Dolly Chugh, a social psychologist and management professor at NYU Stern, shares insights on navigating challenges to self-identity. She discusses how nostalgia can obscure reality and the importance of preparing for criticism. Emphasizing the roles of guilt and shame as growth indicators, Dolly advocates for a 'good-ish' mindset in leadership. The conversation explores how understanding our emotional responses can foster resilience and improve interpersonal communication, equipping listeners with tools for personal and professional development.
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insights INSIGHT
Nostalgia's Shadow
Nostalgia offers comfort and belonging but isn't the full story.
It can hinder connection by obscuring others' potentially different experiences.
question_answer ANECDOTE
4th of July and Juneteenth
Dolly Chugh was surprised to learn Juneteenth marked slavery's end, almost a century after the 4th of July.
This highlighted how celebrations of independence excluded a significant portion of the population.
insights INSIGHT
Guilt vs. Shame
Guilt is about feeling bad about a specific action, while shame targets one's whole identity.
Guilt prompts action to fix the issue; shame often leads to withdrawal.
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This book offers practical tools to confront difficult issues like sexism, racism, and inequality, helping readers become better allies by acknowledging and addressing their own biases. It emphasizes the importance of a growth mindset in becoming a 'good-ish' person who continuously strives for improvement.
Dolly Chugh: A More Just Future
Dolly Chugh is a social psychologist and management professor at the New York University Stern School of Business where she teaches MBA courses in leadership and management. She was one of six professors chosen from thousands at NYU to receive the Distinguished Teaching Award in 2020 and one of five to receive the Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Faculty Award in 2013.
She has been named an SPSP Fellow, received the Academy of Management Best Paper award, and been named one of the top 100 Most Influential People in Business Ethics by Ethisphere Magazine. Her first book, The Person You Mean to Be has received rave praise from Adam Grant, Angela Duckworth, Liz Wiseman, Billie Jean King, and many others. She is the author of A More Just Future: Psychological Tools for Reckoning with our Past and Driving Social Change.
All of us know that we will be challenged by others. Sometimes how we see ourselves limits what we could do to change our behavior. In this conversation, Dolly and I discuss how we can do better and the mindset and actions that will help us move forward.
Key Points
There’s no such thing as bad weather, only unsuitable clothing.
Nostalgia feels good to many of us, but can get in the way of us seeing the “ands” in situations and experiences.
When we are challenged, especially in the context of identity, our tendency is either to deny, distance, or dismantle.
Feeling of guilt and shame are indicators that there is an opportunity to change. The goal is not to avoid them, but to use them as a starting point for different behavior.
Use values affirmations to give you a booster shot to prepare for the inevitable challenges ahead. These affirmations will help you respond in a more healthy way for everyone.
Resources Mentioned
Dear Good People newsletter by Dolly Chugh
TED talk: How to let go of being a "good" person -- and become a better person by Dolly Chugh
The Person You Mean to Be* by Dolly Chugh
A More Just Future* by Dolly Chugh
Interview Notes
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Related Episodes
The Way Managers Can be Champions for Justice, with Minda Harts (episode 552)
How to Help People Engage in Growth, with Whitney Johnson (episode 576)
How to Solve the Toughest Problems, with Wendy Smith (episode 612)
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