If you ask experienced UX practitioners how to stay user-centric, you’ll inevitably hear something about the importance of customer journeys. However, as teams become more mature in their UX practices, the number of journeys being tracked and analyzed has been growing, sometimes faster than teams can manage, leading to scattered and uncoordinated redesign efforts. In this episode, we hear some tips about customer journey management from Kim Salazar of NN/g and Jochem van der Veer of TheyDo, a customer journey management platform. Learn more about the episode guests: Kim Salazar, Senior UX Specialist at NN/g Jochem van der Veer, Co-Founder & CEO, TheyDo / TheyDo.com Related NN/g courses & reports: Customer-Journey Management (full-day / 2 half-days course) Operationalizing CX: Organizational Strategies for Delivering Superior Omnichannel Experiences (142-page report) Related NN/g articles & videos: The Practice of Customer-Journey Mangement (free article) What is Journey Management? (3 min video)

Journey mapping is reaching its limits. Sure, journey maps and mapping work fine at a small project or team level.  But it quickly breaks down when you want to organize around the journey, at a bigger company scale. In order to do this, you need something that goes beyond mapping. But before we dig into what that is, let's look at why journey mapping breaks down: Everyone has their way of doing it; there is no standard. It's hard to get an overview across multiple journeys. Identifying and prioritizing opportunities is a challenge. Tracking progress and impact isn't part of the process. Adoption slows down as most tools aren't made for business users. And many other things... Now, this might sound strange, but I think these are good challenges to have. The fact that these challenges are becoming more pressing is a sign. A sign that the demand for a journey-centric way of working is growing inside companies. Something that we've been hoping and advocating for all these years. So what is the next step... How do you take your journey mapping game to the next level? Well, that's what Jochem van der Veer and I explore in this week's episode. As you'll hear, Jochem has a unique close-up view of how companies use journeys inside their business.  Want to help your company organize around the journey, beyond a single project or team? This conversation will get you heading in the right direction. What I found interesting is that we're seeing the contours of a new business approach and philosophy emerging. Makes me excited! Enjoy the conversation and keep making a positive impact :) - Marc --- [ 1. GUIDE ] --- 00:00 Welcome to episode 167 04:45 Who is Jochem 06:00 Lightning round 08:30 Partnership with TheyDo 12:00 What is Journey Management 13:30 Mapping vs. management 17:15 Journey management stack 19:30 What is the problem 21:00 Product or service-centric 26:15 Maturity levels 32:00 Role of TheyDo 36:15 Governance 38:15 What is the right time 43:00 Journey Management Index 47:45 Closing thoughts --- [ 2. LINKS ] --- https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer/ https://www.theydo.com --- [ 3. JOURNEY MANAGEMENT INDEX ] --- Assess your journey excellence maturity level. Find opportunities for growth. Benchmark yourself against your colleagues and competitors. https://www.servicedesignshow.com/index

Jochem van der Veer, CEO of TheyDo, offers unique insights into journey management's evolution as he predicts trends for 2025. He emphasizes the shift from mapping to management and highlights the role of AI in enhancing customer experience. The conversation dives into the challenges organizations face in scaling these strategies and the importance of data integration. Jochem also teases an exciting upcoming conference, 'Beyond the Map,' underscoring the significance of community and collaboration in advancing service design.