So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast

Ep. 235: Cancel culture, legal education, and the Supreme Court with Ilya Shapiro

Feb 6, 2025

In this discussion, Ilya Shapiro, a senior fellow at the Manhattan Institute and author of "Lawless," shares his insights on the evolving landscape of legal education. He recounts his personal encounters with cancel culture, particularly during his time at Georgetown. Shapiro also analyzes significant Supreme Court cases affecting free speech, including the TikTok ownership debate and Texas' age verification law. He emphasizes the need for open dialogue in academia and reflects on the ideological shifts within elite institutions.

01:19:24

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Episode guests

Ilya Shapiro

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Quick takeaways

Ilya Shapiro discusses how the ideological conformity in elite institutions is being challenged, indicating a potential return to open debate.

The episode highlights Shapiro's personal experiences with cancel culture, illustrating the risks faced by those who voice dissenting opinions in academia.

Shapiro critiques the declining state of law schools, emphasizing the need for diverse viewpoints to safeguard foundational legal principles and academic rigor.

Deep dives

The Impact of DEI on Free Expression

The episode highlights a significant political shift in the approach to Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) initiatives under the current administration, particularly targeting policies implemented by the previous administration. A key discussion revolves around executive orders aimed at dismantling institutional DEI programs, indicating a broader assault on these initiatives across federal agencies. The conversation underscores the implications of these orders for free speech and expression in educational and professional environments, suggesting that such actions may create an atmosphere where individuals feel less free to express themselves. The potential chilling effects on open discourse and academic freedom are illustrated as being a direct consequence of this political maneuvering.

Intro

2min

Controversies and Career Transitions

11min

Navigating Campuses and Free Speech

23min

Navigating Legal Education and Ideological Bias

13min

The Impact of Social Media on Cancel Culture and Policy Changes

2min

Navigating Racial Preferences: Impacts of SFFA on Corporate America

2min

Navigating Speech Protection in Academia Amidst Cancel Culture

2min

Navigating Free Speech and National Security

17min

Navigating Anti-Semitism and Free Speech

8min

Over the years, elite institutions shifted from fostering open debate to enforcing ideological conformity. But as guest Ilya Shapiro puts it, “the pendulum is swinging back.” He shares his firsthand experience with cancel culture and how the American Bar Association’s policies influence legal education. Shapiro also opines on major free speech cases before the Supreme Court, including the TikTok ownership battle and Texas’ age verification law for adult content.

Shapiro is a senior fellow and director of constitutional studies at the Manhattan Institute. He previously (and briefly) served as executive director and senior lecturer at the Georgetown Center for the Constitution and as a vice president at the Cato Institute. His latest book, “Lawless: The Miseducation of America’s Elites,” is out now.

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Read the transcript.

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

02:58 Shapiro’s Georgetown controversy

15:07 Free speech on campus

26:51 Law schools’ decline

40:47 Legal profession challenges

42:33 The “vibe shift” away from cancel culture

56:02 TikTok and age verification at the Supreme Court

01:03:37 Anti-Semitism on campus

01:09:36 Outro

Show notes: