The Commercial Efficiency Crisis in B2B SaaS Sales with Nick Toman - Ep. 44

Feb 27, 2025

In a world where B2B deals involve more people than ever, growth is suffering. Nick Toman shares insights on how more sellers can actually hinder win rates. The discussion includes three key behaviors that lead to successful sales relationships and how slowing down can paradoxically speed up deals. Sales compensation's role in shaping behaviors is explored, alongside the intriguing concept of 'Headway Selling.' Plus, there are plenty of lighthearted moments, from childhood sports traumas to gnome confessions!

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Episode notes

Intro

00:00 • 2min

Challenging Sales Paradigms

01:54 • 5min

The Power of Publication: Insights from Harvard Business Review

07:12 • 1min

The Art of Storytelling in B2B Sales

08:34 • 28min

Maximizing Sales Efficiency Through Talent, Data, and Technology

36:13 • 3min

Sales Strategies in B2B: Balancing Humor and Insight

39:43 • 15min

A Playful Exchange of Sports Fandom and Personal Anecdotes

55:00 • 2min

Solution Selling

Creating Buyers in Difficult Selling Markets

Michael T. Bosworth

Solution Selling by Michael T. Bosworth offers a structured approach to sales, emphasizing the importance of understanding buyer needs, navigating the buying cycle, and addressing pain points. The book provides tools and techniques for successful selling, including the 10 faces of pain and the nine-block vision processing model. It is particularly valuable for sales professionals facing challenging markets.

SPIN selling

Neil Rackham

SPIN Selling by Neil Rackham is a seminal work in the field of sales, particularly focused on large and complex sales. The book is the result of a 12-year, $1 million research project by Huthwaite corporation, analyzing over 35,000 sales calls. It introduces the SPIN methodology, which involves asking four types of questions: Situation, Problem, Implication, and Need-Payoff. This approach helps salespeople understand the client's needs, identify problems, appreciate the implications of these problems, and clarify the benefits of the solution. The book challenges traditional sales techniques, especially those focused on closing, and emphasizes a consultative, customer-centric approach that fosters long-term relationships and increases sales effectiveness.

The Challenger Sale

Taking Control of the Customer Conversation

Brent Adamson

Matthew Dixon

Based on an extensive study of thousands of sales reps across multiple industries, 'The Challenger Sale' argues that classic relationship building is less effective, especially in complex business-to-business sales. The authors identify five distinct sales profiles, with the 'Challenger' being the highest performer. Challengers approach customers with unique insights, tailor their message to the customer's needs, and assertively take control of the sale. The book provides a framework for identifying and training sales reps to adopt the Challenger approach, which can lead to higher customer loyalty and greater growth.

There are more people than ever involved in deals on both the vendor side and customer side, and it’s having a massively negative impact on B2B growth.

Nick Toman is the Chief Product and Transformation Officer at SBI (Sales Benchmark Index) and is the third and final co-author of The Challenger Sale we’ve had on the show. Nick brings some amazing new sales and business research to dive into with co-hosts Matt Amundson and Craig Rosenberg. Nick unveils the effect that having more sellers involved has on win rates, the three behaviors of B2B salespeople that lead to the best commercial relationships, and why actions that seem like they would slow down deals are actually the key to closing them faster. Matt sparks an interesting discussion around sales compensation and the impact it has on both the behaviors of B2B sellers and the growth of the company on the whole. Toward the end, Nick teases his new concept of 'Headway Selling,' which focuses on actually helping customers reach their goals rather than simply selling them as much useless crap as possible.

Also, Craig recounts his childhood trauma of growing up a Dodgers fan in San Fransisco, Matt practices to be a court stenographer, and Sam the Producer confesses to an affinity for gnomes (?).

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Critical Takeaways

Not only have buying groups grown immensely, but the number of people working on deals with those buying groups has also exploded. There are now an average of 12 people in buying groups and 5 people involved with the sale from the vendor side. This has led to a spike in confusion for buyers and a sharp decline in win rates for salespeople.
The role of CSMs (Customer Success Managers) has devolved to have an extremely broad remit that is too big for them to actually deliver on effectively. In an ideal world, the CSM role should be to use very clear signals to identify customers who are struggling with adoption or retention issues and help them solve those issues. As it stands, many CSMs provide ongoing services and end up competing with account managers to land expansion and renewal opportunities. The competition on its own is one thing, but once the business is compensating both the CSM and the AM, there’s an issue with cost and efficiency.
B2B sales reps need to focus on deeply understanding and aligning with customer initiatives. Sellers should be thinking about how they can help customers grow in their own businesses and avoid roadblocks. Gaining this deeper understanding of customer needs drastically shortens sales cycles and increases deal sizes.
There are 4 main archetypes of behavior for people in commercial roles: 1. Narrowing- Closing early, Closing often. 2. Provoking - Provocative insights to redirect customer thinking (AKA: Challenger). 3. Translating - Detail & data-oriented to help customers understand impact. 4. Anticipating - Help customers think through the process and future challenges.
Of those 4 archetypes, the two that perform best in sales are Translating and Anticipating. The research showed that sellers exhibiting those behaviors actually closed deals more quickly and for more money than sellers using the Narrowing or Provoking behaviors.

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Chapters

00:00 Coming Up in this Episode...

00:40 Will the Real Nick Toman Please Stand Up

01:53 Introducing Nick Toman, Co-Author of The Challenger Sale

03:09 The Impact of The Challenger Sale in B2B Sales

13:55 Commercial Efficiency is Crippling B2B SaaS Growth

21:22 Is Sales Commision Getting out of hand for B2B Companies?

28:22 Why Don't Buyers Want to Talk to Sellers Anymore?

31:05 Key Behaviors for Successful Commercial Relationships

33:53 Why Starting Fast Is So Critical for Sales Success All Year Long

36:27 Strategies for Effective Sales Execution to Start the Fiscal Year Strong

41:08 Understanding The Four Commercial Role Archetypes & Their Impact on Deal Velocity

48:54 Customer-Centric Selling and Trust Building

53:56 Headway Selling & Delivering Real Customer Success

Epic Quotes

“ You’ve got to help the customer make headway and you don't want to make headwinds.” - Nick Toman
“ Commercial efficiency- the yield on dollars spent in sales and marketing- has gone down 50 plus percent.” - Nick Toman
“ Those who really do situate themselves in a path of helping the customer evolve their business and get things right do much better than those who are like ‘Buy this thing.’” - Nick Toman

Connect with Nick Toman

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nicktoman/
SBI Website: https://sbigrowth.com/
Latest Research - How a Fast Start to the Year Defines Your Growth Outcomes: https://sbigrowth.com/tools-and-solutions/how_a_fast_start_defines_your_growth_outcomes

Shoutouts

Matt Dixon: https://thetransaction.substack.com/p/decoding-sales-indecision-with-matt?r=3iae7z
Brent Adamson: https://thetransaction.substack.com/p/reframing-b2b-sales-to-drive-buyer?r=3iae7z
The End of Solution Sales - HBR Article: https://hbr.org/2012/07/the-end-of-solution-sales
Dave Brock: https://thetransaction.substack.com/p/really-knowing-your-customer-with?r=3iae7z
Mike Bosworth: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mikebosworth/
Neil Rackham
Harvard Business Review: https://hbr.org/
Karen Freeman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karenefreeman/
Stop Trying to Delight Your Customers - HBR Article: https://hbr.org/2010/07/stop-trying-to-delight-your-customers
AJ Gandhi: https://thetransaction.substack.com/p/navigating-market-success-with-aj?r=3iae7z
Vantage: https://www.vantage.sh/
Ben Schaechter: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bensign/
Marlin Equity Partners: https://www.marlinequity.com/
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