Smoke 'Em If You Got 'Em Podcast

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit smokeempodcast.substack.comWelcome new subscribers to Smoke ‘Em If You Got ‘Em! We are super-stoked that Substack included our little pod as a Featured Publication. Quick lay of the land: Free subscribers get notified whenever we post an episode, and can enjoy 45-60 minutes of a free preview. Paid subscribers get our undying love and the full fig — including pop-culture recommendations and the juiciest bits of the conversation — along with the ability to comment in our active and (may we say) impressive Smoke ‘Em community, plus exclusive access to bonus episodes and solo ventures, like Sarah’s Friday-night “Smoking Diaries” and Nancy’s Sunday morning “Pie Talk.” We have Zoom hangs every first Sunday of the month for paid subscribers, where we enjoy laughter, civic debate, and (occasionally) wigs. Now, as they say, on with the show …We start with the sad tale of Alec Baldwin and the Rust gun tragedy, then discuss a blockbuster New York Times magazine story on the inner lives and private turmoil of police in Louisville, where Breonna Taylor was killed. It’s a rich, empathic portrait that likely wouldn’t have appeared last year, just like recent stories on the probability of a lab leak in China and the futility of masking. Is culture taking a turn? Chicago mayor Lori Lightfoot was ousted the evening after we recorded this episode; it could be a referendum on violent crime. Here at Smoke ‘Em, we aim to humanize stories that get ripped of context and nuance by an ever-churning media machine and its social-network accomplice. The NYT story — which is, full disclosure, written by one of Sarah’s closest friends, journalist Jamie Thompson — gives us an opportunity to sympathize with another side, and prompts stories about lost love (for Sarah) and Portland chaos (for Nancy).Plus: Sarah squicks out “moderate MILF” Nancy by telling her about a massage challenge on the latest episode of MILF Manor; the etymology of “cuffing season”; the secret allure of Alabama; blue eye shadow, Y/N? And much more!Reminder: Zoom hang this Sunday, 3/5, 8pm ET/5pm PT, for paid subscribers. Link will be emailed on the day-of!

We are talking feeding people this week, and Portland, and who counts as family. Yes that’s the little one in the pic, and me in the ‘stache. What a weird party that was! We wound up in a long conversation with an editor from another city, a visitor who tried to laser-beam you with his charm. “Don’t you know the effect you have on men?” he later said, to one of us, a line I found kind of hilarious, like something from a book called, “Ninety Things To Say To A Woman That Might Get You in Her Pants.” The guy’s life later went up in flames, and pretty publicly. I’m not throwing a log on that fire but will say, I was less than surprised.We are also talking this week’s literati flare-ups (the stealth editing of Roald Dahl, the never-ending crusade against of J.K. Rowling, dust-up #609 at the Times) and their opposite, the people who come to your aid. Why not also feed them some chicken?Episode notes:“Taking My Ex Back In (for His Own Good),” by Nancy Rommelmann (NYT Modern Love)I misspoke when I said You Must Remember This is Kat Rosenfield’s second book. It’s her fifth! But the second I’ve read, and which I love love love love love.Paloma-cam during Kat Rosenfield’s party for No One Will Miss HerMy Smoke ‘Em If You Got ‘Em partner, Sarah Hepola, went on record saying “The Witch Trials of J.K. Rowling” will be the Podcast of the YearI think we are all coming to realize that late 2020/early 2021 was a time when certain segments of the media and the public-at-large became absolutely possessed with a desire for the blood of their colleagues. I’ve written and talked about Donald G. [I accidentally said “J.”] McNeil Jr. a dozen times. He and Andy Mills, an original creator of the NYT’s “The Daily” as well as its once-crown jewel podcast “Caliphate,” were both ushered out of the Times in February 2021. McNeil now writes on Medium, and Andy is working with Bari Weiss’s The Free Press, including on “The Witch Trials of J.K. Rowling.” Good work will out. And speaking of not canceling people…Katie Herzog and Jesse Singal update the NYT flame-wars on the most recent episode of Blocked & Reported, “Times Wars, Episode IX: The Normies Strike Back.”Signs of the tide shifting? Penguin Random House to publish 'classic' Roald Dahl books after censorship criticism, by Theara Coleman (The Week) “NPR to Cut 10% of Its Staff,” by Katie Roberson (NYT)Hoisin ChickenThis recipe is very easy to double or triple. Cooking time will depend on the size of the chicken thighs and how many you have in the pan.* 8 chicken thighs, skin on* Salt and pepper* 3/4 cup hoisin sauce, Lee Kum Kee brand preferred, thinned out with 3 - 4 tablespoons soy sauce Preheat oven to 375F.Salt and pepper the chicken thighs on both sides and place them, skin side up, on a rack inside your baking pan or sheet. The rack will prevent the thighs from sitting in the cooking juices and becoming less crisp. No problem if you don’t have a rack! Bake until chicken skin starts to brown, about 25 minutes. Pour and brush on hoisin-soy mixture. Make about another 20 - 25 minutes, until thighs are nicely shellacked.The drippings from the pan can be poured as-is over rice or, better, heat them in a small saucepan until somewhat reduced and yummier, about 5 minutes.Serve chicken with sticky rice and a cucumber salad: peeled and seeded cucumbers, sliced and mixed with rice wine vinegar and a large pinch of sugar and a smaller pinch of salt. Add some chopped fresh basil, mint or cilantro if you’re feeling fancy.Three ways to make sticky rice! (Also called glutinous rice, sushi rice, and sweet rice.) I have not had great luck making sticky rice in the rice cooker, and have never tried the microwave method. Let me know if you do!Everything is more delicious when you become a paid or free subscriber This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit smokeempodcast.substack.com/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit smokeempodcast.substack.comTwo recent controversies prove the power of words, and also our country’s near-hopeless division. Publishers of Roald Dahl’s children’s classics, including Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, were busted making edits that removed “offensive” passages for modern audiences, an effort spearheaded by a group called Inclusive Minds (“consultants and campaigners,” according to their website). Nancy and Sarah sift through the reactions and dangerous implications, and wonder: What are we asking — or rather, enforcing — that our children give up? Could it be delight?Meanwhile, Nancy and Sarah are loving a new podcast from The Free Press, “The Witch Trials of J.K. Rowling.” Hosted by Westboro Baptist Church apostate Megan Phelps-Roper, and masterminded by exiled The Daily producer Andy Mills, the show interviews the author born as Joanne Rowling and reveals her to be sympathetic, deep-thinking, and (of course) complicated. The show has only dropped two episodes, but it’s Sarah’s current vote for Podcast of the Year. Whatever you think of Rowling (and can anyone tell us how to pronounce her last name?), this podcast is an extraordinary peek into a pressing controversy — not that such value would ever stop the haters.Also: Sarah sings the Oscar Meyer jingle. MILF Manor gets a new MILF. Who is Nancy’s vote for the most popular humorist of the past 50 years? (Hint from Sarah: It’s not the most popular humorist.) And: Is Dave Barry funny? A debate.

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit smokeempodcast.substack.comEarlier this week, nearly 200 New York Times contributors sent an open letter to the “paper of record,” excoriating its coverage on trans issues. GLAAD followed suit, with a letter that also made clear demands. The Times responded with a cool head. The end, right?Nope. The ensuing drama consumed journo Twitter, and by Friday, more than a 1,000 contributors signed the open letter. What’s at stake is not merely the paper’s coverage of trans issues (which is far deeper and more rigorous than the open letter suggests), but the nature of journalism itself: Should it describe the world as it is, or as it should be? What role should activism play in today’s newsroom? Are the people who signed the letter on the right side of history, or the wrong side of history? And what if history actually has no sides?This week we devote the entire episode to this impassioned, twisty, and personally high-stakes conversation for us as journalists. We talk about fear, careerism, peer pressure, along with friends who signed the list and those who conspicuously did not. Cameo appearances by: Emily Bazelon, Judd Apatow, Michael Powell, Matt Welch (duh), Bari Weiss, Alex Pareene, Taylor Sheridan, and someone named Peppermint.Also: Will Nancy pen the Moderate MILF manifesto? Why is Sarah on the bacon Wikipedia page? Plus, love and romance in our hot boxes.

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit smokeempodcast.substack.comThe Internet knows him as “Chartthrob” and “Map Daddy,” but once upon a time, Sarah knew him as “Snackwells,” the boy-genius politics editor at Salon and sweetheart of a co-worker who bought her a daily Diet Dr Pepper and picked stray vegetables out of everything he ate. The one and only Steve Kornacki joins the pod to talk about his stratospheric popularity as elections analyst on MSNBC (“I don’t fully understand what happened”), the Super Bowl and sports betting, his #1 Spotify listen of 2022 (Bobby Vee, anyone?), his famous Gap khakis, and his fantastic new podcast, “The Revolution,” tracking the rise and fall of Newt Gingrich, whose Nineties’ tenure as Speaker of the House had an outsized influence on American politics.In the bonus: Sarah and Nancy discuss Rihanna’s fumble of a halftime performance: the pregnancy reveal, the amazing dancers who (unintentionally?) looked like sperm, and the bizarre moment when Rihanna sniffed her own crotch. (Sarah has some hot sports opinions about that one.) But there was one performer going for broke during that show, and we adore her. Also: The Waco siege, 30 years later, and will a Netflix show make Nancy change her mind about Glass Onion?

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit smokeempodcast.substack.comIn 2021, actor Armie Hammer’s career crashed into the side of a mountain. The recently separated star had lined up a series of high-profile projects when an anonymous Instagram account called the House of Effie began posting eye-popping messages of violent sexual fantasy that purported to be from Hammer. “I am 100% cannibal,” read one. More women joined the fray, bringing accusations of coercion, power abuse, and eventually rape. The Internet, no surprise here, was riveted. Cue a cascade of clickbait articles and a high-profile documentary, but along the way, there was one side of the story curiously missing: Armie Hammer’s.Journalist Jamie Kirchick changed that with his barnburner new profile, “Armie Hammer Breaks His Silence,” recently published in Graydon Carter’s magazine, Air Mail. Kirchick comes on the podcast to talk about a scandal gone wild, a media in absentia, kink shaming, the parts of those salacious messages we never got to see, the problem with the court of public opinion, and whether consent can ever be taken back. It’s a hell of a story.In the bonus: gamifying your healthcare, Nancy reveals her big TV commercial break, how to eat a cupcake, MILF Manor gets real (silly), the brilliant and controversial third episode of HBO’s The Last of Us, and a whole bunch of hotness in our hot boxes.

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit smokeempodcast.substack.comWhat up with the language police? Nancy and Sarah take on the one-percent who insist on scrubbing the mundane (“he,” “she,” “the”) and the arcane (“graybeard”?) from our mouths on the off-chance the words cause harm or feelings of exclusion. Language is shape-shifting, and good communication aims toward inclusion, but who does it help when we replace basic words with the un-fun, the opaque, and the workshopped? Sarah and Nancy may disagree on how to pronounce Latinx (“Lah-TEENix”? “LaTINKS”?) but agree with Substacker Rob Henderson when he writes that “only the affluent can afford to learn strange vocabulary, because ordinary people have real problems to worry about.” Speaking of language, New York Times Opinion writer and former head of the Times Book Review Pamela Paul revisits the novel American Dirt and its author Jeanine Cummins, both fed to the cultural appropriation fires of 2020. More than a hundred writers wrote an open letter denouncing Cummins to Oprah Winfrey (who’d made American Dirt an Oprah pick), and such campaigns have left publishers running in fear, but the public? They made the book a bestseller. Plus: Nancy and Sarah on deep-fried anything, the legacy of Tom Wolfe (the best American novelist on the subject of “status”) and some cracking 20th-C essays about the sexual revolution, a time when “finding yourself” left many people lost.In the bonus: Sarah takes us to MILF Manor, while Nancy talks about her mom and memory loss, wishing a pox on those who prey on the elderly. An update on journalist Felicia Sonmez, star of the 2022 melodrama, “As the Washington Post Turns.” Then it’s into the hot boxes, of which Sarah’s appears to be gushing lava, lots and lots of lava … And we tease our next guest. You may call him “Map Daddy”; we call him friend.Please note! Zoom hangs for paid subscribers will be the first Sunday of each month. We gather THIS SUNDAY, Feb 5, at 8pm ET/5pm PT. We’ll send a Zoom link the day-of. Will Sarah wear a wig? Will Nancy wear a halter? Find out.Come for the deep-fried Oreos, stay for the MILF Manor recap and straight talk. Isn’t it time to become a paid or free subscriber?

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit smokeempodcast.substack.comWe discuss a viral advice column titled “You Fat-Shamed Your Beautiful Girlfriend.” It begins with a letter from someone wrestling over how to handle a partner’s weight gain. The advice giver’s clap-back (“If your girlfriend wrote into this column with this story, I would tell her she should break up with you”) prompts an antic conversation about fat, shame, sexual desire, pharmaceutical interventions like Ozempic, integrity, and the long relationship we have with our own bodies.Also: Update on a Twitter spat, more philosophical musings on sex with a dead chicken (of course), and we share a dissenting opinion from a listener (and mother) on last week’s episode about “All Gas No Brakes” host Andrew Callaghan, accused of being a “sexual pest.” Sarah points out she’s not here to talk about how things should be, but how they are. Nancy knows you can never protect your kids enough, from the tiniest mean glance to a plane crash. What you can do, she argues, is to teach them good survival skills and tell them it’s absolutely fine to say no.In the bonus episode: MILF Manor may be a sign of cultural collapse, but the second episode sure was fascinating! We revisit a 1980 Stockard Channing movie about an “ugly ducking” who transforms into a hottie with a mind for revenge. Nancy gets hooked on an Israeli television show, and Sarah rediscovers the brilliance of a 1994 movie along with the hotness of Ralph Fiennes.

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit smokeempodcast.substack.comNancy and Sarah dive back into the faked death of romance novelist Susan Meachan, thanks to journalist Ellen Barry, who did a deep dive in the NYT. After learning details of her (actual) life, do we have any more empathy for Meachan and her seduction by and escape into Romancelandia?Next we look at the scandal around Andrew Callaghan, YouTube star of All Gas No Brakes who was hit with allegations of sexual coercion on the eve of his HBO debut. Nancy is suspicious of the timing, as well as the request for money from one of his accusers. Sarah thinks this kerfuffle raises good questions about coercion, alcohol, and sex. They both found Callaghan’s four-minute apology video like a bingo card of social-justice catch phrases.Also: Why can’t we stop talking about sex with dead chickens? And Sarah gets dinged on Twitter by someone accusing her of “agreeing with the boss’ wife about Justice Kavanaugh.” Nancy is confused. Isn’t she Sarah’s boss?In the bonus, it’s onto (into?) the new reality series MILF Manor, which Sarah is mainlining and whose title Nancy can barely bring herself to say. The journalistas took the “Are You a MILF?” quiz. We reveal who scored higher, what’s in our hotboxes, and news about upcoming live events.And speaking of events! Nancy and Sarah will be appearing onstage with Meghan Daum and Sarah Haider (of A Special Place in Hell) on Thursday June 22, as part of the University of Austin’s 2023 Forbidden Courses event. Despite the name of the university, the event is actually being held in Dallas, 7:30-9pm central, at the Old Parkland.For full episodes, go to our Substack page: https://smokeempodcast.substack.com/podcast

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit smokeempodcast.substack.comNancy has been enjoying the audiobook of Harry Windsor’s blockbuster memoir, “Spare,” but Sarah thinks a more fitting title might be “Spare Me.” They debate the controversial figure of Prince Harry, grieving son in a golden cage but also emblem of millennial entitlement and empty social-justice activism. Sarah has a problem with the ghostwriter’s heavy hand, while Nancy has a problem with cruise ships, which becomes relevant when the terrific film “Triangle of Sadness” (which takes place on a boat) prompts a debate on 21st-century American masculinity. Do men still know how to build a fire? What about fixing an engine? And just how manly is it to get frostbite on your penis — and is that even possible?In the bonus: We discuss the life of the late Lisa Marie Presley, who grew up as American royalty, and how far (if at all) she was allowed to fly from the golden cage. Were her marriages to troubled men an attempt to help the troubled father who died when she was nine? Plus, we revisit lustrous moments from the Golden Globes and — again! — Sarah and Nancy disagree about an award-winning film.