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The Rich Roll Podcast
Johann Hari On Why You Can’t Pay Attention (& How To Reclaim Your Focus)
Feb 14, 2022
02:20:53
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Quick takeaways
- Our ability to focus and pay attention is declining due to factors like technology, reduced sleep, and chronic stress.
- Multitasking reduces competency, increases mistakes, and lowers intelligence, highlighting the detrimental effects of constant distraction.
- Collective action is needed to address the attention crisis caused by technology, similar to past movements that resulted in positive changes.
- Flow states, characterized by deep focus, are crucial for attention and productivity, but external interruptions disrupt these states.
- Narrowing your focus on one meaningful goal enhances your ability to enter a flow state and maintain attention.
- Social media algorithms have negative impacts on mental health, polarization, and political outcomes, urging the need for collective action and a shift in the business model.
Deep dives
Importance of Defending and Changing Our Attention
The podcast episode discusses the decline of our ability to focus and pay attention, highlighting the need to defend and change our attention. It emphasizes that attention is crucial for achieving goals and problem-solving. It explores how factors like technology, reduced sleep, and chronic stress contribute to the attention crisis. The episode argues for individual changes such as using lockboxes for phones and implementing digital detox, while also calling for collective action to challenge the systemic forces shaping our attention.
The Impact of Distraction and Multitasking
The episode reveals the detrimental effects of constant distraction and multitasking on our ability to focus and think. It explains the switch cost effect, which shows that attempting to multitask reduces competency, leads to more mistakes, and lowers intelligence. The discussion highlights how technology plays a role in perpetuating distraction and mentions the importance of creating individual boundaries, such as using lockboxes and employing tools like Freedom App, to minimize distractions and regain focus.
The Potential of Collective Action
The podcast episode presents examples of past collective movements that resulted in positive changes, such as banning lead in paint and gasoline. It argues that similar collective action is needed to address the attention crisis caused by technology. The discussion proposes the right to disconnect as a legal reform that could empower individuals, allowing them to disconnect from work-related communication outside of working hours. It emphasizes that change is possible and encourages people to band together to challenge the systemic forces that impact attention.
The Power of Flow States and the Need for Deep Focus
The episode explores the concept of flow states, defined as deep, immersive focus on a particular task. It highlights the importance of flow for attention and productivity, emphasizing how external interruptions disrupt flow states. The episode shares examples and studies that reveal the significant impact of distractions on productivity and intelligence. It underscores the need to create an environment conducive to flow and emphasizes the difficulty of multitasking when deep focus is required.
Importance of Choosing One Goal
To maximize your chances of getting into flow, it is crucial to choose one goal and filter out everything else. By narrowing your focus and concentrating on one specific task, you increase your ability to enter a flow state.
Meaningful Goals and Flow
The goal you choose to pursue should be meaningful to you personally. By selecting a goal that resonates with your values and interests, you enhance your focus and attention. Different individuals may find different activities or pursuits meaningful, so it's important to choose something that aligns with your own sense of purpose.
Challenging Goals at the Edge of Comfort Zone
To optimize your chances of entering flow, it is beneficial to choose goals that are slightly beyond your current comfort zone and at the edge of your abilities. This means selecting tasks that are challenging enough to engage your full attention and require you to stretch yourself, but not so overwhelming that they become unmanageable.
Impact of Technology on Attention
The advent of technology and digital distractions has had a profound impact on our ability to focus and pay attention. Constant interruptions from notifications, texts, and social media platforms impede our ability to enter flow states and maintain deep concentration. The immense challenge lies in managing these distractions and finding ways to reclaim our attention in an increasingly technology-driven world.
The damaging effects of social media algorithms on society
This podcast episode delves into the negative impact of social media algorithms, particularly on the mental health of individuals and the polarization of society. The episode emphasizes how these algorithms prioritize engaging content, often escalating anger and outrage. The speaker mentions the research conducted by mental health professor Jean Twenge, which highlights the detrimental effects on teenage girls. The discussion also explores how algorithms have influenced political outcomes, such as aiding the election of far-right leaders. The episode urges individuals to take collective action and advocates for a shift in the current business model of social media platforms.
The relationship between addiction and technology
The podcast episode delves into the link between addiction and technology, emphasizing the role of technology in alienating individuals from meaningful connections and creating a sense of loneliness. The conversation explores how technology, similar to addictive substances, offers a shallow version of fulfillment and a sense of connection. The episode raises the point that addiction is a symptom of deeper underlying issues and discusses the importance of addressing those root causes. It highlights the need for individuals to prioritize their mental health and well-being while actively seeking meaningful connections and purpose in their lives.
Finding focus and meaning in a technology-driven world
The podcast episode offers practical steps for individuals to find focus and meaning in a technology-driven world. It suggests using tools like the K Safe or installing apps like Freedom to limit distractions and create boundaries with digital devices. The episode also emphasizes the significance of sleep, healthy eating, and conversations about meaningful experiences. Encouraging individuals to prioritize meaningful values over materialistic pursuits, the podcast advocates for creating conditions that support a flow state and allow for deeper connections with oneself and others.
We are living in a time of upgraded technology and downgraded humans.
Our collective ability to resist distraction and sustain attention is in decline.
Although will power plays a role, this problem is not entirely our fault—it’s the by-product of powerful forces incident to modern life.
Disconnection from nature. Disrupted sleep. Toxic environments. Predatory tech.
What exactly does a focus-less future augur? And what can be done to reclaim our ability to truly concentrate?
Back for his second appearance on the show, our steward for these existential questions is journalist & multiple New York Times bestselling author Johann Hari, who, when confronted with his own deteriorating attention span, dove deep into the individual and systemic solutions to this dispiriting collective trend.
Johann has written for the LA Times, Le Monde, and many other outlets, has two of the most-watched TED Talks, and has been profiled in essentially every prominent media outlet. His books include Chasing The Scream and Lost Connections,, which explores the roots of addiction, and was the subject of our first exchange back on episode #416. But today, he’s here to share big lessons from his latest book, Stolen Focus: Why You Can’t Pay Attention, which is a provoking journey into the forces robbing us of our attention and a look at how we might begin to reclaim our minds, and our lives.
Today’s conversation focuses on the problematic impact of big tech, smartphone addiction and surveillance capitalism on our well-being and that of our children.
We discuss the specific factors contributing to attention decline–from reduced sleep, environmental pollution, and something called the switch/cost effect, to chronic stress, poor nutrition, lack of exercise, and disconnection from others and the natural world.
Beyond the many problems, we, of course, also address solutions—both systemic and individualistic—such that we may recapture our focus and be the best version of ourselves.
Johann is quite the entertaining storyteller, with humor that makes hard truths go down a little easier.
To read more, click here. You can also watch it all go down on YouTube. And as always, the podcast streams wild and free on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.
This is a hopeful conversation about how to build a life of greater joy, enhanced personal fulfillment, and focus. My wish is that it serves and enlightens.
Enjoy!
Peace + Plants,
Rich
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