Joca Torres, a product consultant recognized in Marty Cagan’s book, shares his expertise in building product culture during digital transformations. He discusses four core principles: deliver early and often, focus on the problem, deliver results, and adopt an ecosystem mindset. Joca warns against the pitfalls of discovery theatre, emphasizing that true transformation is behavioral, not just technical. He highlights the necessity of executive support and the importance of understanding diverse customer needs for successful product development.
37:38
forum Ask episode
web_stories AI Snips
view_agenda Chapters
menu_book Books
auto_awesome Transcript
info_circle Episode notes
insights INSIGHT
Transformation Is Behavioral Change
Digital transformation is behavioral, not just technical.
Success requires changing people and processes, not just adding digital tools.
insights INSIGHT
Embrace the Ecosystem Mindset
Product teams must serve multiple client types, not just the end user.
Balancing needs of all stakeholders creates more valuable, sustainable products.
question_answer ANECDOTE
Simplifying Gym Check-In Process
Joca handled a gym's request to change check-in process by directly uncovering the real problem: signing waivers.
They delivered a simpler solution by showing the waiver during check-in, satisfying the gym quickly.
Get the Snipd Podcast app to discover more snips from this episode
How Businesses Achieve Breakthrough Growth by Mastering Digital
Marty Cagan
Marty Cagan's "Transformed" explores the evolution of product management and the shift towards a more customer-centric approach. The book emphasizes the importance of building products that truly meet customer needs and solve real problems. Cagan discusses the challenges of scaling product organizations and the need for strong product leadership. He provides practical advice on how to build high-performing product teams and create a culture of innovation. The book is a valuable resource for both aspiring and experienced product managers.
In this episode of The Product Experience podcast, we sit down with Product Consultant Joca Torres, whose work at Gympass is featured in Marty Cagan’s book Transformed. Joca shares the four core principles of successful digital transformation—principles he’s applied in both high-growth startups and century-old corporations.
We unpack what it really takes to shift a company from a delivery mindset to a product-led culture, the traps of discovery theatre, and how empowered teams actually behave.
Key takeaways — Discovery should be fast and focused. Avoid drawn-out discovery phases that confirm what you already know. Good discovery is grounded in existing insights and validated quickly. — The Four Principles of Product Culture:
Deliver Early and Often – Frequent releases drive learning and responsiveness.
Focus on the Problem – Avoid premature solutions. Spend time understanding what really needs solving.
Deliver Results – Products are a means, not an end. Success is measured in impact, not output.
Ecosystem Mindset – Recognise the full range of users and stakeholders. Product is about balancing value across them.
— Transformation is behavioural, not technical. Digital tools are important, but they won’t matter if people and processes don’t change with them. — Executive sponsorship is essential. Cultural shifts only take hold when the leadership team actively supports and models them. — Beware of product theatre. Following the right rituals doesn’t mean you’re creating value. Focus on outcomes, not optics. — Empowered teams are responsible teams. True empowerment means owning the problem, the solution, and the results. It isn’t for everyone.
Chapters 00:00 – The Problem with “Discovery” 01:00 – Introducing Joca Torres 02:30 – A Surprising Need for Digital Transformation 04:00 – What Makes a True Digital Transformation 08:00 – The Four Pillars of Change 13:00 – Thinking Beyond the End User 17:00 – From Feature Delivery to Outcome Ownership
Our Hosts Lily Smith enjoys working as a consultant product manager with early-stage and growing startups and as a mentor to other product managers. She’s currently Chief Product Officer at BBC Maestro, and has spent 13 years in the tech industry working with startups in the SaaS and mobile space. She’s worked on a diverse range of products – leading the product teams through discovery, prototyping, testing and delivery. Lily also founded ProductTank Bristol and runs ProductCamp in Bristol and Bath.
Randy Silver is a Leadership & Product Coach and Consultant. He gets teams unstuck, helping you to supercharge your results. Randy's held interim CPO and Leadership roles at scale-ups and SMEs, advised start-ups, and been Head of Product at HSBC and Sainsbury’s. He participated in Silicon Valley Product Group’s Coaching the Coaches forum, and speaks frequently at conferences and events. You can join one of communities he runs for CPOs (CPO Circles), Product Managers (Product In the {A}ether) and Product Coaches. He’s the author of What Do We Do Now? A Product Manager’s Guide to Strategy in the Time of COVID-19. A recovering music journalist and editor, Randy also launched Amazon’s music stores in the US & UK.
The Product Experience