Mat Dryhurst, engaged in important work at the intersection of music and emergent tech, discusses projects like Holly+ AI and web3 interaction, haveibeentrained.com for opting out of Large Language Model training datasets, and the Interdependence podcast. They explore the impact of emergent tech on musicians and the importance of collaboration. Topics include gatekeeping in the music industry, consent and data in generative AI, regulation of web two, copyright challenges in AI models, potential of web three and crypto, and the compelling yet terrifying aspects of AI.
Embracing AI as a creative medium can lead to exciting and innovative outcomes in music.
Gatekeeping and curation are essential in maintaining the uniqueness and quality of cultural products in the overwhelming digital landscape.
Recognizing the value of consent and developing mechanisms to navigate the use of personal data are crucial in creating a fair and ethical AI ecosystem.
Web 3 and crypto offer possibilities for artists to explore alternative paradigms, fostering diverse cultural landscapes beyond mainstream commercial interests.
Deep dives
The Power and Potential of AI in Music
AI in music offers new tools and possibilities for artists to create ambitious work. It allows for exploration and experimentation that was not possible before. While there are concerns and ethical considerations, embracing AI as a creative medium can lead to exciting and innovative outcomes. The abundance of generated content may also lead to a renewed appreciation for music made by humans, with a focus on live performances and unique artistic expressions. The key is to approach AI in music with optimism, recognizing its potential while also staying mindful of the challenges and considering issues of permission and consent.
The Value of Gatekeepers and Curation
Gatekeeping and curation play important roles in filtering and surfacing content in an overwhelming digital landscape. While these terms may carry negative connotations, they are essential in maintaining the uniqueness and quality of cultural products. Curators and gatekeepers can help navigate through the avalanche of content and provide valuable recommendations and insights to audiences. They are instrumental in distinguishing artists and art scenes, shaping culture, and helping to shape the development of AI in music.
The Importance of Permission and Consent in AI
As AI technology progresses, the issue of permission and consent becomes increasingly important. Artists and creators need to have control over how their data is used and should have the right to participate or opt out. Tools and platforms that offer transparency, such as the 'Have I Been Trained?' website, can provide information about data usage and allow individuals to make informed decisions about their involvement. Recognizing the value of consent and developing mechanisms to navigate the use of personal data are crucial in creating a fair and ethical AI ecosystem.
Looking Ahead: Navigating the Changing Landscape of Music Tech
The rapid advancement of technology and AI in music has necessitated adaptations in how artists and creators approach their work. Innovations like personalized algorithms and curated environments can help cut through the noise and provide valuable content and recommendations. Building consent layers for data usage and considering the role of gatekeepers and curation will be important in shaping the future of music technology and maintaining the integrity and uniqueness of cultural products.
The Potential of Web 3 and Crypto
Web 3 and crypto offer a range of possibilities for artists and creators to explore alternative paradigms. The decentralized nature of crypto allows for the construction of economies and collaborations that are distinct from the traditional top-down structures of the mainstream music industry. It provides tools for experimentation and the creation of unique protocols that can serve individual communities and art practices. The goal is to allow artists to have more agency and self-determination in how their work is valued and shared, fostering diverse cultural landscapes that go beyond dominant commercial interests.
The Role of AI and Consent
The emergence of AI raises important questions about consent and control over data. Artists and creators should have the ability to determine how their data is used in AI systems, rather than being subjected to top-down decisions by technology platforms. The idea is to provide individuals with the tools and information needed to make informed decisions about their participation in AI contexts. The goal is to promote a more inclusive and consent-driven AI landscape, where individuals have options and the ability to shape the way their data is utilized.
Creating More Options and Distinction
The ultimate vision is to create an ecosystem where artists and creators have a multitude of options and protocols to choose from, allowing for diverse expressions and cultural practices. This would challenge the dominant monocultural drudgery often perpetuated by mainstream platforms. The goal is to empower individuals to experiment, collaborate, and craft their own protocols and mechanisms for engaging with culture. This approach to culture fosters vibrant and varied cultural landscapes that go beyond the limitations of traditional structures.
When I make a specific effort to talk to people about AI, the responses range from the occasional Chat GPT enthusiast to a much-more-common feigning of indifference, hinting at a deep insecurity and probably-quite-pronounced fear.
This week's guest is perfectly placed to offer a degree of reassurance, or at least a bit more of a balanced view on the coming storm. And make no mistake, it is coming.
Mat Dryhurst, along with Holly Herndon, has long been engaged in important work at the intersection of music and emergent tech, from the Holly+ project with its AI and web3 interaction, to haveibeentrained.com, which enables artists to opt out of Large Language Model training datasets, and the Interdependence podcast.
We discuss aspects of those projects, as well as the more general trends and developments that will impact musicians and creative people over the coming months and years.
This is an important one, covering some really crucial areas, but it's still a highly enjoyable listen... so get involved!
If you're into what we're doing here on the pod then you can support the show on Patreon! There are two tiers - "Solidarity" for $4 a month, which features regular bonus podcasts and extra content. And "Musicality" which for a mere $10 a month gets you all the music we release on Hotflush and affiliate labels AND other music too, some of which never comes out anywhere else.
Plus there's also a private area for Patreon supporters in the Hotflush Discord Server... but anyone can join the conversation there in the public channels, so please do!
