
Sounds of SAND
Sounds of SAND invites listeners into a contemplative journey through the infinite cycles of existence - from its raw beauty to its deepest mysteries, from its intricate complexity to its profound wonder. Through intimate conversations, thought-provoking interviews, poetic readings, and carefully curated music, we weave together ancient wisdom with lived experience, creating a tapestry of sound that honors the great questions of being
Latest episodes

Jul 13, 2023 • 1h 19min
#43 I Am a Seed: Bayo Akomolafe and Chief Oluwo Obafemi Fayemi
The full title of today’s episode is: “They thought they buried me; They did not know I am a seed”
In this community conversation from June 2023, SAND co-founders Zaya and Maurizio Benazzo host Bayo Akomolafe and Chief Oluwo Fayemi peeling back the layers of history and tap into the wellspring of resilience that resides within us all. Weaving Bayo's wisdom and Chief Oluwo Obafemi's ancestral knowledge, they enture into this mystical landscape, navigating the intricacies of existence, embracing the profound beauty of the unfolding journey.
Bayo Akomolafe (Ph.D.), rooted with the Yoruba people in a more-than-human world, is the father to Alethea and Kyah, the grateful life-partner to Ije, son and brother. A widely celebrated international speaker, posthumanist thinker, poet, teacher, public intellectual, essayist, and author of two books, These Wilds Beyond our Fences: Letters to My Daughter on Humanity’s Search for Home (North Atlantic Books) and We Will Tell our Own Story: The Lions of Africa Speak, Bayo Akomolafe is the Founder of The Emergence Network and host of the online postactivist course, ‘We Will Dance with Mountains’. He currently lectures at Pacifica Graduate Institute, California and University of Vermont, Burlington, Vermont. He sits on the Board of many organizations including Science and Non-Duality (US) and Ancient Futures (Australia). In July 2022, Dr. Akomolafe was appointed the inaugural Global Senior Fellow of University of California’s (Berkeley) Othering and Belonging Institute. He has also been appointed Senior Fellow for The New Institute in Hamburg, Germany. He is the recipient of the New Thought Leadership Award 2021 and the Excellence in Ethnocultural Psychotherapy Award by the African Mental Health Summit 2022.
Chief Oluwo Obafemi Fayemi Epega is a world-renowned Babalawo and the founder of O.I.D.S.I. (Obafemi Institute for the Divine & Universal Study of Ifa). He was initiated as a priest of Obatala in 2004, and received his Tefa in 2005. He strongly believes that the restoration and preservation of African divine sciences and traditions can restore psychological balance and personal empowerment to all people. A lecturer, teacher and healer and the author of Who is Sambo?, Baba Femi has facilitated Ifa workshops all over the world. He has been invited to share his knowledge and insight on countless radio shows, major universities and colleges. In addition to overseeing more than 400 ceremonies and rituals, Baba Femi has either directly facilitated, or served as the principal liaison for the initiations of more than 50 Ifa and Olorisha priests.
With the blessings of Olodumare, his ancestors, and Ifa, this life has allowed him to fully embrace and experience that which his heart has chosen. He is proud to be an African American man, native Houstonian, descendant of slaves, priest of Ifa, teacher, author, mentor, son, a friend to many, a loving husband, and most importantly, an honorable father.
We invite you to connect further with Bayo Akomolafe in an immersive recording from the SAND co-presentation Three Black Men Trauma, Ritual & the Promise of the Monstrous live in Los Angeles from June 2023 with your guides: Bayo Akomolafe, Orland Bishop, and Resmaa Menakem for nearly six hours of talks, video, and explorations.

Jul 6, 2023 • 1h 4min
#42 The Great Liberation Through Hearing: Lama Lhanang Rinpoche and Mordy Levine
“The past is history. The future is mystery. The present moment is a gift”— Lama Lhanang Rinpoche
Today’s guest are the authors of a new book out on Sounds True, The Tibetan Book of the Dead for Beginners: A Guide to Living and Dying. In this episode we go into Tibetan Book of the Dead’s cultural significance in the West, the West’s death phobic culture, the connections to Dream Yoga, what is meant by the Bardo, the history of the Tibetan Book of the Dead, karma and rebirth, and how their new book can support the living and the dead on our lives.
Venerable Lama Lhanang Rinpoche is a teacher of Vajrayana Buddhism of the Nyingma lineage of Tibetan Buddhism. Born in Tibet, he currently directs the Jigme Lingpa Center in San Diego and teaches throughout the United States and internationally. For more, visit.
Mordy Levine is president of the Jigme Lingpa Center and creator of the Meditation Pro Series that has taught meditation to more than 250,000 people. For more, visit
Topics:
00:00 – Introduction03:10 – Genesis of the Book06:12 – TBD in the West13:24 – Tibetean Dream Yoga22:50 – Death Phobic Culture36:26 – Present Moment Gift39:18 – Role of Hearing and Listening50:58 – Karma and Rebirth

Jun 29, 2023 • 55min
#41 Black Therapists Rock: Deran Young
Hosted by SAND Co-founders Zaya and Maurizio Benazzo
Deran Young is a licensed therapist specializing in racial trauma and legacy burdens. She is also a Co-Author of the New York Times Best Seller, You Are Your Best Thing, a retired military officer, & founder of Black Therapists Rock. Black Therapists Rock is a non profit organization with a network of over 30,000 mental health professionals committed to reducing the psychological impact of systemic oppression and intergenerational trauma. She obtained her social work degree from University of Texas, where she studied abroad in Ghana, West Africa for two semesters creating a high school counseling center for under-resourced students. Deran has visited over 37 different countries and her clinical experience spans across four different continents. Her passion for culture and people has led her to become a highly sought after diversity and inclusion consultant working with companies like BBERG, Facebook, Linked In, and YWCA. She resides in the Washington DC area with her 10 year old son.Topics00:00 – Introduction04:12 – Deran’s Journey12:54 – Joining the Military20:42 – Ghana31:50 – Intergenerational Trauma34:28 – Black Therapists Rock42:24 – Racialized Trauma

Jun 22, 2023 • 53min
#40 Living the Mystery: Shakti Caterina Maggi
Spiritual guide and author, Shakti is known internationally as one of the most authentic and profound voices in contemporary spirituality. Presenting the message of Advaita and non-dual Tantra within a contemporary framework, Shakti offers, with compassion and great clarity, an inner technology for dissolving the contraction of suffering that traditionally accompanies each of our lives. Her invitation is to come to the space of inner peace and unconditional love which resides at the heart of us all.
Her key teachings are the love for transcendence, or spiritual awakening, followed by its deep integration, into everyday living, so that each moment can be met as a precious opportunity for spiritual growth. Her students are left with the joy of an open heart and an authentic sense of freedom within the recognition of our being as one with everything.
Shakti's Course on SAND Dwelling in the Heart
Topics: 00:00 – Introduction02:20 – Awakening to Our True Nature05:21 – Letting Go Language08:04 – Emptiness13:08 – Authenticity15:07 – Experiencing with the Heart20:26 – Staying with the Paradox of Seperation29:52 – Seeing into our Listening37:16 – Nondual Tantra40:20 – Compassion and Suffering50:45 – Coming Up for Shakti

6 snips
Jun 15, 2023 • 1h 7min
#39 Tending Our Inner & Outer Landscapes: Lyla June
Lyla June in this illuminating community conversation with Zaya and Maurizio Benazzo shares ways in which indigenous food systems of the past and present teach us how to relate to our inner and outer world. These highly successful systems have been proven to operate based on respect, reverence, responsibility, and reciprocity.
She explores, among others topics: How can we manifest these qualities within ourselves and into the world? How can ancient wisdom help with modern ills? How does inner life reflect in outer behavior?
Stick around towards the end of the episode for an original song by Lyla.
Dr. Lyla June Johnston is an Indigenous public speaker, artist, scholar and community organizer of Diné (Navajo), Tsétsêhéstâhese (Cheyenne) and European lineages from Taos, New Mexico.
Her messages focus on Indigenous rights, supporting youth, traditional land stewardship practices and healing inter-generational and inter-cultural trauma.
She blends undergraduate studies in human ecology at Stanford University, graduate work in Native American Pedagogy at the University of New Mexico, and the indigenous worldview she grew up with to inform her perspectives and solutions. Her internationally acclaimed presentations are conveyed through the medium of poetry, music and/or speech. She is currently pursuing a doctoral degree at the University of Alaska, Fairbanks in Indigenous Studies with a focus on Indigenous Food Systems Revitalization.
Topics:
00:00 – Introduction
04:02 – Outer Landscapes / Indigenous Food Systems
16:30 – Hunting and Fishing
24:40 – Water
46:40 – Bamboo
56:02 – Inner Landscapes

5 snips
Jun 8, 2023 • 1h 30min
#38 Weaving the Eternal Golden Braid: Donald Hoffman & Rupert Spira
“For now, what is important is not finding the answer, but looking for it.”― Douglas R. Hofstadter, Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid
Donald Hoffman is a cognitive scientist and author of more than 100 scientific papers and three books, including Visual Intelligence: How We Create What We See (W.W. Norton, 2000). He received his BA from UCLA in Quantitative Psychology and his Ph.D. from MIT in Computational Psychology. He joined the faculty of UC Irvine in 1983, where he is now a full professor in the departments of cognitive science, computer science and philosophy. He received a Distinguished Scientific Award of the American Psychological Association for early career research into visual perception, the Rustum Roy Award of the Chopra Foundation, and the Troland Research Award of the US National Academy of Sciences. He was chosen by students at UC Irvine to receive a campus-wide teaching award, and to be included in Who’s Who Among America’s Teachers.
Hoffman studies visual perception, visual attention and consciousness using mathematical models, computer simulations, and psychological experiments. His empirical research has led to new insights into how we perceive objects, colors and motion. His theoretical research has led to a “user interface” theory of perception, which proposes that natural selection shapes our perceptions not to report truth but simply to guide adaptive behavior; this is the subject of his TED Talk entitled “ Do we see reality as it is ?” and of an article in The Atlantic entitled “ The case against reality .” It has also led to a “ conscious realism ” theory of consciousness—which proposes a formal model of consciousness and a new solution to the mind-body problem.
Rupert Spira lives in the UK and holds regular meetings and retreats in Europe and the U.S. In these meetings he explores the perennial non-dual understanding that lies at the heart of all the great religious and spiritual traditions, such as Advaita Vedanta, Kashmir Shaivism, Hinduism, Buddhism, mystical Christianity, Sufism and Zen, and which is also the direct, ever-present reality of our own experience. It is a contemporary, experiential approach involving silent meditation, guided meditation and conversation, and it requires no affiliation to any particular religious or spiritual tradition. All that is needed is an interest in the essential nature of experience, and in the longing for love, peace and happiness around which most of our lives revolve.
Rupert is author of The Transparency of Things – Contemplating the Nature of Experience (2008); Presence, in two volumes: The Art of Peace and Happiness and The Intimacy of All Experience (2012); The Light of Pure Knowing – Thirty Meditations on the Essence of Non-Duality (2014); The Ashes of Love (2016); and Transparent Body, Luminous World – The Tantric Yoga of Sensation and Perception (2017). Forthcoming titles include The Nature of Consciousness – Essays on the Unity of Mind and Matter (2017) and The Essence of Meditation – Being Aware of Being Aware (2017).
Topics:
00:00:00 – Introduction
00:03:30 – What’s at the Your Current Edge?
00:10:35 – Is the Mind the Right Instrument for Exploring Consciousness?
00:18:52 – Resting in the Unknown and What Is Understanding, The Ultimate Science?
00:26:44 – What Does the Ego Want?
00:37:00 – Why Does the One Let Itself Go Unconscious?
00:52:00 – What Are The Limits of Language and Thoughts to Express Consciousness?
00:56:56 – The Amplitudhedron and Beyond
01:02:00 – How Can We Perceive Outside of Spacetime?
01:16:39 – Spiritual Bypassing: Awakening and Transcending
–Previous Episode with Donald Hoffman and Rupert Spira hosted by Simon Mundie: The Convergence of Science and Spirituality | Donald Hoffman & Rupert Spira

Jun 1, 2023 • 60min
#37 Collective Consciousness: Orland Bishop
Orland Bishop is the founder and director of ShadeTree Multicultural Foundation in Los Angeles, where he has pioneered approaches to urban truces and mentoring at-risk youth that combine new ideas with traditional ways of knowledge. ShadeTree serves as an intentional community of mentors, elders, teachers, artists, healers, and advocates for the healthy development of children and youth. Orland’s work in healing and human development is framed by an extensive study of medicine, naturopathy, psychology, and Indigenous cosmologies, primarily those of South and West Africa.
Find more about the Three Black Men: A Journey Into the Magical Otherwise series with Orland Bishop, Resmaa Menakem, and Bayo Akomolafe.
Purchase tickets to watch the North American live web stream and download the recording of this event
Topics:
00:00 – Introduction
03:17 – Part 1, Are We a Part of the Same Reality?
05:12 – ”I Give You My Word”
10:00 – Know Thyself
13:00 – Shared Inner Freedom & Trust
16:13 – Shared States of Consciousness
23:40 – Part 2, What Gives Form to Consciousness
30:44 – Light of Consciousness
37:35 – Collective and Racialized Trauma Questions from the Group
46:10 – Where Does History Go?

May 25, 2023 • 1h 10min
#36 Holographic Being: Mukti
Mukti’s name originates in Sanskrit and is most often translated as “liberation,” a term used in Vedanta and Buddhism much the way the term “salvation” is used in Christianity. Mukti has been the Associate Teacher of Open Gate Sangha since 2004 and has been a student of her husband, Adyashanti, since he began teaching in 1996, when they founded Open Gate Sangha together.
Previously, Mukti was raised and schooled in the Catholic tradition and also studied the teachings of Paramahansa Yogananda for over 20 years—two paths that have greatly informed her journeys into meditation, introspection, and prayer. She holds a master’s degree in Traditional Chinese Medicine, a license in acupuncture, and a Hatha Yoga teaching certification. These backgrounds in body awareness and the healing arts, as well as her years of study with Adyashanti, largely inform her presentation style, her recommended inquiry methods, and her interest in the energetic unfolding of realization and embodiment.
Links:Open Gate Sangha
The Energetics of Awakening Course
The Center for Humane Technology
The One of Us: Living from the Heart of Illumined Relationship (Sounds True) Topics:
00:00 – Introduction
04:41 – Energetics of Awakening
11:45 – Spiritual Bypassing / Shadow / Integration
18:08 – Evolution / Deepening of Mukti’s Teaching
21:29 – Sacredness of Attention in the Attention Economy
30:07 – Importance of Spiritual Community
33:08 – The Spiritual Path of Paradox and the Shared Field of Awareness
50:11 – Holographic Being
55:36 – The Importance of the Fundamentals of Practice
57:59 – Being in a Dharmic Romantic Relationship

May 18, 2023 • 1h 38min
#35 Deep Medicine: Rupa Marya
Dr. Rupa Marya illuminates the hidden connections between our biological systems and the profound injustices of our political and economic systems. What is deep medicine? How can re-establishing our relationships with the Earth and one another help us to heal? The first part of the episode is taken from a live SAND Community Conversation hosted by SAND Co-founders Zaya and Maurizio Benazzo.
The book Inflamed: Deep Medicine and the Anatomy of Injustice by Rupa Marya and Raj Patel is available now.
In the second part of this episode, Rupa is part of a panel hosted by Dr. Gabor Maté as part of The Wisdom of Trauma film launch 'Talks on Trauma' series. This panel discussion is called: “How Trauma Literacy Can Transform Medicine” with MDs: Pamela Wible, Will Van Derveer, Jeffrey Rediger, Dr. Gabor Maté, and Rupa Marya.
You can listen to this entire panel and 32 other talks as part of The Wisdom of Trauma All Access Pass.
Dr. Rupa Marya is a physician, activist, writer, mother, and a composer. She is a Professor of Medicine at the University of California, San Francisco, where she practices and teaches internal medicine. Her work sits at the nexus of climate, health and racial justice. Dr Marya founded and directs the Deep Medicine Circle, a women of color-led organization committed to healing the wounds of colonialism through food, medicine, story, restoration and learning. She is also a co-founder of the Do No Harm Coalition, a collective of health workers committed to addressing disease through structural change. Dr Marya was recognized in 2021 with the Women Leaders in Medicine Award by the American Medical Student Association. She was a reviewer of the American Medical Association's Organizational Strategic Plan to Embed Racial Justice and Advance Health Equity. Because of her work in health equity, Dr. Marya was appointed by Governor Newsom to the Healthy California for All Commission, to advance a model for universal healthcare in California. She has toured twenty-nine countries with her band, Rupa and the April Fishes, whose music was described by the legend Gil Scott-Heron as “Liberation Music.” Together with Raj Patel, she co-authored the international bestselling book Inflamed: Deep Medicine and the Anatomy of Injustice.
Topics:
01:00:00 – Introduction
01:03:16 – Part 1, SAND Community Conversation
01:04:28 – Rupa’s Personal Story and Childhood
01:07:58 – Patterns in Traditional vs. Western Medicine and the Writing of ‘Inflamed’
01:11:10 – Influence of Collective and Individual Trauma of Health
01:12:49 – Colonial Power Structures in Medicine
01:15:39 – Climate Collapse and Global Health
01:17:27 – Indigenous Wisdom of the Interconnected Web of Life
01:21:11 – How Do We Heal in a Balanced Way?
01:31:33 – Part 2, How Trauma Literacy Can Transform Medicine with Gabor Maté
01:35:59 – Pamela Wilbe Introduction
01:38:37 – Jeffery Rediger Introduction
01:41:55 – Will Van Derveer Introduction
01:46:35 – Rupa Marya Introduction
01:51:15 – Jeffrey Rediger Introduction
01:54:17 – Overcoming Incurable Diseases
02:03:45 – The Science of How Society Gets Into Our Cells
02:36:39 – Conclusions

15 snips
May 11, 2023 • 53min
#34 Converations on Complexity: Neil Theise
“We are not walking through the world; we are interwoven with it. In everything we do, we participate in complexity."–Neil Theise
Neil Theise is a professor of pathology at the NYU Grossman School of Medicine. Through his scientific research, he has been a pioneer of adult stem cell plasticity and the anatomy of the human interstitium. Dr. Theise’s studies in complexity theory have led to interdisciplinary collaborations in fields such as integrative medicine, consciousness studies, and science-religion dialogue.
Neil’s new book, which we discuss on the episode, is Notes on Complexity
The book is “An electrifying introduction to complexity theory, the science of how complex systems behave—from cells to human beings, ecosystems, the known universe, and beyond—that profoundly reframes our understanding and illuminates our interconnectedness.”
Mentioned in the episode:
The Source by James A. Michener
Everything Only Looks Like a Thing with Neil Theise at the Science and Nonduality Conference
Chaos: Making a New Science by James Gleick
Introduction to John Conway’s “Game of Life”
Some examples of emergent patterns in the “Game of Life”
Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid by Douglas R. Hofstadter
Topics:
00:00 – Introduction
02:15 – Neil’s Scientific and Spiritual Background
08:29 – Complexity and the Merging of Science and Spirituality
15:48 – Complex vs Complicated
22:14 – Chaos, Fractals, and Emergence
29:48 – Biological Emergence
36:44 – Incompleteness Theorem, Quantum Physics, and Consciousness
47:02 – Complexity and Resiliency
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