The Power of Music Thinking

In many episodes, we talk about how sound and listening can make a difference for good. We’ve explored themes like sound healing, music psychology, and deep listening—all ways sound and music thinking can be a force for good. Today is somewhat different. We speak with Fabio Cervi, an audio investigator for Earshot, a non-profit audio investigation organisation that works on the front lines of human rights and environmental advocacy. Fabio’s work isn't just about listening; it's about finding evidence. He uses sound to tell the stories of communities affected by violence. In our conversation today, Fabio shares sound files from two astonishing cases. First, we’ll hear and deconstruct the evidence from an attack on a silent vigil in Serbia, involving a mysterious sound that people felt rather than heard, and a potential sonic weapon known as an LRAD. Then, we move to the occupied Syrian Golan Heights to explore Zifzafa, a protest video game that uses real-world field recordings to fight against an illegal massive wind turbine project. This is audio as ballistics, as evidence, and as advocacy. It’s a truly fascinating look at how sound can be used in the fight for justice. Show notes Connect with Fabio via Instagram: @fabioclaudioc Earshot - audio investigations for communities affected by corporate, state, and environmental injustice: https://earshot.ngo Connect with earshot on Instagram: @earshot.ngo and Twitter: @earshot_ngo Related podcasts Sonic UX research with Caitlyn Trevor Deep listening with Sharon Stewart Health care, Sound healing and mantras

The word 'orchestration' is everywhere in business right now—we see 'innovation orchestrator,' 'data orchestrator.', ‘Change orchestrator’. It’s become a strategic buzzword and many are using it, just search for the term on LinkedIn.   I’ve mentioned my research on this topic before, and I’m thrilled to share that the full peer-reviewed paper—which I co-authored and presented at the RSD14 Relating Systems Thinking and Design conference—is now available. You can find the link in the show notes.   But to bring this idea to life, I wanted to try an experiment. I used AI, specifically NotebookLM, to take the core concepts from our paper and turn them into a conversation, as if it were a podcast itself.   So, what you’re about to hear is a 16-minute audio piece, created by AI, that explores what a musical orchestrator actually does, and how this music thinking relates to business, all based on our research.    It's a fun experiment, and I think it's the perfect introduction to why this concept is so critical for leadership today. Let’s listen.    Show notes Read the abstract and download the full paper: The Analogy of Orchestration in systemic Co-design https://musicthinking.com/the-analogy-of-orchestration-in-systemic-co-design/ Podcast episode: Everything about Orchestration with Robin Hoffmann: https://musicthinking.com/everything-about-orchestration-with-robin-hoffmann/ If you're interested in taking this conversation from the podcast into your organisation, visit musicthinking.com to learn about my leadership facilitation and sounding board sessions. Or, if you have a specific question, reach out to me via email at christof-at-musicthinking-dot-com.    

One of the great myths of a modern career is that you have to choose just one path. My guest today, Jessica Wan, is living proof that you absolutely don’t. Her career has taken her from leading marketing teams at world-renowned organisations like Apple and the San Francisco Opera, to becoming a sought-after executive coach. And running parallel to all of this, she is a classically trained singer preparing for her next recital. She champions a philosophy she calls 'The Ampersand Manifesto', which celebrates people who connect multiple passions and professions.  It's a really inspiring chat about embracing all parts of who you are. And as a special treat, you will also hear a sneak peek at the end of the conversation from Jessica's recital. She sings a song together with the audience that was popular everywhere in Taiwan in the 80s and 90s called 月亮代表我的心 – The Moon Represents My Heart. So, let's dive into the conversation. Show notes Connect with Jessica: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jessicamwan/  Jessica Wan, Executive & Leadership Coach: https://www.jessicawan.com The Ampersand Manifesto podcast: https://www.theampersandmanifesto.com/ You like this? Consider buying me a coffee: https://ko-fi.com/musicthinking and don't forget to visit https://musicthinking.com for more fun, free downloads, book, and workshops.  

Could smart sound design actually make calling a hospital a less stressful experience? And what if the sound of a cello could be scientifically mapped to our emotions? These are just some of the questions we’ll be exploring today with our guest, Caitlyn Trevor. Caitlyn holds a PhD in Music Theory, a Master’s in Cello Performance, and is an award-winning film score composer. As a researcher and UX professional, her work sits at that fascinating intersection of performance, science, and user experience. In our chat, we trace Caitlyn’s journey from discovering the Lord of the Rings soundtrack to conducting neuroscience research in Switzerland. We’ll get into the specifics of how playing music acts as a full-body exercise for the brain, and why she’s applying that knowledge to improve everyday sonic experiences. We also discuss her fantastic LinkedIn series, "Sound Effects," which shows how sound can drive behaviour change. For example, one post reveals how adding a simple warning sound to an e-scooter can cut the number of times it goes unnoticed by pedestrians from a staggering 97% down to just 3%. It's a wonderful conversation packed with insight.  Show notes Connect with Caitlyn via LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caitlyn-trevor/   The Sound Effect series on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/sonicuxr   Video Music in the tunnel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Irk1leLxfk   What is Music Cognition, video by David Heron: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R76p5B9nyPk   Show support If this podcast has sparked an idea, offered a new perspective, or provided a tool you’ve found useful. Please consider to support Music Thinking on Ko-fi: https://ko-fi.com/musicthinking  

Today we’re heading to Hoboken, New Jersey, to speak with Chris Dalla Riva, who works at the fascinating intersection of music and data. He’s a Senior Product Manager at the streaming service Audiomack, and the writer behind the popular newsletter Can’t Get Much Higher. His work has been featured by The Economist and NPR, and you might know him as the guy who set off an internet-wide debate about the decline of key changes in popular music. In our conversation today, we get into some incredible territory. We’ll discuss his research into the Billboard charts that reveals the surprising moment Black artists began to dominate popular music. We’ll also find out how his company, Audiomack, is beating giants like Spotify across Africa with one simple, but crucial, feature. And we'll hear about the book that came from his personal quest to analyze every single Billboard number one hit since 1958. Show notes Connect with Chris on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/christopher-dalla-riva-114ab078/  Website: https://www.chrisdallariva.com/uncharted The free and open spreadsheet with all Billboard Top 100 from 1958: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1j1AUgtMnjpFTz54UdXgCKZ1i4bNxFjf01ImJ-BqBEt0/edit?gid=1077686609#gid=1077686609 Show support If this podcast has sparked an idea, offered a new perspective, or provided a tool you’ve found useful. You can now show your appreciation and help sustain the show through our new Ko-fi page. Your support, whether a one-time ‘coffee’ or a monthly membership, makes a huge difference. Thank you for being part of this journey. Please consider to support Music Thinking on Ko-fi: https://ko-fi.com/musicthinking     

And we're back! In this special first episode after the summer break, Christof takes you on a sensory journey to Japan with a series of 'audio postcards' recorded in Kyoto, Tokyo, and Koyasan. It's an immersive exploration of sound, mindfulness, and creativity. Stick around for the second half, where Christof makes three major announcements about the future of Music Thinking, including a new way for you to support the show and an upcoming online workshop. IN THIS EPISODE, YOU'LL HEAR: Audio Postcard #1: The serene water basin and surrounding soundscape of the Ryoanji Temple garden in Kyoto. Audio Postcard #2: The chaotic, energetic wave of sound at the famous Shibuya Scramble Crossing in Tokyo. Audio Postcard #3: The meditative, rhythmic sound of a Zen garden being raked by artisans in Koyasan. Announcement 1: Introducing a brand new, simple way to support the podcast on Ko-fi. Announcement 2: Details on the new 'Music Thinking 101' online workshop. Announcement 3: A preview of the exciting new guest episodes and Japan specials coming this season. ❤️ SUPPORT THE SHOW If you find value in Music Thinking, you can now support the show directly and help keep it ad-free and independent. Become a member for perks or make a one-time 'thank you' donation on our new Ko-fi page: ▶︎ https://ko-fi.com/musicthinking 🧠 NEW ONLINE WORKSHOP: MUSIC THINKING 101 Join the new 90-minute online introduction to the Music Thinking Framework. A fast-paced, interactive session to transform how you co-create, lead, and understand your business. ▶︎ https://lu.ma/is0p00tv RESOURCES MENTIONED: Ryoanji Temple, Kyoto Shibuya Scramble Crossing, Tokyo Kongobuji Temple, Koyasan Pro Tip: For an even better listener experience, consider adding timestamps to the items in the "IN THIS EPISODE" list after you've edited the final audio.  

Our guest today is both an accomplished musician and a fascinating researcher. Dr. Sandra Garrido is a pianist and violinist who holds a PhD combining the worlds of music and psychology. Her work focuses on a question that touches all of us: how can music regulate our mood and improve our mental wellbeing? What's truly unique is that she explores this not just today, but through a historical lens, uncovering how music has always been used to help people feel better.  In our conversation, Sandra gives us fascinating insights into the paradoxical appeal of sad music. We discussed why the same Adele song might comfort one person while sending another into a negative loop. Sandra also shares how music can be a powerful tool for young people with depression and its surprising role in dementia care. This makes this a conversation you won't want to miss, with practical tips like how to organise your summer playlist (or the winter one if you are down under). Show notes Connect with Sandra on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sandramgarrido/  University profile: https://www.westernsydney.edu.au/marcs/about/our_people/researchers/dr_sandra_garrido MoodyTunes website: https://www.moodytunes.com.au Dementia resources: https://www.musicfordementia.com.au Show support Please choose one or more of the ‘three ways to support the show’: Subscribe to the podcast. Leave us a review — even one sentence helps! I appreciate your support; it helps the show! Tell your friends about the podcast and musicthinking.com Buy the book The Power of Music Thinking and/or the Jam Cards at a 20% discount using musicthinking20 at the check-out of the BIS Publishers website only.  

Our guest today is Dr. Maya Ackerman, a world-renowned AI expert who has been at the forefront of generative AI since 2015. She holds a PhD in Computer Science, is a professor at Santa Clara University, and has authored over 60 research publications.  As the co-founder and CEO of WaveAI, one of the earliest generative AI startups, she specialises in creating systems that elevate AI from a novelty to an essential tool for millions. A recognised 'Woman of Influence' and sought after for her expertise by outlets such as NBC News and New Scientist, her perspective is truly unique. In our conversation, we explore the delicate balance between human and machine creativity. It's a relationship that requires trust, improvisation, and a deep understanding of what you could truly call the dance of leading and following. And that perspective is exactly what we explore today. This is a conversation that bridges worlds: from learning to play the piano and sing opera to becoming a CEO in AI.  We get into the very nature of creativity itself, discussing improvisation, hallucination, imagination, and what Maya refers to as 'computational creativity.' We even touch on science fiction, asking how these humble creative machines might elevate, and not replace, us in the near future. Show notes Connect with Maya on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mackerma/  LyricStudio: https://lyricstudio.net/  MelodyStudio: https://melodystudio.net/  Creative Machines Book (available for pre-order, releasing in Oct) https://www.amazon.com/Creative-Machines-Future-Human-Creativity/dp/1394316267  Mentioned in the talk, speculative fiction books by Annalee Newitz, check out Terraformers and Autonomous:  https://www.goodreads.com/author/show/191888.Annalee_Newitz  Show support Please choose one or more of the ‘three ways to support the show’: Subscribe to the podcast. Leave us a review — even one sentence helps! I appreciate your support; it helps the show! Tell your friends about the podcast and musicthinking.com Buy the book The Power of Music Thinking and/or the Jam Cards at a 20% discount using musicthinking20 at the check-out of the BIS Publishers website only.  

This is a personal story about my first online interview at the end of the 1990s. It is a trip back in time with original sound snippets from the interview with famous conductor and pianist Daniel Barenboim in the Opéra Royale at Versailles. Find out how we did this technically and what questions the maestro was asked that came from the internet. This is another special episode where I experiment with different kinds of storytelling.  This time, it is also about pioneering the internet and music thinking. You hear original sounds from 1997 that might sound a bit bumpy but have historical value. It shows unreleased material from a great musician, an empathic, sympathetic person in a relaxed, collegial atmosphere. Show notes Europa Concert 1997: https://www.medici.tv/en/concerts/europakonzert-1997-chateau-de-versailles-paris-daniel-barenboim-conductor-and-piano-berliner-philharmoniker-ravel-mozart-beethoven Daniel Barenboim Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Barenboim  Show support Please choose one or more of the ‘three ways to support the show’: Subscribe to the podcast. Leave us a review — even one sentence helps! I appreciate your support; it helps the show! Tell your friends about the podcast and musicthinking.com Buy the book The Power of Music Thinking and/or the Jam Cards at a 20% discount using musicthinking20 at the check-out of the BIS Publishers website only.​​  

What can people and organisations learn from science and music? Why should we care? Are there universal mechanisms that are valid all over the world to all human species? Or is everything an individual experience?  Today, we talk with Hauke Egermann, Professor of Systematical Musicology at the University of Cologne. We speak about universal mechanisms that are valid all over the world; we learn from research with an isolated culture in Congo, the Pygmies from Mebenzélé, that refuse to practise negative music and have different songs to regulate their emotions. Songs against fear, anger, or, among others, music to protect hunters in the rainforest. How do they respond to music they have never heard or connected with? What does it evoke, and how does this relate to Canadian Indigenous people and the listening patterns in the Western world?  Hauke also shares the Music Date concert with us, where the audience's emotional reaction is tracked in the first tutti part of a concert to then separate and assign them to eight different mini-concerts around one emotion based on their responses.   Show notes Connect with Hauke: https://musikwissenschaft.phil-fak.uni-koeln.de/en/mitarbeiter-innen/professoren-innen/hauke-egermann  Mentioned paper about universal emotion-related psychophysiological responses: https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/psychology/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2014.01341/full Google scholar profile: https://scholar.google.com/citations?hl=de&user=aSSMPDoAAAAJ&view_op=list_works&sortby=pubdate    Related podcasts:  A love letter to sound with Nina Kraus: https://musicthinking.com/a-love-letter-to-sound-with-nina-kraus/ Standing still with Alexander Refsum Jensenius: https://musicthinking.com/standing-still-with-alexander-refsum-jensenius/