
That Relationship Show
The Couch offers an opportunity to hear experienced marriage counselors share what they've learned from decades of working with couples. If you and your partner are disconnected, unable to talk without arguing or wondering if you can save your relationship, Deb and Nao can help. Their warm, engaging way of talking about EFT can offer hope when all seems lost in your relationship.
Latest episodes

Nov 3, 2019 • 1h 12min
For Therapists Only: The Certification Blues
In this episode Deb & Nao talk about the challenges & rewards of pursuing certification in EFT. They interview newly certified therapist Elizabeth Moitoza LICSW about her experience, and offer tips and support for those in the process.

Oct 20, 2019 • 1h 12min
What Women Need
Deb and Nao welcome New York Times Bestselling author Dr. Emily Nagoski, expert on women's sexual wellbeing. Using warmth and humor, she covers everything women need to know--from the impact of stress on women's health and well-being to modern day romance novels to the importance of bringing joy and pleasure to our lives.

Sep 15, 2019 • 1h 14min
The Best Tools for Couples & Families
Deb & Nao welcome Master Trainer George Faller to share his wisdom about how EFT can best help couples and families. From his experiences as a firefighter during 9/11 to working with couples impacted by trauma to training hundreds of therapists in the model, George brings his unique brand of warmth and humor to The Couch.

Aug 24, 2019 • 1h 12min
Emotionally Focused Family Therapy
Deb & Nao interview Trainer and Co-Director of ICEEFT Gail Palmer, MSW, RMFT. From her early collaboration with Sue to her decades working with families and teaching EFT to students and therapists, Gail brings her warmth and wisdom to The Couch. She explains how the model of EFT is used with families to promote connection and growth throughout the lifespan.

Aug 3, 2019 • 1h 1min
The Other Side of the Couch with Lori Gottlieb
Deb & Nao welcome therapist, New York Times bestselling author and former Hollywood writer Lori Gottlieb to The Couch to talk about her new book Maybe You Should Talk To Someone. The book chronicles her own therapy and the ways it dovetails with four of her clients' stories. Funny, engaging and deeply personal, Lori's stories inspired us to reveal some of our own.

Jul 3, 2019 • 34min
Helpful Tips for Individuals
In this bonus episode, Deb & Nao talk about Emotionally Focused Individual Therapy, and offer practical tips to help listeners learn how to identify, regulate and lean in to emotions. These skills empower us to have the kinds of relationships that fulfill us---whether with a partner, a co-worker, a child or a friend.

Jun 16, 2019 • 1h 15min
Competing Attachments
From Las Vegas, arguably the capital of competing attachments, Nao & Deb welcome Dr. Anabelle Bugatti. Host of We Heart Therapy, Anabelle talks about what it's like to work with couples in Sin City, where there is so much that can threaten attachment. From Mama's Boys to pleasure-seeking, the episode covers the gamut of EFT in action.

May 26, 2019 • 1h 12min
Everything You Wanted to Know About Sex (but were afraid to ask)
Deb & Nao welcome renowned psychologist and expert on sexuality in relationships Dr. Barry McCarthy. In this candid and often explicit interview, Dr. McCarthy tells us why sex should be a team sport, how desire can be rekindled and when we should engage in foreplay. This is not an episode to listen to with your kids in the car, but definitely worth sharing with your partner!

May 5, 2019 • 53min
The Transformative Power of Empathy
From Ireland via San Francisco, Deb & Nao welcome Marriage & Family therapist Fiachra Figs O'Sullivan. With his unique brand of warmth, humor and Irish charm, Figs shares his passion for helping others heal from emotional pain. He his therapist wife Teale run the company empathi.com, aimed at democratizing mental health care.

Mar 24, 2019 • 1h 2min
The Echoes of Trauma
Deb & Nao welcome Dr Susan Simonds from Moscow, Idaho to talk about a passion of hers; the intersection of trauma, relationships and healing through creative expression. She explains how forgetting the orange juice can be a blip on the radar or a nuclear meltdown, depending on our trauma history.