

Maintainable
Robby Russell
Do you feel like you're hitting a wall with your existing software projects? Are you curious to hear how other people are navigating this? You're not alone.
On the Maintainable Software Podcast, Robby speaks with seasoned practitioners who have overcome the technical and cultural problems often associated with software development.
Our guests will share stories in each episode and outline tangible, real-world approaches to software challenges. In turn, you'll uncover new ways of thinking about how to improve your software project's maintainability.
On the Maintainable Software Podcast, Robby speaks with seasoned practitioners who have overcome the technical and cultural problems often associated with software development.
Our guests will share stories in each episode and outline tangible, real-world approaches to software challenges. In turn, you'll uncover new ways of thinking about how to improve your software project's maintainability.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Jun 4, 2024 • 46min
Stig Brautaset: Understanding Alien Artifacts in Legacy Code
In this episode of Maintainable, Robby chats with Stig Brautaset, Staff Software Engineer at CircleCI. Stig shares his insights on maintaining well-documented but complex legacy code, the impact of team dynamics on software maintenance, and his experiences with the SBJSON library.Stig discusses the characteristics of well-maintained software, emphasizing the importance of team experience, domain knowledge, and risk appetite. He reflects on his own career journey, highlighting the transition from overconfidence to a balanced approach to risk-taking.A significant portion of the conversation delves into Stig's concept of "Alien Artifacts," which describes highly resistant legacy code written by highly skilled engineers. He explains the challenges of modifying such code and shares examples from his own experiences.Stig also talks about his work on the SBJSON library, addressing the complexities of handling multiple versions and dependency conflicts. He advocates for developers maintaining the software they ship and discusses the balance between shipping features quickly and maintaining long-term code quality.Key TakeawaysThe influence of team dynamics on software maintenanceUnderstanding the concept of "Alien Artifacts" in legacy codeStrategies for handling multiple versions of a software libraryThe importance of developers being on call for the software they shipManaging different types of technical debtBook Recommendation:The Scout Mindset by Julia GalefStig Brautaset on LinkedInAlien Artifacts Blog PostSBJSON Library CircleCIThe Confident Commit PodcastHelpful Links:Stig Brautaset on LinkedInAlien Artifacts Blog PostSBJSON Library CircleCIThe Confident Commit PodcastWant to share your thoughts on this episode? Reach out to Robby at robby@maintainable.fm.Thanks to Our Sponsor!Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out!
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May 28, 2024 • 42min
Brit Myers - Decoding Product vs. Technical Risk
Join Robby as he welcomes Brit Myers to the podcast. Brit, currently thriving as the VP of Engineering at System Initiative, discusses the intricacies of maintaining software. She emphasizes the importance of navigable software, where the ease of tracing the code and understanding its structure is paramount. Brit highlights the significance of clear naming conventions and inline documentation, as they help in maintaining a cohesive narrative within the software. The conversation touches on the challenges posed by discrepancies in vocabulary between product management and engineering, and how glossaries can bridge these communication gaps. Brit advocates for the use of glossaries more as a reflective tool rather than a proactive one, given the dynamic nature of software development. She also delves into strategies for managing legacy code and technical debt, proposing a pragmatic approach where wrapping and modularizing legacy components can mitigate risks. She discusses the balance between immediate feature delivery and long-term code health, stressing the importance of aligning technical risks with business objectives. The episode explores the impact of company culture on development practices, the benefits of synchronous work environments, and the evolving landscape of DevOps. Tune in to tap into Brit’s valuable wisdom.Book Recommendation:Crucial Conversations: Tools for Talking When Stakes are High By Kerry Patterson, Stephen R. Covey, Joseph Grenny, Ron McMillan, and Al SwitzlerHelpful Links:System InitiativeBrit on LinkedInSPACE FrameworkDORA metricsThanks to Our Sponsor!Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out!
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May 21, 2024 • 36min
Andrea Guarino - Leveraging Static Analysis for Better Code
Andrea Guarino, Software Engineer at Sonar, discusses the importance of leveraging static analysis tools for maintaining clean and adaptable code. He emphasizes consistency, responsibility, and preventing security leaks. Andrea addresses challenges of maintaining code consistency in legacy code and offers pragmatic advice on managing technical debt. He advocates for code quality, time allocation, and integrating tools like Sonar into the development workflow for long-term sustainability.

May 7, 2024 • 47min
Staffan Nöteberg - On the Power of Monotasking in Software Development
Agile Coach and author Staffan Nöteberg delves into software maintainability, abstraction, modularity, and technical debt. He emphasizes the power of monotasking for productivity, introducing panorama sessions to prioritize tasks. The discussion also covers effective collaboration, time management strategies, and the benefits of visual aids in documentation.

Apr 23, 2024 • 53min
Martin Emde - Ruby Central and the Art of Being Tolerant to Change
In this episode of Maintainable, our host Robby Russell sits down with Martin Emde, a sage in the Ruby community and the current Director of Open Source at Ruby Central. Together, they weave through the intricacies of maintainable software, legacy code, and the unwavering power of the Ruby ecosystem. Martin, with his wealth of experience, shares tales from the trenches of open-source software development, focusing on RubyGems and Bundler, and how they've evolved to face the challenges of modern software needs.Martin addresses the elephant in the room - complexity in software. He muses on the natural progression of software projects from simplicity to complexity, drawing parallels to the growth of living organisms. It's not about fighting complexity, but embracing it with open arms, ensuring the software remains adaptable and maintainable. This conversation sheds light on the importance of testing, documentation, and community support in navigating the seas of complex software development.Diving deeper, they discuss the essence of technical debt, not as a villain in our stories but as a necessary step in the rapid evolution of technology. Martin's perspective on technical debt as a tool for progress rather than an obstacle is refreshing, encouraging developers to approach their work with more kindness and understanding.The discussion also highlights Ruby Central's pivotal role in nurturing the Ruby community, emphasizing the importance of contributions, whether code, conversation, or financial support. Martin's call to action for developers to engage with open-source projects, to adopt gems in need, and to provide support where possible, is a heartwarming reminder of the collective effort required to sustain the vibrant Ruby ecosystem.For those curious minds eager to dive into the world of Ruby, contribute to its growth, or simply enjoy a captivating discussion on software development, this episode is a delightful journey through the challenges and joys of maintaining open-source software. Don't miss out on the gems of wisdom shared in this episode, and be sure to check out the useful links below for more information on how you can contribute to the Ruby community.Book Recommendation:Project Hail Mary by Andy WeirHelpful Links:BundlerRuby CentralAdopt a GemMartin on GithubMartin's websiteThanks to Our Sponsor!Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out!
Subscribe to Maintainable on:Apple PodcastsSpotifyOr search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts.Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.

Apr 16, 2024 • 48min
Esther Olatunde - AI's Role in Evolving Software Engineering Practices
Esther Olatunde, a Senior Product Engineer at Intercom, discusses software maintenance, technical debt, and the impact of AI on software development. They explore onboarding for new developers, managing technical debt, and the future of software engineering with AI tools like GitHub Copilot. The episode provides practical advice for maintaining software quality and advocating for maintenance tasks to non-developers.

Mar 26, 2024 • 40min
Robbie Wagner - Whiskey, Front-End, and Whatnot
Starting off, Robbie Russell and Robbie Wagner bonding over the complexities of their names in the coffee queue.They dive into the essence of maintainable software, debating the importance of recent commits and the dangers of a single-contributor project.Tech debt, the ever-looming shadow over software development, gets a moment in the spotlight. They share a laugh over buying GitHub stars as a measure of project health.Wagner's approach to tackling tech debt without permission is both rebellious and pragmatic, advocating for quality and refactoring 'on-the-go'.The conversation shifts to the Scout rule in software maintenance, and how constant vigilance is key to overcoming tech debt fatigue.Discussions around Ember.js, its community, and the evolution of front-end development light up the conversation.The narrative takes a turn as they explore automating the mundane, with ESLint, Prettier, and CI tools like Dependabot starring as the unsung heroes in the quest for quality.They touch upon the challenges of maintaining a balance between new features and tech debt, with Wagner emphasizing the sneaky art of integrating tech debt fixes into regular work.Robbie Wagner shares his love for rye whiskey, introducing listeners to his favorite brands and distilleries.Wrapping up, they delve into the world of podcasts, discussing the uniqueness of "Whiskey, Web and Whatnot" and how it blends technical discussions with personal stories and whiskey.Helpful Links:Check out Whiskey, Web and Whatnot for more episodes and whiskey recommendations!Thanks to Our Sponsor!Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out!
Subscribe to Maintainable on:Apple PodcastsSpotifyOr search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts.Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.

Mar 12, 2024 • 46min
Irina Nazarova - Investing in Innovation: The Consultancy's Guide to Growth
In the latest episode of Maintainable, Robby Russell has a fascinating conversation with Irina Nazarova, the CEO of Evil Martians, a name that resonates with innovation and bold strides in the software development world. They dive deep into what it takes to maintain not just code, but also the delicate balance between rapid development and long-term sustainability in the ever-evolving startup landscape.Irina shares her unique perspective on the common traits of well-maintained software, stressing the importance of adaptability and the role of technical debt at different stages of a company's growth. With a background rich in pushing the boundaries of what's possible in software consultancy, she offers a fresh take on commercializing open-source projects, nurturing innovation within the team, and the significance of building genuine relationships with clients.Listeners will get a glimpse into the challenges and triumphs of running a software consultancy that dares to dream big. From the intricacies of investing in internal projects to the philosophy behind fostering a culture of innovation and respect, this episode is a goldmine of insights for anyone curious about the intersection of consultancy work and product development.Don't miss out on this engaging discussion that reveals the byproducts of passion, dedication, and a relentless pursuit of excellence in the software industry. Check out the episode and let us know your thoughts!Book Recommendations:The Challenger SaleHelpful Links:Evil MartiansIrina on LinkedInIrina on TwitterAnyCableLayered Design for Ruby on Rails Applications by Vladimir DementyevThanks to Our Sponsor!Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out!
Subscribe to Maintainable on:Apple PodcastsSpotifyOr search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts.Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.

Mar 5, 2024 • 47min
Kyle Daigle - Scaling Up with AI: A New Era of Code Maintenance
Robby has a chat with Kyle Daigle, the Chief Operating Officer at GitHub. They dive into the evolution of software development from the perspective of maintaining and scaling software within large organizations like GitHub. Kyle talks about the importance of simplicity and readability in code over complexity, advocating for well-named variables and straightforward codebases to enhance maintainability.He reflects on his journey from a young developer to understanding the value of well-maintained software, noting the balance between creativity in naming and the necessity for clarity as projects and teams grow. The conversation also covers the approach to technical debt, highlighting that not all old code is debt, but rather it depends on whether it hinders progress. Additionally, they explore the impact of AI tools like GitHub Copilot on software development, suggesting that these tools can aid in quicker code reviews and foster higher-level problem-solving discussions among developers. Stay tuned to learn more.Book Recommendations:Turn The Ship Around By David MarquetHelpful Links:Githubkdaigle @ githubThanks to Our Sponsor!Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out!
Subscribe to Maintainable on:Apple PodcastsSpotifyOr search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts.Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.

Feb 27, 2024 • 54min
Jon Moniaci - Can We Draw A Boundary?
Robby speaks to the Senior Software Engineer at Perchwell, Jon Moniaci. They discuss the delicate balance between innovation and stability in software development. Jon emphasizes the importance of fostering an environment where engineers can experiment without fear, advocating for a culture of defensive programming to mitigate the fear of breaking things in production. He shares insights from his experiences, including the challenges of working with legacy code and the importance of testing and QA processes. He also talks about the value of considering software pieces as potential microservices to encourage maintainability and flexibility, even if full microservice architecture isn't implemented. This approach, Jon suggests, allows for more sustainable development practices, ultimately leading to more resilient and adaptable software systems. Tune in for that and so much more!Book Recommendations:Sapiens by Yuval Noah Harari The End of Everything (Astrophysically Speaking) by Katie MackHelpful Links:WebsiteJon on LinkedInPerchwellThanks to Our Sponsor!Turn hours of debugging into just minutes! AppSignal is a performance monitoring and error tracking tool designed for Ruby, Elixir, Python, Node.js, Javascript, and soon, other frameworks. It offers six powerful features with one simple interface, providing developers with real-time insights into the performance and health of web applications. Keep your coding cool and error-free, one line at a time! Check them out!
Subscribe to Maintainable on:Apple PodcastsSpotifyOr search "Maintainable" wherever you stream your podcasts.Keep up to date with the Maintainable Podcast by joining the newsletter.