The Tim Ferriss Show

#598: Primatologist Isabel Behncke on Play, Sexual Selection, and Lessons from Following Bonobos for 3,000 Kilometers in the Jungles of Congo

Jun 1, 2022

Isabel Behncke, a pioneering field primatologist, shares insights from her extraordinary journey studying bonobos in the Congo. She reveals how these playful apes exemplify social bonding and creativity, drawing parallels to human behavior. Discover the significance of play in education and societal development, and how it contrasts with the aggression seen in chimpanzees. Isabel also explores topics like sexual selection, female empowerment among bonobos, and the challenges faced in the wilderness, all while emphasizing the value of understanding our closest animal relatives.

02:14:50

Episode guests

Isabel Behncke

Highlights

AI Chapters

Episode notes

The Advantages of Being Funny

04:20

The Importance of Von Humboldt

03:58

Darwin and von Humboldt - The Origins of Evolution

01:56

The Drunken Monkey Hypothesis

01:01

Intro

5min

Exploring Social Behaviors: Lessons from Bonobos and Human Play

3min

Bonobos and the Roots of Evolutionary Thought

27min

Exploring Sexual Selection and Complexity in Evolutionary Theory

3min

Understanding Niche Construction and Its Implications for Organisms

3min

Exploring Darwinian Thought and Complexity Through Nature's Feedback Loops

2min

Bonobos vs. Chimpanzees: Nature and Behavior

16min

Bonobo Behavior and Female Empowerment

15min

Exploring the Congo: Challenges and Cultural Insights

14min

10.

The Dynamics of Play in Animals and Humans

23min

11.

Exploring Animal Communication and Human Connection

18min

12.

Discoveries and Mindfulness

6min

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Isabel Behncke (@IsabelBehncke) is a field primatologist and applied evolutionary ethologist who studies social behavior in animals (including humans) to understand our urgent challenges with each other and the planet.

Isabel grew up at the foothills of the Andes mountains in Chile, where she developed a life-long love for nature and wildness as well as culture and the arts. An explorer-scientist, she is the first South American to follow great apes in the wild in Africa. She walked more than 3,000 km (~1864 miles) in the jungles of Congo for her field research observing the social lives of wild bonobo apes, who, together with chimpanzees, are our closest living relatives. Isabel documented how bonobos play freely in nature and has extended this research to study how human apes play—at Burning Man, other festivals, and in everyday life. Isabel has observed how play is at the root of creativity, social bonding, and healthy development, findings that have relevance in education, innovation, complex risk assessments, and freedom.

Isabel holds a BSc in Zoology and an MSc in Nature Conservation, both from University College London, an MPhil in Human Evolution from Cambridge University, and a PhD in Evolutionary Anthropology from Oxford University. She has won several distinctions for her public communication and knowledge integration, which range in formats from TED, WIRED, the UN, BBC, and Nat Geo to rural schools in Patagonia and traveling buses of schoolchildren in Congo. She is a senior fellow of the Gruter Institute, a TED fellow, and currently advises the Chilean government, working on long-term strategies in science, technology, innovation, and knowledge for Chile’s president. She can be found in Chile and New York City.

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[08:11] Baco and Jiro

[13:05] What is an applied evolutionary ethologist?

[15:43] Lorenz vs. Skinner

[18:23] The brilliance of consilience

[19:11] Humboldt vs. Darwin and the origins of evolutionary thinking

[29:42] Recent revolutionary thoughts about evolution

[36:16] Complexity and niche construction

[41:33] What’s more fun: a barrel of chimpanzees or a barrel of bonobos?

[49:19] Chimpanzee geography

[59:29] Magnificent bonobos

[1:02:11] Female mammal problems and solutions

[1:09:17] Sexual dimorphism