HIListically Speaking with Hilary Russo

I have sleep apnea. I also had major jaw surgery at 15. Are they connected? If I had a Magic 8 Ball, it would likely say, "All signs point to Yes". And so would one pioneer in holistic dentistry by the name of Dr. Claire Stagg. ⁣ Through my personal journey of trauma and jaw surgery, we highlight the limitations of conventional solutions like CPAP and oral appliances, underscoring the need for a comprehensive, whole-body approach. Dr. Stagg shares invaluable insights into the interconnectedness of our body's systems, focusing on non-surgical solutions for TMJ, clenching, grinding, sleep apnea, and airway disorders. ⁣ This is about building your symphony of specialists who focus on the root cause, not just the diagnosis. It's the conversation I wish my parents and I had over 35 years ago when I sat in the dentist's chair. Today, I hope it serves as a guide for anyone struggling to find answers. And for parents, let it offer a new kind of hope for your kids to leave you better informed when it comes to your dental health and overall well-being.⁣ ⁣⁣ Grab a copy of Dr. Stagg's book, "Smile: It's All Connected" ⁣ Hardcover: https://amzn.to/3XLYm9X (Amazon)⁣ ⁣ Share storytime about proper dental health with her children's book "Captain IFBI" ⁣https://amzn.to/4cipP7l (Amazon)⁣ ⁣ Get the Daily Dental Protocol Checklist.⁣ https://lp.constantcontactpages.com/sl/Y4V5mXB⁣⁣ CONNECT WITH DR STAGG ⁣ https://healthconnectionsdentistry.com/⁣ https://www.instagram.com/SmileProDentist⁣ https://www.facebook.com/SmileProDentist⁣ ⁣ ⁣HEALING IN YOUR HANDS. HAVENING WITH HILARY⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/havening⁣ ⁣ CONNECT WITH HILARY⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ https://www.instagram.com/hilaryrusso https://www.facebook.com/HIListicallySpeaking/⁣ https://www.facebook.com/groups/hugitoutcollective/⁣ https://x.com/hilaryrusso⁣ https://www.tiktok.com/@hilisticallyspeaking⁣ Music by Lipbone Redding https://lipbone.com/⁣ FULL TRANSCRIPT ALSO ON PODCAST WEBSITE⁣ ⁣ ⁣ 00:06 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ Think about all the systems that are shut down because you can't breathe right? The oral appliance isn't going to fix it. The CPAP is definitely not going to fix it, because what's going to happen is the body is going to acclimatize or get used to that level of band-aiding and then it's like okay, you know what it is. The little Dutch boy with his finger came to mind with a dam. So you put one finger here and then you put one finger here, and then you put one finger here and you put one finger, and then you're not gonna have enough fingers or toes, and then the dam's gonna break. And it's exactly the same concept. ⁣ ⁣ 00:40 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Okay, my friends, One of the reasons I went into the work that I do is it was an effort to heal my own trauma and, as a result of that, from having TMJ my whole life, from having jaw surgery when I was a teenager and not knowing really how to heal and not getting the right kind of support after that surgery, I wanted to know what I could do to heal later in life, because we really never stop healing, right? You hear me talk about that all the time and it's really how Havening came into my life. It was the first time I was ever Havened was on the trauma from my surgery years later. But what we're learning is that it's all connected. Everything from head to toe. It's all connected. Everything from head to toe, it's all connected. ⁣ ⁣ 01:32⁣ So when I was introduced to Dr Claire Stagg, a holistic dentist who believes in the whole body approach thank you so much I knew that her story and her method would resonate with so many others, because I've had these conversations with so many Dr Stagg about TMJ, jaw issues, clenching, grinding, stress and the problems that happen after the breathing, the sleep apnea, and it's such a common problem. So when you came into my space, when I was introduced to you by a client who you introduced me to, I knew that you were the right person to talk about this, to share the journey, to share possibilities, and I am so grateful that you are here. ⁣ ⁣ 02:12 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ Well, thank you, thank you, and I think it would be good to, if it's okay with you, to answer your questions and your journey, because I think you went through the whole gamut of from the start out the gate to the journey itself. So the first thing I'd like to add is that surgery is a massive undertaking and, unfortunately, one of the things because you and I have talked before this is that, without stepping on too many toes and being politically correct, it would be wise to figure out why orthognathic surgery is being done. A lot of times people are having their jaws move forward without understanding how the whole concepts work, and a lot of times some things can be done, so a lot and some can be done non-surgically. You just don't know what. You don't know until you know it. So surgery is a end-all, be-all concept and if you have a broken bone, it's a good time to put things together. ⁣ ⁣ 03:20⁣ But the head, the cranium, all these things keep moving all the time. I have a skull here with sutures. I mean this is just the top part, if you will, this is the front. The head you can tell Fred moves a lot too with me. Then this is the part that I work with and this is what I tell everybody, this is what I do right this part and right this part, and then this part. All right, but not as crooked. But what happened is you had your surgery to go ahead and to fix something that might have been fixable without it actually having to have the surgery. So here we go. I'm trying to put it all together for you and showing us us on YouTube. ⁣ ⁣ 04:04 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ We are on YouTube in case anybody wants to watch the video rather than just listen. It is on YouTube. ⁣ ⁣ 04:10 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ Right. So what I'm trying to say basically is that if you approach and saying that you need jaw surgery, please educate yourself more before you go down that rabbit hole, because it makes us a lot harder for us who are coming in behind to work on, to have arch expansion or arch development or airway issues to resolve them, if we're trying to move bone when you have screws tying them in. That's all I'm trying to say. So I interjected very early on. I'm sorry, but that's where I think. If you start off the gate that way and I think, unfortunately your issues, if I may say so, continued and stemmed from the actual surgery. They were trying to do one thing, but you ended up with a lot of other things. So that's where we have to weigh the pros and the cons, right. ⁣ ⁣ 04:59 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Absolutely. ⁣ ⁣ 04:59 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ Very delicate. ⁣ ⁣ 05:00 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, and it's something that you know. Back in the 80s, when this surgery was done, I was 15 years old. What was known about it? It was pretty much a younger surgery. The surgery itself was hours, the healing process was eight to 10 weeks with a jaw wired shut, and just you know. If this is triggering to anyone, I just want to preface that we're going to go there, that this surgery was not a minor surgery that you're doing in a dental office. I had a doctor that dealt with the face, I had an orthodontist, I had a dentist. It was like this team. And even after the surgery, a year later, I had follow-up surgery and I told myself. I said this has got to be it Like there can't be more than this because it was very traumatic. And this has got to be it Like this, there can't be more than this, because it was very traumatic. And the years following, because I was still growing, there was movement still happening, obviously, right. ⁣ ⁣ 05:55 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ So, and at 15, you're not finished growing. And that's the other thing to girls and boys grow differently. Girls can grow, still continue growing, sometimes up to 18, sometimes maybe even 21. Boys start later, but they can continue growing. I have a friend of my former husband who was continuing to grow tall at 29 plus. So everybody's different, but 15 is very young to do that. ⁣ ⁣ 06:19 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ It was young. It was a decision I had to make. ⁣ ⁣ 06:21 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ We could start a column of pros and cons there, Hihillary, of things that could go really really well and things that we might want to wait because they might cause problems later on, right? ⁣ ⁣ 06:32 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ But this is also something that you have a lot of younger patients and I know that there are moms and dads out there that listen that this might not be for them, specifically someone who's in my age range, but perhaps their child has breathing issues or they are dealing with. You know, I had the malocclusion, I had a protruded lower jaw and it was causing a lot of lockjaw and pain and discomfort and to go to that extreme after braces. I imagine that's not the approach this day and age, because there's more science, there's been more development, so it's also to give parents an understanding of information that they're getting about holistic dentistry and other possibilities before taking that approach with their children even. ⁣ ⁣ 07:19 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ All right, so let's go ahead about and talk. Interject also because you had four premolars extracted correct? ⁣ ⁣ 07:27 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yes, I think you're talking about the wisdom teeth. No, no, no, oh no. ⁣ ⁣ 07:32 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ The 18 year old molar right. We, in theory, have 32 teeth, all right. Unfortunately, and I'm just so we're. We're going to talk about all the not to do things all right, to put it in quotes for air, quotes for those who are listening there are a lot of things that and I'm not bashing orthodontists, please don't get me wrong, I'm not. I do orthodontics too, so that's not the issue. There's different ways of doing things all right. That's not the issue. There's different ways of doing things All right. One of them and if you, if you read or you know of Western Price, western Price talked about nutrition, about airway, of growing, of growing arches. All right, your head, your neck. So basically we're back to this again All right. ⁣ ⁣ 08:21⁣ And unfortunately, what happens is that when you have the jaw joint like this, all right, this is this is, think of it this way, like this, and then like that, when you translate, okay, what happens? A lot of times? You end up with a jaw disorder or joint disorder if this whole part, this maxilla, this part, is not developed enough and it sounds to me like what you had was an underdeveloped upper arch right. So, unfortunately, a lot of times, people say, oh, this one, they think that this is the normal one. And then this is too far forward, the lower jaw is too far forward, and that's why you end up having all these issues. Let's go ahead and let's take teeth out and bring the jaw back. Well, you've just created a joint problem, a TM joint, temporal mandibular joint problem, because now you shove the joint back, the jaw back. So now you see the cascade of events and this is what I was trying to say the cascade of events, of all the not to do so. First of all, figure out why you need surgery, what has happened, and then all the not to do so. You can't compound a problem with another, causing causative problem that will create another set of problems. ⁣ ⁣ 09:48⁣ So the first thing that you want to do is you want to be able to develop the arches and figure out which one truly is underdeveloped, because nine times out of ten, it's not necessary that the lower jaw is too far forward. Most of the time it's because the upper arch is not developed enough. And so, in order to balance them, conventional orthodontics go ahead and say let's take teeth out to make more room. Well, there's just so much. Think of a garage. This is my favorite analogy that I use. All right, think of a garage and let's say you have a 20 by 20 by 24, four walls that are 20 feet long, right? So it's a square, okay. And you say you're going to make more room and you decide to take four feet off in the length of each side of the garage. Will you have a bigger or a smaller? ⁣ ⁣ 10:45 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ garage. You're not going to have a lot of space for those cars, that's for sure, correct. But you have a smaller garage, right, right, and it's exactly the same thing with the mouth, all right. ⁣ ⁣ 10:55 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ So think too, now that you have on top of that garage, you have another room, all right, which is the nose. The nose, if you will, is a hollow space, all right. But the floor of the nose is the roof of the mouth, which you've just made smaller. What are you doing to the nasal passages? It's the same exact thing. Now you've brought the jaws up and back, you've made the garage or the box smaller. You've made the nasal passages smaller. Now you've brought everything back. What's back here? It's the tube that the airway is. So you start breathing through the nose, and the tube continues from the nose down to the throat. ⁣ ⁣ 11:43 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And again, I just want to mention to folks if folks are actually listening and they want to see what Dr Stagg is talking about, you can go ahead and find this podcast episode on youtubecom slash Hilary Russo. You'll see all the podcast episodes there to watch as well, if you want to do that. ⁣ ⁣ 11:58 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ So, if you go ahead, when you think about it, this is a person laying down, but this is the best picture that I can have right now to where we need to breathe through our nose. A lot of people breathe through their mouths, but, no matter what, if you lay back and everything closes up, then you have OSA or obstructive sleep apnea. So, basically, what I'm trying to say is the rabbit hole started by, probably, the diagnosis of lack of airway or lack of space, and so that's where it would be important to go ahead and to determine what type of space do you want? Which space are you trying to open up? The nasal passage or the oropharyngeal passageway? An oral mouth? Pharynx is the back, where the throat is. So in your case, it sounds to me like they wanted to go ahead and to move your jaw so that you can have straight teeth, right. ⁣ ⁣ 12:54 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That was part of it, and also I was getting a lot of pain and jaw aches. So they broke it, set it back and I don't know if I truly remember everything because I was a kid. You know you think you're getting braces, retainers, it's all to straighten your teeth. That's it, day is done, perfect teeth and you're happy. But there were more issues I was dealing with and that is where I am now, 35 years later, where the problems have become the obstructive sleep apnea movement and wondering where does one go next when you have years in between and other issues are now coming up. ⁣ ⁣ 13:32 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ Right. So the rabbit hole you're down at the bottom of the rabbit hole, right? Okay? So we're not going to cry over spilt milk, because it is what it is, it's done. But now you're aware that there are issues that you have to deal with. Okay, so then the goal is to figure out how we can get you out of the rabbit hole by reverse engineering what has occurred. So, basically, now you're going to address your airway, you're going to address your jaw joints, you're going to address your bite and you're going to address your nasal passages both going to address your nasal passages, both upper and lower. That's the airway, all, right. So this is where you mentioned that you were talking with um sleep doctors. Okay, that's one part of the orchestra. If you will, all right, then you're going to talk with dentists. That's the other part of the team, if you will, the orchestra. ⁣ ⁣ 14:22⁣ I like to say that patients are the music. You either have harmony or cac. Say that patients are the music. You either have harmony or cacophony. It's a French term. You either have chaos or you have health, right. So the whole idea now is to figure out who's going to be in charge of trying to figure out what's wrong, what happened where you are now, because we can't reverse engineer everything to. If you have screws in there, per se, all right, but the whole idea is to figure out what can we do to either see what we can ameliorate or make better and or stop from getting worse. So that's the interesting part is that's where you really need to figure out where you are now. ⁣ ⁣ 15:02⁣ If you do have an airway issue, to what intensity is the airway issue an issue? Those of you who do not know anything about sleep apnea we have either a sleep test, a home sleep test, to where you can take a little apparatus. Home Dentists, we're not allowed to diagnose sleep apnea, but we can treat it with oral appliances. So mild to moderate sleep apnea we can treat with an oral appliance. Severe sleep apnea is supposed to be treated. Standard of the gold, standard of care is with a CPAP machine, which stands for continuous positive air pressure. It's like a reverse blow dryer mower back up your nose or your mouth, right. So if you consider that you have an issue, then we need to figure out what your index or your indices are. So, again, a lot of this is on my website, healthconnectionsdentistrycom, where you can read up on the sleep screenings. Again, we cannot diagnose sleep apnea, but we can treat it with an oral appliance. ⁣ ⁣ 16:07⁣ Mild to moderate sleep apnea, usually at normal. Zero to five. Your indices are normal. Five to 15, it's mild sleep apnea, 15 to 30, it's moderate and over 30 is severe. Now, those are just the standard of care, the norms and the indices and who cares right. All you really need, as a patient, to know is whether I can breathe or not. Please, let me breathe or not. Let me help me breathe. So if you go ahead and you consider them, that's why you can have a home sleep test and we do home sleep test, because it helps me figure out as a dentist, because I can treat a functional breathing disorder that is in my wheelhouse. But I cannot treat sleep apnea without it being diagnosed by a physician. So if you have officially been diagnosed as you have Hilary with by a physician for sleep apnea, then that's where, too, you need to find yourself a doctor, dentist, who is versed in this type of care. So then you need to figure out where you're going to go from there. ⁣ ⁣ 17:18 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And I think that's the thing, and I've talked to other people and I know folks are tuning into this episode of HIListically Speaking with Dr Claire Stagg. Just to remind you, we will put that information on the website. We will put everything about the healthconnectionscom dentistry. Also her book that we're going to talk about that just came out. That's doing very well. And the questions I've been hearing from some who have been in these forums are are you know if you've been diagnosed with moderate sleep apnea? Like myself, I've also been through this traumatic TMJ surgery. I'm 35 years in. I know there are little plates in my mouth from the initial surgery and I've been given a referral to see an ENT, a referral to see a pulmonologist, a referral to see a speech pathologist. But then there's the airway side and then there's go find a dentist and it can be very overwhelming, like where to go first right. ⁣ ⁣ 18:12⁣ And I think that's the similar question I hear from folks. ⁣ ⁣ 18:15 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ Where do I go first? Right, and that's where I said the orchestra, all right. So I like to think that a doctor like myself, a dentist, who sees the medical side as well as the oral dental side, we and I liken it to the conductor of the orchestra the orchestra, the parts, the wind, the pipes, the drums, the bass, the, whatever the strings, whatever, all the different parts, if you will are all the different doctors, if you will, who are doctors, if you will, who are going to partake in making music. The patient is the one who is the music, and you either are going to have that harmony where everything just falls into place and that everything works well and you're healthy, all right or you have everybody throw something at the wall and expecting something to stick right. That's putting it pump up politely. So the goal is to get the bullseye the first time if you fail to plan to plan to fail, right, right. And so the goal now is someone like myself and we we talked about this is we got to figure out where you are exactly in this point in time. It didn't really matter so much anymore now, because you've had that surgery and that changes and has changed you forever. But where are you now? What are the building blocks that we can use now to move forward? Interject here for the parents and for those who are asking yeah, but this doesn't pertain to me. Well, we can work with children With the AFT systems. ⁣ ⁣ 19:50⁣ Dr Nordstrom has come up with systems to work with neonates. You can do the tie releases. You can start as from the newborns on. The whole idea is to breathe properly. Once you breathe properly, as in, you have proper tongue position and then you have proper nasal breathing, then you set yourself up for success, right. ⁣ ⁣ 20:10⁣ Unfortunately, with a modern diet and with the way that things are going nowadays, unfortunately things retract a lot and you don't have that room and you end up with disorders and you went through what you went through. Okay, so if we go ahead and we have that conductor I circled back now to the music all right, if you go ahead and you have a team, somebody's got to know what the right hand's doing. Somebody has to know what the left hand's doing, but together we make sure that we're all on board with the same ultimate goal, which would be to get you to breathe again properly. What I heard you say is that you went to see an ENT and they have their own wheelhouse, they have their own tools, they have their own tests, they have their own. We got to do this. This is it, this is my way, or the highway right I? ⁣ ⁣ 21:01 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ haven't actually gone to the ENT yet. I have a referral right because I'm like I want to go the right route before somebody starts telling me oh, you need this, this and this. I did consult with one dentist who said you need a CPAP, and I'm like you don't even know what you're talking about. ⁣ ⁣ 21:17 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ That's the weekend course. ⁣ ⁣ 21:20 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Right, that's the oh, I heard sleep apnea. I'm not a sleep dentist, I don't even deal with this stuff, but I've heard this is the best route to go. I don't want to hear, I've heard. I want to know what is good for me, because it's bio individuality. This is what I've been through. So I'm in this place. Where do I go to the ENT first? Do I go to the pulmonologist first? Do I go to a dentist who deals with, who is specializes in airway and TMJ? You know that's and sleep apnea, which obviously falls under that. ⁣ ⁣ 21:52 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ So one of the things you need to be aware of is the American Dental Association does not recognize these as specialties, unfortunately. I think that will change my practice. I have an emphasis in treating sleep apnea, tmj disorders, head, neck, facial pain. So that is one thing that you can be aware of. The second thing is a lot of us who do this have had many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many hours of extra training. It's just not a weekend course. ⁣ ⁣ 22:26⁣ I mean, I've been doing this for nearly 20 plus years to this intensity and it's a process I keep learning. I mean, I'm still going through a residency for pediatrics right now and it's a lot that I know, but now I'm learning to fine tune and I'm going. I can deep dive a little bit more for certain things that I have been able to do, because it's same old, same old. Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose, as we say in French. The more it changes, the more it's the same. So there's a lot of different things but, like you said, I like that bio individuality. So everybody's different but everybody's the same. It's just you can't use one cookie cutter technique, but we're all humans and that's where it's all connected. ⁣ ⁣ 23:10⁣ So we're circling back to how it's all connected. And if you have somebody who understands how it's all connected, that's when they could guide the ENT to say hey, you know what? This is what I suspect I use the word very underlined, bold caps suspect. I suspect, for example, she has a nasal valve collapse. I suspect, for example, she has a deviated septum. I suspect she has sinus issues. I suspect that she has pharyngeal obstruction. Could you please verify for me? Could there be upper airway resistance syndrome? I suspect that she may be having obstructive events. You might even have central apneic events, we don't know. So that's where you get somebody who understands as a dentist. All right, cause we're the best ones, and this is what floors me and I'm just going to put something for hooah, hooah for my team, my team, all right, this is what we do all day long. We're in the mouth. We see this stuff day in, day out. ⁣ ⁣ 24:17⁣ What bothers me is that they don't train dentists nowadays to read the signs of obstructive C-papnea and or airway disorders. That's going to change. That's all in the book, by the way. Every single sign you could think of is in the book. But I think that's what needs to be changed. It should be common sense that it's not drill, fill and build, it's actually determine what you see, that it's not normal. ⁣ ⁣ 24:43⁣ So I would hear patients tell me entire lives they've had these tore eyes. They look like little mushrooms at the bottom of their jaws or one on the roof of their mouth, on their palate. Or my dentist told me that was normal. No normal for whom? All right, I digress. So, anyhow, what happens is if you have a team conductor, then the dentist who understands this, who is more versed in this knowledge, can go ahead and say okay, then this ENT, could you please help me accomplish X, y, z. If you have a sleep doctor, all right. You don't want to get lost in the rabbit hole of medicine, right, because that's the other thing too. You can very easily get lost in that rabbit hole, all right. ⁣ ⁣ 25:29⁣ So, you want to stay with those of us, because your mouth, your head, your neck is this, is our wheelhouse. Ent is air, nose and throat. All right, sleep. They're the physicians. They're the ones that are going to. Yes, they prescribe the CPAP. Yes, they're the ones that are going to diagnose it. But at the end of the day it they're the ones they're going to diagnose it, but we're at the end of the day, it's still the dentist that's going to do the appliance for you. ⁣ ⁣ 25:50⁣ one way or the other, it's going to be something in your mouth right right and I prefer to go that route it bugs me that now you have physicians who are doing oral appliances. It's like, okay, you won't let us diagnose something that we deal with, okay, yes, yes, there's the medical, the physical aspect, the insurance part, blah, blah, blah, blah, of sleep apnea. Yes, there's a lot of pathophysiology that needs to be dealt with by a physician. Get that, get that, but don't go make an oral appliance for my patient. You don't know what you're dealing with, you don't know how to make it, you don't know what position to do it and you certainly don't know how to put it into the way they breathe better, and you don't know how to check it and you don't know where you're putting that jaw joint. So, yeah, that that kind of bugs me a lot. ⁣ ⁣ 26:33 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Sorry, I think that's part of the reason why now share. This is an open space. If you want to drop an F bomb, you can. I don't mind. ⁣ ⁣ 26:41 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ I can say it in French, but I could say it in French. ⁣ ⁣ 26:49 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yes, right, you can French your way out of this. So I, my thing is and I've thought this, but from talking to you, from talking to others in the field that even though I've been given referrals, I've been holding off on filling those referrals because I'm like I think that's just a doctor telling me this is what's normal and this is how we normally protocol this. My gut tells me that it's somebody who deals with this face all the time and that moves into the next things like how do you find that sleep dentist? How do you find a dentist who is experienced or emphasizes work in that area and know that you're getting someone who's good and isn't just going to say, hey, we're going to, we'll get you fixed up with an orthodontist and now you're going to get a palate expander or now we're going to do the surgery over? Because that's a fear that I've run into as well as one that I have on my own. ⁣ ⁣ 27:43 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ Right, I wouldn't go there yet if I were you. Okay, just stop Whenever you hear surgery again, just let's think this over, all right. So let me give you some of my feedback too. Right, there was a sleep course, all right, and I thought, okay, cool, I'll go ahead and I'll go, I'll support the symptom. Nobody's talking about causes, and that bugs me to high end. And there was a children's neurologist in a very, very prestigious hospital Boston I think it is who said yes, said yes, I mean it's all fine and good. Because they said, oh, don't worry about it, you know. And then she said no, no, no, I think she has a point. ⁣ ⁣ 28:34⁣ Yes, so the thing that is that, all right, if you go ahead, you think about all the systems that are shut down because you can't breathe. Right, the order appliance isn't going to fix it, the c-pap is definitely not going to fix it, because what's going to happen is the body's going to acclimatize or get used to that level of band-aiding. And then it's like okay, you know what it is, the little dutch boy with his finger came to mind with a dab. So you put one finger here and then you put one finger here, and then you put one finger here and then you put one finger here and you put one finger and then you're not gonna have enough fingers or toes and then the dam's gonna break. And it's exactly the same concept, because if you go ahead and you the the concept of an oral appliance okay to come back again and I'm showing the picture to mount moderate c, pap. Yeah, it's called a mandibular advancement device, or MAD for short, right, okay, well, what does that do? It brings the lower jaw forward. Why? Because the tongue is attached to the front of the lower jaw. So you bring the lower jaw forward. All right, so that's the mandibular advancement device. Well, how far are you going to be able to break the jaw out of socket? Eventually? No, because if you don't address the root cause, you're going to have inflammation. ⁣ ⁣ 29:55⁣ So that airway that's already restricted, be it because of diet, because of environment, because of whatever. You have large tonsils which are supposed to be there as buckets to hold whatever pathogens or whatever bugs that are in the air or that you're eating, or whatever. They're the engines that are holding the foot down, if you will, the soles, whichever. They're the ones that protect you so things don't go to your lungs, but eventually they get overwhelmed, and that's when your airway is so closed up by these massive tonsils. And then again let's take them out. Surgery to remove tonsils. All right, did that too? All right. ⁣ ⁣ 30:34⁣ So I know I'm jumping everywhere right now, but I'm trying to go by the anatomy. If you'll follow, there's a process to my reasoning here. So the dentist will say say okay, let's do a manageable advancement device for mild to moderate sleep apnea, but that's not treating the root cause. All right. The sleep doctor will say you need a CPAP because it's severe sleep apnea. But that's not also treating the root cause. ⁣ ⁣ 31:05⁣ Because somewhere along the line, if you don't have a nasal what we could call a patent nasal passage or passageway to get air through your nose, all right then. And or if you're doing a CPAP to push air down your mouth which you should be breathing in your mouth anyhow then you're still not getting the air, the quality of air you need. As a sidekick, just so you know, when you breathe through your nose, you actually develop nitric oxide. It's a gas, all right that you develop. You create it. As a human, we create nitric oxide in our sinuses. When you don't nose breathe, you're not getting your nitric oxide, which means that your vessels are getting hotter faster, you age faster. All right, none of that's going to happen with a CPAP and none of that's going to happen with the appliance, because three months down the road there's just so much that you could advancement that you can do. There's just so much titration with a level of pressurization with a CPAP that you can do, and eventually you're back to square one. ⁣ ⁣ 32:10⁣ Okay, well then now let's do orthognathic surgery to bring your jaws forward. And then that's when you have another issue, because now you're locked in. So let's tie back that in. With the anatomy, remember I showed you, and for those of you who can't see, the skull is not fixed. There's lots and lots and lots and lots of little sutures. That's why I was saying there's dozens and dozens and dozens of bones, but they're all connected, and the cranium, the housing of the cranium, but there's lots of them underneath, all right, under the skull, all right. So what happens is all these bones actually pulse. That's called the cranial sacral rhythm. All right, that's where cranial sacral therapy would be really good. That's where you unfortunately have issues because you have screws holding your face. Your facial plates are held together, right, so we're trying to go through all the systems and the scenarios here. ⁣ ⁣ 33:08⁣ An ideal person who hasn't had surgery can have all these little bones changed. Because they're not fused together. They are not fused together. They are not fused together. What did you hear me say? They're not fused together, they are not fused together. So if anybody says that you cannot expand your palate because you're over nine run, it's not true. I expanded, I've done an arch expansion on an 83 year old all right. ⁣ ⁣ 33:41 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I actually had a conversation with a dentist who told me that women they're finding and tell me if what your thought is on this the palate of a woman actually is able to expand for much longer than we originally thought years wise like it, and maybe I'm saying this wrong, but she even had a palate expander in the top and she's in her 50s. So I'm curious, I mean, is that an approach to try? So can I guy it's a human period. Anyone can. Anyone. Okay. ⁣ ⁣ 34:11 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ A human can have. Now I don't know if there's going to be a sex differentiation for the progression of the of the treatment. The treatment I don't know, but any human can have their arches expanded, short of having a disorder of one sort or the other, but in general you can have the arches expanding because the bones are not fused. Right, it's not here, it's here. Let's talk about why you can develop a palatal expansion and growth. All right, this is a totally misunderstood concept. All right, remember we talked about the roof of the mouth is the floor of the nose, and this is magnetic. So bear with me, that's why it was all all catawanka earlier on. So in here you have what we call the nasal passages and you have a thing called turbinates, right? So if you look at it, there's little windmills in here. So you have anterior, middle and posterior nasal passages too, and here you have what we call the sinus, the maxillary sinuses. Here you have the frontal sinuses, all right, okay. ⁣ ⁣ 35:14⁣ So how arch expansion works? And this is why you do slow. Slow is good what you do. Remember this is magnetic, so it might be a little hard for me to do. You go ahead, you do a little bit. All right, you do a little bit and then you wait, then that goes ahead and creates bone. Then you do a little bit, then it creates bone, you do a little bit and it creates bone and so, slowly but surely, you've created the arch that is wider, because it happens in the middle. All right, if you go too fast, what happens is you end up having extrusion of the teeth, or the flaring of the teeth and or what we call the buckle plate perforations, which is what the orthodontist freaked out about. You're going to flare out the teeth because you're going too fast. ⁣ ⁣ 36:07 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Well, how long does something like that take normally? What is that process? ⁣ ⁣ 36:11 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ They do what the orthodontist usually do, what they call rapid palatal expansion. Slow is the best thing. Do a little bit grow bone. Do a little bit grow bone. Do a little bit grow bone. Do a little bit grow bone. Guess what happens, unless you have a septal spur which acts like a handcuff to hold that nasal passage, that septum tied up to another bone on the side. If you don't have a septal spur, that deviated septum just lines right down. That's what happened with me and I was in my fifties I was over 55 when I did mine. If you go ahead and you do slowly, you can expand an arch. Now there's a school out there that says let's do it in a month and then we wait six months. I'd say okay. That to me sounds so wrong and this is my humble opinion, for each time I'm giving you anything. These are my humble opinions and what I've learned and what I've read and my interpretation of everything. ⁣ ⁣ 37:13⁣ Okay, of course, but if you're going to go ahead and you're going to go like zip and then wait, go ahead and you're going to go like zip and then wait, all right. The big fallacy with that is you zipped and you waited six months and that space, in theory, is supposed to grow bone. Uh-uh, it fills up with collagen. That is why, when you go too fast and kids or whom on whom, no matter what age, if you go too fast, you end up with a ton of relapse. So, slow, a little bit grow bone, a little bit grow bone, a little bit grow bone, a little bit grow bone. ⁣ ⁣ 37:49 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Now you have success now, this is just one approach. Right, the palette expansion is just one approach okay, that's the transverse approach. ⁣ ⁣ 37:58 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ So if you're doing this in 3d, you have to think your garage right, because you have width, you have depth and then you have length. Well, it's the same thing. This is the width. The transverse effect is the width. All right, now we have the sagittal aspect, which is from the side, so that's where two to for example, if I'm not mistaken that your issues came from, is that if you look at my profile and they said that this part of you was there, but this part of you was too far forward, so I'm going to exaggerate now, like that, right? ⁣ ⁣ 38:36 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That's exactly what it was like, right. ⁣ ⁣ 38:38 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ It wasn't that this was too far forward. It can be, but in reality it's that this was underdeveloped. So that's the side view, or the sagittal view. Nine times out of 10, if you have an airway issue, it's because you're overclosed, and then you need height, and that's when we can go ahead and do height. Interestingly enough, oral appliances the same one that they advocate to go ahead and do the mandible advancement devices the same thing. There's two things that they do. When they're doing a sleep appliance, what are they? Protraction vertical, but they're doing the protraction with the lower jaw only and vertical. They're putting the special amount of vertical or the height into the appliances. ⁣ ⁣ 39:27 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Acrylic Now there's a lot of information that we're sharing with folks. I'm taking in a lot of information. I do want to mention real quick that Dr Stack has a new book that just came out, called Smile. It's all connected whole health through balance. I'm going to put a link on there in the podcast notes, rather to grab that book, because this is really something that was written for the everyday person to understand. It's not like reading a medical guide or anything like that. ⁣ ⁣ 39:56⁣ You will be able to go to an upset or an issue that you might be confronted with, learn more about it because, as we were saying before, what gets measured gets managed. But also we have to be our own healthcare advocates and then find the right kind of people to support you, because obviously you can't fix the problem yourself, but you can support yourself in that. And also I know you have a children's book and that's Captain IFBI. I in that. And also I know you have a children's book and that's Captain IFBI. I love that Right encouraging good oral hygiene habits, which, by the way, that ties in with the download that you're offering as well, which is the dental protocol checklist, and I love that. We're going to put all that in the podcast notes so that folks that are tuning in or if they're watching on YouTube because you know you're showing us some fun stuff on visual they'll have the option to either listen to this anywhere we have podcasts and also on YouTube. ⁣ ⁣ 40:46⁣ But, on that note, if you feel that this podcast episode with Dr Claire Staggs inspiring you anyway, touches you anyway, if you know anyone who might be confronted with any of these upsets whether it's sleep apnea, whether it is TMJ or any kind of upset that you might be dealing with, the dental side of your life, or even breathing this is something you can pass along to somebody, share it, let them have the knowledge and make a decision where they want to go next, because we definitely are sharing some really good information here and I really appreciate it. ⁣ ⁣ 41:18⁣ Dr Sags, I know we're talking a lot about my upset, but I know there are other people out there that are dealing with the sleep issues, the sleep apnea, the breathing, the grinding, the bruxing, and wanting to change the holistic approach to dentistry. You're just a normal person, sweetie. I'm just like everybody else. I know I am, and it's one of the reasons why I do this show, because many of the things that I'm facing or have seen with clients is something I want to talk about so that I can make this a vessel for others to get answers or at least find something that they could take away from this and hopefully make a choice that helps them become a happy and healthy grownup, you know. ⁣ ⁣ 42:03 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ So let's talk about the book. This book was written. It's taken me 10 years to get it out here. All right, this book was written for the average lay person. It's a conversation from one mom to all the other moms who have asked me questions. ⁣ ⁣ 42:21⁣ All these years I've been practicing. I graduated in 1982. So I've been at this for a long time. I came to this country in 87. So I was not of American training per se, so I have had different training. I'm also very outside the box thinker and I like to ask why? So why do you want me to do it this way? Give me a reason why I should do it that way. ⁣ ⁣ 42:47⁣ So the whole idea was to understand that, yes, why are these patients getting better? Why is there cacophony? Why is there not harmony? Why do they have all these issues all the time that they haven't had resolution for and that I have not been able to finger point. That's when I went down my training what's going on? What's going on, what's going on. ⁣ ⁣ 43:10⁣ So the book's goal is to go ahead and to change the demand. Because my what? To educate the demand, if you will, because the more people are educated in this is the more they'll understand what's actually going on. It's for you to be your own advocate in your own choices. Just like Hilary at 15 did not know any better or any know what to do or not not to do, her mom or parents didn't know, because they followed their, the advice of their physicians, which is okay, don't get me wrong. You know, but why don't you find out? If you go ahead and you're playing a game of poker, wouldn't it be nice to know your hand instead of playing blind? You know what I mean. ⁣ ⁣ 43:58⁣ So this, this book, has the entire deck in it. This is what I'm trying to say. It's written with you for everything, everything that Hilary and I have talked about, and I think one if you have the book, you will see anything about airway, you'll see about joints, you'll see about teeth, you'll see about muscles, you'll see about nerves, how it used to be, how it is and what the connections are structural, chemical, mechanical, functional, emotional, spiritual, because we're all one. And then in the future, where I think dentistry should and could be. But I think and I know that if we change the demand, the supply will have to change, because the more the moms and the dads and all of us understand how this is connected. They're going to have to teach doctors how to connect the dots too. So that was the goal of this book is to change the way dentistry is perceived and experienced in the world and then change the world for a healthier, better place people to be healthy so they don't have to suffer like a Hilary. ⁣ ⁣ 45:04 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, I so needed. I wish my parents had this back in the 80s when I had this surgery, even though it was different back then. We've progressed, we've gotten better, we're more knowledgeable, we have more tools available to us and science and approaches, but it's here now and if my what is the saying? Someday your story can be somebody else's survival guide. I use that one a lot. I know that's Brene Brown. ⁣ ⁣ 45:26 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ That's a good one, yeah. ⁣ ⁣ 45:27 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, and I'm hoping that this next stage of my own journey is much less invasive and more productive. It's finding ways. So having conversations with doctors like yourself, people who practice more of a holistic and whole body approach and aren't really running right to surgeries and appliances and everything that might not be the best plan, you know. It's constructing the plan building the house and realizing what size garage is really going to fit and what kind of cars do you have for that garage. ⁣ ⁣ 46:03 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ Right, because there's different appliances too, so there's different arrows in your quiver, because you want to shoot for the bullseye every time, right, and that's that's where I did all that additional training. It's like, okay, okay, so we have a joint issue. Well, well, let's deal with a joint, but then you can't disconnect the tongue and the space that the tongue holds. And then, okay, so now I do tie releases. So, and not everybody's going to practice the way that I practice this. ⁣ ⁣ 46:33⁣ This is my passion, though, and you talked about your survival journey. My daughter fell and hit her chin when she was three and a half, and that's where she hit her chin, which automatically put her jaw joints up and back, got her disc displaced. So here I am searching for answers back in 2003, 2004. And that's where I ended up. So, yes, I was doing the chemical aspect, where we were mercury free, we were doing all the nutrition, everything. But then it's like, how do I fix my child, how do I get her to not be in pain too? And so that's where it's like, okay, let's do this, let's figure out how we can make this happen. And so that was my journey to go ahead and to put that together for all the other parents who would have these questions. ⁣ ⁣ 47:22 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, and interestingly enough, here you are, a dentist, being confronted with something that you think, oh, I have the answers because I'm a dentist At least it happened to a dentist's daughter and you're looking for the approaches that are going to help her heal and live her best life the best way possible. ⁣ ⁣ 47:39 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ So you know, it makes me laugh too. I guess I'm getting very spicy today. I like spicy, dr Staggs Very spicy. So I remember I had this 83,. He's 90-something now, but he was clearly apneic. I mean his lips were blue, all right, his he had no airway, really, really bad. And so I told, I told him you know why don't you do a sleep screening? No, no, no, my doctor blah, blah, blah. So I went ahead and I said okay, ask your doctor to go ahead and send you to lab and have a sleep test. So he goes ahead and he tells his physician that and his physician says what does she know? She's just a dentist, yeah. ⁣ ⁣ 48:29 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Aye, aye, aye, aye, aye. I wish we could all just get along and work together. So anyhow, that's my two cents again. ⁣ ⁣ 48:38 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ So don't read a book by its cover and look for somebody who understands how it's all connected and there's going to be more of us. There are more of us, it's just you don't know where to find them. ⁣ ⁣ 48:49 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ So what I want to do real quick in closing, I usually do a game with all of my guests, and what I've been doing is I pull you're going to have a little fun and what I've been doing is I pull you're going to have a little fun. This is what we do here. Not everything's so serious. I'm going to throw out a word, something you said today, and I want you to come back with the first word that comes to mind. Just a quick word association game. ⁣ ⁣ 49:08⁣ I already want to say happy. Say happy as much as you want. But if I say the word holistic, what's the first word that comes to mind? Body, jaw, oh God, pain, palate, growth, airway, life, dentist, happy. ⁣ ⁣ 49:28 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ Smile, beautiful Happy. ⁣ ⁣ 49:30 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Beautiful. Love that. I love that you focus on the word happy. Just be your own healthcare advocate. You know we don't, we don't have to throw out a name. There are a number of things out there that are good and there are a number of things out there that are not so good, and you have to be your own healthcare advocate to make that choice. ⁣ ⁣ 49:47 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ And things can work different strokes for different folks. I mean it could be the best thing, anything could be the best thing for anybody. It's just that sometimes, when you don't know any different, you wish that had you known, had I known. Had I known, had I known I wouldn't have done it this way that's kind of where I am. ⁣ ⁣ 50:06 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I wish I knew at 15. So I'm hoping that what you shared, I know we'll have more conversations because I'm on a route where I'm going to be looking for approaches uh, because unfortunately we're not in the same area, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't hop a flight to come down to Florida, by the way, no, you still can. I can, I can, but I'm gonna. I know you have a tight schedule, a lot of people to talk to, everybody is. You're in high demand, dr Stagg, and for good reason, and I'm just so grateful to have you here. ⁣ ⁣ 50:35 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ I am eternally grateful to you interviewers, because you have platforms that you can spread the word to the world, because you're the ones, basically, that are going to change. I'm just, I'm just flotsam on the ripple of the of the thing you know. I'm just like, hey, go this way, go this way, go this way. ⁣ ⁣ 50:55 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ We're all in it together as you said, it's all connected, we're all connected. So if we can do anything to help others, that's what we're here for and I'm just so grateful for you. Thank you so much. Thank you too. ⁣ ⁣ 51:06 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ And thank you for having me. And so, on a one little note, I was like this is my last little saying in the book, which has lots of little life lessons. My one is that you're not a drop in the ocean, you're the entire ocean in a drop. So blessings, Hilhillary, I love you. Thank you so much. ⁣ ⁣ 51:24 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I love you too. Thank you for being part of the ripple. ⁣ ⁣ 51:28 - Dr. Claire Stagg (Guest)⁣ Thank you. ⁣ ⁣ 51:29 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I know we unpacked a lot, I know there's a lot going on here with Dr Stagg, but for good reason and we are not done. Next, I want you to grab a copy of Dr Stagg's book Smile it's all connected whole health through balance, plus her children's book that she has Captain IFBI, as well as her checklist to download for daily dental protocol. All of this is in the podcast notes and, if anything resonated with you that we shared here on the show, if you were touched, moved and inspired by our conversation, if you have more questions, dr Stagg is actually holding a Q&A online on Wednesday, july 17th, at 7 pm Eastern time. It's a really great chance to connect with her again, maybe follow up on some of the things we talked about, or if you have your own questions, and get to the root of your dental journey no pun intended with that one and you can get some more knowledge, because knowledge is power. Right, what gets measured gets managed. So be your own healthcare advocate. ⁣ ⁣ 52:30⁣ First, and you know I share a lot about my havening journey, how it has been a big part of my chronic pain. My TMJ and I want to offer you the opportunity to try Havening and see if it works for you. This is a really wonderful way to overcome fears. If you have a fear of going to the dentist or the doctor or even managing chronic pain, or maybe you just wanted to self-soothe, to self-regulate, for daily self-care, it's a wonderful tool to put in your toolbox and I'd be happy to have a conversation with you and see if it's right for you. A link to connect with me is also in the podcast notes. ⁣ ⁣ 53:07⁣ HIListically Speaking is edited by 2MarketMedia with music by Lipo Redding, and I know you tune in week after week because you want answers, you want to find ways to be a happy and healthy grownup, and I'm here for you and I just want you to know that those traumas that you're turning into triumphs, they're happening, they're in motion and I am proud of you. I believe in you, I love you and I will see you soon. Be well. ⁣

Nervous system medicine practitioner, Karden Rabin, shares his journey through chronic pain, discussing healing through the body's secret language. Topics include opioids, trauma, emotions, healing tools, serendipitous encounters, and a rapid fire game. Learn about regulating the nervous system for true healing.

Melissa Hiemann had her 'awakening' back in 2014 when she realized after years of avoiding her traumas through addictions and instant gratification, she was repeating bad behaviors and avoiding the root cause of her pain. ⁣ Nearly failing out of school and focusing on limited beliefs, she realized something had to give. ⁣ ⁣ That wake-up call lead her on a new path of discovery and inner healing. Now, through her Centre for Healing, she's helping others find their future peace today, by raising consciousness through manifesting and being trauma-informed.⁣ ⁣ On this episode of HIListically Speaking, we get to the root of what's holding you back and weighing you down, discover different energetic hygiene approaches and pave the way for abundant living. ⁣ ⁣DOWNLOAD AND TUNE IN TO THIS CONVERSATION ON ANY PODCAST PLATFORM OR YOUTUBE! ⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast ⁣ https://www.youtube.com/hilaryrusso⁣ ⁣ CHAPTERS/KEY MOMENTS⁣ 00:00 Intro and Your Future Peace⁣ 01:47 Root Cause of Addictions and instant gratification⁣ 09:15 Unexpected Journey and Finding Purpose ⁣ 11:38 Maintaining Energetic Hygiene for Practitioners⁣ 14:10 Importance of Professionalism and Self-Care⁣ 19:13 Setting Boundaries and Self-Care in Work⁣ 22:35 Importance of Trauma-Informed Certification ⁣ 30:00 Rapid Fire Game⁣ 32:58 Healing Generational Trauma and Self-Regulation⁣ 36:24 Trauma-Informed Healing Resources ⁣ ⁣CONNECT WITH MELISSA⁣ https://www.facebook.com/groups/thecentreforhealing ⁣ https://www.instagram.com/thecentreforhealing/⁣ https://www.youtube.com/@thecentreforhealing⁣ https://www.linkedin.com/in/melissahiemann/⁣ GRAB HER BOOK ON AMAZON!⁣Natural High: Secrets to Overcoming Instant Gratification and Finding Inner Peace https://amzn.to/3yPTwxR⁣⁣ CENTER FOR HEALING COURSES⁣ (Use code HILARY for a 10% discount on any course) https://www.thecentreforhealing.com/a/43957/58GLXrgy ⁣ PUT THE HEALING IN YOUR HANDS WITH HAVENING ⁣https://www.hilaryrusso.com/havening⁣⁣ CONNECT WITH HILARY⁣ https://www.instagram.com/hilaryrusso⁣ https://www.youtube.com/hilaryrusso⁣ https://www.facebook.com/hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.tiktok.com/@hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ Music by Lipbone Redding https://lipbone.com/⁣ TRANSCRIPT⁣ 00:07 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ A lot of people. They reach out for things outside of themselves to try and feel okay, to try and feel safe in their body, and so those can be instant things like addictions, like I had shopping addictions. I had heroin, marijuana, alcohol, cigarettes, anything I could do in the moment to not feel how I was feeling. I was just jumping to it because I didn't know how to escape how I was feeling in the moment and so when I had those things I felt good for a little bit. But what happens is you ruin your future peace. ⁣ ⁣ 00:40 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Let's get to the root cause Now. I know that that term is thrown around a lot right, root cause? And in the world of functional medicine and holistic medicine, it's about going beyond the diagnosis or the surface, or really getting to the heart of things, the soul of what is holding you back and weighing you down. One of the things I love about HIListically Speaking is having guests come on the show who are experts in their field, but they share their own journeys, right. They're getting to their own root cause, their soul, and turning their own traumas into triumphs. ⁣ ⁣ 01:17⁣ Melissa Hiemann she has been on her own awakening journey and she started that back in 2014. And, melissa, you nearly failed out of school. You struggled with addictions addictions and I use that with an S on the end and from those traumas you learned how to heal your limiting beliefs and now, as a therapist, you help others do that every day. It is such a pleasure to have you here and being really open to talk about the root cause and how we can change those traumas into triumphs. Thanks for being here. ⁣ ⁣ 01:48⁣ Thank you so much for having me on. It's a pleasure. I want to really talk about the root cause of things, because we haven't covered that topic, but also the fact that you have dealt with numerous addictions, not just one. I've had people come on the show talking about one thing, but it goes back to this book that you wrote called Natural High Secrets to Overcoming Instant Gratification and then Finding the Inner Peace. So can we go there? First, because I think in this world of instant gratification, which we get that from the internet, we get that from different addictions and the internet can be one of them. Now we get that from different addictions and the internet can be one of them. Now, how are you working with people in this area from your own experiences? ⁣ ⁣ 02:30 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ Yeah, sure. So yeah, from my own experience of overcoming my addictions and going on my own healing journey, as you mentioned, I came to realize I wasn't willing to sit in my body with how I was feeling. And so an outcome of that and a symptom of that, is that either we jump up into our head, we try and intellectualize everything and also we try to numb out how we're feeling, because essentially we're all trying to feel good, right, we're all trying to feel peaceful and happy and like, obviously. And so when we don't feel like that and if we don't have the tools for several root cause reasons, if we don't have the tools to soothe ourselves, if we don't have the tools to feel our emotions, we don't feel safe to feel our emotions, then a lot of people they reach out for things outside of themselves to try and feel okay, to try and feel safe in their body, and so those can be instant things like addictions. ⁣ ⁣ 03:28⁣ Like I had shopping addictions. I had heroin, marijuana, alcohol, cigarettes, anything I could do in the moment to not feel how I was feeling. I was just jumping to it because I didn't know how to escape how I was feeling in the moment. And so when I had those things. I felt good for a little bit, you know, but what happens is you ruin your future peace because I've just spent all my money, I've just I've got to hang over the next day, I've taken away from my future self feeling okay, because I wanted that instant gratification, I wanted to feel better now, and I didn't know, I didn't have the tools to know how to do that, and so that took me on a huge journey of then discovering how to heal, to feel my emotions, to be able to process them, to be able to not project it onto everyone else. And then, yeah, this whole journey took me through a lot of modalities and it took me to wanting to help others and give this really valuable information to others that are struggling or they have family members that are struggling. ⁣ ⁣ 04:36 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, you mentioned. You didn't want it to ruin your future peace. That hit me. You didn't want it to ruin your future peace. That hit me. You didn't want it to ruin your future peace. So there was a wake up call, apparently. What was that about? ⁣ ⁣ 04:51 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ Oh my gosh. So the wake up call I was sitting in my little apartment on the beach and I had my sports car and I had my corporate job and you know, externally my life looked amazing. But in, in reality, I was in that little apartment because I had left my abusive relationship. I had been with someone else to help myself leave that relationship because I was so insecure. And I remember the day that I moved, the other guy was like I can't do this. ⁣ ⁣ 05:19⁣ And I remember sitting there like so depressed and so sad, looking out at the water, thinking maybe I'm the lowest common denominator here, like why does this keep happening? You know, and I had no awareness I had, I was just, you know, blaming everyone else. I was like the whim of everyone else and I was like I think I need to get help, like and at that point maybe I had seen a counselor once. I was all about just like being positive, making sure I look good on the outside and kind of just pushing, sucking it up and pushing it through and and, and you know, part of that was I was probably looking at the water, drinking or whatever I was doing, and I that's the first time I reached out for for help, because I was like again I, that I probably have a part in this more than I realize and, and maybe you know, and I well, that's the wake up call, right? ⁣ ⁣ 06:12 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I mean part of that is the awareness. The first step to any change is awareness and to be able to sit back and be like perhaps this is something that I need to take responsibility for and stop blaming everything outside of self. ⁣ ⁣ 06:26 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ Exactly that. Yeah, that was huge yeah. ⁣ ⁣ 06:30 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, and maybe, maybe blame isn't the right word because then we're just shaming ourselves, but just taking accountability and responsibility that you want to have a better future right as you. Better future peace. Yeah that what's not working. Maybe I'm part of not seeing what could be working, so how did that lead you to the work that you're doing now, and especially the root cause therapy method? ⁣ ⁣ 06:54 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ Yeah, so yeah, this would be like 2013,. 2014 I'm talking about. So it was quite a while ago, but I did. I, I, a friend, had um come over and he was like you should contact this other guy. He's like into this life coaching or something. Now I'm like sure I'll message him and have a chat, you know. ⁣ ⁣ 07:12⁣ Anyway, I organized a session and it wasn't just a chat, it was a deeply transformational regression, inner child healing experience, and I walked out just never the same person again, just becoming conscious of my subconscious, of my unconscious, of these patterns that were playing out in the background. Because, honestly, I thought yesterday and the past was just in the past I didn't realize it was still playing out in the now. I had no awareness of that. And so when I walked out of that session, I was like wow. And I remember two weeks later he's like I'm running a course, I'm training people in it, and at the time I was in a sales job because I knew I wanted a business. I just didn't know what kind. I'm like I need to learn sales. So I remember doing that course and halfway through it hit me like a lightning bolt. I don't know for those of you that you just found your purpose in the middle of something. It literally felt like a lightning bolt went through my body, yes, and I was like this is what I'm meant to be doing. I'm meant to be helping people get out of their own way. ⁣ ⁣ 08:17⁣ And I remember just healing like kind of one limiting belief, this fear of failure and I had been working on a business in the background like a jewelry business for a year and in healing that one belief, within two weeks I had finished designing the product, got it in production, started like selling it like so quickly and I'm like, oh my gosh, people just get in their own way. I was just getting in my own way, like I need to help people get out of their own way as well, like I, honestly, I grew up thinking that I was dumb and I grew up thinking that I couldn't learn like other people and there was something wrong with me. But actually I was just disassociated because I didn't feel safe growing up. There was quite a bit of trauma and I took on the beliefs that people told me. ⁣ ⁣ 08:56⁣ So starting to shift them, starting to feel my emotions, starting to become aware of my behaviors, that I was doing to try and escape how I was feeling Like it just opened up a whole new world for me. So I became certified as soon as I could and I just did not stop studying. All of a sudden I was a bookworm. All of a sudden I cut out half the people in my life and I'm just like surrounded by books and videos and like I'm like, give me more, you know. And that's kind of where it started, yeah. ⁣ ⁣ 09:27 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, it's amazing how we can look back on where we were five years ago, 10 years ago, and think I never thought in a million years I would be doing this. You know, I think about that myself because my background being a journalist. But the traumas of being in journalism especially when you're dealing with stories from 9-11 or just traumatic conversations that moved me into this work or just stuff that we've dealt with in life, and it's kind of like a pop, right. You're like what am I doing? How can I leave this world better? Right. And then you're like I never thought I'd be doing this. But if you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans. ⁣ ⁣ 10:04 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ I'd be doing this, but if you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans. Yes, yeah, totally, and I think that when you start to do any kind of therapy or like healing well, you do tend to expand outside of you just being in the survival, like looking after yourself, and as you expand, you're like I want to serve people. Now, like I'm, I have this huge yearning to like heal people and help as many people as I can, and I think it's beautiful and I think it's amazing. ⁣ ⁣ 10:29⁣ whatever industry that we're in, you can just tell when people are really passionate and they're lit up and they're like on this, on this path, you know and so, yeah, I just, I just love, but I particularly love our space as well, because I'm, I know, like until I'm 100 I'll probably still find things to heal, but I'm forever expanding to be of service, you know, and then in turn, then we can pass that wisdom on to the people around us and onto our clients and the people that we're mentoring, and it's just a beautiful ripple effect. ⁣ ⁣ 11:03 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And we don't own it. That's the thing Like everything that we effect and we don't own it. That's the thing Like everything that we're learning we don't own. So even if you're developing a course or a certification, or you're sharing a modality or an approach, or you're helping somebody else heal their traumas or upsets, we're not healing them, we're just guiding them, we're supporting them, but we don't own the process. You know, and we see a lot of people out there coaching and doing their thing, and there are many that are doing for the right reasons, and then there are some that are doing it for reasons that are not so beneficial of the person they are serving. So how do you differentiate yourself? To make sure people know I'm coming from an authentic space yourself, to make sure? ⁣ ⁣ 11:44 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ people know I'm coming from an authentic space. Yeah, definitely. So that's something that I found out of my training. I kind of went into a session going OK, obviously I want to make money and things like that. But I was like I've been given a bunch of tools what is the protocol here to actually run a really effective session? So my clients are getting so much out of it. ⁣ ⁣ 12:04⁣ Because my first few sessions I was like I look back and I think that could have gone so much better, like obviously we're always learning and things like that. But I had to put it, structure it together myself, and so one of like a part of my mission is to help as many people that are healers and therapists to do what they love full time, and a part of that was to go what did I actually need when I got training to run the best sessions that I can? So my clients are walking away. They know they got something out of it, because this work can be really intangible, like I think I feel better, you know, and that can be like talk therapy, like oh, I think I feel better, I think I feel worse, I don't know. I'm kind of walking around on the surface, and so what I did was I created this structure for not only for clients but for the practitioners to feel really confident, to be able to run a really holistic session looking at the whole person and then to be able to find the root cause through this structure and then. ⁣ ⁣ 13:00⁣ So my path is like international business freight, like it was completely different, but what I got out of that was that I was really good at in terms of collecting data and looking at data changes. So what I did was I was like, as a practitioner and as a client, for you to see the exact changes that have happened over each session. So we call it the testing sheet and we can actually see, with the client's feedback, including muscle testing, including just how they're feeling and and, somatically, what's coming up for them. We can see and manage the priorities of what we can work on in each session and what has actually been shifted, like we actually have data from each session and so we can actually show the client or tell the client and actually prioritize what's best to work on. What have we already worked through? Um, and so that's kind of like the, the heart of root cause therapy. ⁣ ⁣ 13:51⁣ It's like making it a much more tangible process and looking at someone on all levels of consciousness, their conscious mind their subconscious, their physical body, their mental body, um, and so yeah, it's a, it's that, and that's not including the actual healing part of it, the actual going to the root cause. But that's such an important piece because I really want more professionalism in the space. I wanted people to know that they were safe with their practitioner. So, like in my training there's a lot of training around like that, how to manage your clients properly like I've had coaching sessions where they're just like here's a calendar link, like there's no intake form, there's no like proper structure, like oh yeah, like they might email you after, like no, I want this to be a really safe container where we know I'm with someone that knows what they're doing. We teach the method, but we also teach the business side of that to be really ethical and really give that credibility. ⁣ ⁣ 14:50 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I love that we're touching on this area of how to serve the practitioner and the coach. I mean, I was just telling you when we were before we pressed record that I just finished doing a two-day conference where I was emcee and also presenting to healers, to healers, coaches, practitioners, because we're really the first ones to not think about taking care of ourselves. And one of the areas that I focus on a lot is secondary traumatic stress, because we think it's burnout, we think we're just overwhelmed and rarely, when you're doing trauma work especially, you don't realize that you might be just like a sponge. You're taking in some of what you're hearing, some of what another person's trauma is that primary duress right. So we need more conversations like this, especially for practitioners, caregivers, coaches, therapists, doctors that yes, you are in service to others, but how beautiful is it that you are taking care of yourself so that you can show up 100% for someone else and stop putting yourself on the back burner, you know. ⁣ ⁣ 15:52 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ Absolutely, I mean so. ⁣ ⁣ 15:54⁣ My partner and I in 2016 opened an outpatient mental health and addiction center, so we were not only dealing and helping people with their addictions, but also we would include their their main family members or their partner, whoever was mainly their person and so there was a lot of that and we were working 12 hour days and I remember this older lady that, um, we had like infranutrition things and she was like you guys need to get massages, you guys need to slow down, like you can't, like people need you, and at the time I was like, whatever, I was like I'm fine, and we were just pushing through and working crazy hours and managing all the staff and like, obviously like dealing with inquiries and hearing all the stories and doing the healing. So we're like, yeah, like you said, like secondary trauma, witnessing with the client the traumas that they went through, like in some of them, you know, obviously horrific, and like kind of processing that and doing our own work at the same time. And yeah, and we did, we got to the point after like four and a half years where, like after I had a child as well, after I had a baby, that changed my priority of like looking after myself and having time. And that's why we kind of shifted over to teaching online courses, not only being able to help more people around the world, but to actually look after ourselves a little bit. Because it was, it was, yeah, I was getting to the point of burnout and I was getting sick a lot and I was dysregulated, like sometimes I was getting really angry and really frustrated and and that's like not the approach that I want to have. ⁣ ⁣ 17:30⁣ I'm the center for healing, like we're meant to be baseball and I'm like we need to practice what we preach here. So I so resonate with that and, yeah, part of like the training for our students is that energetic hygiene, you know, energetically, like before a session, grounding yourself, being able to hold space for them, an empathetic space, but not trying to take on what's coming up and letting the client process it and, like you said, being a guide. And then, after a session, like little things, like just getting doing your notes, just like getting it out, so you're not thinking about it for days after, having your own little ritual to help clear the space. And it might be also little things like increasing your prices a little bit so you have less clients. So there's so many little elements that you can do to find that that work-life balance because the work is is so important like the world needs us. So, yeah, like you said, we do need to make sure that our cup is full so then we don't have empathy, burnout and things like that so important. ⁣ ⁣ 18:31 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Energetic hygiene. Energetic hygiene, that is a great way of putting it. So let's talk about some of those energetic hygiene approaches that we can do for those who are in the caregiving practitioner doctors, therapists, you know what, anyone because it doesn't matter what your, what field you're in, you're always going to be hearing other people's stuff right, whether you do it for a living or not. So let's go through maybe like five things people can do. You just mentioned a couple. You mentioned saying yes to that massage, doing your notes right away, doing a little self care right, doing the notes right away rather than waiting. Name a couple others. I'm curious. ⁣ ⁣ 19:13 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ Yeah, so other things would be well, like I said, just increasing your prices a little bit, just so that, and not feeling bad about that. I mean some people like to do a sliding scale, which means sometimes you charge certain demographics one price, but I found that I just I had to do that to honor my time and that allowed me to have like a couple of hours in the day to chill and watch Netflix or just that's self-care, to chill and watch Netflix or just that's self-care. ⁣ ⁣ 19:40⁣ That is self-care especially for those of us that, like we're always like I need you to be doing something with work, like no, you can be a normal person as well and just like binge a little bit, and that's fine. You know, on your favorite show and the other things I would say is that and this is a word that gets thrown around so much with boundaries but just getting really clear on what works for you in terms of maybe there's only certain times of the day where you have the most energy, like the best energy. So for some people it might be 4pm onwards, so that's fine. Make your availability 4pm onwards, and why I say boundaries? Because some of us go. Your availability 4p onwards. And why I say boundaries? Because some of us go. ⁣ ⁣ 20:23⁣ Well, I just need to be available when clients need me, so I'm going to jump on it anytime, even if it doesn't suit my I know, like when I have good energy and not good energy, and so honoring that and holding to that and not being scared that they're not going to book with you or not being scared that you're not going to make enough money because of that. If you really like, own that and go. No, these are. I only work Thursday, friday and Saturday um for consultations. Whatever industry that you're in, try your best to make it suit how you work, because otherwise you will get burnt out and you will get resentful and I think that does come through um with whatever you're doing to the clients as well. So that's super important. And I did touch on ritual a little bit and it depends how woo-woo you are, how spiritual you are. But you know I've got stuff like this space clearing spray. You know that I just spray around me. I like to smell some essential oil to kind of ground me. ⁣ ⁣ 21:21⁣ Sometimes I'm like I just need to go outside and just be near a tree or something like I just and just grounding grounding and I would say the number one thing and we do offer supervision in our courses is that have someone that you can talk to about your sessions, to decompress and just to debrief. We were really lucky at the Healing Center because all our officers were near each other like, oh my God, I want to tell you about the session, blah, blah, blah. We were able to debrief, but it's not so easy, especially with client confidentiality. You don't want to just like tell your partner about your whole client's session. So having someone that, whether they're a co-worker, like someone that is doing the same method as you. ⁣ ⁣ 22:04⁣ It could be someone that is your trainer or someone that you've hired as a mentor, someone that you can just go blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, like this or I got triggered, or you know cause. We're going to get triggered as well, you know, in sessions, and I think if you've got someone to bounce that off, that's so important for your own mental health and to get it out. ⁣ ⁣ 22:26 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Everything you said is like, so on point, because you know we want to serve, we want to help, we want to help people heal, and rarely are we thinking about what we can do. ⁣ ⁣ 22:35⁣ But also having that one person who's in a similar field, that understands, rather than unloading it on your partner or unloading it on you know a friend who's kind of like I don't know what you're talking about, and not breaking confidentiality, but doing it within the walls of your, your therapeutic center, or if you work at a place or you just know, like I have a mentor that I go to, I have my other practitioners, and having that just to be like, how do you feel about this? You need that, we all need that, you know. So that's really important. I think those are really good tips, especially when we're doing trauma work, and I want to talk to you briefly about that, because you do offer a trauma informed certification and there are a lot of certifications out there. So what makes your trauma-informed certification different from the copious other ones that are out there, the myriad of courses that call you trauma-informed? ⁣ ⁣ 23:34 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ Yeah, sure. So originally, as I was watching the industry change and a lot of coaches coming into the industry and myself just having the awareness of blending therapy and coaching, I'm like I have the sense that a lot of people are being held space for, but I feel like with coaching, there's not much awareness of trauma or reactions of trauma that people are having or when a client is having a trauma response, and, as a coach, often people are trying to push them through that, which can cause them to shut down or get depressed or become burnt out. And so, as I watch the industry rapidly grow, I said to my partner and another trainer that we have on, like you guys need to make a trauma-informed certificate, like for these coaches, like it's super important. So they, they did it, they create, they recorded it and everything and we started selling it and I just I just had this feeling I'm like it's not. It was a very affordable price and everything. I'm like it's not, it's not reaching enough people, it's not, and it's not reaching enough people, it's not. ⁣ ⁣ 24:45⁣ And and we're doing quite well with our other courses. I know you guys put a lot of effort into this and it's an incredible course, but do you mind making it free. And they were like what? And I'm like, trust me, trust me, trust me. They're like, okay, I'm like we need to make a positive ripple effect in the industry. And so they were like, okay, like they're just trusting me again, and it absolutely blew up. So to date, I think about 70,000 people have enrolled in this course and literally because I see the comments every day, so in our courses you can do comments under each lesson and we're there and we're answering questions and things like that, and the testimonial is like this is the best course on being trauma-informed in the world. I've done a psychology degree. This is the best education that I've ever had. ⁣ ⁣ 25:31⁣ This is, and so people taking it that are either managers, parents, teachers, so it's not just for coaches, it's for anyone that is holding space to other people in any capacity, and so many people go through it for themselves as well, and so the main kind of points that are in there that people get out of it is understanding the nervous system, understanding the reactions of the nervous system, understanding how to hold space for someone by regulating yourself, to be able to hold a safe space for whoever you're holding the space for, and to recognize when someone is having a trauma response and how to navigate that and how to help them around that. ⁣ ⁣ 26:13⁣ And I think you know one of my old friends she was and I'm talking 15 years ago became a school teacher and she would like complain about some kid that had ADHD and she would be quite negative about it and be like, oh, I kind of would have a go at them, see if they do this course they would have a huge understanding of oh, this is actually the reaction that they're having because of what they've been through. And these are the things that I can do to help this student to feel safer, to learn and to hold and to be able to understand. Okay, what can we adjust to make it a safer experience for them? ⁣ ⁣ 26:48⁣ So they're not having these behavioral reactions. But it comes to anyone really like why do we have these behavioral reactions? What do they actually mean? You know, and yeah, so. ⁣ ⁣ 27:00 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Well, I think it's amazing that you're offering it for free and I just want to let folks know that I'm going to have that link in the notes of this podcast for Melissa's certification. This is a trauma informed certification or even the other short, free educational courses that you do offer. We'll have that all in the podcast notes for the Center for Healing. That's so generous and honestly to be able to give that gift to people even if they don't need the certification. ⁣ ⁣ 27:29⁣ The knowledge is really helpful, whether you are in the field of therapy or coaching, like you said, teachers I know plenty of lawyers and people that are in the legal that are hearing the stories from the narcissist, and I mean the battle back and forth is traumatic in a lot of ways and there are a lot of lawyers that are getting sort of certifications in narcissism, trauma, informed approaches, just so they know how to NLP, you know learning the language of what's coming at you. So all of this is so helpful. I mean more education is great as long as it's authentic and comes with some kind of a backing. ⁣ ⁣ 28:10 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ So absolutely and the the way that the that Matt and Ryan teacher is. It's so digestible, like you don't have to have the technical knowledge of, like the coaching industry or NLP or as a therapist, like it's so or science exactly. It's like, oh my gosh, like everything that I've learned has clicked in. ⁣ ⁣ 28:31⁣ You know, and um, and, and people enjoy watching it and I'm just so I'm so grateful for Matt and Ryan that they were like yes, make this a free, because I truly believe if everyone becomes trauma informed, we are going to have a better world, because we're going to realize I'm raging and I'm angry, because actually I'm feeling scared and dysregulated about this because potentially I'm getting triggered because of this. ⁣ ⁣ 28:56⁣ So, rather than attacking someone all of a sudden, we've had this huge awareness about ourselves and we're able to calm down and then have a conversation with someone that we need to have a conversation with, rather than attacking each other, abusing each other, cutting each other off, like just basic human behavior, like having that understanding that all of us I don't want to say all of us have experienced extreme trauma, but all of us have. I don't want to say all of us have experienced extreme trauma, but all of us have probably had painful experiences of probably getting triggered now by each other and by circumstances. That, yeah, if we're to have that awareness, understanding ourselves and others, it's going to be a much more peaceful, communicative society. I really believe that. Yes absolutely. ⁣ ⁣ 29:41 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I couldn't agree more. And it's a question of learning how to respond instead of react. You know, because that that scared, that scared creature that we have in the little amygdala up there, little Amy, that gets scared and doesn't feel safe if she's gonna, if she's backed against a corner, it's all hell breaks loose. You know, yeah, so it's definitely understanding that that's great, it's such a beautiful offering and just everything that you're doing. So, before we actually wrap things up because I know you've got things that you need to do, you got a full day ahead of you in Australia I would love to play a little game with you, real quick, sure, and what I'm going to do is I'm going to throw out a word and you just come back with the first word that comes to mind. Let's get things going with the get you get you moving on your day ahead. You'll thank thank me for it later. All right, one word, here we go. Transformational Recalcerapy Okay, okay. Healing. ⁣ ⁣ 30:44⁣ In a child Peace neutrality practitioner space holder boundaries self-care addiction self-soothing energetic hygiene. ⁣ ⁣ 31:11 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ I know it's two words, but I just really love that I'm going to say the word you already said, but boundaries Okay. ⁣ ⁣ 31:20 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And self-care, and that's one word, because it's hyphenated. ⁣ ⁣ 31:25 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ Yes, self-love Beliefs. ⁣ ⁣ 31:33 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Generalizations Good. ⁣ ⁣ 31:34 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ Gratification, I want to say painful emotions, which is the opposite of gratification. But I feel like it's okay. We're trying to gratify ourselves so we don't feel the painful emotions. ⁣ ⁣ 31:47 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Now I'm going to give you one more word. I got to keep going. One more Root cause one more root cause. ⁣ ⁣ 31:56 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ The word that comes to mind is dna, just because I've had a lot of clients with generational trauma at the moment. ⁣ ⁣ 32:03 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, that's a. That's a big topic yeah we didn't even really get into that. I know you mentioned it a little bit going back to the inner child, but that generational trauma and holding space for ourselves with the ancestral trauma, what would you say to those tuning in about being able to process that and be open to the idea of generational trauma? ⁣ ⁣ 32:29 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ so you can look at the cherry blossom study. There's a study that's been done on how generational trauma can get passed down, not only by us hearing stories that have happened to our ancestors, but actually we live out the symptoms in our dna. So some people will have symptoms and behaviors that they don't understand why they're having them and it doesn't make sense their reactions that they're having to the life that they've had, and sometimes the trauma has been passed down generationally. And so I have taken people into regression and I myself have gone into regression where I was in my grandmother, where she couldn't feed her kids and my mom was only little and I felt how she felt and I saw the rice on the table and that's all she had for them. This is in Sri Lanka, in a village rice on the table and that's all she had for them. This is in Sri Lanka, in a village, and I and and the behaviors that I had previous to understanding that was like I would hate to go to a restaurant. ⁣ ⁣ 33:22⁣ I always looked at the food and I always used to think there's not enough food. I can't eat this restaurant food. They're wasting so much food. There's not enough food. I couldn't go to a supermarket. I had all these weird behaviors that were unexplainable, but once I went to that and healed that, that shifted all of that. Now I'm happy to go to a restaurant and I believe there's an abundance of food and so, yes, it's very those of us that are willing to do the work. ⁣ ⁣ 33:49 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ We're often healing generations of trauma from both sides our mother and father's ancestry you know, so it's yeah I remember when I first went through trauma informed, my trauma, informed certification I really opened up and I was like and I don't know where it came from it, just like it was, like I just vomited all of this generational trauma and the feeling that I had in my body that I had not felt before. ⁣ ⁣ 34:14⁣ And I remember calling my mom after saying it ends now, like it ends today. And I had already been doing this work for a while, but something about something hit me hard with that program where I went really deep into the generational trauma and I was like, oh no, like it ends, it ends today, it ends here, with this lineage, right here. And that's really an awareness, it's stepping into the tension of the unknown and realizing you have a couple of choices. You can go forward, right, you can retreat and nothing changes. If nothing changes, you can try to go around it without dealing with it or try to go over it, but you'll get kicked back. So it's really just like diving through it, you know. ⁣ ⁣ 34:56 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ A hundred percent yeah. ⁣ ⁣ 34:59 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Wow, Good stuff. Melissa, thank you so much for being here and I want to give you a moment because we got off track after the. Well, we got on a good track, but we changed gears after the rapid fire game. ⁣ ⁣ 35:23 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ I'm curious do you have any final words that you'd like to share with those tuning in? Yeah, I'd just like to say that, if anything, start to feel into your body, more into your feelings, and stop intellectualizing them so much. And it's safe to feel your negative emotions and they do go if you fully feel them and breathe into them. They do go after 60 to 90 seconds and I think that would save so many people's lives just by doing that. Just by doing that, your relationships, your health, the way you look after yourself. That's a really great first step to take. ⁣ ⁣ 35:50 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, like, is it a bad day or is it just a bad five minutes? Right, we tend to just like catastrophize everything to make it like life is horrible, and it's like is life horrible or is it really just like in this moment, right now, you're really ticked off, right yeah, but that's great. Just give yourself a chance to self-regulate. You know we have that power and it's beautiful when we know we have it, because then we're just more empowered. ⁣ ⁣ 36:15 - Melissa Hiemann (Guest)⁣ Definitely. Thanks so much. Thank you, it's been my honor to be on. Thank you so much. ⁣ ⁣ 36:23 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Might as well. All right, I want you to take advantage of Melissa's trauma-informed certification and courses. She's offering a lot of free resources that you can put in your toolbox that brain candy jar that you got a lot of free resources that you can put in your toolbox that brain candy jar that you got. I'll add that in the podcast notes of this episode, along with her book Natural High Secrets to Overcoming Instant Gratification and Finding Inner Peace, plus more on her root cause therapy and the Center for Healing, and we talked a lot about ways that you can be kind to your mind during this conversation, finding ways to heal the healer in you. One way that you can do that is with Havening techniques. If you want to learn more about Havening and how it can change your brain, I dropped a link in the podcast notes as well on ways to connect with me. Remember to give this podcast and this episode a little love. Just by leaving a rating or review. You are making a difference. ⁣ ⁣ 37:14⁣ Wherever you are tuning in, we are on all podcast platforms, including Apple, Spotify, and even YouTube. I love hearing from you week after week and I appreciate all your shares HIListically Speaking is edited 2Market Media with music by Lipbone Redding and supported by you. So thank you. I appreciate you every day. I know there is a lot of podcasts that are out there. You're choosing to join me every week. It is a gift to have you here and I am truly grateful. I love you, I believe in you and I will see you next week.

Before she was designing holistic spaces, Gala Magriñá was living large in the fashion industry. But no amount of partying and rubbing elbows with celebs created a happy space, inside or out. That is until she realized that investing in your personal space is investing in yourself. On this episode of the HIListically Speaking Podcast, discover how holistic interior design goes beyond the aesthetics and considers the mind, body, and spirit approach that's necessary to create mindful spaces that support inner healing and personal growth. You'll walk away with a new perspective of what it means to create a respite that flows and flourishes personally and professionally. Download and listen to this conversation on any podcast platform. https://pod.link/hilisticallyspeaking Grab The Badass books series Gala and Hilary talked about! You Are a Badass: How to Stop Doubting Your Greatness and Start Living an Awesome Life, Jen Sincero https://amzn.to/3KjV99l (Amazon) Get all four books! You Are a Badass Series 4 Books Collection Set by Jen Sincero (You Are a Badass, You Are a Badass at Making Money, You Are a Badass Every Day & Badass Habits, Jen Sincero https://amzn.to/4dRn3qS (Amazon) CHAPTERS/KEY MOMENTS⁣ 00:00 Intro 00:27 What does holistic mean to you? 03:24 Gala's story: From fashion to functional living 08:05 Design and Well-Being Connection 13:31 Navigating Stressful Transitions in Design 11:02 Personalized Wellness Practices 18:15 Creating Sanctuary-Like Spaces 24:51 Beyond Spaces 26:55 Interior Design Methodology 32:48 Rapid Fire Game 34:52. Investing in your space is investing in yourself 35:06 Hilary Close CONNECT WITH GALA https://www.instagram.com/galamagrinadesign https://www.linkedin.com/in/galamagrina/ GALA'S DESIGN COURSE (launching in Sept 2024) https://galamagrinadesign.com/beyond-spaces-course/ PUT THE HEALING IN YOUR HANDS WITH HAVENING ⁣https://www.hilaryrusso.com/havening ⁣GRAB MY DISCOUNT ON HOLISTIC HEALTH COURSES AT IIN https://sldr.page.link/4byd CONNECT WITH HILARY⁣ https://www.instagram.com/hilaryrusso ⁣ https://www.youtube.com/hilaryrusso https://www.facebook.com/hilisticallyspeaking https://www.tiktok.com/@hilisticallyspeaking https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast Music by Lipbone Redding https://lipbone.com/

Grief wrapped its cold hands around my heart with the loss of my calico kitty, Miss Eliza Doolittle. But in sharing my story on episode 151, I discovered I wasn't alone and others had a tail of their own to tell about the power of pet companionship. On this episode of HIListically Speaking, I passed the microphone over to our listeners who share gratitude moments for the fur babies who left a paw print on their hearts. Whether they're purring beside us or frolicking beyond the Rainbow Bridge, we honor the laughter and love they bring into our lives, as we recount stories of the profound bonds formed between humans and their animal companions and heal in community.⁣ ⁣ CHAPTERS/KEY MOMENTS⁣ 00:00 Intro ⁣ 00:08 Healing Through Community⁣ 03:04 Juile and Champ⁣ 04:28 Bree and Moe⁣ 05:24 Amy and Bella⁣ 06:31 TC and Charlotte⁣ 07:38 Brooke and Lady⁣ 8:48 Kristin and Angie⁣ 10:18 Beverly and Coco⁣ 11:24. Hilary's closing thoughts on pet loss and love⁣ ⁣ JOIN ME FOR THE NEXT HAVENING HAPPY HOUR⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/events⁣ ⁣ DOWNLOAD THE HUG IT OUT FIVE DAY CHALLENGE⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/5daychallenge⁣ ⁣ CONNECT WITH HILARY⁣ https://www.instagram.com/hilaryrusso⁣ ⁣https://www.youtube.com/hilaryrusso⁣ https://www.facebook.com/hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.tiktok.com/@hilisticallyspeaking⁣https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣Music by Lipbone Redding https://lipbone.com/⁣ ⁣ TRANSCRIPT⁣ Full transcript available on https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣ 00:08 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ The power of community is amazing, isn't it? It helps us connect, it helps us grow, it helps us learn and it helps us heal. Recently I lost my beautiful calico kitty, Miss Eliza Doolittle. Those of you who watch this podcast know that she sits right behind me on this very chair. Maybe you've seen her in commercials or in videos and if you know me personally, you've probably had a chance to sit with her for a while right here in my home. And one of the ways I found healing, after close to 19 years with her by my side, was to share her story right here HIListically Speaking, and what I learned from living with her for close to two decades. To me it was therapeutic to share with you. It felt right, as raw as it was, as real as it was and as recent as it was. It was necessary and important for my healing journey. ⁣ ⁣ 01:09⁣ What happened after I dropped episode 151 was an outpouring of HIListically Speaking listeners from listeners and fans and friends and family and strangers. I received gifts and cards and words of encouragement and kindness and stories, so many stories, your stories, and I thought what better way to share and heal than in community? After all, that's what this podcast is all about. That's what HIListically Speaking is all about those empowering conversations of trauma to triumph through health, healing and humor. Basically what it takes to be a happy and healthy grownup, because even in loss there is laughter at some point in time, don't you think it comes. It might take a while, but it's there. ⁣ ⁣ 02:10⁣ So this episode is about you and your stories. Pets that you have loved, that have made a difference in your life. Some have crossed over the Rainbow Bridge already and maybe they're hanging out with Eliza. Others showed up just at the right time and are still bringing you happiness and joy and, I hope, for a very long time. I asked you to press record and share your stories and your pictures so that we can honor those fur babies in our lives. And what came back is what you're about to hear on this episode, and it is truly inspiring and amazing. When we become pet parents, we know our time with them is short. It is likely that we will outlive them, and we know that there will be heartbreak. It's inevitable. But to love and to be loved is the real gift. ⁣ ⁣ 03:04 - Julie (Caller)⁣ Hi, this is Julie Marty-Pearson from Bakersfield, California, and I am here to share my story about my childhood dog, champ. I got Champ as a puppy when I was about 12 years old. At the time I was dealing with some difficult health issues and I ended up missing most of my 7th grade year. Champ became my best friend. He was my little buddy. Seeing most of my 7th grade year, champ became my best friend. He was my little buddy. He was there with me through all the tough days when I wasn't feeling well, when I wasn't able to see my friends and go to events and fun things like I wanted to, and Champ was there for me. ⁣ ⁣ 03:37⁣ All the way through college I lived with my parents to save money, and the day I left for grad school I had to say goodbye, even though I knew he'd be taken care of by my parents. I knew I was going to miss him. Little did I know he had snuck a little surprise in one of my boxes for me. Cut to the next day in my new apartment, unpacking all of my boxes In the middle of my books, in one box I found Champ's tennis ball. He had dropped it in the box for me and I packed it away without knowing, so that I would always have a piece of him with me. Champ passed away about six months after that. It's like he knew he'd done his job and he was okay to leave, and I still miss him every single day. ⁣ ⁣ 04:28 - Bree (Caller)⁣ I want to honor my dear sweet Moe, who just left us. In the last few weeks he wasn't a fan of everyone but he definitely loved his mama and he provided so much comfort in our bedtime snuggles, I know, when I just wasn't feeling right or was just having a day or a moment, I could retreat to my room and lay in my bed and wherever he was in the room he would just pop up and lay next to me, usually near my head. It was just kind of like a comfort, like knowing he was there for me. You know, no words needed to be exchanged and I just felt his little body vibrating with purrs and and it was sweet to know that somebody was there with me. So, moving forward, it will be a change and adjustment on how to find that comfort somewhere else, but I am grateful for the 18 years he provided me that snuggle and that love. ⁣ ⁣ 05:24 - Amy (Host)⁣ Hi, my name is Amy. I'm the host of the Grounded in Maine podcast and I just wanted to talk about my dog, Bella, who was everything to me. She was nine pounds, she was a Pomeranian, she loved everybody and she loved everything. She was the only pet I've ever had that loved going to the vet. She just loved anyone that would make a big deal of her and she just was the best thing ever. Her last year she was diagnosed with congestive heart failure and a collapsed trachea and she was having seizures. Oh, that was a hard year. She completely broke me when she passed away. Like I said no more dogs, I don't want to hurt like that again. And then it was the beginning of a vacation, actually, and so I took that week off and I didn't talk to anybody. I could not say the words without falling apart, crying, so I just messaged them through Facebook and that was it. And that's why I was saying, Hilary, I'm impressed that you're able to talk about that, because I still get teary and it's been six years. ⁣ ⁣ 06:31 - TC (Caller)⁣ Charlotte York McPuppy Newman. Let me be her human mom for 16 years on this earth and it's a privilege that I will never get over. I met her when she was nine weeks old and it was an instant bond and an instant love, and it was so powerful she traveled with me across the country. I mean, if dogs could have frequent flyer miles or hotel points, she would have been platinum status everywhere. ⁣ ⁣ 06:52⁣ Planes, trains, automobiles. But it was more than just the physical journeys. It was the emotional journeys. She went on with me. She saw me on the highest days when we were dancing in the kitchen, and she saw me on the lowest days when she knew just to cuddle up around me in bed because I couldn't do much more for her when she transitioned to the other side. It was one of the hardest events, the hardest times of my life, but it was so precious to get to hold her as she took her last breath. I was her mama and she was my baby, Though I will always have a Charlotte-shaped hole in my life. I see her signs everywhere Butterflies, dogs that stare at me in the eye for no reason, and I am so grateful that I got to be Miss Charlotte's mom. ⁣ ⁣ 07:38 - Brooke (Caller)⁣ Hi everyone. Two years ago I adopted a five-year-old Chiwini. Her name is Lady. She's 12 pounds and has had lots of trauma in her life. She attached to me quickly and wants to go everywhere with me all the time, which is not always possible. ⁣ ⁣ 07:52⁣ Well, years ago I had a post-traumatic stress disorder diagnosis due to my upbringing and it resurfaced recently. I'll get a dump of adrenaline and a debilitating fear for no immediate threat. It makes life difficult and I started thinking between the trauma of my dog and the trauma of mine, maybe I could make this into a positive thing. So I called a dog trainer and they came over and evaluated her. She has what it takes to be a PTSD service dog. So for 120 hours we need to train. She is halfway through that and, absolutely amazing, my little dog responds to me so well and calms me. I calm her. It's kind of this leaning on each other situation, but we're making each other's lives better and with every day she learns something new, as do I. Our lives are calmer and happier because we're together all the time. So I just wanted to share that. Thank you so much. ⁣ ⁣ 08:48 - Kristin (Caller)⁣ My name's Kristen. I want to share this story about a dog I once had named Augie, who I bought from a puppy mill and on a whim one day and told myself that I was saving him from that horrible place. Augie was a beautiful black lab. At the time I was in an on-again, off-again relationship with a man I would marry and divorce in less than a year. On one of our hiatuses I secretly bought Augie because the man I loved hated dogs and was afraid of them, and I prayed that Augie would keep him away. Augie gave me a run for my money and he had not only massive amounts of energy but massive amounts of anxiety, and I'm an ICU nurse and a mom and I make a lot of hard decisions, but this was one of the hardest I've ever made. ⁣ ⁣ 09:29⁣ I decided to find Augie a new home, because not only did he not have good quality of life in our home, we didn't either Rehomed him. I found a man, a friend of my dad's, named Billy, who was like a lab whisperer. Augie snapped and he snarled at Billy and Billy stood there and he didn't flinch and a little while later Augie went, hopped in his truck and went to live with Billy I still get pictures of Augie from time to time. He's living his best life ever. He got the love and life that he deserved, and I ended up writing a book about my healing journey, which is called Heal the Intensive Care Review. You know I wanted Augie to save me, but I learned that the only one that could save me was me and that I had the power to do it. ⁣ ⁣ 10:18 - Beverly (Caller)⁣ Hi, I'm Beverly. I'm 83 years old and I've been a pet owner most of my life and I love my pets to bits. Recently I lost my husband and I've been very, very depressed. He was the light of my life and, as a result, it caused me to want to have company in one form or another and I recently I adopted a dog, a little chihuahua, and he has been the light of my life. His name is Coco and I've never in my life as much as I've loved all my animals. I've never loved an animal like this. Perhaps my need caused me to love greater, I don't know, but he has made a major difference in my life. Having Coco in my life has been a godsend and, although I still miss my husband, coco is a wonderful distraction and completes my life. ⁣ ⁣ 11:24 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ What an incredible collection of stories from childhood to current day. Our pets really do make a difference in our lives, and I am so grateful to everyone who took the time to share and, more importantly, took the time to love. Whether or not you pressed record on this very episode. If you are tuning in right now, I know this is reaching you when it needs to, and if this episode touched, moved and inspired you in any way, I would love to hear from you. I'd love to know what you think, share your thoughtful responses by leaving a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify Podcasts or YouTube or wherever your headphones take you. I'd love to read what you have to share. So download this episode, make a difference, pay it forward. Somebody else you might know could use this right now, and I imagine those who are part of this episode will love to hear your thoughts too. ⁣ ⁣ 12:19⁣ On that note, if you've experienced the loss of a pet, I hope in time you open your heart again to love again. And if that is part of the journey, you know now, know that you're chosen and know that you were chosen or, better yet, you chose each other. What a gift, what a gift to know that. Thank you again for being here. Thank you again for one of your choices being that you tune in week after week. I love you for that and I'll see you next week. Be well. ⁣ ⁣

We have a saying in the world of integrative nutrition. If it's made by people in white coats, you are likely going to see people in white coats. In other words, your food could be keeping you sick. But Doctor of Social Sciences, Nicolette Richer is on a mission to change that for millions of people by 2030. On this episode of the HIListically Speaking Podcast, we take a deep dive into the healing potential of whole foods as Dr. Richer shares her insights on dismantling systemic barriers to wellness, particularly for BIPOC women. Learn about the pitfalls of the ketogenic diet and other trendy plans, and be inspired by stories of empowerment and recovery through eating from the earth. This episode is not only rich with actionable knowledge but also a call to action for those tuning in to embrace scientific literacy and health education for a healthier, more informed society. It's time to eat real to heal on the HIListically Speaking Podcast. ⁣ ⁣Full Transcript https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣ CHAPTERS/KEY MOMENTS⁣ 00:00 Intro ⁣ 00:08 Food as Medicine for Healthful Living⁣ 03:25 Addressing Health Disparities ⁣ 10:24 Holistic Healing Empowerment ⁣ 14:10 The Dangers of the Keto Diet⁣ 16:02 Media Misinformation ⁣ 19:33 Health Coaches and clients⁣ 27:02 Nutrition, Healing, and Wellness Journey⁣ 29:00 Dr. Richer's shift from government to nutrition⁣ 31:45 Rapid Fire Game⁣ 32:55 Reversing Chronic Disease and Detoxing⁣ 34:00 Hilary's closing thoughts and how to connect⁣ ⁣ ⁣ CONNECT WITH DR. NICOLETTE RICHER⁣ Eat Real to Heal Cookbook: Using Nutrient-Dense Foods for Happiness and Longevity https://amzn.to/4blFWAG (Amazon) Eat Real to Heal: Using Food As Medicine to Reverse Chronic Diseases from Diabetes, Arthritis, Cancer and More https://amzn.to/4bnnFCZ (Amazon)⁣ https://www.instagram.com/nicolettericher/⁣ https://www.facebook.com/richerhealthconsulting/⁣ https://www.youtube.com/@eatrealtoheal⁣ https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/eat-real-to-heal-podcast/id1442998357⁣ ⁣ JOIN THE REAL TO HEAL PROGRAM https://www.richerhealth.ca/eat-real-to-heal-course⁣ ⁣ PUT THE HEALING IN YOUR HANDS WITH HAVENING ⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/havening⁣ ⁣GRAB MY DISCOUNT ON COURSES ON INTEGRATIVE NUTRITION AT IIN https://sldr.page.link/4byd CONNECT WITH HILARY⁣ https://www.instagram.com/hilaryrusso⁣ ⁣https://www.youtube.com/hilaryrusso⁣ https://www.facebook.com/hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.tiktok.com/@hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣Music by Lipbone Redding https://lipbone.com/⁣ ⁣*******⁣ ⁣ EPISODE TRANSCRIPT ⁣ Full Transcript https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣)⁣ ⁣ 00:08 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Individuals who can afford to buy food at Whole Foods, but they still choose to buy processed refined food. I've been working with these individuals for a long time. I've, quite frankly, become a little bit exhausted because we do have so much information there's too much information out there, in fact but it's interesting. I've decided to really focus on BIPOC women, and that is an area that I know I'll be focusing on probably for the next half of my life, the next 50 years, and it's the area with some of the biggest challenges, because we're still facing racism in this area. We're still facing those economic gaps as well. ⁣ ⁣ 00:43 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ All right, my friends, this is not the first time we talked about this, but imagine being able to reverse the chronic diseases in your life, the health issues that you have, with small changes and I mean really small changes that can make a difference. Like I said, this isn't the first time we talked about this. Holistic living and integrative nutrition is really a big part of that. If you can reverse 97% of the chronic diseases out there with whole food eating, with different kinds of approaches to taking care of your body, mind and spirit holistically, whole body approach, wouldn't you want to have the answers? And that is exactly why I have Dr Nicolette Richer here. She is a doctor of social sciences and she is on a mission to teach 22 million people using food as medicine by a deadline, by the way, 2030. Dr Nicolette, it is so great to have you here. Thank you so much for being on HIListically Speaking. ⁣ ⁣ 01:39 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Yeah, and thanks for having me. It's a pleasure to be here and share this information. ⁣ ⁣ 01:43 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ So I was chit-chatting with you before we pressed record about. You are the first doctor of social sciences I've actually had on this podcast. We're, you know well into 150 plus podcast episodes here. Being that this podcast is about holistic health well-being, turning those traumas into triumphs in our life. I've realized from the different kinds of doctors I've had on the show many in functional medicine and integrative medicine that doctors do not go to medical school and take nutritional courses. That's kind of an extracurricular and I do want to start out there. So how is being a social science doctor different? ⁣ ⁣ 02:19 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Yeah. So I was actually on the path to med school and all of our friends and our customers who ate at our plant-based whole food restaurants told me don't go to med school if I want to teach people how to reverse their chronic diseases. So I wrote my MCATs, I passed my MCAT, I was applying for med school and I really thought that was the path, that was the way I could help the most amount of people. And they were like Nikki, you're not going to be able to help people in seven and a half minute. You know practitioner patient appointments. And so they're the ones who actually the medical doctors talked me out of going to med school. And they said work with people around behavior change that's what's important around education around nutrition. And they also point blank said I'd lose my license if I was prescribing nutrition to patients who had heart disease and diabetes and cancer, etc. Etc. That's what a lot of people don't realize is they can't prescribe a specific diet as a doctor because that's not considered evidence-based medicine, even though we have thousands of studies to show that plant-based whole food eating is literally the answer to reversing 97% of all chronic diseases. ⁣ ⁣ 03:25⁣ So, being a social scientist, I get to be on the side of understanding what makes a person tick, what makes them actually engage in the behaviors to reverse a chronic disease. What are the barriers in society that prevent them from being able to reverse their disease? Because it's never just a person has a disease and they want to reverse it. No, there's economic factors, there's geographic factors, there's political policies that are in place that prevent people from accessing food, particularly if you are Black, indigenous or a person of color, and a lot of people don't know that. So it's not just a simple have a disease, choose to reverse your disease. That's not how it works. There's financial inequities that are in place, there's racism within the medical system that prevent people from getting the proper lab test done, etc. Etc. So, being a social scientist, I'm actually able to look at the systems that are in place and the systems that need to be changed that would allow somebody to even engage in the behaviors of reversing their chronic disease in the first place. ⁣ ⁣ 04:22 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And that's a big difference. That's a really big difference from what you originally went to school for, like you said, but was this something that you identified with because of your own health concerns as well? ⁣ ⁣ 04:33 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Good question and the answer is no, but a lot of people. That's. Number one question I get asked is how I got into this work. I was working in government actually creating policy for environmental policy, so I was in environmental toxicology and screening and you know wastewater management etc. Etc. ⁣ ⁣ 04:51⁣ And so in doing that work, at the same time my best friend's dad was diagnosed with stage four cancer. He was 72 years old at the time and he had metastasized to his bones. He was not given chemo surgery or radiation as a treatment option at all and they just sent him home to die. So instead he had heard about metabolic nutrition and detoxification years and years and years before. So he went back and started researching, investigating, asking lots of questions, and he immediately changed his behavior, his lifestyle. He stopped eating processed food, stopped eating pizza and burgers and fries and packaged ingredients, and he switched to organic, plant-based whole food diet, daily detoxification with supplements and added juicings for the added nutrients. And at 72 years old, he reversed his stage for metastasized cancer, where he was given three months to live and he lived another 22 more years. ⁣ ⁣ 05:44⁣ Now, being naturally a researcher and really curious, I couldn't discount what he did and just chalk it up to one anecdotal story. So I investigated the therapy to understand. You know, what did it mean, what was the science behind it? And lo and behold, it opened up a whole new world where I saw that actually, not even just for the last 200 years of published medical research and peer reviewed journal articles does this information exist. But you know, going back through traditional Chinese medicine and Ayurvedic medicine and other indigenous medicine practices, you know food has been medicine since the day every single human being was came into existence on the planet. ⁣ ⁣ 06:20 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ What is your hope when you say that you want to teach 22 million people how to eradicate their chronic diseases using food as medicine in the next, really, six years? Yeah, when you think about that, what does that mean for you? Because I know that you are putting a lot of these programs, in these wellness programs in organizations, companies and institutions, but and teaching doctors is one thing that you do, so what is how? Would that mission be a possibility for you? ⁣ ⁣ 06:49 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ yeah, I think one of the biggest, most important things any entrepreneur can do is to set a big, hairy, audacious goal. And a big, hairy, audacious goal is a goal that is bigger than anything you can ever imagine accomplishing. And if we don't set goals like that, then we we just don't set big goals. We actually set really small goals that are very easy to achieve, and so it's important to set a big, hairy, audacious goal. So that is mine. It's going to be really hard to quantify. ⁣ ⁣ 07:12⁣ For example, I was invited to China by the Ministry of Health and the Center for Chronic Disease Control to teach 600 physicians how to do this metabolic therapy that I teach. So what they ended up doing was donating 200 acres of organic farmland. The Chinese government did that and they mandated in China that every municipality needed to be in charge of the diabetes reversing diabetes using food as medicine. They now have a 150 bed wellness center where anybody in China can go to to learn the therapy that I taught these physicians. They gutted a main hospital in Beijing to put in a metabolic nutrition and detox center and including kitchens with stoves where every Wednesday evening the community can come and learn about food as medicine. So that's a country with over a billion people. ⁣ ⁣ 07:57⁣ Now, am I going to know exactly how many patients those 600 individuals, those physicians, have been able to impact in the 150 bed center and the hospital in Beijing? ⁣ ⁣ 08:08⁣ I will not be able to quantify that, but it allows me to actually reach out to organizations that I would not normally have reached out to and say, hey, can we partner? Another example is that Lululemon, which is a major employer of 34,000 employees, is one of our biggest sponsors and they made me an ambassador simply so we could get the message out, as food is medicine. So we're now working with them on a huge endeavor which is not only around chronic diseases but around mental health disorders as well, because mental health disorders are just chronic diseases, and so to really support men around the globe in reversing their suicidal ideation and mood disorders as well. So it's by partnering with these big organizations that I think I'm going to be able to achieve this goal. So, yeah, going to be hard to quantify, for sure, because I don't keep track of every single individual, but it allows me to really partner with big organizations. ⁣ ⁣ 09:00 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ You glow when you're talking about this. You really you come alive, Like I'm just watching you as you talk about, and even talking about things that are traumatic when you talk about suicide. But I think you're seeing the other side of it, like where the possibility is. ⁣ ⁣ 09:13 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Yeah, thank you for noticing that. It is definitely my life's work. It doesn't even feel like work and every time I get a client who is sitting on the side of the road. This is one example a very successful entrepreneur in our town who called me from the side of the road crying because he had a rope in his hand but couldn't figure out where to hang the rope. He had served in the British Air Forces. ⁣ ⁣ 09:37⁣ You can listen to the podcast on our Eat Real to Heal podcast his story. And then now to see him, married with two kids, running a restaurant. He completed our metabolic, nutrition and detox coaching certification. He helped his entire family reverse their head to toe psoriasis. After he healed himself of his psoriasis and his chronic diseases and mood disorders, no longer wants to take his life. He's thriving. And when you see an individual, you know really, do that 150 degree turn like that? Yeah, I can't help but glow and smile and I can give you thousands of case studies like that reversing mental health disorders, suicidal ideation, chronic diseases. It's one of the easiest things to do, but our society makes it so complicated, so I'm excited to be on the side that knows how to do it. ⁣ ⁣ 10:24 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I think that's where we truly vibe, because that's an area where I'm focusing on. As far as being a holistic practitioner in the emotional well-being field, you know, having self-regulating tools, having ways that you can put the power of emotional well-being in someone else's hands. People will say often they'll say, oh, you're a healer or you are the one that is doing the work for someone, but it's being the guide, it's being the person that says here are the tools. You're the one that's actually doing the work that empowers the actual client or patient in your case. And I think about that, like just in the work I do with Havening Techniques, which is a, you know, a psychosensory, neuroscience-based approach that changes your thoughts, moods, behaviors and habits rapidly and being able to give people those tools. Really, I think I'm seeing parts of the mirroring back. You know like you get very excited when you see that, oh yes, this is working for somebody and the work that you're doing is working for so many people. Where do you feel that the challenges are truly in the work that you do? ⁣ ⁣ 11:30 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Yeah. So we just got a book picked up by a publisher, our third book. It's called Rise Up and it's all about how women of color, it's time to rise up. It's time to reclaim our ancestral knowledge that food is medicine. It's time to reverse these chronic diseases. It's time to end the discrimination in the health field, in our food systems field, and it's time to reverse these chronic diseases. It's time to end the discrimination in the health field, in our food systems field, and it's time to really close those economic disparity gaps that we see that are huge, that really women face at higher levels than men. ⁣ ⁣ 11:58⁣ So one of the big areas for BIPOC women especially, but men as well, and all genders and identities it is the fact that so many BIPOC individuals can't even access clean, real food. So they can't access your services, they can't access my services. It is out of their ability to be able to afford them. There's policies in place that won't that prevent them from having a grocery store that sells organic, clean, real food at affordable prices in their community. These are called redline districts. You know, whole Foods will not, whole Foods will not put their restaurant or their grocery store in a redline district. ⁣ ⁣ 12:37⁣ Food deserts Well, yeah, and it's not even just food. Deserts, like just because you can get pop tarts in a grocery store, does not. That's not food. So it's actually having nutrition deserts, and so that's a huge problem. So that is the work that I'm really focused on individuals who can afford to buy, you know, food at a Whole Foods, but they still choose to buy processed, refined food. I've been working with these individuals for a long time. I've, quite frankly, become a little bit exhausted because we do have so much information there's too much information out there, in fact, but it's interesting. I've decided to really focus on BIPOC women, and that is an area that I know I'll be focusing on probably for the next half of my life, the next 50 years, and it's the area with some of the biggest challenges, because we're still facing racism in this area. We're still facing those economic gaps as well. ⁣ ⁣ 13:31 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That is something that I became very familiar with when I was working with CVS Health, because I was hosting a show called Healthy Communities. We focused on the social determinants of health and seeing the lack in some of these communities that, really, put it, halted a number of communities from being able to access what is healthier for them in their everyday, in their communities. But also it's changing the habits, because if for so long they have been eating a certain way to survive, it's changing the thought, moods, behaviors and habits to thrive, to live well to realize that they can turn so many things around, and it's not just the food, like you said, it's an emotional response as well. ⁣ ⁣ 14:10⁣ Can you touch on why keto kills? That was something that came up because we hear so much about keto on both sides. I'm curious from your perspective, why does keto kill? ⁣ ⁣ 14:20 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Yeah. So I'll actually just jump in and say it's not my perspective. It's actually what the scientific literature shows. So we have media, nutritionists, health advocates promoting keto based on a very few amount of studies and these studies have not been done long term. All of the studies that I've looked at that have been done long term. They had to actually stop the studies because they actually resulted in people having higher rates of suicidal ideation, clinical depression, which they didn't even have starting keto, higher rates of heart disease. Some studies had to be stopped because some of the patients they couldn't even carry out the long-term study because some of the patients ended up with 98% arterial blockage from keto. So they couldn't ethically continue the study because the subjects, the participants, would have died. ⁣ ⁣ 15:06⁣ So when you just look at the evidence, that is why I do not promote keto but scientifically, from a biochemical perspective as well, when you choose to eat that high amount of fat, that high amount of protein, and especially if doing it through an animal-based diet, you create what's called a TMAO reaction in the gut. This happens in everybody. It's just a basic biochemical principle. Most people have no idea what TMAO does and is. So this reaction happens and then it starts immediately to clog arteries. When you do this, you create insulin insensitivity. You cannot draw glucose and insulin across the arterial walls into the cells where it's needed. So your kidneys, your heart, all your organs that are dependent on glucose and insulin no longer able to receive it. So then you create diabetes, heart disease, mental health disorders and more. So there is no way I can get behind that, because the long-term studies show keto kills. ⁣ ⁣ 16:02⁣ So now we have a bunch of hooligans and I'll call them hooligans running around the planet. Most of these hooligans are backed by media because they running around the planet. Most of these hooligans are backed by media because they you know how media loves to. You know jump onto one little molecule like resveratrol from red wine, one study showing that resveratrol it does the body good. All of a sudden, the media is promoting red wine as being good for you. ⁣ ⁣ 16:22⁣ But what media fails to say is that you'd need to drink 12 bottles of red wine in one sitting to get enough resveratrol. That would actually be beneficial to the body. So we have people running around spreading nutritional information that do not know how to read an actual scientific study from beginning to end, and this is killing people. So it's not just keto kills, media kills. Nutritionists who fail to read scientific studies are killing people every single day, and I do not say that lightly if they're in. You don't know how many nutritionists that have patients, clients that end up coming to me afterwards because their markers are worse than when they started with that nutritionist, and so it's really, really important that we start looking at nutrition as a body of medicine that is not going to be run by people who've never read a single scientific study. ⁣ ⁣ 17:11 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I have a question about testing too. When people do come to you, do they get specific types of tests, meaning like their vitamin tests, blood work, like a full panel? What's the first step for somebody that comes to you as a patient or a potential patient? ⁣ ⁣ 17:25 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Yes. So everybody who comes to me already has years of diagnostic testing done. They have years of lab results. They have everything. Most often I don't need. There's only a few more tests that I need done. They're very minor, so they already have it. Because they're on disability, they've had their chronic disease for a long time, they're on 36 different medications, so they don't need more testing. ⁣ ⁣ 17:47⁣ This is the other side that drives me, and if I can say this on the show, you can say whatever you want Thank you, that shit. Crazy is when a health coach takes on a new client and then they just send them for these expensive tests that do not need to be done, whereas they already have the testing done. We've seen their lab markers, we've seen their hormone panels, we've seen everything. So my clients come in, we already know their full diagnosis. I work with their entire medical team to reverse their disease. So the premise of what I teach is only there's two things you have your chronic disease because of two factors okay Nutritional deficiency that resulted in toxicity or toxicity that resulted in nutritional deficiency. You reverse those two factors and the client heals. Now people will say what about the emotional side of it, which I know is really a lot of the good work that you do. ⁣ ⁣ 18:36⁣ Of course there's an emotional side of it, but here's the thing Most of my clients don't have the mental capacity anymore because their brain fog is so bad that you can coach the hell out of them and they cannot remember what you just said. They cannot implement the tools that you know. So the thing is is that we can reverse those two things nutritional deficiency and toxicity which really starts with the next meal that they eat, the next meal they can do it that day. Within a day they can start to think clearly, which means that they can address yes, intergenerational trauma is 100% true and affects probably everybody. Right? ⁣ ⁣ 19:11⁣ People have huge traumas, big T traumas, little t traumas, emotional concussions All humans have that. If you're a human on the planet, you have that. So what we do is we just go in with the simplest thing that every human does on any given day, and that's that they eat food. We just change the food that they're eating and all of a sudden they heal, even though they still have the big T traumas. They still haven't even dealt with that. But now that their brain is clear and their body's nervous system is not in angst because it's looking for nutrients or it's highly toxic, all of a sudden they're able to address the emotional side, or the spiritual side, or their mental health as well. But we start with the physical first and foremost. ⁣ ⁣ 19:50 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, that's why you're the type of doctor I love to work with, because there is such a need for the liaison between the client, the patient and the doctor, and I think that's where health coaches come in. But what? Where you really hit the nail on the head is that, first of all, stay within your scope of practice. Everyone, if you are a health coach that tunes into this podcast or you are in any way in the nutrition or health or medical or mental health field, please stay within your scope of practice. Build that tribe of people, like you mentioned, working with their doctors right, it's not just one, because we all have these areas that we focus on that we're there to support the client or the patient for the doctor, right? So the one thing I do want to share with those who are tuning in is that Dr Nicolette has just graciously offered her reverse your chronic disease. This is her program that she has. It's called Eat Real to Heal, course. I'm going to put that in the podcast notes. And also there is a program, a certification program, that you have, on nutritional detox. ⁣ ⁣ 20:53⁣ If we can just learn how to detox this body from the things that we you know we do it so much for our home. We do it for things outside of ourselves. If we're not starting right here, the temple before you, the one that you look in the mirror and see every day, what are we doing Right? So having something like this is really great. I'll put all of that in the podcast notes. You can look into Dr Nicolette's approaches everything on her website to offer more. What would the first step be for folks that are looking to take this to the next level? They are frustrated, they are getting brain fog, they are getting migraines, they are not sleeping well. You know we can really compound all of these doctor visits that they get and that in itself can just burn you out. So what's the first step? ⁣ ⁣ 21:35 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ The first step is when you go to the grocery store is you have to know the difference between processed food and refined food. So a lot of people don't like taking supplements. They're afraid of supplements, they think they're going to hurt them. But again, that's because they're not looking at the research that shows that supplements do very, very little harm, and in fact, you can count on my fingers how many people have been negatively impacted by supplements, whereas prescription medications everybody's willing to pop those pills and which you do need until you know another way. So the first thing you need to do is know the difference between refined and processed food. All the processed food that's out there usually comes in a box, a bag, a package of some sort. You need to not purchase that stuff anymore. It's full of preservatives high in sodium, it's full in food coloring, it's full of glyphosate, it's full of you know, pesticides, herbicides. This stuff is killing you slowly cell by cell, organ by organ. ⁣ ⁣ 22:29⁣ So that's the first thing you need to know. ⁣ ⁣ 22:30⁣ So when you go to the grocery store, it makes it really, really, really easy, because when you want to go buy the potatoes, sure the potatoes might come in a bag, but try and get the potatoes that are still dirty that come in the box. Buy the apples, not the fruit roll-ups or the applesauce in a jar. Buy the oranges, buy the chickpeas, not the chickpea potato chips that are 100% organic and still covered in tons of sodium and have to have supplements added to them to even be considered food. So this is the first thing that people need to do. You do not need to know how to cook, which is so beautiful. A lot of my clients who come to our retreats they've never chopped a potato or even seen broccoli. And it is okay, because in our Eat Real to Heal program, we teach you how to become some of the best chefs in the entire world, and you don't have to spend hours in the kitchen If somebody has to give you meal plan after meal plan, week after week. This is not intuitive eating, and what we do is teach you how to eat intuitively so you can eat with the seasons, you can buy what's affordable at the grocery store and then you know how to make it really really easily with spending the least amount of time in the kitchen. Really important to cook your food. ⁣ ⁣ 23:34⁣ So if there's a lot of raw foodists out there who are suffering from chronic diseases, one of the most important things you could do is actually use the heat from your stove as medicine, because by cooking the food, you're going to actually access about 2000 times more nutrients and make it really easy on your body to heal. ⁣ ⁣ 23:49⁣ So if you're doing any fad programs right now, if somebody is telling you to fast right now to try and reverse your chronic disease, I promise you. ⁣ ⁣ 23:57⁣ I've worked with thousands of people who fasted and they're still have their chronic diseases and that's because they're still not eating clean, real food. So eat real food. And with our coaching program I just have to say and it's not just an online course where you're going to be left to do it on your own Only 5% of people ever ever even open up, let alone complete, an online course that they purchased. So we offer a lifetime of group coaching every single week so we can handhold you through the process, so you can ask the questions and not have to spend 24 hours just trying to find the answer on Google or within the course. You can just simply show up, ask the questions and, as you age and as you go through menopause or giving birth or whatever it is that you're going to be doing over the course of your life, we're still here for you to answer those questions in our weekly live group coaching. ⁣ ⁣ 24:44 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And that's the Real to Heal course. Correct, that's your group coaching course. ⁣ ⁣ 24:47 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ That's the Eat Real to Heal course and it's the community too, isn't it? ⁣ ⁣ 24:50 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ It's community. I mean, you're not alone in the battle. It's not one to one and there are benefits to one in one. But I think there's also real benefits to having community and knowing other people are going through something. It might not be your specific battle, but we're all in this together kind of thing, right, you learn from others. ⁣ ⁣ 25:04 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Yeah, and like, for example, andrew, you know he suffered from 30 migraines. A Everybody celebrated Miguel rheumatoid arthritis on disability couldn't play baseball anymore, which is his sport. Couldn't work anymore, living alone at home suffering from rheumatoid arthritis on all of these prescription meds that were just like slowly killing him. When the day his doctors took him off his last medication and declared him rheumatoid arthritis free, we all celebrated. His son died a month later. We were all there to support him and hold him through that time. So, yes, community is so, so, so important. ⁣ ⁣ 25:42 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ What do you think is the biggest fad out there right now that you just wish people would just stop? ⁣ ⁣ 25:51 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ I don't know. Keto for sure is one of the biggest ones. Keto is just another name for the Atkins diet, so everybody needs to know that that created so much heart disease in the 80s. ⁣ ⁣ 26:01 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I remember that. ⁣ ⁣ 26:02 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ So keto, I would say, is the one that is doing the most harm to humans, to their bodies and to the planet. It is horrific when it's, you know, in a time when we need to be consuming less meat because we were told 100 years ago how you, we need protein, we need fat, we need, you know, all of these animal-based products. And now, basically, governments around the world are rewriting all their nutrition programs to say, please stop eating so much meat. At the same time that all the keto advocates came out, and all because of what? They? Sure, you can lose weight, but you're going to clog your arteries doing it. So I would say, keto Fasting is amazing, for sure, there's no doubt about it, but people are using it like it's the only thing that they need to do, and it's so important that, sure, if you're going to eat within that eight hour period, that's fine, but if you have a chronic disease, you need nutrients all throughout the day, and that is critical, especially if you're trying to reverse something like a very aggressive chronic disease like cancer, where you have limited time on your hands. Fasting is not going to get you there. So that's a challenge for me and, as well, the kind of fasting people are doing. ⁣ ⁣ 27:10⁣ I'm a big proponent of intermittent fasting, where you still consume some calories, but not this. You know people who are running around, you know consuming their one meal a day, which you can do for a limited amount of time. But again, you have to look at the long-term studies as well. And as well you have to know that you're not a yeast molecule, you are not a yeast species alone. You are intricate human species. ⁣ ⁣ 27:38⁣ So what happens in the laboratory in a Petri dish, is not the same that happens to a human in real life. That's busy, running around taking care of kids, has stress, you know, because the economy is taking in environmental toxins. So it's really important that people are critical of the scientific research that gets published as well, and anybody can take a course in how to you know understand bias in a research and how to read the entire study. So that's going to be really important is we need to develop a scientifically literate society, and anybody can do that. My kids are teenagers and they know how to read through scientific journals now, and so this is something we need to be teaching in school. So that's also one of the big fads is that our education system is also needs an overhaul. ⁣ ⁣ 28:22 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Oh, that could be a whole nother conversation. I agree with that, not just. I mean in all areas. It's not your everyday home ec, home ec, like when we grew up. You know, and I'm so happy to see that some schools are taking that really seriously, both nutrition and mental health, mindfulness, you know, bringing those into the classroom. ⁣ ⁣ 28:41⁣ So hopefully we will see a change with more champions like yourself. I know we have a little time left and I just want to remind folks that there is a wonderful course, that that the doctor is putting out, and it's called eat real to heal, and also the detox coaching certification she has. I'm going to put all of that in the podcast notes you mentioned. You have a book that you're working on called rise up, and is there anything else that is coming up? Because there's? I have so much on you that I want to talk about in this time and I actually really I do have something I want to ask you about. Please tell me about the Green Mustache Organic Cafes. ⁣ ⁣ 29:16 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Yeah. So back in 2013, I had been working in government up until that point and our local HR manager in the government said could you please teach all our employees the Eat Realty Heal program? And so I did and all of a sudden all the employees started coming back to me saying oh, I don't have, you know, emphysema anymore. I can breathe again. I don't have depression. I just got pregnant after being told for 15 years I cannot get pregnant. Diabetes gone, heart disease. So all of these individuals kept coming back their energy through the roof, you know, brain fog gone. So I started taking on clients. Then because you, then because people are saying can you work with my mom? She's got this disease. Can you work with my cousin? So I started taking on clients and one of the number one things my clients said to me was after they got started with the program and they saw well, you need to be in your kitchen, right? Feminist movement was wonderful, but it really did take humans out of the kitchen and didn't replace them. So that's all fine to take women out of the homes, put them in the workforce, but they forgot to put a chef back in the kitchen for the household. And so tv dinners. You know macaroni and cheese. Those things came to be the convenient food, quick fix, yes. So my client started asking me can you make me the food? So I did. I did. ⁣ ⁣ 30:35⁣ I was like five months pregnant with my third child and I would start making juices and making the food and delivering it to clients and delivering it to restaurants so they can sell it to their patrons. They were asking for the food and I was like I cannot do this anymore. I need a restaurant where I can have a whole team who makes the food and I can be coaching clients. So I quit my job in government, opened up the first restaurant. That's when I was also applying for med school. I had just written my MCAT and all the doctors who were eating at our restaurant. ⁣ ⁣ 31:02⁣ They said Nikki, do not go to med school, just grow the green mustache. So the green mustache is 100% organic, plant-based, whole food, vegan, gluten-free cafe, which means we basically get the food from our farmers. They pick it at five in the morning. They bring it into our restaurant. We convert it into amazing meals lots of warm dishes, cool dishes. Any beverage you get in there is made from a whole food. We do not have refined sugar, we do not have any salt, we do not have any refined oils, everything is made from scratch and whole foods. So that's our restaurant. And, yeah, we had up to eight locations at one point, or seven locations, and we have 10 coming to New York at one point soon. So, yeah, that's an exciting company. ⁣ ⁣ 31:46 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That's amazing. What a journey. Love it. We have a couple minutes left. I want to ask you if you are willing to do a quick rapid fire game that I do with my guests at the end of every podcast. I'm going to throw out a word and then what you do is come back with the first word that comes to mind. All right, yeah, refined Processed food Intuitive. ⁣ ⁣ 32:08 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Healer Clean vegetables, metabolism, mitochondria disease, reversed bipoc, complete, most amazing total health and wellness knowledge that needs to be resurrected so that we use that beautiful wisdom to heal the planet and heal all people and animals and rocks and trees and soil, etc. ⁣ ⁣ 32:37 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Can I just leave it there? We're going to make that one long word like supercalifragilisticexpialidocious. ⁣ ⁣ 32:43 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ That's exactly what it was intended to be. That's great, yes. ⁣ ⁣ 32:46 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Awesome. One more word for you, just like it's the exclamation point heal. ⁣ ⁣ 32:52 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ Potential. Yeah, and we all have that right. ⁣ ⁣ 32:55 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I think that's what you're teaching people. ⁣ ⁣ 32:56 - Dr. Nicolette Richer (Guest)⁣ We all do. ⁣ ⁣ 32:58⁣ We all have the ability to be free of chronic disease, and I'll just talk about the nutrition and detox coaching certification. ⁣ ⁣ 33:05⁣ So that is a six month training program for any individual, whether you have a science background or not, whether you're a physician, a stay at home dad, someone who's a physician, a stay-at-home dad, someone who's battling a chronic disease. That's a beautiful program where you're going to learn everything that I know that I've learned in the last 25 years about reversing chronic disease. I download all the science to you the art of reversing disease, how to coach clients and then we help you build a business in helping other people reverse their chronic diseases. So that's an exciting program. One of our former students he just got a $4 million investment for his business that he built. Another student has 169 acre beautiful piece of land in British Columbia where he now works with elders and indigenous communities working to help men and women in their 20s reverse their mood disorders and mental health disorders and chronic diseases. I love that program because it can take anybody, you do not need to be a physician, and it turns you into a healer overnight. ⁣ ⁣ 34:06 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ We're our own healers first. Yes, exactly, it's really the only ones that we can focus on is the inner healing, yeah, you know, and then we can support others on their journey as well. Exactly, thank you for being here and just sharing your gift. Thank you for having me on your show. If you connect with what Dr Roche shared during our conversation on HIListically Speaking, it may be time to connect with her personally so you can turn your health around and finally heal once and for all. Just check out the list of notes of Holistically Speaking and see how you can find out more about the Eat Real to Heal program that she has, her course and her detox coaching certification, as well as everything else that we shared during our conversation right here on this podcast episode, and listen. ⁣ ⁣ 34:50⁣ Dr Richer shared that healing is about building your army right, finding the right doctors, the right practitioners, the right coaches to support you on your healing journey. And you know what? Havening could be one of those things, and I could be that guy by your side. So if you want to see how havening can help you with your emotional well-being, how you could hug it out, how you could put the healing back in your hands and make that part of that army that you want to build to heal, to live a well-balanced life. Just check the list of notes I shared how you can get in touch with me for a complimentary session and learn more about how Havening can help you on your healing journey. ⁣ ⁣ 35:31⁣ And don't forget to share your thoughts and your responses about this podcast episode. Remember, every time you download, every time you subscribe, every time you leave your message and thoughtful message on the app where you listen, it lets others find this episode and this could help someone else too, so you can pay it forward. I really appreciate reading those responses and I love to read what you have to share Holistically. Speaking is edited by 2MarketMedia with music by Lipbone Redding and listened to and tuned into and supported by you. So thank you so much for being part of this journey. Week after week, you have everything you need to heal yourself. You might just need a guy by your side, and taking this first step just by tuning in here is all part of that process. So thank you for trusting me on your journey. I love you, I believe in you and I will see you next week.

The echo of the past can be filled with uncertainties, especially for those touched by adoption. Award-winning author Julie McGue, a twin adoptee bravely bares her soul in her quest for identity within her richly blended family. Our conversation explores the topic of closed adoption, and highlights not only the obstacles faced by those denied access to their biological lineage and medical history, but also the universal longing to deeply understand our roots. From the insecurities of adoptive parents to the fear of rejection from birth parents, we travel the rocky road adoptees commonly face. But also, the transformative power of community and storytelling that can serve as a channel for the shared human experience that heals and shapes our lives. ⁣ ⁣ CHAPTERS/KEY MOMENTS⁣ 00:00 Intro ⁣ 04:38 Discovering Family History and DNA ⁣ 08:40 Navigating Family and Identity Struggles ⁣ 11:13 Reunion and Discovery⁣ 17:01 Adoption and Loss⁣ 19:15 Community Support ⁣ 32:54 Ancestral Exploration and Healing ⁣ 34:35 The Power of Storytelling⁣ 36:25 Rapid Fire Game⁣ 38:05 Julie's final thoughts⁣ 39:45 Hilary's closing ⁣ CONNECT WITH JULIE MCGUE⁣ https://www.juliemcgueauthor.com ⁣ www.facebook.com/juliemcguewrites⁣ www.instagram.com/julieryanmcgue⁣ www.linkedin.com/in/julie-mcgue-a246b841⁣ ⁣ JULIE'S BOOKS ON AMAZON⁣ ⁣"Twice a Daughter: A Search for Identity, Family, and Belonging" and "Belonging Matters: Conversations on Adoption, Family, and Kinship"⁣ ⁣ LEARN MORE ABOUT HAVENING WITH HILARY⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/havening⁣ ⁣RECEIVE THE BRAIN CANDY NEWSLETTER https://hilaryrusso.com/braincandy CONNECT WITH HILARY⁣ https://www.instagram.com/hilaryrusso⁣ ⁣https://www.youtube.com/hilaryrusso⁣ https://www.facebook.com/hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.tiktok.com/@hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣Music by Lipbone Redding https://lipbone.com/⁣ ⁣ ⁣ EPISODE TRANSCRIPT ⁣ (Full Transcript https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣)⁣ ⁣ 00:08 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ This is the day that she always feared would happen. And all of a sudden, here it is, it's happening, and she didn't show her best self. Did she come around? Yes, she came around, but it was a tricky mother-daughter conflict. We were adults, so we did work our best at re-encouraging everyone that the love was there. ⁣ ⁣ 00:31 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ We hear a lot of ups and downs when it comes to adoption, but one thing if you are not an adoptee or you're not even connected to the adoption community, a lot of questions come up about belonging, identity, how to make sure you know everything about your health and well-being and I have not covered this topic on HIListically Speaking before and I find this to be something that is extremely important for us to talk about whether you know somebody or you are an adoptee or you have adopted a child and I think one person that is a perfect guest to have on the show is Julie McGue. She is an adoptee, she is also a twin, and she is someone that did not seek out information about her adoption until later in life. And, Julie, this is a topic that I think does need more discussion, and I'm so glad you're here to share your experiences and your story. So thanks for being here. Thank you, yeah, oh. ⁣ ⁣ 01:41⁣ Was Julie adopted together with her sibling? Were they adopted separately, and how the relationship with your sibling and the family really was able to grow and prosper and just create that sense of belonging and identity? Can we go into that first? Oh, sure, I'd be happy to. ⁣ ⁣ 02:01 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ So my twin sister and I were adopted together through Catholic Charities and their policy was always to keep multiple birth siblings together. So right off the bat, my birth mom knew that if she had more than one child which was definitely something that ran in her family that her daughters or her kids would stay together, so that was important to her. One of the things that's interesting about being a twin, especially if you're adopted is one of the things that adoptees often wonder about is who do I look like, who do I take after? And so that sense of belonging is a big question for adoptees. From the very beginning I never had to look understand who I look like. I always looked like my sister. To be raised with a full sibling is a real blessing for any adopted person. So a lot of good things came out of being adopted with my sister. ⁣ ⁣ 03:12⁣ My parents also adopted a boy two years after my sister and I, and how often happens, they were able to have three biological children after all of us. So I grew up in this big Irish Catholic blended family of three adoptees and three biological kids. To my parents' credit, I don't think I could tell any difference, but how they treated any one of us. Everybody had the same rewards, the same punishments. They were pretty strict and they were very clear about how much they loved us and how much they wanted this family that they built through adoption and natural childbirth. ⁣ ⁣ 03:59⁣ So I waited until I was 48 years old to do any research about my adoption. It was closed. Closed means that the birth parents' identities are disguised or hidden, and it also allows adoptive parents to not have that co-parenting situation that sometimes happens with open adoption. But unfortunately, what it does is it doesn't allow an adoptee to have any sense of their identity, from where they came from, who they were before adoption was the plan made for them. ⁣ ⁣ 04:38⁣ So, even though I had this twin sister and I knew I belonged to her and I certainly felt belonging in my family, I had no idea. Was I really Catholic? Was I really Irish? What else did I not know? And then I had this breast biopsy at 48 and my husband insisted that I get at family history if I could. I have three daughters. All of that affected them, and so my first phone call was to my twin sister and it said you know, what do you think? And she said absolutely, I support you completely. It became my journey, my story, but she was involved every step of the way, every decision that we had to make. She and I talked about it. ⁣ ⁣ 05:29 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ So that is a lot. That is a lot later in life to question your family history, knowing that you came from a nurturing, loving family, had a sibling who looked just like you that you can share that experience with, in addition to another sibling who was also adopted. Was there ever, even earlier in life, a desire to want to find out more about your birth mother and your lineage, your past, your DNA? We're doing so many of these DNA tests now. Did that exist? ⁣ ⁣ 06:04 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Yes, that did exist and this is something that adoptees talk about a lot, that we have a lot of fantasies with lack of information. Like anybody, you kind of make up your own story in your head. You know, brene Brown talks about that a lot in her books the stories we make up in our heads to make us feel better about something that just happened. So my sister and I decided when we were teenagers our birth parents must have been teenagers and we decided that maybe he was the star football player and maybe she was the head cheerleader and that they, they were passionate and they wanted to go to college. And this just wasn't what you know. They wanted to do was get married and raise kids. So that appeased us for a while. There also was in the back of my mind and my sister's mind that, you know, maybe it was something else, maybe it was two were too many, maybe that was the reason why we were placed for adoption. So there were a lot of things to think about when you know that the gatekeepers are going to keep you from accessing everything. You just stuck it in a little drawer and every once in a while you take it out are going to keep you from accessing everything. You just stuff it in a little drawer and every once in a while you take it out and you look at it and then you put it back in. What ended up happening? Timing was everything with this. ⁣ ⁣ 07:37⁣ I had the breast biopsy. ⁣ ⁣ 07:39⁣ Turns out I didn't have breast cancer, but the threat that it might be in my family line meant I was going to full steam ahead. I was ready to go, my sister was ready to help with it, and the state of Illinois had changed their policy, their law about adoption, meaning that any adoptee over a certain age could access the original birth record. So I accessed my original birth record. Unfortunately, the search agency I turned it over to figured out that my birth mom had used an alias on the original birth record perfectly legal in 1959 to falsify a public record like that sounding to me, and also perfectly legal to not include the birth father's name. He didn't sign off on his parental rights, which is not something that happens today. ⁣ ⁣ 08:40⁣ So we were kind of stuck and at the same time that we're struggling with getting the search going, my adoptive mom was not happy with me. She really feared that she was going to be set aside as our mother and I had to work really hard and so did my, to prove to her that our bond was our bond. She had raised us, and that was a tricky thing. I'm battling health, I'm battling this search and I'm also having to be really careful with my adoptive mom. So there were a lot of issues at play. ⁣ ⁣ 09:25 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And I imagine that this could also bring, were a lot of issues at play, and I imagine that this could also bring up the thought of loss and grief and grief, before grief even happens. Your mom raised beautiful children and, while they might not be from her womb, there's kind of a spiritual womb that exists in families that are well-rounded and close and that can be a disconnection. So, having that conversation and her also knowing that there was another entity that was on Team Julie being your twin, I can only imagine how difficult that must have been for her. But my question is how did you have conversations with your brother about this as well? ⁣ ⁣ 10:04 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Oh, yes, definitely. ⁣ ⁣ 10:06 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Because here is another child in the family that was also adopted, and does it spark that curiosity for your brother as well to try to find his birth parents? ⁣ ⁣ 10:16 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ He was waiting and watching how my parents handled my sister and I going down this path when our search got rolling and I ended up getting involved with Catholic Charities because they had a social worker that did this kind of work. He came to every adoption support group meeting with me, paying attention, seeing how he was going to sort through this for himself. My sister and I definitely blazed the trail for him and by the time he got around to doing it, my parents realized this was going to be okay, the family was going to stay intact, that this was very important to all of us to understand who and where we came from and assimilate that into our personality. My mom did eventually come around. It is kind of a God wink moment, if you will, at the end of the book Twice a Daughter. ⁣ ⁣ 11:13⁣ I won't give everything away, but I do find a brother and a sister, a half brother and a half sister, so we share the same father. And when I do find my birth father, he doesn't want anything to do with my sister and I, but he does give me my medical history, which was what I was after, and he wouldn't comply with DNA analysis. So there was this question was he really the right guy and I really did feel like I needed DNA to know, because breast cancer ran in his family. My aunt had died of breast cancer before she was 40. So big breast cancer scary stuff. And my brother, my birth father, told my brother that you know, there's these two women. One of them is requesting all of this information and testing in and I'm not going to do it. And my brothers just picked up the phone and called me a cold call and, as we often do when we're talking with strangers, you know you're saying where did you go to school and how do you know? How do we, how would our paths have crossed ever? ⁣ ⁣ 12:26⁣ But came out that I knew his wife and that his wife and my family were intertwined. I won't give the whole secret away and because of that, because my adoptive parents and my adoptive family already knew my sister-in-law and her family, we all had probably met my brother and not known he was our brother. It fixed everything, Hilary. Instantly it was my mom realized oh, I know these people. This is great. Let's get together for family dinner. This is an amazing, beautiful moment. So the story, you know, it's ups and downs and it's one setback after another, but in the end there was this beautiful coming together of families that knew each other but didn't know they were biologically related. Do I ever get to meet my birth father? I don't he. He had a cardiac event and died before he changed his mind, so who knows if that would have ever happened. ⁣ ⁣ 13:46 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ It sounds like it is a Godwink moment and so fortunate to be able to have that and have some sense of closure. But not everyone gets that. ⁣ ⁣ 13:56 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ No, you did mention your book. ⁣ ⁣ 13:59 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I want to mention that real quick. Julie has three books. The third one's coming out next year, but the book we're referring to is Twice a Daughter, A Search for Identity, Family and Belonging, and then your second book is Belonging Matters. Those are the conversations of adoption, family and kinship, more like essays, and we'll put all of these links in the podcast notes. But just to go back to that, this is a wonderful turnout. Sounds like a perfect movie where everybody works out like a Hallmark movie in a way. ⁣ ⁣ 14:29⁣ But it's not always like that, Because when you think about and I just know this personally, not from being an adoptee or adopting, but having friends who have and sometimes you don't find the parents, sometimes you find family members and they don't really want to have a connection with you. ⁣ ⁣ 14:48 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Oh, it definitely. At my birth, mom did not want anything to do with us either, so it was not an easy road for her as far as being found. ⁣ ⁣ 14:58 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Right, but when it comes to health, do you think that there are laws and rules that need to be in place? And if that's the case, how would that change adoption for those who would consider putting their child up for adoption but don't want to be found? ⁣ ⁣ 15:16 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ The trend now in adoption is open adoption, which means that an adoptive parent enters into an adoption plan with the birth parents and they establish between them what the contact is going to be. Is it going to be just a yearly phone conversation or cards and letters? So it is between the birth parents and the adoptive parents, so that piece is so much better. When it comes to adoption, closed adoptions really did go out of vogue after 1980. Unfortunately, to your point about laws and statutes those of us that were adopted before 1980 during closed adoption it is up to each individual state to decide what their statutes are and to this point Illinois was one of the first eight states that changed open records acts. New York has changed their laws. There's probably about 15 out of 50 states that allow people my age to access their original birth records and research their family medical history. ⁣ ⁣ 16:32⁣ Unfortunately, dna can help some of us. It can't help all of us because the database is only as good as the people that subscribe to it. For example, my half-brother. That family never would have signed up for DNA. They don't want their specimens anywhere, so I would not have been able to find them through DNA. ⁣ ⁣ 17:01⁣ But some adoptees do the thing about birth parents and I want to emphasize the loss because you brought that up earlier. Loss is prevalent in the whole adoption triad. Adoptive parents most of them choose adoption as the way to build a family because they have infertility. So there's this insecurity about being able to have a biological child, a birth parents, birth mothers generally. It's a searing loss for them to have this situation present themselves where they're not going to parent their child and adoptees lose a sense of their family and their identity. ⁣ ⁣ 17:50⁣ One of the things that happened as a result of my search and my birth mom telling my sister and I I don't want anything to do with these girls I wasn't expecting that, Hilary, I thought I would be the lost girl found that she was waiting for me to find her. In fact, she didn't want to be found. She feared Her family had not. She'd never told her family. She feared my birth father coming back into her life. ⁣ ⁣ 18:22⁣ There was a lot of fear about that and I turned to Catholic Charities and got involved with their post adoption support group and it was one of the most meaningful things that came out of that adoption search because I came to understand the heartache that a birth mother goes through in coming to the decisions that they make and they work just as hard as adoptees do to make contact with their birth child sometimes with no success, sometimes with success and the adoptive parents. My adoptive mom was a little unusual in her lack of support because there were adoptive parents in our group that were supporting their child to find access to information that was important to them. It's a complicated situation for everybody and the people that are outside of the adoption world. I think sometimes there's some preconceived ideas about it. Adoptees like me present themselves until my middle age as being well-adjusted, and I write an essay about that in Belonging Matters. I did feel well-adjusted until I wasn't well-adjusted. I wanted that. ⁣ ⁣ 19:47 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ When was that? ⁣ ⁣ 19:49 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Well, I needed to know this family history and I couldn't have it, and it made me mad, and I think that you know there are a lot of angry adoptees out there. I think maybe that's some of the voices that people hear adoptees that aren't happy about their situation or they can't find, um, their relatives, um. But I felt like the, the support group that I I'm still involved in that, by the way, it's been 15 years, um, I think when you start listening to everybody else's perspective and you realize this isn't just about you, there's other things at play here. I think it allows us not only to heal personally but to have empathy for the other members in the triangle. ⁣ ⁣ 20:44 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, it's a sense of community, knowing that you're not alone, even if your story is different. It's giving you a sense of community and a collective of those who are going through something with that similar attachment. ⁣ ⁣ 20:57 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Yes, exactly. ⁣ ⁣ 20:59 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ So that anytime we can have a support and a community, and I imagine sometimes that's even a community of people who aren't connected to your story personally. Right, so that, and it's beautiful that you're still involved with that that the thought that is coming up to me is you were 48 when this awareness of I need to make some decisions and get some answers came to pass. But were there moments earlier where you really felt that pull? I mean, you mentioned making up the stories with your sister. Have you approached your parents, your adopted parents, prior to look into this earlier? ⁣ ⁣ 21:45⁣ And were you shut down? Were you supported? ⁣ ⁣ 21:55 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ you shut down? Were you supported? Really good question. So when I always knew that I was adopted. So that was a conversation my parents must have had with us when we were three or four or something, but every once in a while, around our birthday, they would sit us down in the living room and we'd have the adoption talk and they'd ask us you know, is there anything we can help you with? If you want to research your adoption, we'll help you, okay? So that conversation happened a handful of times when I was growing up. So my mother's reaction to me deciding to eventually search at 48 came out of nowhere and, as we talked about earlier, I know now that it came out of fear. She was worried that this woman was going to be a threat to her and in talking with the social worker about her reaction, she said you know, this is the day that she always feared would happen. Yeah, and she put it out of her mind. ⁣ ⁣ 23:00⁣ And all of a sudden, here it is, it's happening, and she didn't show her best self. Did she come around? Yes, she came around. Self Did she come around? Yes, she came around. But it was, you know, a tricky mother-daughter conflict. You know, we were adults, so we did work our best at just re-encouraging everyone that the love was there. ⁣ ⁣ 23:28 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I imagine that is a conversation that parents who have adopted children have with themselves quite regularly, because you especially when you mentioned the fact that there are different reasons why people adopt many times it might be because they can't have their own children and when you finally have that moment, you're like holding your breath, that first year especially, you know, will anything change? Is this going to become an adoption? If it started in foster care, then adoption so many different avenues that people can take and then, as the child gets older, they become so much a part of you. If it is that well-balanced family environment, you stop thinking about those things, but it's still there and there's that thought of loss before a loss even exists, right, so the brain tends to go there. We go to the negative. It's how we keep ourselves alive. So creating that nurturing reminder to your mom and letting her know that it's still something I'm sure she thought about every day in some way, you know. So what would be your advice? And before we even go there, I just want to mention again, if you did miss it the first time Julie is an adoptee. ⁣ ⁣ 24:48⁣ She's also a twin and she pursued finding her, adopted, her birth mother at 48 years old due to a potential health issue which we're happy that you're not dealing with. But then you have to think about your own family, like your children. You said you're a mother of three daughters, and then where do we go from there? So Julie has two wonderful books that are out very different and they kind of build on each other. I imagine you have Twice a Daughter A Search for Identity, family and Belonging, and then Belonging Matters Conversations on Adoption, family and Kinship, which is more of the essays, and then a new book coming out, which is another memoir in 2025, which is Twice the Family a memoir of love, loss and sisterhood. Really beautiful. Build on these three areas in your life, like, basically it's it's three stages in your life and building on that, was it, was it ever a thought, to become an author? Did you think about that? ⁣ ⁣ 25:50 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ I have always been a writer but a journaler, so more of a private writing experience. So when Twice a Daughter, the story of the adoption search was unfolding, I was keeping copious notes with my journals and the more I told people the story of what was happening. And you know, I can't find my birth mother. Now I found my birth mother and she doesn't want to know us and my mom doesn't want to help me with this and the health stuff was going on whole saga which was five years from beginning to end. People would say, gosh, I hope you're going to write a book about this. And I thought, wow, I wonder if I should. And so I started taking writing classes at the University of Chicago in downtown Chicago, and so the book came together in 2021. And right right after COVID. I mean, I was writing the book during COVID. ⁣ ⁣ 26:51 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Great time to write. ⁣ ⁣ 26:53 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Yeah, what's interesting about having written the story and one of the things I like to speak to is this is my story, yes, but every struggle that I went through in that process is the same thing that other adoptees go through. They struggle with support from their adoptive family. They struggle with connection to make with their birth parents, to make with their birth parents. Some adoptees find siblings and in the communities that I'm involved in, most of us have better relationships with our siblings the siblings that we find than we do with our birth parents, because they don't have any skin in the game. They don't have any baggage to bring to the relationship. They're excited. They have two new siblings that they didn't even know that they had and there are a lot of similarities and it's been a lot of fun getting to know my new brother and sister, although my brother always says I am not your new brother, I have always been your brother, so I find that very sweet. I've also one of the things that I've written essays about is getting to know beyond this immediate circle. ⁣ ⁣ 28:15⁣ My birth mom didn't want to tell her family. She wanted to keep us a secret. Her family, she wanted to keep us a secret, and this whole theme of secret keeping is, and shame is, at the very core of adoption from the closed adoption era. She had a hard time letting people know, because she had taken on society's shame and blame, viewed herself as a sinner, that she'd had this relationship outside of marriage and he wouldn't marry her, and it was something that she kept inside her identity. She didn't marry until she was in the late 40s. I don't have any other siblings from her, and so it has never been easy for her to introduce us to other people, and some of the things that she did to my sister and I not introducing us to family members and not inviting us to family reunions is foreign to me. My family that I grew up in was very loving. We had a lot of family gatherings, family reunions, big parties. ⁣ ⁣ 29:30⁣ I couldn't understand my birth mother's attitude about including my sister and I, and I have finally come to the place I talk about healing that. I realize it's not my problem, it's her problem. I can't fix her. I would love for her to be fixed so that she could find joy in this relationship with her two daughters that she never could claim. I mean, think about how hard that is on Mother's Day to pretend that you are not a mother, so I have a lot of empathy for her and her situation. That was not easy to come to. A lot of self-work on that front. I also have forgiveness for my birth father. He chose not to meet us. ⁣ ⁣ 30:21 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That was my first question. ⁣ ⁣ 30:22 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Yeah, I was gonna ask you about that, because yeah, he chose not to meet my sister and I, and that situation is complicated by a second marriage or whatever. I had a great dad growing up. My adoptive father was just amazing, everyone's favorite, and so I don't feel cheated. There is one thing I do feel cheated about. ⁣ ⁣ 30:46 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ What's that? ⁣ ⁣ 30:46 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ I found out that my sister and I are strongly Native American on both sides of my biological families. I was deprived of knowing that, identifying with a culture that was mine to know my adoptive parents it's not their fault, they were not given any of that information, so I didn't find out about this culture that I belonged to until I was in my 50s and it's a little late then. Also, because my birth father's name is not on my original birth record means that I can't claim to be a Chippewa, so denied on many fronts, and so I'm still figuring that out. Here I am 65 and I'm still trying to figure out. How do I feel about this identity piece? I want to belong in that culture, I want to understand it, but I am denied access. ⁣ ⁣ 31:53 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And I imagine that goes back to the feelings associated with ancestral and generational trauma. You never connected to it knowingly, but when? And this I think this goes back to the DNA testing, all these DNA testings that we're finding out about now and using, and people are finding families that exist all over the world. Being able to attach yourself to a lineage, a culture, a heritage that you had no clue about and wanting to learn more about it, but then for you not being able to actually claim it is, in some ways, another loss. ⁣ ⁣ 32:37 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Definitely is. ⁣ ⁣ 32:38 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, yeah. So do you still feel a connection to it, to where you want to explore, learning about it, even if you can't claim it? ⁣ ⁣ 32:53 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Absolutely. I have some trips planned to northern Minnesota to see where my birth father is from Minnesota, to see where my birth father's from. He grew up very poor on the outskirts of the Chippewa Reservation in northern Minnesota, and so I do have plans to visit those places. I did extensive genealogy and have a lot of family history that I find fascinating, and so do my children, which is kind of fun. Three of my kids played college sports and that was kind of a joke in my family because I didn't have access to where did that come from, and so we never really knew. And then we found out that our birth father played college football, and so some of these things have fallen into place, made sense. ⁣ ⁣ 33:47 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ It really is putting together a puzzle. Yeah, yeah, it really is. And how beautiful it is that you're experiencing all these things with now, your own children and your sister and family members that are curious. It's a curiosity, you know, but you know, with these traumas, as I often say and you mentioned as well, you find the healing there's a little bit of humor there's always you're confronted with your health turns into those triumphant moments, you know, and your mess is your message, basically. So what is next for Julie, in addition to the book that you have coming out, what is it that you are exploring now, in this stage of your life, with all of this beautiful knowledge? ⁣ ⁣ 34:35 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ One of the things I really like to do is write short essays. For example, I had I was on vacation. I came back I was dreading going out to the mailbox and getting the mail and paying the bills and doing all that and so reluctantly went out there and the mail hadn't come yet. I didn't realize that. But inside my mailbox was a little card. A child had drawn it and a message inside and it said you won the mailbox project, love Layla. ⁣ ⁣ 35:12⁣ So I just wrote an essay about this and it just caught me at the right moment. Here was an innocent child doing a random act of kindness, stuffed a little note in my mailbox and I came upon it right when I needed to. So that another little God wink moment. Going back to my comment earlier, I love finding these quirky little moments in life and building them out and writing a story about it. I write often about my grandsons and some of the fun, cute little stuff that they do. In fact I wrote an essay last fall that is in belonging matters, and I just recently found out it won a couple of different awards. ⁣ ⁣ 36:00⁣ So I think I think I'm done writing memoir, but I think I'm not done being a storyteller. ⁣ ⁣ 36:09 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That's great, yeah, we. Our stories are so much a part of our healing you know, and hopefully they'll touch, move and inspire someone else, right? What is it Brene says one day, your story will be somebody else's survival guide. ⁣ ⁣ 36:22 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Yes, oh yeah. So well said Something like that. ⁣ ⁣ 36:25 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, yeah. Well, I want to have a little fun with you for a moment before we close. Sure, I've been writing down some words that you've said and what I do is a rapid fire, which is basically word association. I'm going to throw out a word that you said and you just come back as fast as you can with one word that associates with that one. What comes to mind first. Okay, Okay. All right, here we go. Ad Self Heritage. ⁣ ⁣ 37:05 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Ancestry, family, belonging Community, neighbors. Author Writer Loss. Writer Loss. ⁣ ⁣ 37:27 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Grief DNA. ⁣ ⁣ 37:30 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Biology Support Community. ⁣ 37:39 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Beautiful and we do need community. We really do, and this big part of what this show is about is bringing people together, you know, to find those trauma, to triumph moments and know that even if their stories are different, there's a connection in some way. So I appreciate you sharing your story and do you have any final thoughts that you want to share with listeners and those who tune in? ⁣ ⁣ 38:10 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ One thing I like to say to people is if you are not in the adoption community, but you know somebody that's touched by adoption, sit back and listen to what they have to say, or their viewpoint or their hurt, because so often we jump in and we offer an opinion or we have a perspective that we're not willing to change without really listening to somebody and I think this follows through with other hot topics. It doesn't have to be adoption. If we take the time to listen, time to listen and have empathy for the speaker, I think that we have the potential to invoke change in our societies and our communities, but we have to be willing to do that, to be willing to listen. ⁣ ⁣ 38:54 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That's beautiful, always coming from that place of compassion and empathy. It doesn't have to be our story, but that's what connects us. Thank you for sharing that. That's beautiful. We will share all the information on your books, julie McGue. Three books In 2025, we'll see three out there. Maybe even more with all these essays you're writing. Who knows? But Twice a Daughter A Search for Identity, family and Belonging, belonging Matters, conversations on Adoption, family and Kinship. And in 2025, twice a Family A Memoir of Love, loss and Sisterhood, and all of that will be in the podcast notes. I highly recommend sharing this, taking time to read these stories and see what your connection is and the empathy that you might have to this conversation, julie, thank you so much. It's been a pleasure. ⁣ ⁣ 39:42 - Julie McGue (Guest)⁣ Thanks, Hilary. Thanks for your thoughtful questions and really easy conversation. ⁣ ⁣ 39:52 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I appreciate it, my pleasure. All right, my friends, if this conversation with Julie McGue inspired you in any way, like it did me, consider leaving a rating and a review wherever you're tuning in. It will help others find this podcast when you do that, and they might be the ones that really need to connect to the story. So do yourself a favor and do us a favor, and do others a favor and pay it forward. And if you want to connect with Julie personally, learn more about her stories or her books, I've shared all that information in the notes of this podcast. That includes her two books that are out right now Twice a Daughter A Search for Identity, family and Belonging and Belonging Matters, which are conversations on adoption, family and kinship, and, of course, her soon-to-be-released book in 2025, which is Twice a Family, which is a memoir of love, loss, sisterhood. That comes out in February. ⁣ ⁣ 40:41⁣ And, yes, you can connect with me and learn more about how you can turn your traumas into triumphs, how you can hug it out with Havening with me as your guide, and you can also join us for Havening happy hours every month or any other event that I might be hosting. You can find that information on how to attend those events to connect with me. In the notes of this podcast as well, there's links for everything you need. HIListically Speaking is edited by 2 Market Media with music by Lipbone Redding and tuned into by you. So thank you for returning week after week and being part of the process, and never forget, no matter your journey, you do belong and your story does matter. I love you, I believe in you and I will see you next week. Be well. ⁣ ⁣

If you've ever wondered how self-perception can influence your journey to personal success, this conversation on the HIListically Speaking Podcast with guest Dr. John Demartini is for you. A world-renowned luminary in human behavior and emotional intelligence, Dr. Demartini will have you asking yourself, "How do I elevate my self-awareness?" But also inspire authentic living through balance and embracing both the inner hero and the bully within. Dr. Demartini shares his trauma-to-triumph stories that will leave you in awe. Including two powerful lessons he learned as a high school dropout from one of the world's most successful entrepreneurs of his time, to the words he lives by that have been the blueprint for humanity, wisdom, and love. ⁣ ⁣ ⁣CHAPTERS/KEY MOMENTS⁣ 0:00 Intro ⁣ 0:10 Human Potential Through Emotional Intelligence⁣ 03:38 Imposter Syndrome, the Ego for Authenticity⁣ 07:17 Self-Judgment and Behavior ⁣ 16:08 Lesson in Wisdom and Courage⁣ 21:54 Creating Original Ideas for Humanity⁣ 29:09 Free Masterclasses with Dr. Demartini⁣ 31:00 Essentials of Emotional Intelligence Book⁣ 32:50 Unlocking Your Inner Genius ⁣ 38:47 Self-Talk for Success⁣ 42:48 Authenticity and Self-Acceptance ⁣ 46:25 The Power of Gratitude and Love⁣ 56:28 Life's Balance and Self-Confidence⁣ ⁣ CONNECT WITH DR. DEMARTINI ⁣ https://drdemartini.com/ or @drjohndemartini⁣ ⁣ Essentials of Emotional Intelligence Book (available on Amazon May 2024⁣ CONNECT WITH HILARY⁣ https://www.instagram.com/hilaryrusso⁣ ⁣https://www.youtube.com/hilaryrusso⁣ https://www.facebook.com/hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.tiktok.com/@hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣Music by Lipbone Redding https://lipbone.com/⁣ ⁣ Never miss an episode or info on upcoming workshops and events. Subscribe to the Brain Candy Newsletter.⁣ EPISODE TRANSCRIPT ⁣ (Full Transcript https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣)⁣ ⁣ ⁣ 00:00 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Every symptom in our physiology, every symptom in our psychology, every symptom in our sociological connections, in our relationships, even in our business transactions. Our feedback mechanisms trying to get us back to authenticity, where we have equanimity within ourselves and equity between ourselves and others, so we can create a transaction that has a sustainable, fair exchange, where we maximize our potential. So we understand that, no matter what's going on, it's on the way for that objective, not in the way. ⁣ ⁣ 00:30 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Am I unlocking my greatest human potential? Think about that question just for a moment, because that's where we're going today. Sit with it for a moment and then think about that, because you're about to meet somebody who can challenge you with that question and help you find the answer. He is not your typical expert. He has a unique blend of wisdom and wit and insight, and he's dedicated his life to unraveling the mysteries of human behavior and helping people, including himself, discover that human potential. Thank you so much for joining us here. As I mentioned, you are a world leading human behavior specialist. You're a philosopher and international speaker, multi bestselling author and founder of the Demartini Method, which is a revolutionary tool in modern psychology, and it is just such a pleasure and a joy to have you here to share more about what you do and how you hold space in this world. So thank you. ⁣ ⁣ 01:32 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Thank you. What a great intro. Thank you. ⁣ ⁣ 01:35 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Well, I've been really tapping into everything you're sharing and you talk a lot about, most recently the emotional intelligence side of things with your most recent book, and I want to touch on that because you really have made such a significant difference in how people are truly transforming their own lives. So let's go there first. What is making this book, this most recent book, the Essentials of Emotional Intelligence, different from all these other amazing pieces of literature you've written in the past? ⁣ ⁣ 02:28 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ not always appreciate themselves, not love themselves, because of the emotional vicissitudes and volatilities that they allow themselves to participate in. I'll give an example. You see somebody walking down the street. You meet them and you think, wow, they're more intelligent than me, or maybe they're more achieving, successful than me, or maybe wealthier, or maybe they're more, have a stable relationship, or maybe they're more of a leader or more they're physically fit or more inspired. ⁣ ⁣ 02:59⁣ And then you put them a bit on a pedestal because you're conscious of the upsides and blind and subjectively biased and unconscious of the downsides. And then you beat yourself up and minimize yourself and then you're not honoring your magnificence Because you're comparing yourself to others instead of comparing your daily actions to your own values. Or you might meet somebody and you look down on them and think I'm superior to them, I'm too proud to admit what I see in them, inside me, and you'll now put them down intellectually or in business or finance or family or social or physical or spiritual. And then you now put them in the pit and exaggerate yourself. Anytime we put some in a pedestal and minimize ourselves or put people in a pit and exaggerate ourselves, we're not being ourselves. We've got an imposter syndrome. We've got a facade, a persona, a mask that we're wearing the superiority complex, the inferiority complex, the puffed up, the beat up. ⁣ ⁣ 04:03 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And as long as we do that, we're in a state of becoming, not our authentic state of being. I love that you touch on that state of the becoming versus the being, because a lot of times I'll say are you being, are you in a state of being or a state of doing? But using the word becoming is is something that is really resonating with me. And going back to the idea of the imposter syndrome, I think we're hearing a lot more about that now and I imagine that's because we live in this global village where everything is right at the touch of our fingertips, you know. So we're infiltrated with so much information and comparison game that it could be very detrimental, whether you're a child or an adult. ⁣ ⁣ 04:40 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Well, we're not here to compare ourselves to others. We're here to compare our own daily actions to what's most meaningful to us, and how congruent are we with what's really priority? But the second we put people on pedestals or pits, we distorted our views, subjectively, of them and we simultaneously created the symptoms in ourselves to let us know that simultaneously created the symptoms in ourselves to let us know that All of the physiological symptoms that we generate genetically, epigenetically or autonomically are feedback mechanisms to guide us back to authenticity. And when we puff ourselves up, we tend to activate our narcissistic side, because we feel superior and we tend to project our values and expect others to live in our values, which creates futility to humble us. Period, we tend to project our values and expect others to live in our values, which creates futility to humble us. And anytime we minimize ourselves and exaggerate them, we tend to go into our altruistic persona and we try to sacrifice for them, which is futile because we can't sustain it. So both of those are feedback mechanisms that are futility, that allow us to go back to who we are. ⁣ ⁣ 05:42⁣ Every symptom in our physiology, every symptom in our psychology, every symptom in our sociological connections, in our relationships, even in our business transactions, our feedback mechanisms, trying to get us back to authenticity, where we have equanimity within ourselves and equity between ourselves and others, so we can create a transaction that has a sustainable, fair exchange, where we maximize our potential. So we understand that, no matter what's going on, it's on the way for that objective, not in the way, and we transcend our fantasies of our amygdala of avoiding pain and seeking pleasure and only going to one-sided realities. As the Buddha says, the desire for that which is unobtainable and the desire to avoid that which is unavoidable is a source of human suffering. But when we finally realize that there's a balance of life and there's nothing to get rid of in yourself and there's nothing to try to go and find in yourself, it's already present and you embrace it in yourself and not compare it to somebody else, because you won't honor it in yourself when you're comparing what you think it needs to be in you with somebody else, what? ⁣ ⁣ 06:43 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ you think it needs to be in you with somebody else, For those out there that are hearing you and want so desperately I don't even want to say desperately, but are really open to the possibility of the neuroplasticity of the brain right, being able to really truly change your thoughts, change your life, kind of thing. How are there easy steps to go about that approach? If they're stuck in the imposter syndrome, if they are on the pedestal or the pit, there must be a simple step to take first. ⁣ ⁣ 07:17 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Yes, well, I've been fascinated by this, for I've been teaching 51 years, so I've been doing it a bit. And you know, there's a statement in Romans 2.1 of the New Testament not that that is the ultimate source by any means, it's just a source but it says that beware of judging other people, for whatever you see in them, you do the same thing. So I was 40-something years ago. I found myself when I was saying something about other people. I found myself talking to myself Whatever I was saying to them and being adamant about. I was thinking I'm really talking to myself, trying to convince myself of what I'm saying to them. Isn't it interesting. So, instead of waiting for people to push my buttons, I decided to go to the Oxford English Dictionary and underline every possible human behavioral trait that could be found. Now Gordon Halport did the same thing years earlier. I didn't know about that at the time, but he must have been as neurotic as I was, because I went through every one and underlined every one of them. ⁣ ⁣ 08:19⁣ In the book I found 4,628 character traits of human beings. Then what I did is I put an initial of the individual out to the side of the margin of the dictionary. Who is it that I know that displays this trait to the furthest degree. So if I saw somebody that was generous, who is the most generous? If I saw somebody that was inconsiderate, who is the most inconsiderate In my perception? These are my distortions, but I put the names out there. Once I put the name next to each of those, I then asked myself John, go to a moment where and when you perceive yourself displaying or demonstrating this particular trait. And I had to be honest with myself because I knew that I did because you only react to things on the outside that represent parts of yourself you haven't loved. So if you're resentful to somebody, they're reminding you that you're too proud to admit you've done it. They're reminding you of something you're feeling ashamed of and they're bringing it out. The reason you want to avoid them is because you don't want to dissociate away from what you're judging in yourself. So I went through there and I found every one of those traits inside myself to the same degree, quantitatively and qualitatively, as I saw in them. And I didn't stop until I saw it which was waking up intuition and unconscious information about me and took out the subjective bias and allowed me to see myself objectively and I realized I was hero and villain, and saint and sinner, and I had every one of those traits. I had all pairs of opposites. ⁣ ⁣ 09:53⁣ Heraclitus, 5th century BC, said there's a unity of opposites in all of us. And it was Wilhelm Watt, in the 1895 Father Experimental Psychology, that said that there's a simultaneous contrast in all people. When they become aware of it, they're fully self-actualized. So nothing's missing At the level of the soul, nothing's missing At the level of the senses. Things appear to be missing. The things that appear to be missing are the things you're too proud or too humble to admit that you see in others, inside yourself, and pure, reflective awareness, which allows true loving intimacy, allows you to realize that whatever you see is you. So the first thing to help you transcend the vicissitudes and the volatilities of the incomplete awareness is to take the time to go and look at where you do the same thing. That's just one of many steps, and when I did that I found all 4,628 traits. I sat and I documented where I had them all. So that means that no matter what anybody said about me, it was true, but maybe not in the context they were projecting, but I owned it and I found out that any trait you don't own is a trait that people push your buttons with, but when you own it, you go. ⁣ ⁣ 11:08⁣ Yes, sometimes I'm this way, sometimes I'm that If I walked up to somebody and I said you're always nice, you're never mean, you're always kind, you're never cruel, you're always positive, never negative, they would go. Not exactly, their intuition would point out the times when they've been the other and they'd immediately be thinking about the time when they're the opposite of that. If I said you're always mean, you're never nice, you're always cruel, you're never kind, always stingy, never generous, they'd go. No, that's not true either. But if I said sometimes you're nice, sometimes you're mean, sometimes you're kind, sometimes you're cruel, they'd go. That's me, because we know innately, with certainty, that we have a unity of pairs of opposites and when you can embrace both sides of those and don't try to get rid of half of yourself, you finally can love yourself. But the futility of trying to get rid of half of yourself is going to undermine it. ⁣ ⁣ 11:52⁣ So the first step in transcending, because anything you infatuate with or resent occupies space and time in your mind and runs your life, and you can't even sleep at night when you're highly infatuated or resentful, because your mind is intruded by these incomplete awarenesses and it's creating symptoms to let you know you're not loving and not whole. You're playing part in the posture and your symptoms are giving you feedback to let you know that to help you. So when I went through and I owned all those traits, I noticed that there was more poise, more presence, more productivity. Noticed that there was more poise, more presence, more productivity, more able to be prioritized and not influenced by other people's opinions, and able to. You know, I'd rather have the whole world against me than my own soul. I was able to listen to my soul, the state of unconditional love, not the imposter syndrome, because if you put people in pedestals you'll minimize. If you put people in pitch, you can exaggerate, and those are becoming, instead of being so you get to be being when you own all your traits. So that's the first little step. ⁣ ⁣ 13:05⁣ 1947, he said it's not that we don't know so much, we know so much. That isn't so. We've been taught moral hypocrisies. Alistair McIntyre, in his book on the history of ethics, shows that we've been given a bunch of ideals that nobody lives by, but everybody thinks they're supposed to, and then they beat themselves up and because they do. They brain offload decisions to outer authorities, and the outer authorities set up the moral hypocrisies for ability to control people as a strategy. So I realized that it's not that we don't know so much. We know so much. That isn't so. So it's time to confront the fantasies and idealisms and the unrealistic expectations and to look at things in a broader perspective. In a broad mind, it's neither positive or negative. In a narrow mind, it's neither positive or negative. In a narrow mind, it's either positive or negative. ⁣ ⁣ 13:48⁣ So I started to go and ask the trait that I listed on the encyclopedia did I interpret it as a positive trait or a negative trait? And if I interpret it as a positive trait, I then asked what are the downsides of the trait? Until I found enough drawbacks to see both sides? And if I saw it as a negative trait, what are the upsides to it? Until I saw both sides? Because I realized that you may infatuate with a guy. You may meet this guy. He's highly intelligent, ooh. He's an aphrodisiac. He turns me on, he's so intelligent, ooh. But then you go. But he's argumentative, he thinks he's right, he knows it all, he doesn't want to listen, he wants to always win in a fight of argument. And then you go oh, there's downsides to that. ⁣ ⁣ 14:27⁣ But because I was infatuated and fantasizing about how good it was, I was blind, I minimized myself, I sacrificed to get with this guy. I feared his loss and I disempowered myself until I saw both sides. And when I saw both sides, he didn't control me. I gave myself power, my power back. In the process of doing it, I went through the 4,628 traits and looked for the upsides to what I thought was down, the down to what was up, until I saw that it was neither positive nor negative. And then I transcended the moral hypocrisies that I'd been indoctrinated by, which was the dogma, and I got to see that there was nothing but love. All else was illusion, because love is the synthesis and synchronicity of complementary opposites, which is the state of being, which is our spiritual path, as Hagel says oh, fascinating. ⁣ ⁣ 15:18 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I love this conversation so much. I'm just sitting here and I'm thinking with such wisdom that you have, with over 50 years of studying, which everything that you're sharing here on the show in just a small period of time. I'd love to know who is your inspiration Like, who helped you come to this place, because I know you share personally that you had your own story even as a high school dropout, as someone who had his own challenges in his youth. Who truly was your inspiration to move you into the space of becoming and being? ⁣ ⁣ 15:58 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Well, I don't know if there's one, there's probably 30,000. ⁣ ⁣ 16:03 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Maybe a couple of your favorites. ⁣ ⁣ 16:08 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ When I was a young boy, I left home and I left home at 13. At 14, I hitchhiked from Houston, texas, to California. On that hitchhike I was confronted by three cowboys. In El Paso, texas, I had a headband, a Hawaiian shirt on, some shorts, some sandals and I had a surfboard. And I was hitchhiking to California. I got confronted by three cowboys. Cowboys and surfers didn't get along in those days, 1968. ⁣ ⁣ 16:39⁣ I was walking through downtown because the freeway wasn't in those days. You had to go through the downtown and three cowboys lined up across the front of me and they were going to not let me through. They didn't like long-haired hippie kids. I didn't know what to do. I couldn't outrun them, I couldn't go in the store, I couldn't go in the street. I had to confront them and somehow a great ingenious idea came to me. I looked like a wild animal and barked like some wild wolf and dog. Okay, now that that's talking about genius. Now that was that low level genius. So I did and the guys moved aside. They moved aside and they let me through the sidewalk and I'm growling at him with my and they let me through. ⁣ ⁣ 17:26⁣ As I came on the other side there was a guy on the street corner leaning on a lamppost, trying to compose himself from laughing so hard, because he just saw what I did. And he comes up behind me and he puts his arm on top of my shoulder and he said, sonny, that's the funniest dang thing I've ever seen. You took them cowpokes like a pro. Can I buy you a cup of coffee? And I said, sir, I don't drink coffee. Can I get you a Coca-Cola? And I said yes, sir. ⁣ ⁣ 17:53⁣ So he took me to a little malt shop and we're swiveling on these things and I had a little Coke with this guy. He was 62 years old at the time but he seemed older, because when you're 14, that seems old. Now it seems young. I'm 70 almost. So I listened to him and he said you finished with your Coke? I said yes, sir. He said then follow me, I have something to teach you. ⁣ ⁣ 18:16⁣ So he took me two blocks, another two blocks up these steps to the downtown El Paso library. We asked the lady at the information booth if she could keep my surfboard and my little duffel bag there watched while we went too library. We asked the lady at the information booth if she could keep my surfboard and my little duffel bag there, watched while we went to the library. We go down these steps, walk a ways up these little steps and sat there in front of a table and he said just sit here, young man. ⁣ ⁣ 18:36⁣ He went off into the bookshelves, he came back with two big books, put them on the table and sat catty corner to me and he said, son, there's two things I want to teach you. You have to promise me that you will remember these things and never forget them. I said yes, sir. He said number one don't ever judge a book by its cover. I said yes, sir. And he says let me tell you why. ⁣ ⁣ 19:02⁣ Young man, you probably think I'm some old guy on the street, some old bum, but, young man, I'm one of the wealthiest men in the world. I have everything that money can buy. I've got planes and boats and businesses and homes and companies, everything that money can buy. He says so don't ever judge a book by its cover, because he can fool you. I said yes, sir. Then he grabbed my hand and he stuck them on top of the two books, and it was Plato and Aristotle. And he said to me young man, you learn how to read. You learn how to read, boy. I said, yes, sir, and he said and here's why they can take away your possessions. People can die, but there's only two things they can never take away from you, and that is your love and your wisdom. So you gain the wisdom of love and you gain the love of wisdom, because that's something that nobody can ever take away from you and that will accumulate through your life. You promise me you'll never, forget that young man. ⁣ ⁣ 20:10⁣ My cufflinks today say love and wisdom. It turned out it was Howard Hughes. ⁣ ⁣ 20:16 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Oh wow, how many times have you told that story and had that response? That's pretty. ⁣ ⁣ 20:26 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Not that many times, but oh, I feel honored. He was doing an El Paso natural gas deal with El Paso Natural Gas for a brewery he was building in Austin, Texas. This is right before he went to Las Vegas with his germaphobic outcome. ⁣ ⁣ 20:46 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I mean, that's incredible. ⁣ ⁣ 20:48 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ At 17, I met a guy named Paul Bragg. He told me that he says we have a body, we have a mind and we have a soul, and the body must be directed by the mind and the mind must be guided by the soul to maximize who we are. And he says you want to set goals for yourself, your family, your community, your city, your state, your nation, your world and beyond for 100 to 120 years, because by the time you grow up you'll be living to 100 years. This is a 1972. And he said what you see, what you say, what you see, what you say, what you think, what you feel and the actions you take determine your destiny. So if you take command of your life and don't let others take command of your life, you can create a life by design, not duty, and you give yourself permission to shine, not shrink, and you can live in a sense ontologically as a state of being, instead of deontologically as a state of becoming. So he had an impact on me when I was 17. Then I made it to age 23. ⁣ ⁣ 21:54⁣ I made a guy named Lakishwaram. He had six PhDs at 35 years old PhDs at 35 years old already six PhDs and I got to mentor under this guy and learn from this guy, and it was just an amazing breadth of knowledge this man had. And he asked me one day to a question. He asked a question, he answered it and then he said are you certain about your answer? And I said, well, no, is that an answer that's accurate? He says yes, it is. You know inside, trust yourself. Whenever you minimize yourself to others, you'll offload the decision and think they know better than you. Find your core competency where you have highest on your values, where you have the greatest epistemological pursuit, and honor that and stick to your core competence and then do something in your life that fulfills what's core competent and you will excel and do something great with your life. So I have had, I've been blessed to study all of the great classics, both Eastern and Western mysticism, from the Vedanta to Buddhist teachings to all the Greek philosophers. I've slayed all the Nobel Prize winners, anybody who has had any global influence that's done anything amazing I've devoured, and one thing that I'm certain about, that the originators of the various disciplines of life are the people I've learned the most from, the people who gave themselves permission to be an unborrowed visionary, and not somebody that's borrowing and copying, but somebody who is actually an originator. See, I've said since I was about 20, I create original ideas that serve humanity. I create original ideas that serve humanity. ⁣ ⁣ 23:38⁣ I also said I learned something from Albert Einstein. Albert Einstein said I'm not a man of my family or my community or my city or my state or even my nation. I'm a citizen of the world. So I've since I was 18 years old I want to be a citizen of the world. Pictet has said that. ⁣ ⁣ 23:54⁣ Socrates said that I could go down the list of people that understood that they didn't want to be localized, they wanted to be non-locally entangled with the universe. So I live on a ship called the world. It goes to every country around the world. I've said since I was 20 to 21 years old the universe is my playground, the world is my home. Every country is a room in the house, every city is a platform to share my heart and soul. My life is dedicated to love and wisdom and doing whatever I can to expand awareness and potential and the involvement of human consciousness, which has already evolved. It's just us waking up to it and do whatever I can to do that, and I do that seven days a week because I can't think of anything else I'd rather be doing. ⁣ ⁣ 24:34 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Like what is the idea of true originality. ⁣ ⁣ 24:37 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Well, you distill and then you integrate into oneness the information, you link it to what you value most. Aristotle had a thing he called the telos, which is the study of which is teleology was the study of meaning and purpose. When I was 23 years old, I realized I asked the question what is it that makes a difference between people that walk their talk and limp their life, people that do what they say and not? And I was fascinated by what the distinction is, and I found that people who set goals and objectives true objectives, not fantasies that are aligned and congruent with what they truly value most, what their life demonstrates is truly most important to them, they increase the probability of original thinking, and original thinking comes when you're willing to pursue challenges that inspire you. The moment you pursue challenges that inspire you, and the greatest challenge to inspire you, are the ones that serve the greatest number of people, the problems that serve the greatest number of people. You know it's interesting. Elon Musk is a good example of this. He finds what's the biggest problems on the planet and he goes and finds a way of solving them. ⁣ ⁣ 25:50⁣ I have a girlfriend that I dated for a while. My wife passed away and she was at Harvard and Oxford and Cornell. She went to four major universities. A very bright lady and she went to the professor at Harvard Her name is Trish Went to the professor at Harvard and this is a time when there was still a little bit of discrepancy between males and females right, it's starting to get a little bit more even but at the time it was still polarized. And she said I want to be able to create a massive business. And he said well, if you do, you need to find the biggest challenge that the society is facing and find a more efficient solution. She said, okay. ⁣ ⁣ 26:35⁣ So she went back to her country, which was South Africa, and she saw that the energy crisis was the biggest one, because ESCOM in South Africa was constantly rationing energy and had a bit of corruption and it wasn't really serving the people to the fullest. So she says I'm going to find a solution to the energy crisis. When she did, she concluded that nuclear was probably the most efficient probably the most efficient. So she, as an individual, raised the funds and borrowed the money to build a private nuclear power plant. Now no one can say that she's the only one that I know in the world that's pulled that off. Most of these are governments that do so. She ended up building a nuclear power plant, selling it back to the government and doing quite well. Now her husband at the time disowned her and divorced her because he didn't want to have the debt, because this is billions. ⁣ ⁣ 27:28⁣ So she took on the risk to solve the problems at the time. When she solved that, she said what's the next issue in the country? Transportation. People are walking everywhere. They can't afford transportation. So she decided to build commuter trains. ⁣ ⁣ 27:45⁣ But the other thing was unemployment and uneducation. So what she did is she did an aerial view of South Africa. She looked at all the problems where the most poverty was, where jobs were needed and these kind of things. She looked at where the rail was and she rerouted rails into the areas that had the most poverty. She set up educational systems to educate them for engineering and hired these people to build trains and commuter trains and put thousands of people to work and created a computer train manufacturing system in three major locations to transform the education, the economics, job opportunities which reduce crime issues and solve the problem. ⁣ ⁣ 28:29⁣ So people who care about humanity, that are dedicated to finding major problems, the greater the problem they get, the more fulfillment they get in life and the more ingenious and original creative thinking comes out of them to solve it. But if you don't have a big enough problem that inspires you to solve, don't expect genius to emerge. It's there in all of us, but we sometimes want to live in our amygdala, avoiding pain and seeking pleasure and avoiding challenge and seeking ease, that we don't go after. The challenges that inspire us, that make a difference, and those are the ones that wake up the genius and creativity of original thinking. ⁣ ⁣ 29:09 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Before we go any further, I do want to mention if you're just overwhelmed with this unbelievable conversation we're having, please know that he has been so gracious to offer a number of free masterclasses and I'm going to put those links in the listen notes of this podcast episode of HIListically Speaking so that you can pick what look. I would say, download them all, because we're talking about the law of attraction. We're talking about how to increase and deserve that level of finally getting what you want in your life. All of these free gifts, the power of your full advantage and potential. The list goes on and on. ⁣ ⁣ 29:42⁣ I'm not going to run down them all. You're going to, just you're going to go to the list of notes, you're going to see what's up, what is there for you, and take your time. You know I say it all the time on this podcast Every guest I have is like a masterclass, and here you are offering additional master classes in addition to this conversation. So let me just say thank you so much, so grateful, for everything that you are sharing. It is just a wealth of information, from your own experiences and your own growth to how you are serving others in this world from that original, authentic self that you present here today. ⁣ ⁣ 30:22 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ so thank you for that uh, thank you for having give me the opportunity to share with people, because without the people, what good am I? ⁣ ⁣ 30:31 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ absolutely. We need each other in this world, right? So your book, the ascent the essentials of emotional intelligence, is your latest book. Where are you hoping this book will go that perhaps other books haven't, from somebody who has released what close to 50 books, if not more? ⁣ ⁣ 30:48 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Yeah, I've written about 300, but there's about 50 that are paperbacks. Okay, the mission of this book was to give some practical tools on how to stabilize the emotional vicissitudes, the impulsive and instinctual seeking and avoidings that distract us from being present, and how to awaken the four brains executive center, the medial prefrontal cortex, which, according to Scientific American in the October edition of 2022, was called the seat of the self. It's a neural correlate for the seat of the self. It's not our self, but it's the neural correlate. And when we allow that to occur, when we live by priority, that blood glucose and oxygen goes into that forebrain, activates that area. That area has nerve fibers down into the amygdala, nucleus, acumens and palladium, and it uses glutamate and GABA to neutralize the impulses and instincts and dampens the volatility that distract us into the imposter syndrome, so we can be our magnificent self. ⁣ ⁣ 31:58⁣ So that's why, if we don't fill our day with high priority actions that inspire us, that integrate us, our day is designed to fill up with low priority distractions that don't to create chaos in our life, to get us guided back to what is authentic. All the symptoms are trying to get us back to authenticity and a lot of people think there's something wrong with them, but actually they're misinterpreting what this feedback is offering them. Their body and mind is doing what it's designed to do to get them back to authenticity. And when you actually go back and prioritize your life, dedicate to what's highest in priority, delegate what's lowest in priority and delegate to those people that would be inspired to do what you want to delegate, so you give job opportunities and help the economy and help people fulfill their lives. You liberate yourself from the distractions of impulses and instincts and the imposter syndrome. That's what the book's for. ⁣ ⁣ 32:50 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And is this a book that is relatively easy to read for those who might be approaching this kind of mindset, maybe taking a deep dive and making some changes in their own lives? Is this the first book that they should look at, or are there other books? ⁣ ⁣ 33:07 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ There's many books. Everybody when you go to the bookstore you find the one that resonates at that time and 10 weeks later you got another one. I have many books that you could go through and scan and see which ones resonate with you. But I believe that because I have an editor to help me with it, because he would, you know, bring it to where it's. I don't understand that. Clarify it, kind of thing. I think between us we've tried to make the book as understandable as we can. ⁣ ⁣ 33:34⁣ But at the same time I learned many years ago I've been teaching speed learning programs and how to wake up. You know photographic memories and genius and all kinds of stuff in people for many years now. And what people do is they have a conscious self and an unconscious self, right the explicit and implicit, and most people read verbally, not visually, and they're used to phonemes and they're used to you know what they say and only reading and learning as fast as they can speak and as a result of it, anytime they go beyond that speech speed, which is two to 300 words for most people. They go. I didn't get it, but what I've learned is that it's all there in your visual system. Your thalamus filters out certain information, but it's still there. And then when you need it and the information is needed and it helps you fulfill a purpose, it comes from the unconscious up to the conscious level. So I teach people to just take in the information and don't question whether you got it, just take it in, look at it, see it, because then all of a sudden, when you're in a conversation and somebody asks you a question, where that information is needed out, it will come, but you won't need it, you won't even hear it, didn't even know, you knew it until that moment. When you do, then you realize that we're so we limit ourselves to our conscious awareness, which is a small portion of what we are capable of taking in, and then we don't honor the other part of our life that knows. And so I'm a firm believer just delivering the information and letting people trust what they learn, to trust both sides of themselves and to embrace it, because we have a capacity to learn way farther than even most people ever imagined. I mean, I'm absolutely certain I read 11,000 pages in one day and absorbed it, and people start asking questions on it and they go. ⁣ ⁣ 35:33⁣ I don't think I didn't know how you could do that and I said because I didn't question it. I stopped questioning what I learned and believing that it's only what I got consciously. And then, when you asked me the question, whatever was unconscious was there for me. So a lot of people don't realize that they have a genius. There's no uniqueness. Everyone has a genius and it can be awakened and I've been working on that. The first statement that I ever got from Paul Bragg is because I told him I didn't know how to read. I didn't read until I was 18. I didn't know. I was learned and disabled and I was told I would never be able to read. He told me say every single day, say to yourself I'm a genius and I apply my wisdom. ⁣ ⁣ 36:17 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ So I did. ⁣ ⁣ 36:19 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ I didn't know what that even meant. I asked my mom. When I saw my mom, I said what the heck is a genius? She says people like Albert Einstein and Da Vinci. I said well then, get me everything you can about those guys. ⁣ ⁣ 36:28⁣ I later learned that a genius is one who listens to their inner voice and follows their inner vision and obeys and lets the voice and vision on the inside be louder than all opinions on the outside, and then they master the path of their life. They're on their dharmic path, not their karmic wheel, and they liberate themselves from the bondage of all the infatuations, resentments, all the exaggerations of pride and shame that stop them from being authentic when they exaggerate and minimize other people through judgment. So we have a genius inside and it's spontaneously ready to come out, but we don't give it permission to come out because we're too preoccupied with what others think and how we're positioned. And there was two Nobel Prize winners that got their Nobel Prize in 2016 on the place in grid cells and in January February of 2020. ⁣ ⁣ 37:23⁣ Fantastic article on that in the Scientific American showing how we socially put ourselves in pecking orders and hierarchies in society because we disown parts and if we went and we go and take the most powerful people on the planet and go find what do I admire in them, what do I dislike in them, and own them all, we reposition ourselves and we awaken the same playing field that they're playing on and I've proven that in thousands of cases. We have people that have now Grammy award-winning, people that we're just barely seeing, and we got people that are doing amazing things economically, because there's nothing missing in us and fulfillment is the realization. There's nothing missing, never was missing, but we were too busy, preoccupied with being too proud or too humble to admit what we see in others, inside us. And when we finally embrace our hero and villain in all parts of ourselves and not try to get rid of half of ourselves, we finally awaken that magnificent genius that's sitting there dormant, ready to emerge spontaneously into inspired action of creativity and origination. The second we be authentic. ⁣ ⁣ 38:30 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ It so comes back to balance Everything you're saying, like the yin, the yang. It's so balanced and I think you're opening my mind to think of things more than just like work-life balance, and I think you're opening my mind to think of things more than just like work-life balance, and it's so much more. And what you just said about the inner voice because truly this is the loudest voice in the room is our own right. And how are we speaking to ourselves? What is that inner bully doing? That's stepping up on the playground constantly. It's truly embodying the beauty that exists within each and every one of us. The genius remark you said. I would love for you to reiterate that statement, that conversation you had with your mom, because, if anything, that is something that should be up on everyone's wall, your mirror, that thing you see every day, a reminder to yourself of what follows those words. I am. I am a genius. And you said something else. Could you share that Cause? That was brilliant. ⁣ ⁣ 39:29 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Well, that that that came from Paul Bragg. He gave it to me when I was 17. Well, I just turned 18. At the time he said cause? I told him I didn't know how to read, how am I going to be a teacher? I wanted to travel the world and teach. And he said and I thought that's what I saw in my dream. And he says just say to yourself every single day. I'm a genius and I apply my wisdom. Said every single day, until the cells of your body tingle with it, and so with the world. I didn't know how to read at the time. I learned how to read after I started saying that every day. ⁣ ⁣ 40:01 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Well, I'm sure there was an inner dialogue you were having where the words on paper didn't matter as much as the words that you were telling yourself. ⁣ ⁣ 40:08 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Well, the thing is, as many times many people have this internal dialogue, self-depreciation, but they don't realize that they're addicted to praise is the source of it. The addicted to fantasy is the source of it. There's a thing called a moral licensing effect and I hope everybody looks that up. And when everybody's done it without knowing it, most people have gone out and they've worked out. They went to the gym, they worked out, they really did a workout and they kind of got their abs looking good and they got their butt looking good and then all of a sudden they go. Well, I gave myself permission, I can eat more chocolate, I can eat more food and I can drink some more wine tonight. That's the licensing effect. The moment you do something you're proud of, you give yourself permission to do something you're ashamed of. Now that same truth. ⁣ ⁣ 40:54⁣ This is a homeostatic mechanism. I've been studying interceptive homeostatic mechanisms in biological systems for decades and what is interesting is the second you go above equilibrium, like the temperature goes up, you create sweating to bring it back, and the second you go below and it's cold, you create shivering to bring it back. We have a built-in homeostatic interceptive feedback inside our consciousness and anytime we get a neurochemistry that's imbalanced. The pre and post-synaptic brain will automatically rebalance it and attempt to balance it. And so we create for every memory an anti-memory and we create it and we'll dissociate. If it's a traumatic memory, we'll dissociate and create a fantasy, and if it's a fantasy thing, we'll create a paranoia to get a balance, to keep the homeostasis balanced. So the second we're beating ourselves up. Most people go, oh, get rid of that, get rid of that, get rid of that. And they can't get rid of it as long as they're building themselves up with fantasies. And so the second they compare themselves to others and put people on pedestals and go, oh, I want to be like that and set up a fantasy. And then they say only these positive things about themselves. They automatically have to self-depreciate to counterbalance it. So a balanced orientation you don't have that polarity, You've integrated the polarity. ⁣ ⁣ 42:08⁣ So I don't try to be positive all the time, or nice all the time, or peaceful all the time. I'm a human being and I have a set of values. When I live by my highest values, I'm most objective and neutral. When I'm living by lower values, I become more volatile. That's why anybody that does something that's really high priority during the day, they're resilient and adaptable. Because they're neutral, because they don't feel the loss of things they infatuate with, they don't feel the gain of things. They resent the moment they balance themselves and bring themselves up and live by priority, they're more neutral. But if not, they're more polarized. When they get polarized and they end up fearing the loss of the things they infatuate with and fearing the gain of that, they're now distracted. ⁣ ⁣ 42:48⁣ So I basically learned many years ago to ask questions. That rebalanced it and I realized that the second I got addicted to praise, criticism hurt, and the second I puffed myself up. I attract challenge, criticism, distractions. ⁣ ⁣ 43:06⁣ There's a thing called depurposing and repurposing. The second, you get proud and think you're successful. You depurpose, you give yourself permission to do low priority things and the purpose of that is to get you back into authenticity because you're puffed up and then, if you go down, you go okay, now I overate. So now the next morning I'm now going to get up and jog. I haven't been jogging for weeks, but now I overate, I'm going jogging. ⁣ ⁣ 43:28⁣ So you give yourself to repurpose, so you have a built-in homeostatic mechanism to guide you to authenticity. But you're constantly being taught what isn't so, as Dirac said, about how you're supposed to be one-sided. Get rid of half of yourself, Be nice, don't mean, be kind, don't be cruel, be positive, don't be negative. And so you're set up like I got to get rid of half of myself and the whole personal development journey out. There is misleading people into thinking they have to get rid of themselves to love themselves, and the truth is integrating and embracing both sides of yourself is what liberates you and makes you realize the magnificence of who you are and the contributions you're making. ⁣ ⁣ 44:07 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Now you don't build yourself up. ⁣ ⁣ 44:08 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ You don't build yourself up. You don't beat yourself up. People come up to me, and sometimes in interview, and they say, dr Demartini, how did you become successful? And I go I'm not successful. And they go what it says? ⁣ ⁣ 44:22⁣ I have no desire for success because my addiction to success is the very thing that creates the fear of failure. I'm a man on a mission and I see success and failure as feedback mechanisms to help me stay focused and authentic. And if I get successful, I'm proud and I do low priority things to get me back down and if I feel like I'm a failure, I go back to high priority things to get me back up. When I'm in the center, I don't even think of success or failure. I think of my mission. ⁣ ⁣ 44:48⁣ And that is always a perfect blend between myself and other people, because if I'm thinking of success, I think about myself and I forgot my people, and if I think of a failure, I'm thinking about myself, I forgot my people. But when I'm in perfect balance, I'm thinking of perfect balance, reflective awareness of the people, humanity and myself. As Schopenhauer says, we become our true self to the degree that we make everyone else ourself. It's all us out there, and when we get there, we don't think of success or fair. We think of we're working as a team on the planet. And when we get there, we don't think of success or failure, we think of we're working as a team on the planet period. ⁣ ⁣ 45:20 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Thank you so much for that. Thank you for the reminder moment of just a new piece of information for folks to ingest and think about and process and think how they can be both sides and find that center. Find that center Really, it's not even being both sides, it's becoming right. I have some work to do myself, so I really appreciate you and all that you're sharing and just becoming and being, and what I would love to do with you in this moment. I know we have a few seconds left. If you hang with me for just a few seconds, I would love to do a quick game with you and throw out some words that you've shared during this episode and see what the first word is that comes back. A little word association. I love to do with my guests. Do you have a moment? ⁣ ⁣ 46:22 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Sure. ⁣ ⁣ 46:23 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ All right, great. So I'm just going to just go with. The first word that comes to mind is wisdom. Just one word, come back. ⁣ ⁣ 46:32 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ In my case, it's what I feel is my mission. ⁣ ⁣ 46:36 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Mission Okay, and love Same thing Okay, and love Same thing Okay. Venous Same thing World. ⁣ ⁣ 46:50 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Destined. ⁣ ⁣ 46:52 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Emotions. ⁣ ⁣ 46:55 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Feedback systems to the truth of love. ⁣ ⁣ 46:58 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Authenticity. Being feedback systems to the truth of love, authenticity being becoming feedback systems to being you're good, I'm going to leave it with this last word, because it is my word of the year and I want to know what your word for balance would be. ⁣ ⁣ 47:21 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Equanimity of both mind and body. ⁣ ⁣ 47:26 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I want to sit with that one for a moment and I appreciate everything you're sharing, your personal story, your wisdom, your wit and everything you're putting out there into the world while you, while you sail along on the world and I hope at some point I am at a port where you are speaking in person, cause I, I would just really love to be in your personal, your space to really feel that energy, because this is, this is, I'm feeling it right here across the airwaves, that energy, because this is, this is I'm feeling it right here across the airwaves. But I have a feeling it's even more, it's even greater in to be in person with you, where are you next? ⁣ ⁣ 48:09 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ What's what's on? Where's the ship sailing? Next I go from here. I'm here for till tomorrow. Then I go to La Habla, Brazil, and then I'm off to Rio de Janeiro the carnival starts there, so I'm passing through there and then I quickly run over to Chennai and Mumbai to do three presentations at a Change makers conference Thousands of people will be there and then I run back down to Cape Town to do some filming and also presentations there. And then we sail up to Maputo, Mozambique, and then I quickly run to London to do presentations there. ⁣ ⁣ 48:46⁣ And then I get back on a French island and my girlfriend's meeting me in the Seychelles Islands and the Maldives for a little romance Lovely. And then off to India, then Lovely, and then off to India then. And then we go to Sri Lanka and off to Indonesia and Malaysia and Cambodia and Vietnam and those areas. So we circumnavigate the planet and I get off and on, if I have to do live speaking, otherwise I do presentations. But tomorrow I'm in Japan and the next two days I'll be in Australia from the ship here. So I say the universe is my playground, the world is home. ⁣ ⁣ 49:22 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ On that note, would you have anything you would like to close and share with listeners of the HIListically Speaking podcast? ⁣ ⁣ 49:32 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Yeah, can I share a story? I know I go a couple of seconds over, but I think this is. ⁣ ⁣ 49:38⁣ Doctor, it is your time and I graciously accept your stories 34 years ago almost 35, I was speaking in San Francisco and I was doing a seven-day program on self-mastery and leadership and one of the ladies there asked if I could, at lunch, go over to the hospital there and meet with a particular patient. And I said, if you get me a bagel to eat on the way there and back because I have to start, I only got an hour. If you can get me there and back in an hour and give me a bagel or something to eat, I'll be glad to. We went over there and there was a. We went into this hospital room and there was a guy that was kind of leaning up in the bed and was sort of half asleep and a motion covered with sores and he was dying of AIDS. And he was didn't look like he had much farther to go. His immune deficiency is pretty collapsed. ⁣ ⁣ 50:38⁣ And I sat on the edge of the bed, grabbed his hands. He didn't know who I was and I just looked at him and I said to him please repeat with me what I say no matter what I've done or not done, I'm worthy of love. No matter what I've done or not done, I'm worthy of love. No matter what I've done or not done, I'm worthy of love. And I made him say that and at first he just said the words and about five repetitions he started to cry Because he had accumulated and stored a whole lot of judgments on himself and when we judge ourselves and condemn ourselves, our immune system responds. And so I made him say that until he cried, until he literally leaned over and fell literally onto me. I'm twisted on the bed holding him now on to me. I'm twisted on the bed holding him. Now. There was a nurse there, there was another lady I don't know who, she was administration lady and there was a lady that asked me to come. We're all in tears, we're all just in a moment of grace and authenticity. When you have a tear of gratitude, you have a gamma wave in the brain, you get a moment of authenticity. It's a confirmation. In that moment. He did that and he looked up at me and he said I've never in my life ever felt that or believed or ever said that Thank you. And I said Thank you and we hugged each other and I left, went back to do my prose presentation and didn't know anything about it for a few weeks and finally I got a letter from the lady who asked me to come and a picture. Somehow the man changed his perceptions and rallied. ⁣ ⁣ 52:43⁣ I really don't know the limitations of our ability to heal. I've seen things that would be considered less than probable but all I know is that this man rallied. They thought he was going to die. Didn't die Now, I don't know. Maybe he later. I'm sure somewhere down the line he did, but he didn't die in that recent weeks for sure. ⁣ ⁣ 53:10⁣ So I wrote a book called Count your Blessings the Healing Power of Gratitude and Love. ⁣ ⁣ 53:14⁣ I still believe that that's still one of the great healers on the planet. ⁣ ⁣ 53:17⁣ When we're graced by seeing the hidden order of life and we really, truly realize that there's nothing but love, all else was illusion and we've stopped judging ourselves for just a moment and get a glimpse of our real self, that the power of our physiology to normalize and to homeostasis are stored, subconsciously stored imbalances, epigenetic lock-ins, you might say are freed. ⁣ ⁣ 53:45⁣ So I just want to end on a story that, in case you've ever judged yourself, just know that no matter what you've done or not done, you're worthy of love and the only reason you're judging yourself is because you're comparing yourself to somebody else's value system Because the decisions you made was based on what you believed at that time were more advantage and disadvantage to you and yours. But if you try to compare it to somebody else, you'll think you're making mistakes, just like if you try to expect others to live in your values. You think they're making mistakes. But maybe there's no mistakes after a while and maybe it's wise to look back a different way and ask how is whatever I've experienced and whatever I've done, how is it helping me fulfill my mission in life? And don't stop until you get a tear of gratitude for whatever you've done or not done. And that is definitely liberating and empowering for any human being, regardless of the situation. It can help relationships, it can help healing, it can help your body, it can help your business. ⁣ ⁣ 54:43 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Gratitude and love is still one of the great healers on the planet. I am so in a place of gratitude right now. So thank you, and I can only imagine that those who are tuning in are going to feel that as well. Thank you for leaving those words with people to sit with and think about and remember that we're all geniuses and we're all the gift. Thank you, dr Demartini. Appreciate it. ⁣ ⁣ 55:09 - Dr. John Demartini (Guest)⁣ Thank you. Thank you, thank you. ⁣ ⁣ 55:12 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I know we have covered a lot of territory during this conversation, but the beauty is you have so many possibilities to connect with Dr Demartini and learn from him yourself, and I'm going to help you with that. I've shared a number of links in the notes of this podcast episode to his free webinars and, of course, to his latest book, essentials of Emotional Intelligence. And once you've had some time to process this, once you've had some time to listen to the show this week, I'm going to suggest that you come back and do it again, because when you give things a listen more than once, you'd be surprised what you unpack the second or the third time or even the fourth. Then, once you have a little time to sit there with it, go ahead and leave a rating or review, or just let me know what you think about this episode, this show on HIListically Speaking and how it has been serving and supporting you, because that's really what this show is about. ⁣ ⁣ 56:14⁣ HIListically Speaking is edited by 2MarketMedia with music by Lipone Redding and, of course, listened to by you time and time again. So thank you so much for taking time to tune in and remember this, and you know this is my word of the year. This year. Life is about balance, and you heard Dr Demartini talk about it himself, and you, my, are already the perfect genius in your own right, so embrace that and always remember to be kind to your mind. I love you, I believe in you and I will see you next week.

How do we navigate the heartache of loss while cherishing the beauty of memories shared with our cherished pets? Join me for an intimate reflection on the enduring impact of my cat, Eliza Doolittle, whose passing after nearly 19 years left a profound mark on my heart. Let's delve into the love and responsibilities that come with being a pet parenting, finding solace and support within our community during times of grief, and ten life lessons learned from our furry companions. Plus, a chance to share your pet story on an upcoming episode.⁣ ⁣ FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTS AVAILABLE ⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣ CHAPTERS: ⁣ 00:00 Intro: The Rainbow Bridge ⁣ 05:31 The Story of Eliza: The Cat Who Saved Me ⁣ 09:44 The Grief and Guilt of Euthanasia ⁣ 12:54 Finding Gratitude Through Grief ⁣ 17:33 Connection With Pets Beyond the Veil ⁣ 20:00 Ten Things I Learned from the Life of a Pet⁣ 23:21 The Power of Community and Rest ⁣ 26:30 Share Your Pet Story⁣ 27:55 Honoring Unconditional Love ⁣ ⁣ Share your voice and pet story on an upcoming episode:⁣ https://www.speakpipe.com/hilisticallyspeaking⁣ ⁣ Join the HUG it Out Collective on Facebook⁣ https://www.facebook.com/groups/hugitoutcollective⁣ Episodes mentioned on this podcast Ep 17 Chris Palmore Finding Gratitude After Loss Ep 128 Are You a Human Being or a Human Doing? Eliza and Hilary's Blue Buffalo Cat Food Commercials youtube.com/hilaryrusso⁣ Connect with Hilary:⁣ https://www.instagram.com/hilaryrusso⁣ ⁣https://www.youtube.com/hilaryrusso⁣ https://www.facebook.com/hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://twitter.com/HilaryRusso⁣ https://www.tiktok.com/@hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣ Music by Lipbone: https://lipbone.com/⁣ ⁣ ⁣⁣ FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTS AVAILABLE ⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣ ⁣ 00:00 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ 19 years Seems like a moment in time, but for close to 19 years I was blessed to have a pure shadow of sunshine by my side. On my birthday, however, my sweet Eliza Doolittle decided it was time to take a journey without me, and a light in me dimmed. April 1st, just two days after my birthday and two months shy of 19 years, my five pound sassy calico found her way over the rainbow bridge and something changed in me, which is why I'm sharing this with you, because I have a feeling, if you've ever loved and lost a pet, you're going to resonate with what I'm about to share with you. It took me some time to sit down and record this episode. I have to be honest, I needed some time to step away. To be honest, I needed some time to step away. I needed to process this loss and I really needed to allow myself to see where this was going to hit me, because, while I have had pets my entire life since I was a little girl in fact, I don't really know that many years without having a pet in my home, nothing was quite like Eliza. She was mine and I was hers, and for close to two decades, I made this commitment to protect her, to love her, to care for her, and that came with some responsibilities Responsibilities I have never known before. Responsibilities, responsibilities I have never known before. It was level up, it was different, and the feelings that go along with that kind of responsibility, that kind of love, were different too. So, after sharing with those who are closest with me about her passing my family, my friends, my Hug it Out Collective, even colleagues and clients I realized that community is where we really find our healing, and it's a reminder that we were never alone in this battle. Right, even if the responsibilities are different, even if there are hours and hours alone, even if they were just for us to bear, we're really never doing it all by ourselves, because someone you know or yourself has been through it, and I want to share with you just how common it is. ⁣ ⁣ 02:40⁣ It's estimated that more than half of the global population has a pet at home. That's over half a billion dogs and cats, and in the US, 70% of households in 2021 were pet owners, and since the pandemic, the amount of pet adoptions is on the rise, thankfully. So I know I'm not alone when I share that these numbers, no matter what type of pet you have, be it fur, feathers, fins or scales. You likely have, or you have, faced pet loss. And isn't that the rub To know that you will love an animal so much, knowing that it's likely they will leave this world before you and we know that, going into it too right. I know I did, and yet I still loved. And when the time is right, somewhere down the road, I will again, because that's what we do as pet parents. We open our hearts again and again, just not now, not yet. Just not now, not yet. ⁣ ⁣ 03:50⁣ So with that in mind, I thought I would share my story about Miss Eliza Doolittle and some thoughts I have about grief, what I've learned from my time with Lizzy Girl, and some possibilities for us as we go forward on this journey, plus a chance for you to share your story on an upcoming episode. And if this episode resonates with you or any of the guests that I've had here on HIListically Speaking, or any of the episodes we've done, I would love for you to do yourself a favor and do me a favor and subscribe wherever you're tuning in and take it one step further Download those episodes that you listen to, because that's going to make it more possible for others to find this show, this episode and these stories that we tell so beautifully on, HIListically Speaking. Of course, I always appreciate your kind words and your thoughtful responses in your comments, wherever you're tuning in, wherever you're listening or watching, whether it's on a podcast platform or on YouTube, and, honestly, now more than ever, I can really use those words and I know others will too. So how did Miss Eliza Doolittle come into my life? It's quite a sweet story. Actually. ⁣ ⁣ 04:59⁣ It was Thanksgiving Day, 2005. And I was coming home from Thanksgiving dinner at a friend's house and I was driving along in my old Jeep, grand Cherokee. Louise and I pass a hotel and I noticed something moving as I'm about to pass a storm drain and I noticed it was like a little calico puff and I saw its little mouth opening and closing. And let me tell you, I wasn't going that fast, but it was enough for me to know that there was a kitten that was sitting there by that storm drain and I instantly called my friend who was in the car in front of me and I said I gotta turn around. There is a kitten and I don't think it's going to last the winter if it stays out here. Within 30 seconds to a minute. I had turned around, went into the parking lot because I didn't see the kitten at the storm drain. But I heard her and fortunately I had leftovers in my car and I looked under every car in that hotel parking lot right near the storm drain and there she was, hiding underneath the truck. And somehow, with love and care, I was able to force her to come out from underneath the truck because, well, I imagined she was hungry and I had plenty of turkey. And then I put a towel around her, grabbed her and put her in my car. ⁣ ⁣ 06:28⁣ What in the world am I going to do with a kitten? I was not in any kind of a situation to have a cat. I was in a relationship with someone who was highly allergic to cats. So I knew that I had a job to do, and hopefully it would be to find this sweet little kitten a home. But in the two weeks that I had her, nobody came forward. I went to every vet in the area and somehow in those two weeks, those 14 days, I fell in love with this cat and I have a feeling she did the same. So in a way I would say she saved me as much as I saved her, because during that time of my life it was quite difficult what I was going through. ⁣ ⁣ 07:12⁣ I guess things just show up for you at just the right time and I always joke that she's the longest relationship I've ever had. She has gone well beyond both of my long-term relationships. She has traveled more miles with me, crossed more states with me and I wouldn't trade it for anything else. She has had books written about her and chapters, artwork, poems, commercials that she's done. Have you ever seen the Blue Buffalo commercial? That's her. She's been on numerous podcasts, including sitting right behind me and sometimes in my lap. She's joined me in private sessions and even showed up while I was professing with my college students. And, yes, she's been the subject of many social media posts. So it's kind of hard to know life with Hilary without Eliza Doolittle. ⁣ ⁣ 08:07⁣ But as we know, with the years come slowing down and this past year I started seeing signs of her decline. It was happening slowly. I kind of knew over the last year or two that time with her would be even more precious than it was before. And the past few months things started to accelerate. The cancer in my sweet little Calico was starting to show in her face and I found myself feeling the stress, feeling the sickness. It was a fight or flight for me, much like when you're around a sick family member you feel it, you absorb it and you're constantly on alert. And that was a difficult place to be and it absorbed a lot of my headspace, my mental space and my bandwidth was not where it used to be because so much of my intention was on Eliza. ⁣ ⁣ 09:14⁣ So the time came when things really took a turn. On my birthday, March 30th, Eliza told me it was time and my boyfriend, Chris, just happened to be here because we were getting ready to celebrate my birthday that morning. She really made her presence known, that things were really getting difficult. I remember thinking that I don't have this right. You know, I went through a lot of grief before the grief actually set in and grief turned into guilt Because I thought who am I to take away a life? You know, in the perfect world you want your animal, your pet, your fur baby to just kind of curl up in your arms and take its last breath. Naturally right, but that's not the way it always happens and cats are notoriously strong to where they don't really even let you know that they're sick or they have signs of illness. ⁣ ⁣ 10:17⁣ That day it was a turning point for me because I saw that she was beginning to suffer and I wasn't really sure how long it would be. And I remember making an agreement in a way with my vet some months prior that this would be a decision that I would need help with, because I really struggled with the guilt of taking that life, still hoping somewhere in the back of my mind that she would just pass on her own. And I said, when it comes to the time where you think that this could be consuming her or taking away her quality of life, I really just need the honesty. And I got that. I got that that day and I had a moment with Eliza that was almost like an approval, you know, I don't really know how to explain it, but I had the weekend with her. The decision was made and lots of emotions were shared. ⁣ ⁣ 11:30⁣ The night before, Eliza shared a beautiful salmon dinner with Chris and myself. It was really a beautiful evening, a little candlelight dinner, and she got so many treats and so much love and attention. I don't even know if she can get more than she normally gets, but that night was really special and the morning came and we took her to the vet and she was in my arms and surrounded by her little babies and flowers, and I had my hand on her paws the whole time. Chris was caressing her little face and then, at some point, when I knew that time was close, I had my hand on her heart and there's something really powerful about being witness but also feeling that last heartbeat. It was spiritual, it was beautiful and I don't think I'll ever forget that. But in that moment I felt like I was truly connected to her in a different way as she crossed, and I'm really thankful for that. ⁣ ⁣ 12:54⁣ So after all was said and done, I realized I needed to step away a little bit and I was fortunate to spend some time with my boyfriend, chris, and I went to his home in Virginia and just decided to do a little grieving there. It was really a wonderful opportunity for me to go through these stages of grief, and I'm sure there's still more go through these stages of grief and I'm sure there's still more. But I went from the grief to the guilt and then somewhere in there there was a shift to gratitude which took me back a few years, to the time I first wrote about Eliza in a book that was published and it was part of my friend Chris Palmore's book called Dear Gratitude, an anthology, a book that holds space for so many beautiful gratitude stories. And you might remember Chris because he was on episode 17, if , sharing his own grief journey, and it about the loss of his mother and it's interesting how we should circle back to that right. But I was fortunate to share, on page 21 7 of Dear Gratitude, the story of Eliza Doolittle and how she got her name and basically the story you heard here. But I called it Gratitude is Loverly because loverly and my fair lady, if you get the reference, and that's basically how Eliza got her name, because I pretty much found her in a gutter, just like in my Fair Lady, and I thought it was a really beautiful story to share. But I'm so grateful to Chris for giving me that opportunity to share the story of Eliza in his book Dear Gratitude. ⁣ ⁣ 14:40⁣ And again, if you are interested in that episode, it is 17. And I'll put that in the podcast notes for you and when it comes down to it, you really have to think about it. It really is all about gratitude, isn't it? In some way or another, gratitude, after all, is part of the Hug it Out way. Right, if you want to join the Hug it Out collective that I have the Facebook group you'll find weekly themes and challenges in a safe place that supports the traumas to triumphs. And let me tell you, this week that group really showed their colors and showed up for me by supporting my grief, my trauma showed their colors and showed up for me by supporting my grief, my trauma. So you can check the notes of this episode to join us in that group and just see for yourself. ⁣ ⁣ 15:26⁣ But I do have so much gratitude, so much gratitude for all of you who have been part of her life in one way or another, even those who just saw her on camera for the first time or in a podcast episode maybe her Blue Buffalo commercials, whatever, wherever. I'm just grateful that you connected to her in some way through me. And then, of course, those that I shared this with those closest to me, like my mom. She loved that cat and she used to say, oh, kitty's coming to grandma's house, whenever she would watch her, she would call it the country home and it was really sweet to see the connection they had, because she too loved and lost pets my entire life. So that was something my mom and I shared, you know, and even recently, you know, she became a pet parent again after some time without a pet and I'm really glad she has that. Of course, my boyfriend, chris, for having some bond that I still haven't quite figured out In such a short amount of time on this planet, knowing Eliza. They had a bond like no other. And let me tell you, if you have a calico they're very temperamental, they're very territorial and they're very spicy, but somehow that cat got to his heart and he got to hers and it was really beautiful to see. And I have really good friends, really good friends who have been there for me along the way, and I hope you have that in your life too. If you have loved and lost a pet or lost anything that you've loved in your life to have, that support can be very helpful. I know my vet and everyone who got to know this spicy little calico. I have to say thank you to them for just being there and being a support system and, of course, you just for being here to support me and giving me the permission to press record and share and know that you're tuning in. So thank you for that. ⁣ ⁣ 17:33⁣ But back to this week. During this week I found myself watching a lot of YouTube videos on how to connect with your pets from beyond, how to change your frequency and be present. I did a lot of writing, I did a lot of soul searching and I really spent my time in Virginia disconnecting to reconnect Because, like I said, said so much of my emotional bandwidth was really absorbed by Eliza's illness and not really being able to separate from that and it was kind of like giving me the ability to take a breath that I hadn't taken in a really long time. But I had a moment. It happened when I was at Chris's house. It was the first morning I was there after we arrived and there was a trundle bed in the guest room where Eliza loved to sleep in the drawer which was filled with linens. She really made that area her home. In fact I'm not really even sure that the linens have been touched in there because it was just so Eliza right, but I remember that morning opening a drawer and I could still see tiny little calico hairs in there Not too much because she was a very clean cat, but you could see the impression from her body that was on top of a blanket that she had probably been sleeping on and my heart just sank. ⁣ ⁣ 19:15⁣ I remember just being on my knees and putting my hands in the drawer and putting my head down and I sat there for a minute just being so grateful to have her in my life. And I don't know how and I can't explain it, but I felt something brush my ankle, my leg, as if it was her little tail that was brushing by. I was wearing shorts, so it didn't quite make sense to me. There was no fabric around me and I just kind of went huh and smiled and just let it be. You know, not everything has to be explained, and I realized that some things just don't need to be explained, right, they just are just like our pets, they don't look for explanations, they just are there, awesome, authentic, organic selves. So it got me thinking on how, the last 19 years, what I've witnessed with Eliza has been the utmost amount of awesomeness and, frankly, with the other animals that have been in my life as well, and the lessons that I've learned as a pet parent, and I really had to stop and think for a moment that I've truly witnessed some amazing things from the being that she is and other animals have been in my life. ⁣ ⁣ 20:55⁣ And that's where I want to take this episode is to leave you with the top 10 things I've learned from my life with Eliza, and that number one thing is you've got to find the sunshine. I know every time I would turn around, that cat was looking for sunshine, she was basking in the sun, she was sleeping in the sun. She would find that ray just coming through a window and it could be on a floor and she was there. And it's just a reminder how easy it is to find the sunshine if we're just present in the moment. And that leaves me to number two be present and be still the being over the doing is really why we're here, isn't it? And animals do that. They just are so organic about being and we're just too much in the doing, and I share more about that on episode 128. I'll put that in the podcast notes as well, on the importance of being a human being over human doing. ⁣ ⁣ 22:06⁣ Number three is play Adulting gets the best of us, doesn't it? So I want you to stop as often as you can and laugh and play and find that childish enthusiasm that lives within you. Without a care in the world, animals just play. They don't worry about what other animals are thinking, they just are. I learned that no matter how upset I am in a situation, it doesn't need to consume me. That's number four. Be in that place where you can move forward, just like the animals around you move forward Just like the animals around you. They don't spend time in the upset, they just keep moving forward. I learned to let your guard down to trust, and if you've ever spoken to your pet in a childlike voice or as if they are a child, you know exactly what I'm talking about. They aren't judging you, so why are you judging yourself? Just trust that you're doing exactly what you're supposed to be doing. ⁣ ⁣ 23:21⁣ Number six I learned that we're all just walking each other home. I know I say that often, but I use that here because it makes such perfect sense. But when you think about it that way that we're all just walking each other home on this planet, no matter what kind of being we are, we become kinder beings. I learned that in grief beings I learned that in grief we find one another and we share the most vulnerable and beautiful parts of ourselves. It's a reminder of the power of community, right? If you've ever seen animals together, how they play, how they laugh, how they cuddle, it's just so easy to find that comfort and support. We need that too. We need that too. ⁣ ⁣ 24:14⁣ I learned the importance of sleep from that cat Now cats I hear sleep up to like 19 hours a day. I would imagine that's just about right when I think about my time with Eliza and she seems pretty refreshed when she gets up right, just does her thing. But it's just about right when I think about my time with Eliza and she seems pretty refreshed when she gets up right, just does her thing. But it's just a reminder to me that sleep is so important for our well-being. So be sure that you're getting good rest, just like your pets. ⁣ ⁣ 24:45⁣ Number nine find your people or your person. I know I've said this before. I said it earlier in this podcast episode. Eliza saved me as much as I saved her. I became her person. I don't think that was accidental. And number 10, I think, is really important, if not the most important. ⁣ ⁣ 25:09⁣ I've learned that you need to love without condition. You need to love without fear and worry. And when you do this and you just let go and realize that being vulnerable is being courageous, you are just allowing yourself to be the most pure sense of self by loving. And in time grief will come, but that grief will turn to gratitude when you remember that loving is a reason to be grateful, even if it was only for a short time, because love will always fill your home again. You're just that kind of person. You're that kind of person. I'm that kind of person. And somewhere out there an animal is going to want to call you their own, want to call you their own, and maybe, just maybe, they'll be sent to you from someone or something that has loved you from before in your past. When you think about it that way, it's heart opening. ⁣ ⁣ 26:22⁣ In closing, I imagine you've connect with this episode in some way, shape or form. And if you do you've connect with this episode in some way, shape or form and if you do, if it did resonate with you in any way, I would love to know and I'd also love to offer you an opportunity to share your story about your special pet on an upcoming episode In the sharing in the community, we do find that we are never truly alone. So what I'm asking you to do is pretty simple and kind of fun. I would love for you to go to speakpipe dot com slash hilisticallyspeaking. I'll put this in the listen notes and share your voice and your story about a pet that you have loved any point in your life. Really, it could be one that you connected with as a child to more recently, but in sharing about them you're keeping their spirit alive. ⁣ ⁣ 27:14⁣ You know, miss Eliza might not be here on this earth in this moment, sitting on this lap or behind me on my chair in this moment, but she's with me. I will continue to share her stories. I'm sure she's going to come up again and I would love that for you as well. So just press record, share your journey, and then you can take it one step further and share a picture of you with your pet, so that when I release the episode, that memory will be remembered, along with your voice and your story. And once you record, once you go to speakpipe dot com, I will personally reach out to you to share details on how you can share that photo and get in on the show. ⁣ ⁣ 27:53⁣ Do yourself a favor. Give that special being that gave you so much unconditional love a moment in the spotlight. I look forward to hearing your stories, seeing your connection, and I imagine others will as well. So, on that note, thank you for showing up, for tuning in, for being part of my journey, allowing me to feel safe and vulnerable to share my story, this episode. I leave you with the words that you probably have heard before and they are quite memorable from Winnie the Pooh, heard before, and they are quite memorable from Winnie the Pooh how lucky I am to have something that makes saying goodbye so hard. That's the gratitude right there until next time. I love you, I believe in you and I appreciate your open heart. Be well.

⁣Your journey through menopause can be transformative and empowering. When I first heard that statement, I rolled my eyes! But, hear me out on this. You and I both know there is no magic pill to make it go away. And "no", you can't sell your uterus on Ebay either. (Yes, that was a question I got in an email). What you can do is find ways to better understand all the changes and holistically age with beauty and grace. From hormones to hot flashes, brain fog to body changes, it's like puberty for adults. On this episode of the HIListically Speaking Podcast, Hilary welcomes Certified Menopause Coach Specialist Erika Shannon-Hathaway who not only answers your questions but shares actionable steps and practical tips from symptom management and macrodosing to mental clarity and menoparties for self-care.⁣ ⁣ FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTS AVAILABLE ⁣https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣ CHAPTERS: ⁣ 00:00 Intro ⁣ 02:08 The Importance of Health Coaches (51 Seconds)⁣ 06:40 Navigating Adult Puberty and Parenting⁣ 14:44 Importance of Self-Care and Mindset⁣ 26:50 Erika Answers Your Questions (Audience Q&A)⁣ 37:00 Managing Menopause, Hormones and Sleep⁣ 46:48 Struggling With Brain Fog⁣ 53:05 Nutrition and Exercise in Menopause⁣ 54:04 Weight Gain and Estrogen Loss⁣ 57:45 Rapid Fire Game ⁣ 01:00:00 Erika's Closing Thoughts ⁣ 01:01:00 Hilary's final thought and info⁣ ⁣Download my FREE guided Self-Havening for Hot Flashes and Hormones video https://www.hilaryrusso.com/hormones CONNECT WITH ERIKA: ⁣ https://www.instagram.com/erikashannonmovement⁣ ⁣https://www.linkedin.com/in/erikashannon/⁣ ⁣https://www.facebook.com/erikashannonmovement⁣ ⁣https://www.erikashannon.com/menoparty⁣ ⁣https://www.erikashannon.com/yournextchapter-landing-page⁣ Interested in getting better sleep? Listen to Ep 140 with Sleep Expert Mollie Eastman. ⁣ ⁣FREE HAVENING HAPPY HOUR & EVENTS⁣ Join the next Free Havening Happy Hour. Next event: March 27th at 7pm ET. Registration is required https://www.hilaryrusso.com/events⁣⁣ ⁣CONNECT WITH HILARY⁣ https://www.instagram.com/hilaryrusso⁣ ⁣https://www.youtube.com/hilaryrusso⁣ https://www.facebook.com/hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.tiktok.com/@hilisticallyspeaking⁣ https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣ ⁣⁣Music by Lipbone Redding https://lipbone.com/⁣ ⁣ ⁣ EPISODE TRANSCRIPT ⁣ (Full Transcript https://www.hilaryrusso.com/podcast⁣) ⁣ 00:00 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ There are so many things now that give us community around it that it helps us regulate our symptoms and therefore improve our quality of life as we're going through the inevitable journey of menopause. ⁣ ⁣ 00:13 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ As a living, breathing human. You are someone, you know someone or you love someone on the menopause journey and I'm now on the other side of this myself. But I still have questions about how to stay healthy mind, body and spirit All the questions there. Because it's more than just hormones, it's befriending your body, it's understanding the signs and acceptance of this beautiful aging process that we go through as women. And if this isn't you, this conversation is going to help you, support those who are going through this journey. So I've invited my friend, Erika Shannon Hathaway on the show to have a little girl chat, answer your questions and help you walk away from this conversation with a clear understanding of how you can embrace the change. Now some of you tuning in might know Erika because we've spent some time together a number of years on Daily Burn 365, that live streaming fitness show we were both on. ⁣ ⁣ 01:13⁣ But Erika, my dear friend, you have not only been in this fitness industry for close to two decades, you started making that womanly change yourself and said that you want to do more, not just for yourself, but for those you serve, because you've been a coach, as a fitness instructor for years, as someone who has been in this field for so long, and now as a certified menopause coach specialist, you are helping women pave a new way. So thanks for being here. This is so great. I really love that we're going to be talking about menopause. ⁣ ⁣ 01:46 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Thank you. It is so great to be here with you, Hilary, and it's always just like a reunion to see the old gang from DV365. I love you all so much and thank you for doing what you do with this podcast. I think you help and serve so many people who really need it and it's just a real privilege to be here. So thanks for having me. ⁣ ⁣ 02:08 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Well, I love having my DB365 friends on, but this goes so much bigger, as you know. You know being the work of holistic health and thank you for that. I appreciate that. You know it's just we're here to serve and I remember us having a conversation about just health in general and when we were on the show and I was actually a participant on the show while you're one of our amazing trainers we were given health coaches and this was a fairly new industry. You know the health coaching world, which I wound up being on the other side as a health coach myself. But having support and having guidance and having somebody who understands what you're going through to be that guide by yourself, by your side, is really helpful, like having someone be that guide to answer questions you might have, or just kind of be the sister or the brother that you need. You know, and you've embraced that as well, when you were going through this menopause journey, you found yourself a health coach. ⁣ ⁣ 03:06 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Yes, I did. I didn't know. I knew that I was experiencing the beginnings of perimenopause, but I also thought, oh, I'm just so stressed out and I'm not giving myself the self-care I need and I feel like there's something hormonally off with me. So I hired a holistic health coach to help me out and really, at the time, what I wanted was for her to get all of my levels and do all my hormone testing and my blood testing and just give me a magic pill to make it all better. That's what I really wanted and this is me having been in the fitness and wellness industry, for you know, at that point it had been about 15 years. It's been 18 years now. But I was like, okay, I don't have time to do anything other than what I'm doing and I don't want to stop drinking, and so give me a pill, tell me what's wrong, tell me what I'm missing, and let's supplement it. And she, she was great in that. She really honored like I told her what I wanted and she gave me it, but it didn't fully help because there were certain lifestyle changes that I needed to make, but also my cortisol. I had no cortisol, like I had burned through it all and I was operating with the lowest cortisol imaginable and and it was totally throwing me off I was gaining weight and it was a mess. ⁣ ⁣ 04:30⁣ So, um, we worked through a lot of things and I did make significant improvements during that coaching time, but it wasn't until, um, I started really tuning into my own body, that I started fine tuning even more and then, just in the last year and a half, my journey with getting more involved from an educational standpoint about what perimenopause and menopause actually do to your body and how I can help not only myself but all of the people that I've been teaching for so long. We're all growing together and aging together, and so everybody needs it. A hundred percent of people with ovaries are going to go through this, so I'm really grateful to have the knowledge that I have. Now. I've basically made fun of myself and apologize to my health coach about how idealistic and stupid I was just being. Like give me a pill. How much testosterone? What is it? It's like a testosterone booster supplement. How much tribulus do I need to take to make myself feel better? But yeah, it's crazy. ⁣ ⁣ 05:36 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And I think that's true with pretty much anything. I mean, we live in a sick care system, not a healthcare system. We live in a hell care system, not a health care system. I was just going to say Right, we live in a hellscape. It's a hellscape, it's so true, and we're trying so hard to find the way out or find a way to easily make this go away that, whatever the problem is and that's something I went through as well we come from an age where it was like you go to the doctor, you get, you get a diagnosis and I'm not poo-pooing Western Med by any means, but that whole integrative approach and the blend of functional medicine and holistic health is us being our own healthcare advocates to understand and ask questions. You know I can't say this enough, but with this, what did you call it? A hellscape? ⁣ ⁣ 06:26 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Yeah, okay great, it just came to my mind. I love it. Write that down. ⁣ ⁣ 06:31 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That's a good one, but it is because it's it's we're putting too much in the hands of someone else when we really need to to ask the questions. And you know, I remember when my mom was going through it and'm just like you're crazy, you know, like she's going through that thing, right, we're pointing fingers at women like oh, you're just, you know, it's your time of month, which is a horrible thing to say, but when we're going through this part of our lives, which I always say, it's almost like puberty for adults. ⁣ ⁣ 07:00 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ you know I was just having right. ⁣ ⁣ 07:02 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I was just having a conversation at my fitness facility with a number of women. I said this is like puberty, except we just have a better understanding. We have a fully developed brain and we actually learn how to not react and respond to what's happening. ⁣ ⁣ 07:17 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ It's reverse puberty really. ⁣ ⁣ 07:19⁣ My daughter is 11, and she is ramping up for major puberty times. ⁣ ⁣ 07:24⁣ My daughter is 11 and she is ramping up for major puberty times and it is crazy to watch her go through that and see her hormonal changes happening in real time. ⁣ ⁣ 07:32⁣ And also it makes me laugh at the timing of what most of us, if we have kids, if you're going through perimenopause and menopause, most likely one of your daughters or sons is going through puberty at the same time and it's just a hormone. It's a hormone invasion in your house and but there are coping mechanisms and I feel really grateful that I'm able to have conversations with my daughter about menopause and periods and women's health stuff that my Catholic mom never had with me, not because she didn't want me to be educated in it, but because she had never been educated herself. And she even told me when she went through menopause she didn't even know she was going through menopause because nobody talked about it. She said I don't know, I just kind of went through it, I don't, I didn't complain, I didn't know that anything was really wrong. And and now she said she sent me something on Instagram the other day. She said I have never seen so much about menopause in my life and I said I know, isn't it amazing? It's amazing, it is. ⁣ ⁣ 08:44 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ I mean, I think for us and our generation going through puberty it was are you there, god? It's me, margaret, yes, which, by the way, I love that movie, it's so good. I took my daughter. I felt myself there, I know. ⁣ ⁣ 08:59 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Right. ⁣ ⁣ 09:02 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And a health class which everyone was giggling, which I'm sure kids still do. But here we are at this later stage in our lives, this next phase, and it's really truly understanding who we are, how we're showing up, but also getting the support of those around us, whether it's your girlfriends, whether it's your spouse or your partner, them understanding it and also, like you said, having those conversations with your daughter, where she knows where you are and you know where she is, and it really creates a whole different sisterhood, doesn't it? ⁣ ⁣ 09:31 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ It does and it creates a better relationship, because this morning she was having a moment and she was like I hate my hair and it looks terrible, and la, la, la, like all morning. She was just in a mood and I just hugged her. I said I love you, would you like me to plug in the straightener for you? And she was like I love you too. Yeah, that'd be great. ⁣ ⁣ 09:52 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Thank you, she just needed to be heard. Yeah, we need that too. ⁣ ⁣ 09:56 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ And so do we. ⁣ ⁣ 09:58⁣ So do we, and it's wonderful that we are at this point where we can look at the latest research and where we can advocate for ourselves, like you were saying, with our doctors and our healthcare team, and we can even educate some of our healthcare providers about these things, because the studies that are coming out, the studies that they might have come into the business their industry with, are now outdated and debunked, such as the Women's Health Initiative from the late 90s and early 2000s, and so it is our job to show up and know what is happening, to know what symptoms are actually symptoms of perimenopause. ⁣ ⁣ 10:42⁣ There are estrogen receptors in every major organ system in the body, and so it's not just hot flashes, and the majority of people don't know that. And so how lucky are we that we get to live in a time when we can log on to Instagram and see oh my gosh, I'm not the only one having heart palpitations when I have a glass of wine. Or, oh my gosh, I'm not the only one having heart palpitations when I have a glass of wine. Or, oh my gosh, I didn't know that ringing ears were a symptom of perimenopause. I thought that there was something wrong, that I had like a sinus infection or something. There are so many things now that give us community around it that it helps us regulate our symptoms and therefore improve our quality of life as we're going through the inevitable journey of menopause. ⁣ ⁣ 11:27 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And knowing how to support that, which is huge. ⁣ ⁣ 11:31⁣ Right, I love that you bring that up too, because there are a lot of things that are outside of the box of what we think happens in perimenopause and menopause. I remember having that first hot flash and I felt like I was standing over a subway grate in New York City and then it was gone. And then five seconds later I'm in a hot yoga class and then it's gone. That's what we think, that's ideally what we think when we are thinking about the menopause journey, but it is so much more that brain fog that we were just talking about, right. ⁣ ⁣ 12:04⁣ That sets in. How do we support ourselves there? Moods like our moods, behaviors. That's going to switch too, because something's going on with this vehicle of ours, right? Yes? ⁣ ⁣ 12:15 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Everything's going on at the same time. Our entire system is recalibrating to survive without essential life-giving hormones in our bodies and everything is affected by that. And the more that we can recognize it, name it and know what to do to make ourselves feel better, it's just going to make everything better for us in the long run, which is why I love this work that I'm doing now as a certified menopause coach specialist. It's just so gratifying to help people. And there are the pillars of self-care right. There's exercise, there's nutrition, there's sleep. ⁣ ⁣ 12:57⁣ Sleep is a major component of being able to regulate your symptoms and menopause and perimenopause and self-care, even what you do with havening. It is so important. It is so important to comfort yourself and regulate your nervous system, because anxiety kicks in in a big way during perimenopause, not to mention just the stage of life that we're in, where so many of us are. We talk about the sandwich generation, where people are taking care of aging parents and their kids at the same time. I am deeply in that right now, my mother-in-law has dementia and has just been diagnosed with stage three cancer, and then I have an 11-year-old with a broken wrist athlete who is just on the other like bouncing off the walls, and so in the middle, I have to have really good tools to be able to regulate myself so that I can live a life that I love without getting distracted, and also take care of everybody around me at the same time. And it does take a village. ⁣ ⁣ 13:59 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Absolutely, and it is what women do. We are more of the nurturing that feminine energy is to nurture. We are the ones the nurturing that feminine energy is to nurture. We are the ones that are in the container, filling the container right, and it's really important to know how to support yourself so you can support others. And, by the way, I appreciate you mentioning Havening as one of those tools. There are many tools right. There are many. ⁣ ⁣ 14:20⁣ But being able to self-regulate and self-soothe and for self-care is so imperative, no matter what it is Like, if it's taking a yoga class, if it's journaling, if it's just taking five minutes to step away from the chaos to bring that sense of calm. Whatever it is is really vital for your well-being holistically. You know the whole body approach. ⁣ ⁣ 14:44 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Yes, I agree with you, and I think that's something that a lot of people don't understand is when you are coaching someone, or even I was talking to one of my best friends from high school the other day and she is in a major state of anxiety right now. She's also hormonally fully in menopause, but she's another sandwich generation person. Her husband's having some health issues at the moment and her therapist told her that she needed to start meditating or doing some sort of self-regulating something to tamp down her nervous system. And she was like I'm sorry, but like breathing isn't going to help me right now. And I was like, well, actually breathing really is going to help you right now. ⁣ ⁣ 15:25⁣ And I think that carving out little pockets of self-care I call it micro-dosing, so self-care is so important and has tremendous benefits for just regulating your anxiety during the day. And while I said, look, I know there's a lot wrong right now and, yes, breathing isn't going to solve all of the problems, but it is going to take you from a 10 to a seven so that you can take a deep breath, so that you can pay attention to a phone call, so that you can maybe get 20 minutes of rest in between one thing and the other. It does make a difference. Those little things, the havening, all of those things make a big difference. ⁣ ⁣ 16:11 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ All it takes is two minutes to do anything to regulate your nervous system. It doesn't take. But we get in that the brain gets hijacked, right, and the minute that happens it's like going down this, this hill and the ball just keeps getting bigger. It's really having the, the mindset to say wait is. Is this true, is it helpful, is it inspiring, is it necessary and is it kind? ⁣ ⁣ 16:35⁣ When I'm saying that think method that we learn, you know to stop it and put the kibosh on it before it goes too far. So, with you being a certified menopause coach and there's not many certifications out there, so you're really like in it, Erika, and I want to bring attention to that Because, while there are a lot of people talking about menopause, having this certification, having this knowledge, is a level up, and I say that myself with my certifications, I know we're more than our LMNOPs after our name but, there is something about this so that if you are able to go to a doctor, there is somebody like an Erika out there that understands us more on a whole body approach level. ⁣ ⁣ 17:21⁣ I would's right I would love for you to share that, just so people have an idea great. ⁣ ⁣ 17:27 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Yes, there is one certification program right now in the united states that is accredited, which means that for my certification as a fitness professional, I get actual credits for it. It is an evidence-based coaching program created by Molly Galbraith with Girls Gone Strong, and she is an incredible coach and has incredible programs. And the team of doctors who she recruited to help put the certification together I think there were 14 doctors, so it's all evidence-based coaching. It is not theoretical. This is evidence-based coaching about the pillars of your life that you need to integrate. ⁣ ⁣ 18:14⁣ Now my scope of practice is not to prescribe supplements, hormone replacement therapy. Prescribe supplements, hormone replacement therapy any kind of medication. I am not a physician, but what I like to do is work in tandem with your physician. I like to refer you to a pelvic health specialist. I will refer you to people in my network who can help you and work with them together, because if you choose hormone replacement therapy, then my job is to give you the tools to use those hormones in your body to your best and highest good and benefit. ⁣ ⁣ 18:57⁣ So I concentrate on exercise. Clearly, I've been in the fitness industry for 18 years, so I'm well equipped for that. But the type of exercise that you do at this time of life is very different. Of course there's all the elements of cardio and strength and balance and push, pull and all those things. But in menopause the warmups are longer and we want to really concentrate on strength training to build bone density, lean muscle mass and to mitigate the risks of coronary heart disease, diabetes, dementia. There are so many things that exercise does, especially at this time of our life, that have been proven scientifically. Exercise is a definite boon to help us stay healthy as we age exercise is a definite boon to help us stay healthy as we age. ⁣ ⁣ 19:49 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, so the staying in the scope of practice I think is so important the fact that you mentioned that. I appreciate that, because I say that a lot too. I'm not a doctor, I'm not a therapist, a board certified, but people who trust you and know that you are truly doing the work, because it's not just getting one certification and you're done, which there? Are people out there that do that. It is a continuous thing, my friends, that we are con. ⁣ ⁣ 20:12 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Things are constantly changing and coming out in yes, so those especially in this field oh, yeah, everybody has their eyes on it now, so everybody's finally studying it and everyone's a coach right so everyone's with air quotes right, so finding someone who understands it. Yeah, it gets my goat when people I get it and I'm like well, where did you get certified? And they're like what do you mean? ⁣ ⁣ 20:37 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Or even beyond the certification. It's not just taking a weekend class and suddenly you've got something after your name. It really is understanding, because you can do more damage than good. So, if I were to refer somebody who needed support in the area of perimenopause or menopause also, fitness, because let's not forget how well versed you are in that I mean this, we you and I met during our journey with daily burn, but you were already in the fitness world. You've worked with other fitness companies afterwards as somebody that's had a pretty high position as well. Yeah, you understand this. So, putting those things together, if I were to get a question about this and it's outside my scope of practice right, having people like you are important, you know and you're right. ⁣ ⁣ 21:25 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ It builds, it takes a village you know it does, and I operate from a place of incredibly high integrity. I learned that early on in my career that you have to put your money where your mouth is. You have to do what you say you're going to do, and when you have other people's health and wellness in your hands, in the palm of your hand, it is your responsibility to make sure you are fully accredited, because health is too valuable to mess around with, and I want to help people in the purest way, want to help people in the purest way. Having said that, the thing we do as a coach is everybody comes with a different set of symptoms. Everybody comes with a different experience, with a different panel of blood work and hormone levels, at a different stage of life, with different needs and wants, and so, as a coach, I coach to what's probable and not what's possible, and it's very, very much. ⁣ ⁣ 22:31⁣ I am your tour guide, but it's very much up to you to do the work. I'm not going to prescribe you. Yeah, I'm not going to do what I wanted my coach to do back in the day. I wouldn't say like, give me a magic vitamin and it's going to go away. No, we make commitments to do work. We make a plan, we see what's probable, we see what's most likely, what you're most likely to succeed at doing, based on what your values are based on what your values are, not mine, and then we try stuff out. ⁣ ⁣ 23:03 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Right. We call it bio bio individuality in the world of integrative nutrition, which is another great program for certification. But when I was going through the Institute for integrative nutrition, they coined this term. Bio individuality, yeah, which means every person is different, even if we are the same age, same gender, different Even if we are the same age, same gender, same life experiences. Your vehicle, this temple of yours that no one else owns, is operating a little differently. ⁣ ⁣ 23:31 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Absolutely. Even if our hormone numbers are the same, our bodies operate differently. ⁣ ⁣ 23:40 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, and it's really meeting people where they're at with their needs, not what you think. Oh, you're this age, you're this gender, this is what you need and it's not cookie cutter. I get that I get asked that a lot as a practitioner, especially working on the mental health side. How does your session go? And I'm like your session with me today can be different from the one next week can be different from the as it should as it should. ⁣ ⁣ 24:04⁣ So there's no cookie cutter. You know there might be a process, but understanding who is before you and how you're showing up for them, you would want that to be the same as somebody showing up for you. That's how I treat it. Yeah, yeah. ⁣ ⁣ 24:18 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Our job is to ask a lot of questions to figure out what's really important to people. Everybody I work with goes through an exercise creating their menopause vision statement, and it starts with really evaluating what's important to you as you age and how we're gonna keep you optimized for what's really important to you as you age. And that's how I start. So sometimes I'll start with nutrition, sometimes I'll start with exercise, sometimes I'll start with nutrition, sometimes I'll start with exercise, sometimes I'll start with sleep. You know, it just depends on what they need first, and then we keep knocking, knocking it out, and that's just how we work. But there's no so far in my practice. No two people need the same thing at the same time. ⁣ ⁣ 25:01 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, it's constant work too, because keeping up with our clients and making sure you're supporting them on their needs and being that guide for what they need, compared to someone else. But what's beautiful and I want to mention this because this is a good place to mention this you do have this incredible and, oh my gosh, this girl loves play on words, so I love this. You have your menaarty, yes, and I want to talk about that because it's very similar. You and I are so, so similar in a lot of ways, but still different by individuality. I have the you know the the monthly Havening happy hours. You have something called a menoparty, which is every two weeks. Let's talk about that so that people know there is support if they're not able to work with you one-on-one. ⁣ ⁣ 25:47 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Yes, oh, do. I love the menoparties. So the menoparties are a free Zoom online party. They're at eight o'clock at night every other Tuesday usually, and sometimes I have special guests on. So last week I had Dr Liz McGinley on, who is a pelvic health specialist and a chiropractic sports physician, and we talked all about what happens to our joints, tendons and pelvic region as we go through menopause and she was incredible. ⁣ ⁣ 26:21⁣ Sometimes we have what I call an all skate where I do flash coaching. So everybody comes on, we wear our pajamas, we have our little. I have like hoodies that say ain't no party like a meadow party. I wear that and we just show up and build community around this phase of life, which is so vital, and we have such a good time. We laugh really hard and I record them and if you can't make it live, I send it out the next day. ⁣ ⁣ 26:50⁣ But it's just a really wonderful place to meet other women who are in a similar situation to get a little bit of information about how to handle certain things that that someone else might be getting coached on but you're also identifying with as well, and I have made sure every single session is free. No strings attached. There's no, you know you don't have to buy anything to get it, it's just you sign up and you are invited, and you're always invited and you will forever and ever be invited and we just laugh a lot and sometimes it goes into we talk about sex, we talk about sleep, we talk about stress, we talk about family drama, we talk about our kids and our parents and we talk about dry eyes and ringing ears and palpitations and incontinence and peeing when you're doing jumping jacks and like thousands and thousands of things. But it's so much fun and always free and I it's really important to me because I I really believe that putting a paywall behind vital information, I have a problem with that and, of course, I need to do it for certain offerings of mine, because I do need to make a living. ⁣ ⁣ 28:07⁣ But, um, so right now, the options are the. I always want to have a free option, so the free option is the meadow parties, which are great fun, and then I have um, a coaching program that I am launching very soon. That is, we. It's a group coaching, so it's a monthly fee and you get group coaching every single month and you get access to my online community and we talk there all the time and share recipes and stories and support each other, and it's really lovely. And then, of course, I do my one-on-one as well. ⁣ ⁣ 28:37 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Love it, lots of different tiers, the fact that you're offering something for free. And I feel the same way because I've had people mentioned to me like, why aren't you charging for this? I'm like because I have other ways to to provide myself with income from people working with me one on one. This is an opportunity because it is a right. This is a human right that every person should have access to to some degree. ⁣ ⁣ 29:08⁣ Obviously, coaching someone one-on-one in a group experience can be difficult anyway but, you want to have more of a possibility for people to share and connect and know that they're not going through this alone. They're not alone in this battle. So, and making it fun talking about menopause, talking about mental health, whatever it might be, is what breaks down the barriers that have been there for so long, probably the barriers that we went through as Gen Xers and before you know, generations before the silent generation. So I love this. I love that you love the name more than anything. ⁣ ⁣ 29:50 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ I love it and we're going to put all this in there. We're going to have links in the. ⁣ ⁣ 29:52 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ yes, we're going to put the links to Erika's one on one sessions, as well as the mental parties, just so you can get in touch with her. We're going to have that available to you in the podcast notes so that you can get yourself on the party right. Get right, baby, get right with me. ⁣ ⁣ 30:07 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ So what I want to do? ⁣ ⁣ 30:08 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ we got a lot of questions that came in and as recent as I was just at my trainer and there were a bunch of girls asking me questions, I'm like let me write it down. Some of them overlap because they are mainly the same questions that a lot of us have, but some are a little more specific. So let's just go to the questions. You ready for it? I'm ready. All right, let's do this. This is actually from Christine. She's from Michigan and she did ask yeah, that's your. You know right, I went to Michigan, you did go to Michigan. So Christine from Michigan says what sort of exercise is best when you're in menopause, or is it that any kind of exercise is good as long as you're doing something? Very good question, Christine, Great question. ⁣ ⁣ 30:53 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ You want to try for 150 minutes of exercise per week. You want to get in a good amount of cardio, but not high intensity anaerobic cardio. You want to stay in that zone two, zone three moment. So think power walking, put on a weighted vest and take a walk. Go, walk on an incline so that you get your heart rate up. ⁣ ⁣ 31:15⁣ I do a special strength training in my program, move and Win, which is a little movement platform that I have and that all of my clients get for free, called Peripheral Heart Action. And Peripheral Heart Action is strength training, but it is formatted in a way that you alternate exercises between lower body and upper body, with no breaks in between, so that your heart rate stays up, because what you're doing is you're drawing blood flow to your upper body and then to your lower body and then back, and it goes and goes like that. So it actually keeps your heart rate elevated and therefore provides great metabolic value because you're burning calories longer throughout the day. So those are your cardio options, and then strength training. Pick up the heavy weights. Those are your cardio options, and then strength training. Pick up the heavy weights. ⁣ ⁣ 32:06⁣ You're going to want to really strength train, because as we lose estrogen, we lose lean muscle mass, we lose bone density and that increases our likelihood in our postmenopausal life for coronary disease, diabetes, high cholesterol, injury in falls and fractures, osteopenia and osteoporosis. So you really, really want to just intensify your strength training. Pick up the weights. If you don't know how to pick up the weights, hit me up, I'll help you. It doesn't have to be fancy, you don't need fancy equipment, but integrating strength training into your life. ⁣ ⁣ 32:45⁣ I would say three times a week if you can is so valuable and get a little plyo in there for bone density. Yeah, Whether it's little box jumps or just taking sometimes on my stairs right here, I'll just do step up and jump back down, step up and jump back down just to get a little bit of that impact in. It makes a big difference in maintaining bone density. ⁣ ⁣ 33:10 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ And if you have a difficult time jumping, you can do it with just a step up, step down right, absolutely. ⁣ ⁣ 33:17⁣ You don't want to get any injury. That's really important and that comes up a lot. The osteoporosis, obviously. While we are recording this, we've been talking a lot about women's health, women's history month in March and the fact that you know we just had heart health month and women are the highest number that is prone to getting heart disease and cardiac health is very important for women. So I love this question because you went even deeper. So, take note of this, Christine, and those listening Good luck. ⁣ ⁣ 33:52⁣ Yes, she's on the journey and she's in a couple of our other groups that we're in, so I know that she works out, so she's stepping it up a little bit. Great question, christine. We got one that just came in, so I'm actually going to the book of face. I'm going to be reading this like just this is a cold read, like back from our theater. ⁣ ⁣ 34:11 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Okay, you're an expert, you're going to crush it. ⁣ ⁣ 34:15 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Oh, my gosh, I don't know about that. All right, sarah, she has a question about sleep. That's why I'm doing this question, because it's so, so important. Every trainer that I've ever followed exclaims that the benefits of good sleep, the importance of sleep to a good workout, and she says she agrees. However, hot flashes and night sweats are the antithesis of a good night's rest. I'll hear you, girl how do I get a good night's sleep when I'm constantly getting up hour by hour with hot flashes and night sweats? Oh, that is a good question's. Sleep when I'm constantly getting up hour by hour with hot flashes and night sweats? Ooh, that is a good question, sarah, really good question. ⁣ ⁣ 34:48 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Yes, this is a multifaceted question. First of all, thank you for sharing about your sleep struggles. You are not alone. This is a major, major issue. Vasomotor symptoms go haywire during perimenopause and menopause, and so the first thing we would want to do is try to reduce the likelihood of your hot flashes, and so to do that, you take a multifaceted approach, with good nutrition, talking to your healthcare provider to see if you are a good candidate for hormone replacement therapy, because the best way to treat those symptoms is with HRT, if it is something that you're interested in doing. There are some medications that can make hot flashes worse. There are some foods and drinks that can make hot flashes worse Alcohol, I'm looking at you. So if you, unfortunately, alcohol makes hot flashes so much worse. ⁣ ⁣ 35:55⁣ Sugar makes hot flashes so much worse, and eating late meals. You want to increase your protein. You want to increase your fiber in your diet. Make sure that you have a really nice, balanced diet and try to mitigate stress by setting your sleep schedule. Also, lower the temperature in your bedroom. Lower the temperature in your bedroom, sleep naked or with a little tank top on, take your sheets off and give yourself a fan. You know there are lots of ways to prop yourself in a way that the hot flashes go away. But lowering your stress level, getting rid of sugar and alcohol and inflammatory foods, hrt that's going to get ridT that's going to help you alleviate your hot flashes. Without knowing more about your history or all of those things. This is a blanket statement and obviously regular exercise will help with your hot flashes as well. ⁣ ⁣ 37:00⁣ From a sleep perspective, my question would be do you go to sleep and wake up at the same time every day? ⁣ ⁣ 37:08⁣ And, if not, how can you adjust your lifestyle so that you can start that process? ⁣ ⁣ 37:14⁣ And the reason why I ask is because there are other hormones at play here the hormones melatonin and cortisol. ⁣ ⁣ 37:23⁣ High cortisol can cause more hot flashes If you are not sleeping, going to bed and waking up at the same time every day, your cortisol and your melatonin are going to be a little bit skewed. So, if you want so, when we go to sleep, our melatonin gets high, our cortisol gets low. When we wake up, our melatonin is low. Our cortisol should be at the highest point of the whole day when we wake up, and that's why sometimes when we do a hormone panel, we want to do it first thing in the morning so we can test our cortisol right when we wake up. So if we are eating late, if we are watching stressful television shows right up until we go to sleep, if we are having excited conversations, if we are drinking alcohol, if we are out partying or just engaging in a stress-inducing state working out at night, even our cortisol stays high longer and our melatonin doesn't kick in until later, and that will mess with your sleep schedule. You want to really tune into your circadian rhythms here, because that's going to help your hormones regulate. ⁣ ⁣ 38:35 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, I love that you're bringing that up. ⁣ ⁣ 38:36 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Yeah, everything is related. So, to increase your melatonin production at night, dim all the lights in your house. If you're going to watch TV or look at social media, try not to do it at least an hour before bed. If you do, use blue light blockers and try to regulate the type of content that you're consuming right before you go to sleep and then try to wake up at the same time every day so that your body gets into this rhythm where cortisol is happening. And, if you can, try to delay drinking coffee for an hour after you wake up so that your natural cortisol kicks in before you stimulate with caffeine. ⁣ ⁣ 39:17 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That is so important, everything you just said, and it's going above and beyond. And look, I'm a coffee drinker. I try to get away from it, but the caffeine will kick in. I have to know when to stop it, because I feel the change in my body when I have the caffeine and you know also, I'm going to throw this in there While you're listening to this episode. Afterwards, after you have this amazing conversation that you're tuning into with myself and Erika, check out episode 140, because I did an entire episode on sleep within the sleep expert, Mollie Eastman, on episode 140. ⁣ ⁣ 39:52⁣ So tune into this. That's what I'm talking about. We're all in this collective together and it's giving you really valuable information that you can share. Because what made me think about that, Erika, is that you touched on the lights in the home. Yeah, Because we, naturally we have all these bright lights in our home and it doesn't allow us to come down Put a dimmer everywhere. Yeah or the red lights or the blue lights, something that looks like sundown, is so important. I'm telling you it makes a difference with sleep. ⁣ ⁣ 40:17 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ It really does, because your body recognizes it as it's time to get ready to go to sleep now, that's correct. ⁣ ⁣ 40:23 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ So anyway, sarah, great question. Sarah's from Washington State. I love when we have people all over the country and the world Appreciate that question. All right, we're going back home here. We're coming back to Joycey. This is from Jenny. Okay, hi. Jenny Jenny puts a little humor in her stuff. I know Jenny very well. Is it true that even after you go through menopause for 12 months or you go through 12 months with no period, rather you can still experience menopause symptoms like hot flashes? ⁣ ⁣ 40:53 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Absolutely. You can have symptoms of menopause for up to 10 years before and 10 years after. 10 years before and 10 years after. Menopause is defined as one day, yeah, so menopause is marked when you go 365 days without a period. Once that day passes, you are post-menopause and your symptoms can last well into your 60s. ⁣ ⁣ 41:18 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ She's going to love the answer to that question. I'm very sorry to let you know, because she followed up. ⁣ ⁣ 41:24 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Perimenopause can last 10 years. Yeah yeah, I still cycle regularly, but my perimenopause symptoms are real life honey. And my estrogen levels are low. My testosterone levels are low. I have no progesterone, but yet somehow I'm still. My body temperature is going up and down, so I know I'm cycling. So, because I don't get a period anymore. Tmi I had an endometrial ablation in 2019. So it's glorious. I haven't had a period since then. ⁣ ⁣ 41:53 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Again, it goes back to the vehicle. Understanding your vehicle. Do I have oil and gas in this vehicle? What's going on? I have not had and TMI we can share here. That's what this is all about. ⁣ ⁣ 42:02⁣ Sure we can share. And, by the way, Jenny had a little humor to that, because there is humor in the healing, and she said I definitely want to sell my uterus ASAP because I'm done Girl, I get it. She's like I get it. But understanding your body and being able to befriend it and understand what you're going through and it's, you know, it's a process I have not had one in two years. So, like at that one year point, I'm like, oh, is this it? Like, are you there? God, it's me, Hillary, Full circle moment. I keep trying to find Margaret but she's been so busy. So you know, understanding yourself is really important. So, Jenny, listen, I hope that answers some of your questions. You know, you know understanding yourself is really important. So, Jenny, listen, I hope that answers some of your questions. You know you got me, you got the community and just keep listening to your body, you know please don't sell your uterus on eBay. ⁣ ⁣ 42:51 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Yeah, I mean I could say something like quasi serious about the idea of like wanting to sell your uterus on eBay. Mine's for sale. No, I'm just kidding. Idea of like wanting to sell your uterus on eBay. Mine's for sale no, I'm just kidding. If I could say something serious. ⁣ ⁣ 43:10⁣ It reminded me that in this period of life, there is a lot of grief. Yeah, oh yeah. And because, yes, we do. We feel like our bodies have abandoned us. We feel like our bodies have turned against us. We are mourning that our bodies are not operating the way that they used to. We are mourning that we can't keep not operating the way that they used to. We are mourning that we can't keep weight off the way that we used to, or that our sex drive isn't what it used to be, or that our skin is dry, or that our eyesight is going, or that our hair is thinning. We are grieving that we are past our reproductive years. We are grieving a lot of things, and so it's really important to acknowledge that. Like yeah, we joke about. Like, yeah, I want to say I'm done, like somebody just come in and take it all, but careful, what you wish for, right? ⁣ ⁣ 43:52 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Because that's such a good point, Erika. And it is grief, it is loss, and when we really show up for ourselves and realize this is a process of what we're going through and you even mentioned it like really understanding this beautiful process of aging, there's going to be bumps and bruises, just like there are in every stage, every decade of our lives. But the grief of not being able to have children I hear that one a lot in session, a lot in session, you know, or just even if you didn't want children or have children, which I didn't it's the idea that biologically I can't, it's something being taken from us and so, yeah, looking at it as grief is something that allows us to show up for ourselves. ⁣ ⁣ 44:41 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ And for many women in this phase, in this age, we have kids that are leaving the nest, so that's another piece of grief, because then the child is gone, your main focus for the last 18 years is gone and all of a sudden you're like, well now I'm all washed up, like what am I gonna do now? And that's where we really have an opportunity to lean into the newness of this phase of our life and the possibility and really lean into that persona of being this wise, wonderful, full woman who, or person with ovaries. We don't want to discount our lovely and wonderful trans friends. We want to be really able to be grateful for this transition, and that is really hard sometimes. ⁣ ⁣ 45:37⁣ So that's another one of my really big goals is to help people embrace and love a post-menopausal life. ⁣ ⁣ 45:47 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, yeah, and you know you hit the nail on the head. It makes me think a little bit about my hug it out method, which is about, in the healing, you have to have the humor, you have to be able to understand what you're going through personally and have gratitude for self, the H-U-G and once you have that, you're able to better show up for yourself, better show up for others. So just hold space for yourself, my friends. You know this is a beautiful process that we're going through together or have been through or will go through. Or you know somebody. Like I said at the the beginning of this, this conversation, we'll know somebody who is going through it. So, even if it isn't your journey, somebody is going through it that you know. So show up for them. Trauma to triumph Trauma to triumph, girl. ⁣ ⁣ 46:35⁣ You know it All right, we have one more question. Thank you for that question too, jenny, and just for us going further into it. Yeah, lily in California. Oh girl, oh girl. You and I were just talking about this. Erika Brain fog, it's my battle. That's all she wrote. She wrote brain fog is my battle. What the heck can I do? ⁣ ⁣ 46:56 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Oh God, Brain fog is the worst. Brain fog is the worst. I'm experiencing a lot of brain fog today actually, and I told Hilary before we went live. I'm really afraid that I'm going to lose my train of thought and that my brain is going to like exit the building. ⁣ ⁣ 47:14 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ This is the conversation, because you think you're alone in it and I have conversations with my boyfriend all the time. I'm forgetting everything and you start thinking like, is this early onset Alzheimer's? What's wrong with me? And we start saying things like what's wrong with me? That's got the kibosh on that right. So share your thoughts on this question. ⁣ ⁣ 47:34 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Number one is sleep. I know personally I can talk about me because I am in my body right now and I am experiencing what you're talking about. So I know that this weekend I lost a lot of sleep. We had plans on Friday night where we were out late. Saturday night I went to a friend's house and came home later than I usually would. ⁣ ⁣ 47:52⁣ I've had a little bit of high-functioning anxiety the last few weeks because of some family stuff going on and I know it has deeply affected my sleep. And when I don't get good sleep and I don't get my regular exercise, my brain fog is much, much worse. And so I would say sleep and I would say stop multitasking. We as women think that we can and should be multitasking all of the time. Multitasking does us no favors. So if you combine like really regiment your sleep, try to get that quality sleep. ⁣ ⁣ 48:33⁣ I take magnesium glycinate before bed every night and I also take I drink tart cherry juice before I go to bed which has natural occurring melatonin from tryptophan in it and it helps me sleep. Um, I'm just sharing what I do. Obviously I'm not. I don't prescribe these things, but if it works for me, it might work for you. Um, but but the when I try to multitask, just turn off your phone, don't go on social media. Don't get that like monkey brain situation going on. It's not going to help you right now. Go get some fresh air, take a walk, get the blood flowing in your body and get some sleep. That's, for me, what helps me almost immediately. ⁣ ⁣ 49:15 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That's really good. So what is? You take magnesium, not just magnesium. You're taking magnesium, yeah, so we'll. We'll add that, just so people have that in the notes and they can do with what they want. But you know another way and I'll just share this too do a few moments of Havening, like sit there, lie in your bed, do a little Havening. I actually have a video on hormones and hot flashes for Havening, but I'm going to do one on sleep because this is this is a big topic and I'll I have a hard time sleeping. ⁣ ⁣ 49:45⁣ I have sleep apnea, so I have to settle my mind and stepping away, like you said, from technology even keeping it out of the room is a big thing but just sitting there and like giving yourself two minutes just to self-soothe could put your brain in that Delta wave state, which is sleep state so you know you want to get into that subconscious mind, but be in the subconscious in a positive, because then your brain starts racing right. ⁣ ⁣ 50:11 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Yeah, I actually took my digital clock out of my room smart a month ago because, I was having anxiety knowing how many minutes I was awake in the middle of the night. I was like counting minutes. I was like it's been 46 minutes, I am still awake. Why am I still awake? Why am I thinking? Nothing that you're thinking about in the middle of the night is productive. ⁣ ⁣ 50:32⁣ And it's not real. All the anxiety, it's not real. It's like there's nothing that's sensical about what you're thinking about, what you're spinning about in the middle of the night and you can't do anything about it anyway, right, and I tell myself this. So, tools that I use to get back to sleep, just while we're talking about it tapping I do a lot of tapping and if you don't know about tapping EFT tapping it's amazing and I think of it as like an outside in, just like havening. ⁣ ⁣ 51:03 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Tapping and havening are the same in that they're both psychosensory approaches. Right, you don't put your mind to it. ⁣ ⁣ 51:07 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ It's not like meditation, where you're like clear your mind. It's like I'm going to tap here, I'm going to tap here, I'm going to tap here and here, and here and here and here, and it's going to regulate your nervous system, just like havening. I'm going to touch my hands, I'm going to touch my face, I'm going to give myself a little something and it's going to soothe myself like self-soothing tactics. Yes, and I also listen to sleep hypnosis. ⁣ ⁣ 51:34 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yes, we talked about that when we were chit-chatting. Hypnosis is great. I'm a certified hypnotherapist and it's been helpful for me to learn from well again like the certification right. But going even deeper and listening to there's so much content out there. My friends on YouTube, find the ones that are legit and tap into it because it can actually really be helpful. ⁣ ⁣ 51:59 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ the sleep hypnosis yes, yes, just make sure you bookmark them so you don't have to go searching YouTube at 2 o'clock in the morning, because that's not going to help you, because then your brain is in a hole. ⁣ ⁣ 52:09 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, that's actually really good. I use the. ⁣ ⁣ 52:11 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Aura app A-U-R-A. They have great sleep hypnosis. ⁣ ⁣ 52:15 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Great Love that, all right. Well, those are our questions. Let me check to see if we got any others, because we got to play a little game real quick. I want to just. I like these last minute folks that send their questions. We'll check real quick. Doesn't look like we got any more, because you answered some of the questions, uh-oh. No, I take that back. ⁣ ⁣ 52:35 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ We have one more question and I'm going to get them in, if I can, let's see. ⁣ ⁣ 52:39 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ This is from Wendy. And okay, good question, wendy. Wendy said is it possible to lose weight when you're in perimenopause? Haven't changed my diet and workouts, but managed to pack on some weight and I cannot lose it now. Wendy, my dear, let's see what Erika has to say. ⁣ ⁣ 52:57 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ I have a lot to say about this. First of all, I would want to know, as your coach, what did you do to change your diet? Restrictive eating is not your friend in perimenopause, because you need more than you think you do and you need to really up your protein and your fiber. Protein and fiber. For women. We're going 25 grams of fiber per day at least and protein you want to get 20 to 30 grams of protein per meal. ⁣ ⁣ 53:27⁣ You want to eat. You want to eat, eat, eat, eat, eat all the good things. Stop counting calories. Stop counting calories. You just want to eat more protein and fiber. Um, what? ⁣ ⁣ 53:40 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ was the other part At least a hundred, a hundred grams of protein a day. Again, just had this conversation too. And what did you say? 25 grams of fiber, right? ⁣ ⁣ 53:49 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ For women? Yeah, at least 25. That's a really good question. ⁣ ⁣ 53:52 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Wendy, thank you for asking that. That just popped in. ⁣ ⁣ 53:56 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ So I'm glad we were able to-. ⁣ ⁣ 53:57 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ There was another part of that question. Oh, let me go back and check real quick. So Wendy said that she hasn't been able. She's been packing on the weight how I can't lose it now? ⁣ ⁣ 54:07 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ yeah, it's just a statement she hasn't changed her diet or workouts so the loss of estrogen causes a redistribution of weight in the body and the accumulation of visceral fat which is around the abdominal area. So the belly fat situation, definitely without changing anything, can can come upon you in menopause or perimenopause, very suddenly actually, and so that's why, with the visceral fat, we have to incorporate the nutrition piece, because visceral fat does not perform the way that subcutaneous fat performs, so subcutaneous fat is easier to gain and lose. Visceral fat is really persnickety and it really depends on what you eat, what you eat and what you do not eat. So you want to avoid inflammatory foods. You want to avoid sugar and alcohol, if you can, added sugars. You want to just pack your day with whole foods and good quality food not processed, and you want to exercise in that zone too. That is going to help you lose weight. ⁣ ⁣ 55:29⁣ But all of the high intensity HIIT workouts, all the crazy indoor cycling, all the anaerobic workouts that we used to do in our 20s and 30s, it's not going to serve you now because that just makes your cortisol high and it's not going to give you the recovery that you need. So it all feeds into the same. But diet and exercise are huge. Stop dieting, stop counting calories. And we grew up I mean, I'm Gen X we grew up with this restrictive diet mentality of you have to count calories, you can only have 2,000 calories a day and then we overexercise to compensate. None of that is going to work for you now. We have to completely reprogram our minds to live differently in these bodies, because these are different bodies than they were in our 20s and 30s. ⁣ ⁣ 56:21 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Yeah, wendy, I get you. I was a kid that went to well, we called it fat camp, which is just putting shame on us right there. But I went to a camp that was counting calories and making sure it's calories in, calories out. Get this amount. You can't work out like you did when you were 13 or 14 or 15 or even 20. Just the movement, like Erika said, the 150 minutes a week, that's 30 minutes a day, five days a week. Right, doing the weight bearing, exercise and really be mindful of the amount of protein. Actually just have as much protein as possible. ⁣ ⁣ 56:58 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ You know I mean really, there's really no limit. As much protein as you possibly can. ⁣ ⁣ 57:02 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ There's just so much that your body will absorb and process. But if you go over, you're fine with that. And then getting that good source of fiber because, again, taking care of our heart, heart health, is really important as well. So these little tips will be helpful for you. Wendy, you are supported, know that you can. Uh, you can find support. You got it, girl. So those are some great questions, and thank you to everybody that submitted. Now let's play a little game with Erika. ⁣ ⁣ 57:28 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Oh dear. ⁣ ⁣ 57:28 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ All right, as we close things out, Hilary loves to do a game called Rapid Fire, where, I ask you, I actually mention a word that you brought up during this conversation and you come back with the first word that comes to mind. Oh shit Okay Love it there's so many times. I think it would be better to do this at the beginning. ⁣ ⁣ 57:45⁣ but no, no, let's close it on a high note here Just the first word that comes to mind, first word that comes to mind. I will throw out some words that you have said. Just come back with the first word, like boom, boom, boom. Let's do it. And I know this is going to be really great, because you have brain fog. You have brain fog, all right, here we go. Hormones Complicated Sleep. ⁣ ⁣ 58:09 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Essential. ⁣ ⁣ 58:09 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Period Sucks, menopause, long haul, self-care, self-care, you said Necessary, it's one word, it's hyphenated. ⁣ ⁣ 58:25 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Sugar Inlimited qualities. That's more than one word. ⁣ ⁣ 58:30 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ That's okay, that's okay. No judgment Sorry, inlimited quantities Fine. We'll put hyphens in between. It yeah, midlife. ⁣ ⁣ 58:40 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Privilege Fitness. Cornerstone Brain fog Sucks. ⁣ ⁣ 58:51 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Scary. Brain fog is scary. It is a little scary, but again, understanding where you're coming from helps right and woman Powerful. Yeah, I had to end it on a high note. Look, we're going through stuff ladies and those who identify as tuning in we're going through stuff, guys. And those who identify as and are tuning in we're going through stuff, so we are going to support each other. ⁣ ⁣ 59:17⁣ Yeah, we're not alone in the battle, you know, and this is a part of life and change, and it's not always pretty, but understanding yourself is what empowers you right and finding the glimmers in it, finding the humor, finding the community and the camaraderie. Yeah, and attending a menoparty and coming to a menoparty. Again we're going to put everything in the link of the podcast notes, but I want to give you a moment, Erika, to share a final note. What are your final thoughts with those tuning into HIListically Speaking? ⁣ ⁣ 59:52 - Erika Shannon-Hathaway (Guest)⁣ Well, first of all, thank you, Hilary, for having me. It is just so great to see you and I love what you're doing with your podcast. I think it's so important. Thank you with your podcast. I think it's so important and it's such great. Quality, quality content, quality, everything. So thank you for letting me be a part of it. I think, as a closing, I would just say hang in there. You are not alone. There are resources out there for you. All of your feelings are real and valid and all of your symptoms are real, and while we might not be able to fully alleviate them all, and while we will never be able to go back to what we were, we are all able to become something so much wiser and live a full and gratifying and beautiful life in menopause. ⁣ ⁣ 01:00:46 - Hilary Russo (Host)⁣ Beautiful Love that. What a beautiful share. Thanks, Erika, this has been great. ⁣ ⁣ 01:00:51⁣ Love you dearly, I'm so glad that you're on this journey, and I don't just mean the menopause journey, I mean the journey of supporting yourself and others. So it's great having you. Thanks for being here. Thank you, okay, sunshines, your questions have been answered. And listen if you want to take it a step further. ⁣ ⁣ 01:01:09⁣ There is no time like the present to check out one of Erika's mental parties. They are free. They happen every other week. It's a chance to come together as a community and talk about some of these topics. So I would say, check the links in the podcast notes of this episode to find out more about the mental parties, how to work with Erika one-on-one or even just connect with her on social media or her website and listen. ⁣ ⁣ 01:01:31⁣ We also talked about the importance of self-care, did we not? And one of the things that I have actually created was how to do self-havening for hot flashes and those hormones. I did this a while back, but I'm going to put a link to that in the podcast notes of this episode as well, so that you can follow along on a guided havening experience with yours truly and give it a try and listen. If you found this episode helpful, do me a solid, leave a rating, a review, wherever you do your listening, whether it's on Apple Podcasts, spotify Podcasts or even on YouTube or any of the other platforms that we are on, which we are on all of them and leave a message because make sure you're also downloading and subscribing, because then that allows others to find this episode or this podcast in general, and it's paying it forward. So do yourself a favor, do others favor and do me a favor. ⁣ ⁣ 01:02:22⁣ HIListically Speaking is edited by 2Market Media with music by Lipbone Redding and listened to by you. So thank you for joining me for this party every week and finding more ways to turn your traumas into triumphs and be kind to your mind. It doesn't go unnoticed. On that note, remember that you are never alone in this battle or whatever you are facing. You are supported, you are loved and I am always here to continue pressing record. I'll see you next week. Be well. ⁣