
The Counter Narrative: Changing the Way We Talk (and think) About Education
A podcast dedicated to changing the way we talk and think about education. We all know that the field isn't perfect but there is plenty of awesome work happening everyday. Listen in as I profile educators who are positively impacting their staff, students, and communities.
Latest episodes

Mar 15, 2024 • 1h 9min
Episode 199: Interview w/ Sawsan Jaber
In this compelling episode, I sit down with renowned educator and passionate speaker, Sawsan Jaber, to delve into a topic that's as sensitive as it is crucial: the impact of the ongoing crisis in Gaza on Palestinian students in America, against the backdrop of school districts' responses to international conflicts. At a time when Illinois, home to one of the highest concentrations of Palestinian students in the country, has seen school letters openly supporting Israel, we explore the discord between the principles of Equity and unbiased education and the realities faced by these students.
Sawsan Jaber, a voice of reason and empathy, does not shy away from addressing the elephant in the room. She questions the message sent by educational institutions when they appear to support actions that many interpret as profoundly unjust. Through her lens as an educator and as the child of refugees who personally experienced the ravages of conflict in Palestine, Sawsan offers a perspective seldom heard in mainstream media or educational discourse.
This episode is not just a critique but a journey towards understanding. Sawsan calls out the hypocrisy she observes in political and educational circles, urging for a more inclusive approach to handling sensitive geopolitical issues within the educational sphere. She also outlines pathways for listeners to gain a more nuanced understanding of the situation, advocating for a dialogue that respects the diverse backgrounds of students and their families.
Join me for a thought-provoking discussion that challenges us to reflect on the role of education in times of conflict and the importance of fostering an environment that truly embodies the ideals of equity and inclusivity.

Mar 8, 2024 • 14min
Episode 198: Pause to Ponder - The Black Irish
In this thought-provoking "Pause to Ponder" episode of The Counter Narrative Podcast, Charles delves deep into the rich tapestry of Afro-Irish heritage, a journey sparked by his own mixed ancestry and the intriguing question: Is the term "Black Irish" rooted in reality or merely a myth? He embarks on a historical exploration, unraveling the origins and evolutions of this complex identity. From the legendary tales of the Spanish Armada to the vibrant stories of contemporary Afro-Irish figures like Phil Lynott, Paul McGrath, and Ruth Negga, this episode illuminates the contributions that have woven the intricate social and cultural fabric of Ireland today.
Join me as I celebrate diversity, challenge perceptions, and uncover the nuanced stories of the Afro-Irish community, shedding light on a lesser-known aspect of Ireland's diverse identity.

Mar 1, 2024 • 36min
Episode 197: Interview w/ Charle Peck
In this enlightening episode of The Counter Narrative Podcast, host Charles sits down with trauma-informed expert Charle Peck to delve deep into the critical shortcomings of current Social and Emotional Learning (SEL) frameworks. Charle provocatively argues that the SEL programs in place today fall short of their transformative potential, primarily because they overlook the intricate tapestry of human interactions and the nuanced needs of individuals grappling with trauma. With her insightful analysis, Charle underscores the necessity for a more holistic approach that genuinely accommodates the complexities of human behavior and emotions.
As the conversation unfolds, Charles and Charle coin the term "simple sustainable solutions," advocating for a paradigm shift in how we conceive and implement SEL initiatives. This episode is a clarion call to educators, policymakers, and mental health professionals to rethink and revitalize our current methodologies, ensuring they are truly inclusive and effective in nurturing resilient, empathetic communities. Tune in for a thought-provoking discussion that challenges the status quo and paves the way for innovative, accessible strategies in the realm of social and emotional learning.

Feb 23, 2024 • 13min
Episode 196: Pause to Ponder - Agreement & Alignment
In this compelling episode of The Counter Narrative Podcast, host Charles Williams explores the nuanced relationship between alignment and agreement in leadership, inspired by insights from the John Maxwell Executive Leadership Podcast. Charles delves into the importance of maintaining a unified team front, emphasizing that true alignment transcends mere agreement and is deeply rooted in shared core values. Through personal anecdotes, he illustrates how alignment on fundamental principles can bridge the gap between differing opinions, transforming potential conflicts into opportunities for collaboration.
Charles concludes with practical advice for those facing misalignment in their professional lives: identify and understand your core values, assess their alignment with your organization and its leaders, and then decide whether to engage in dialogue to find common ground or seek a new environment that resonates with your values. This episode is a must-listen for anyone looking to navigate the complexities of leadership and team dynamics with integrity and purpose.

Feb 16, 2024 • 38min
Episode 195: Interview w/ Erin Glenn
Episode Description:
Join host Charles Williams on this enlightening episode of The Counter Narrative Podcast as he sits down with the insightful Erin Glenn to tackle a topic close to the heart of every educator: treating education as a respected profession amidst its often challenging portrayal in the media. Erin, with her wealth of experience and passion for education, delves into the critical issues of teacher recruitment and retention, offering a fresh perspective on how we can not only prepare teachers for the challenges of the classroom but also ensure they remain engaged, current, and have ample opportunities for growth beyond their teaching roles.
Throughout the conversation, Erin sheds light on the systemic changes needed to elevate the teaching profession, drawing on examples of successful strategies and personal anecdotes to illustrate her points. She emphasizes the importance of creating a supportive environment that values continuous learning and professional development, ensuring that educators feel valued, respected, and motivated to excel in their careers.
Whether you're an educator, administrator, policy maker, or simply someone who cares about the future of education, this episode is a must-listen. Join us as we explore the ways in which we can collectively work towards a future where education is not only respected but revered, and where teachers are recognized as the pillars of society they truly are. Don't miss this compelling conversation on The Counter Narrative Podcast.
Guest Biography:

Feb 9, 2024 • 9min
Episode 194: Pause to Ponder - COVID Thoughts
In this heartfelt episode, Charles shares a personal reflection from a week spent in isolation due to COVID-19. Initially viewing the unexpected downtime as an opportunity to get ahead on work, he is quickly reminded of the body's need for rest and the pitfalls of hustle culture, especially within the realm of education. Through his experience, this episode explores the delicate balance between productivity and well-being, the pressures of educational leadership, and the importance of modeling self-care and resilience. Join me for a candid discussion on reevaluating our priorities in the face of ongoing challenges and redefining what success looks like in education and beyond.

Feb 2, 2024 • 50min
Episode 193: Interview w/ Joe Brummer
In this insightful episode of "The Counter Narrative Podcast," host Charles Williams sits down with Joe Brummer, an expert in trauma-informed practices. Together, they delve into the transformative world of restorative practices in educational settings, a movement gaining momentum across schools nationwide. Joe sheds light on a critical oversight in the current implementation of these practices; while they hold immense potential for fostering understanding and resolution, their effectiveness is frequently undercut by a lack of integration with trauma-informed approaches. Through a thought-provoking discussion, Joe emphasizes that for restorative justice to realize its full promise, it must be underpinned by a deep understanding of trauma and its impacts. This episode is a must-listen for educators, administrators, and anyone interested in creating more empathetic and effective environments for conflict resolution.

Jan 26, 2024 • 19min
Episode 192: Pause to Ponder - The Negro Leagues and School Desegregation
In this thought-provoking episode of "The Counter Narrative Podcast," host Charles Williams delves into the nuanced and complex history of integration in America, drawing compelling parallels between the integration of the Negro Leagues into Major League Baseball and the desegregation of schools. Through the lens of specific examples, such as the decline of the Kansas City Monarchs and the challenges faced by Sumner High School, we explore the unintended consequences of integration on vital African American institutions. The episode concludes with insightful suggestions on recognizing and preserving the contributions of these institutions, fostering a nuanced understanding of integration's effects, and ensuring real equality in practice within the field of education.
Join us as we navigate the intricate legacy of integration and its impact on both the past and present of American society.

Jan 19, 2024 • 31min
Episode 191: Interview w/ Dr. Don Parker
About The Guest:
Dr. Don Parker is a transformational keynote speaker and professional development provider. He specializes in SEL, supporting teachers to build trusting relationships with students, restorative practices, trauma-informed practices, and improving the culture and climate of schools to enhance students’ and teachers’ feeling of belonging.
Dr. Parker is a former principal and served at Posen School in Posen, IL where he improved the school climate, staff collaboration, parent engagement, and student achievement. Before that he was the principal of Lincoln Avenue School, a K-8 school in Dolton, IL, where he improved the culture, implemented a resilience program, managed the implementation of restorative justice, and increased attendance and student achievement.
Dr. Parker has a strong belief in creating a school climate in which the entire staff strives for excellence to meet the academic and social emotional needs of each student. He has presented throughout the United States at distinguished educational conferences including ASCD, Every Student Succeeds Act Conference, the National Principals Conference, Illinois Principals Conference, Oklahoma Secondary and Elementary Conference, the Raising Student Achievement Conference, Transforming School Culture Conference, and the Innovative Schools Summit, just to name a few.
Dr. Parker is the author of the book "Building Bridges: Engaging Students At-Risk Through the Power of Relationships" and "Be the Driving Force: Leading Your School on the Road to Equity."
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Jan 13, 2024 • 18min
Episode 190: Pause to Ponder - The Busyness Myth
Busy, busy, busy ... like the white rabbit perpetually late and always rushing.
We are all so busy and yet ... I often wonder ... are we busy doing the right things?
What if, we reexamined what it is that makes us so busy and, in the process, redefine what it means to be effective, efficient, and successful?
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Don't miss a single episode and discover more exciting content by signing up here!
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Interested in attending NCMLE to connect with Charles Williams and other educational leaders from across the country? Click here to register today!