shops, marked a transition from youthful fascination to a deeper appreciation of the craft. The episode also explores Jonah’s entrepreneurial journey, where he transformed his passion for magic into a successful career. He recounts the pivotal moment that led him to pursue magic professionally and shares the role his family played in supporting his dreams, even when they had their reservations. Finally, listen in as Jonah shares insights into building a successful business in the magic industry. From mastering marketing strategies and building an online presence to embracing the power of mastermind groups, Jonah emphasizes the importance of community and support. The episode also touches on overcoming ego and the significance of work ethic and motivation in achieving success. Throughout, Jonah reflects on the evolving nature of modern magic, the impact of social media, and the joy of mentoring emerging magicians. With heartwarming stories and practical advice, this episode is a testament to the enduring passion for magic and the transformative power of community and creativity. Entrepreneurial Journey in Magic Industry We take a journey through the early career of a magician who transitioned from working at a day camp to performing magic full-time. It all began with a pivotal moment in 2011 when, despite an initial lack of interest in marketing and business, he realized the potential of pursuing magic as a profession after seeing a poorly received magic show at a camp. With the encouragement and help of his entrepreneurial mother, he contacted 150 camp directors and started booking magic workshops, initially underpricing his services due to inexperience. Over the years, he expanded his network, refined his approach, and grew his summer business to earn significant income. By the time he graduated with a math degree in 2016, he had already established a successful career in magic, choosing to follow his passion rather than a traditional path in mathematics. Marketing Strategies and Business Success We explore the journey of building an online presence and leveraging it for success in marketing and business. Starting with inspiration from various marketing podcasts, I highlight the power of having a large audience to sell products or services, even without a clear initial idea of what those might be. Through experimenting with affiliate links and merchandise, I learned the value of sharing knowledge and creating content. During the COVID pandemic, I recognized an opportunity to expand into virtual shows and workshops, which led to the development of the Magicians Accountability Group in Quarantine (MAGIQ). This chapter illustrates how perseverance and seizing opportunities can lead to unexpected growth, eventually establishing a coaching and mastermind format that has continued to evolve since its inception during the pandemic. The Importance of Work Ethic  We discuss the intricacies of work ethic and motivation, particularly in the context of pursuing a career in magic. I share personal anecdotes about the expectations set by my parents and the necessity of having a strong work ethic to succeed. We examine the idea that understanding how to work hard is a learned skill, emphasizing the importance of having a compelling ‘why’ behind one’s efforts. The conversation touches on the concept of motivation being driven by either the pursuit of rewards or the avoidance of negative outcomes. We discuss setting goals that are both selfish and selfless, to find a balance that drives success. Additionally, I express confusion over people who desire growth in their careers but do not take actionable steps, highlighting the necessity of effort, such as consistently creating content or trying new strategies. Mentions https://ericleclerc.com/ https://www.instagram.com/magic4yourbrain/   The post UNO REVERSE: Jonah Babins gets interviewed by Eric Leclerc appeared first on Discourse in Magic.