The Resilient Recruiter

In this discussion, Matt Alder, a talent acquisition futurist with over 25 years in recruitment technology, dives into the transformative role of AI in recruitment. He highlights the rapid changes in the field and warns against the pitfalls of unchecked experimentation. Matt emphasizes the importance of trust and human skills—networks, relationships, and influence—as essential for recruiters. He explores AI's current benefits, like enhancing candidate experience and the emergence of autonomous candidate agents, painting a picture of a fascinating future in recruitment.

For 20 years, Maria Sinclair watched other people get promoted while she stayed stuck in her own head. She questioned whether she belonged, worried about how she was perceived, and doubted nearly every decision she made.Then Covid hit, and everything changed.Cobalt furloughed 45 of its 55 UK staff, leaving only ten people working. Maria picked up multiple desks, supported clients across new specialisms, and kept the operation steady during one of the most challenging periods the industry had ever seen. That moment revealed a capability she had never fully recognised in herself.Today, Maria is the Managing Director of Cobalt, ranked 49th in the UK’s Hot 100 list based on GP per employee. After 23 years with the business, she has worked her way up from recruitment consultant to MD while helping build a culture known for tenure, trust, and consistent performance.In this conversation, Maria explains how she built confidence later in her career, why she focuses on job quality over call volume, how openness about challenges like perimenopause strengthens team culture, and how Cobalt hires for work ethic and trains for market expertise.If you have ever doubted whether you are ready to lead, this episode shows what becomes possible when you start backing yourself.You’ll learn:• How Maria entered recruitment after being rejected eight times• Why confidence took decades to develop• How she navigated the 2009 crash, Brexit, and Covid• Why the COVID-19 crisis became the turning point in her leadership• The cultural principles that support performance• Why job quality matters more than call volume• How Cobalt assesses work ethic and validates billings• The patience required to train recruiters from other sectors• Why expertise beats activity in the built environmentTimestamps:[6:00] Breaking into recruitment after eight rejections[18:29] The confidence struggle[24:09] Navigating economic shocks[25:36] The Covid moment[28:49] The promotion that shifted everything[30:44] Being open about perimenopause[36:17] Culture and retention[41:37] KPIs that matter[50:18] Hiring for work ethic[54:29] Training recruiters from other sectors[58:13] Becoming an industry expert[1:01:06] Closing rate problems and what they meanGuest Bio:Maria Sinclair is the Managing Director of Cobalt, operating across the built environment with offices in the UK, Germany, and the US. Cobalt ranks 49th in Recruiter Magazine’s Hot 100 list based on GP per employee. Maria has been with Cobalt for 23 years and was appointed UK MD in January 2024.

What does it take to raise your fees, win better clients, and rebuild your recruiting business from the ground up?In this episode, I speak with Randee Staats, founder of S4 Search Partners, who went from losing everything — $250K in debt and $500 left — to rebuilding a seven-figure desk within the following year.Randee explains the decisions that nearly destroyed his business, the turning point that pushed him to rebuild, and the systems that rebuilt his confidence, his pipeline, and his profitability.He also breaks down the daily discipline, fee structure changes, and point-based productivity system that helped him win better clients and finally charge what he is worth.In This Episode, You'll Learn:How Randee launched his firm from his parents' basementThe moment he landed a billion-dollar clientThe scaling mistake that cost him $250KWhy he walked away from a $600K accountHow he raised his fees to 20 to 25 percentThe script he uses to convert email replies into meetingsThe daily BD rhythm that rebuilt his pipelineThe point system that keeps him consistentHow he broke seven figures the year after rebuildingEpisode Highlights02:49 Discovering recruiting05:04 Launching from the basement09:35 The Jim Carrey check13:15 Early success and hidden risks14:18 The scaling mistake17:16 The turning point23:10 The weekly client call script42:00 The wake-up call44:14 New rules for pricing46:47 The $30K placement50:21 Daily planner51:22 BD rhythm1:03:09 The point system1:07:33 Breaking seven figuresGuest BioRandee Staats is the founder of S4 Search Partners, based in New Jersey. He launched the firm in 2015, scaled a major national account to $600K, and later rebuilt his business from $500 and $250K in debt to seven-figure billings using a disciplined daily system and a new fee structure.LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/randee-staats/Connect with Mark WhitbyFree 30-minute strategy call: recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-sessionLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mwhitby/Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Why do some recruiters struggle for traction while others build demand engines that bring clients to them? My guest, Tom Froggatt, made that shift after three days of calling 600 people with no results.Tom is the founder of Singular, a biotech search firm and one of Europe's leading specialists. Six months after launching the business, he hit a breaking point that changed everything. Instead of doubling down on cold calls, Tom built a system that creates predictable client demand. Today, a £4,000 campaign can generate £55,000 in revenue, and his business runs on consistent inbound opportunities.In this conversation, Tom explains how he replaced cold outreach with a system, how he uses content and insight reports to convert strangers into six figure clients, and why the volume required for effective marketing is far higher than most recruiters expect.In this episode, you'll discoverWhy Tom realised he did not have a BD problem but a systems problemHow three days of rejection created a turning pointHow podcasting connected him with senior biotech leadersWhy each client is worth £55,000 in 12 monthsHow his insight report converts inbound retained workWhy most recruiters underestimate the required volumeHow thinking like a tech founder beats thinking like a traditional recruiterEpisode Highlights[6:44] Starting Singular in a windowless office and the six-month reality check [19:16] Three days, 600 calls, zero results. The moment everything changed [21:22] Launching "Careers in Discovery" and building relationships with senior biotech leaders [22:05] The podcast guest who walked Tom straight to HR and introduced him on the spot [36:44] The mindset shift from "winning clients" to building revenue-generating systems [42:16] Why each client is worth £55,000 in 12 months and what that means for ad spend [49:30] The exact funnel. Free insight reports that convert strangers into six-figure partnerships [54:14] Why Tom gives away £2,500 worth of market data for free and why it works [58:47] How to identify real client pain points without guessing [1:03:09] Why reverse engineering problems to fit your service always fails [1:10:27] The volume truth. Why 200 outreach attempts are not nearly enoughIf you want to build predictable client demand without relying on cold outreach, this episode will show you how.Guest BioTom Froggatt is the founder of Singular, a biotech search and talent company specialising in early drug discovery roles across Europe. Before Singular, Tom spent ten years at S3, where he opened their New York office at age 25. He is also the host of the Careers in Discovery podcast with more than 300 episodes.Connect with TomLinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/tom-froggatt Singular: https://book.singular-biotech.com/webVersapia websiteConnect with MarkFree strategy call: recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/mwhitbySubscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Why do some recruitment founders build seven-figure businesses while others plateau despite working just as hard? My guest, Ollie Scott, discovered growth doesn't come from hustle alone. It comes from strategic bets.Ollie is the founder of Unknown, a talent growth consultancy that's worked with over 500 brands including Nike, Apple, and Disney. Six years ago, he started with £13,000 on a credit card and one mission: build the opposite of every recruitment company he'd ever seen.In this episode, Ollie shares his journey from rebellion to revenue. You'll hear why differentiation always beats trying to be the best, how scaling from 8 to 18 people nearly destroyed his business, and the three strategic bets he used to rebuild.You’ll Learn:• Why trying to be the “best” agency is a losing strategy• How Unknown defined a point of view clients cared about• What went wrong scaling from 8 to 18 people• Why profit is the safety net that enables innovation• How to build a productized recruitment offering• Why freelance talent pools are the future of recurring revenue• How recruiters can monetise M&A intelligence• How to price buy-side advisory at six-figure feesEpisode Timestamps:[4:05] Selling suits to James Caan’s recruitment firm[10:23] Launching Unknown with £13,000 on a credit card[15:36] Naming strategy and brand distinctiveness[18:26] Writing a breakup letter to recruitment companies[21:44] Why rebellion works early but can’t scale[36:36] Productizing around three ICPs[44:03] Scaling to 18 people destroyed profit margins[48:34] Profit as psychological safety[53:20] Building recurring revenue through freelance talent pools[58:25] Why recruiters have more M&A intelligence than M&A firmsGuest Bio:Ollie Scott is the founder of Unknown, a £3 million talent growth consultancy specialising in the global creative industry. Before launching Unknown, Ollie spent six years at Gemini People, joining the board in his early twenties. Unknown now operates across executive search, freelance talent pools, and M&A advisory for creative agencies.Connect with Ollie:LinkedIn: Ollie ScottWebsite: unknown.mediaConnect with Mark:recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-sessionlinkedin.com/in/markwhitbyInstagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Why do some recruitment business leaders triple their revenue while others plateau despite working twice as hard? My guest, Martin Herbst, discovered the answer the hard way. After hitting rock bottom with burnout, he rebuilt his leadership philosophy from the ground up — and within five years, JobAdder tripled its revenue and client base.Martin is the CEO of JobAdder, one of the world’s leading recruitment technology platforms. Under his leadership, the company has achieved record growth while helping recruiters work smarter without losing the human touch.In this episode, Martin opens up about his personal experience with burnout and shares how he transformed that crisis into a leadership breakthrough. You’ll learn how he built a healthier, more effective approach to scaling a recruitment business one that’s rooted in purpose, values, and vision rather than constant hustle.He also breaks down the exact leadership frameworks that helped JobAdder grow sustainably: how to align your team around a clear long-term strategy, why empathy drives innovation, and how to balance big-picture vision with daily execution.Beyond leadership, Martin dives into how technology and AI are reshaping recruitment. He explains where automation genuinely creates value for recruiters, how to avoid the “AI hype trap,” and why human connection will always be the most powerful differentiator in this business.If you’ve ever struggled with overwhelm, exhaustion, or inconsistent growth, this conversation is a must-listen. Martin’s story is proof that scaling your business doesn’t require sacrificing your health or your values.In this episode, you’ll discover:How burnout became the catalyst for a breakthroughThe daily habits that keep stress and anxiety in checkWhy swimming is Martin’s secret weapon for clarity and focusThe strategy process behind JobAdder’s 5-year growth storyWhy most recruitment leaders underinvest in long-term planningHow to use vision and values as your ultimate growth leversThe fundamental role of AI in recruitment (and where it adds true value)Why the best BD technology is still the telephoneEpisode highlights:[6:44] The burnout story: high anxiety and insomnia that led to stepping away completely[11:17] Morning and evening borders: the simple habits that prevent burnout from creeping back[19:32] How JobAdder tripled revenue in five years, and why it wasn’t about working harder[23:31] Why most recruitment agency owners underinvest in strategy and long-term vision[32:29] Why recruitment might be the profession most immune to AI disruption[48:36] Why automation has created diminishing returns in outreach[53:59] The #1 business development tool that still outperforms AIMartin’s story is both a cautionary tale and an inspiring roadmap for recruiters who want to build high-performing, values-driven businesses that last.Guest Bio:Martin Herbst is the CEO of JobAdder, a global recruitment software company headquartered in Sydney, Australia. Under his leadership, JobAdder has tripled its revenue and client base in five years. Before joining JobAdder in 2020, Martin spent nearly seven years at eBay running their classifieds business in Australia (Gumtree). He also worked at eBay in San Francisco and at the Wall Street Journal online in digital media strategy. Originally from the United States, Martin now lives in Australia.Connect with Martin:LinkedIn: Martin Herbst on LinkedInWebsite: JobAdder.comConnect with Mark:Get your free 30-minute strategy session: recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-sessionMark on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/markwhitbyFollow on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

How does a professional touring musician go from the recording studio to building a $1.2M recruiting firm without ever making a single cold call?In this episode of The Resilient Recruiter, Justin Levinson, founder of Coming Up Creative, reveals how he blended creativity, authenticity, and smart systems to grow a seven-figure recruitment business serving the world’s top entertainment and gaming brands.Justin’s story is proof that success in recruitment isn’t about grinding harder - it’s about thinking differently. You’ll hear how he built a global team, automated outreach without losing the human touch, and turned every conversation into an opportunity.Listen to discover:How creative thinking helped Justin scale to $1.2M in billingsThe “anti-campaign” approach that fills his calendar with warm leadsWhy branding and design matter more in creative industriesHow to build trust, credibility, and inbound clients without cold callsThe diversification strategy that kept his firm thriving through Hollywood strikesIf you’ve ever wondered whether it’s possible to grow a high-performing recruiting business without endless prospecting, this episode is your blueprint.Connect with Justin LevinsonLinkedIn: Justin LevinsonWebsite: Coming Up CreativeConnect with Mark WhitbyFREE strategy session: www.recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-sessionLinkedIn: Mark Whitby

The hardest part of business development isn't effort, it's consistency. Most recruiters know what to do, but struggle to do it every day while juggling clients, candidates, and placements. You know you should be reaching out to prospects daily, but between managing active searches, candidate interviews, and client meetings, your pipeline suffers. The solution? Build automated systems that generate leads while you focus on conversations that close deals.Giorgio Zanella is a go-to-market engineer who's built hundreds of automation workflows for recruiters and founders. Working out of Clay's New York office, he's spent three years mastering the platform and helping recruitment professionals scale their outbound without losing the personal touch. In this behind-the-scenes episode of The Resilient Recruiter, we break down the exact infrastructure, tools, and strategies you need to automate your outbound without sacrificing personalization or sounding like spam.This isn't theory. Giorgio has analyzed thousands of campaigns and knows exactly what separates automation that works from automation that gets ignored. You'll learn why Clay.com has become the number one platform for scaling outreach, how to choose the right tools for email and LinkedIn automation, what infrastructure you actually need (domains, inboxes, and warming protocols), and how to achieve 3-5% response rates on cold email when most people can't break 1%.We cover the complete tech stack: Clay for workflow automation and data enrichment, Instantly for email sequencing, HeyReach for LinkedIn automation, and how these tools work together to create synchronized multichannel campaigns. You'll discover how Clay's "waterfall enrichment" replaces expensive tools like ZoomInfo (saving you $15K+ per year), why LinkedIn outreach gets higher response rates than email (and its hidden limitations), and how to build email infrastructure that protects your domain reputation while scaling to hundreds of sends per day.Giorgio shares the exact formula for safe, sustainable outreach: 3-4 alternate domains, 2 inboxes per domain, 12-15 emails per inbox per day, and the two-week warming process you can't skip. He explains why most recruiters wreck their deliverability by sending from their main domain, how to set up synchronized campaigns where email, LinkedIn, and phone calls happen in coordinated sequences, and why relevance (right person, right time, right message) beats volume every single time.You'll learn what "good" response rates actually look like (spoiler: they're lower than you think, but the ROI is massive), how to calculate return on investment for cold outreach campaigns, and why even a 1% response rate can generate huge returns when your infrastructure costs are minimal. Giorgio breaks down why personalization and timing are more important than blast volume, how to track real-time signals like job changes and promotions to time your outreach perfectly, and the practical first steps to start automating your business development this month.This episode is part of our new course, Automate Your Outreach: How to Generate Client Leads Daily on Autopilot, a four-week implementation program where Mark and Giorgio guide you step-by-step through building your own automation system. Whether you're a solo recruiter trying to scale or an agency owner looking to systematize business development across your team, this conversation gives you the blueprint.Episode highlights:• [00:50] Introducing Giorgio Zanella and the vision behind the "Automate Your Outreach" program• [03:30] What is Clay and why recruiters are using it to automate lead generation• [07:35] The tech stack you actually need: Clay, Instantly, HeyReach (and what to skip)• [12:20] How to replace expensive data tools like ZoomInfo with Clay's "waterfall enrichment"• [18:40] Email vs. LinkedIn outreach: which gets more replies and why• [23:25] How to run synchronized multichannel campaigns (email + LinkedIn + phone)• [31:30] Why personalization and timing beat volume every time• [40:55] Building a bulletproof email infrastructure (domains, inboxes, warm-up rules)• [52:00] What "good" reply rates look like and how to calculate ROI on outreach• [1:10:00] Practical first steps to start automating your BD this monthFor more information or to register for the Automate Your Outreach course, visit recruitmentcoach.com/automateGet your FREE 30-minute strategy call: http://www.recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session/Connect with Giorgio Zanella on LinkedInSubscribe to The Resilient Recruiter on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

Why do some recruiters struggle to break $300K while others hit seven figures in their third year? My guest, Tito Caceres, spotted a $160 billion industry that most recruiters have never even thought about. And he built a thriving business there with nothing but a credit card and relentless hustle.Tito grew up in his family's landscaping business and swore he'd never work in that industry. Ironically, that's exactly where he found his million-dollar niche. After building a career in sales and recruitment, he recognized an opportunity that others had completely missed.In 2021, he launched Bloom Talent Solutions and went all-in. First year? $600K in billings working solo with no agency pedigree. This year, he's on pace for $1.6 million.In this episode, you'll hear how Tito scaled fast by going retained-only, building a transparency system that keeps clients loyal, and creating new income sources beyond placement fees. You'll also hear why he fired clients to achieve clarity, how he packages candidates better than any resume ever could, and what it really takes to dominate a niche market. If you've ever wondered how far focus and follow-through can take a solo recruiter, this is your playbook.EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS:How Tito went from despising the landscaping industry to building a million-dollar recruiting business in itFirst year billings: $600K working solo with no pedigreeWhy Tito walked away from contingent work in year two (and never looked back)The transparency system that keeps clients coming back: weekly reports, bi-weekly meetings, and QBRsPerformance sheets: the mandatory tool that packages candidates better than any resumeHow Tito built AI-driven recruiting systems that put him miles ahead of other recruitersThe subscription model that turns relationships into reliable income before placement fees even come inHiring misfires, family challenges, and the painful lessons that led to clarityRevenue share partnerships with industry consultants that generate referrals on autopilotCONNECT WITH TITO CACERES:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tito-caceres/Bloom Talent Solutions: http://getbloomtalent.comRESOURCES MENTIONED:Clay.comLemlistRecruitment Coach Live SummitClaire Ackers on LinkedInCONNECT WITH MARK WHITBY: Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session/Mark on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mwhitby/Mark on Twitter: https://twitter.com/markwhitbyMark on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TheRecruitmentCoach/Mark on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/recruitmentcoach/SUBSCRIBE TO THE RESILIENT RECRUITERThis episode is a must-listen if you're ready to scale a high-profit, low-overhead search firm.

What if getting fired 20 times wasn’t failure, but the perfect preparation to build something meaningful?In this episode, recorded in London, I talk with James Rowe about what it really takes to build a six-figure solo recruitment practice without office rent, payroll, or management headaches.James shares how experienced recruiters can keep more of what they bill using smart systems, automation tools, and a resilient mindset. If you’ve ever thought about going solo or simplifying your business, you’ll get practical ideas you can apply right away.Timestamps0:00 Intro5:14 Getting fired 20+ times and discovering recruitment13:15 From “terrible employee” to entrepreneur14:01 The economics of solo recruiting18:37 Why general recruiters struggle24:33 Finding balance as a solo recruiter29:02 Email and automation that work40:54 Two email tweaks that boosted replies 20%46:03 Lead magnets that convert at 50%56:06 Why resilience and community matter mostYou’ll learn:How to structure your solo desk to scale without overheadThe automation tools (Clay, ChatGPT, Phantom Buster) that win clientsWhy niche specialists thrive while generalists get squeezedThe “Sent from my iPhone” follow-up trick that increases repliesWhy resilience and community matter more than talentThe Resilient Recruiter brings you weekly conversations with top agency leaders, solo recruiters, and search-firm owners, hosted by Mark Whitby, coach and founder of RecruitmentCoach.com.