

No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp
Tokens Media
What does it really mean to live a good life—in our politics, our faith, our work, and our relationships?
On No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp, we explore the ideas, practices, and public debates that shape human flourishing today. Each week you’ll hear thought-provoking conversations with bestselling authors, philosophers, neuroscientists, psychologists, theologians, artists, and political leaders—people wrestling with the biggest questions of meaning and purpose in our time.
Together we ask:
How can religion be a force for healing instead of division?
What does neuroscience reveal about happiness, habits, and productivity?
Where do politics and justice meet the pursuit of the common good?
How do truth, beauty, and goodness help us live well—personally and collectively?
If you care about faith, politics, social justice, science, or the search for meaning, you’ll find courageous, practical conversations here. Because pursuing a meaningful life is no small endeavor—and we’re with you on the road.
Learn more at nosmallendeavor.com.
On No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp, we explore the ideas, practices, and public debates that shape human flourishing today. Each week you’ll hear thought-provoking conversations with bestselling authors, philosophers, neuroscientists, psychologists, theologians, artists, and political leaders—people wrestling with the biggest questions of meaning and purpose in our time.
Together we ask:
How can religion be a force for healing instead of division?
What does neuroscience reveal about happiness, habits, and productivity?
Where do politics and justice meet the pursuit of the common good?
How do truth, beauty, and goodness help us live well—personally and collectively?
If you care about faith, politics, social justice, science, or the search for meaning, you’ll find courageous, practical conversations here. Because pursuing a meaningful life is no small endeavor—and we’re with you on the road.
Learn more at nosmallendeavor.com.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Jan 23, 2024 • 1h 20min
139: Unabridged Interview: Martin Sheen
This is our unabridged interview with Martin Sheen.
In this episode, Lee sits down with the former President of the United States…
At least, that’s how many listeners may know Martin Sheen, an award-winning actor known for his roles in “Apocalypse Now” and “The Departed,” and perhaps most famously for playing President Jed Bartlet in the hit TV series “The West Wing.”
But offscreen, Martin is perhaps best described as an ardent Catholic peace activist who has been arrested over 60 times. In this episode, he tells his whole story, full of humor and grace all the way from his childhood, to his acting career, to activism alongside James Lawson and John Dear, and much more.
Show Notes
Similar episodes:
The Architect of The American Civil Rights Movement: James Lawson
Taking the Beatitudes Seriously: John Dear
Resources mentioned this episode:
The West Wing Cathedral Scene
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes
Transcript for Abridged Episode
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Shop No Small Endeavor Merch: Scandalous Witness Course | Scandalous Witness Book | Joy & the Good Life Course
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jan 18, 2024 • 54min
139: Martin Sheen: Actor and Activist (Best of NSE)
In this episode, Lee sits down with the former President of the United States…
At least, that’s how many listeners may know Martin Sheen, an award-winning actor known for his roles in “Apocalypse Now” and “The Departed,” and perhaps most famously for playing President Jed Bartlet in the hit TV series “The West Wing.”
But offscreen, Martin is perhaps best described as an ardent Catholic peace activist who has been arrested over 60 times. In this episode, he tells his whole story, full of humor and grace all the way from his childhood, to his acting career, to activism alongside James Lawson and John Dear, and much more.
Show Notes
Similar episodes:
The Architect of The American Civil Rights Movement: James Lawson
Taking the Beatitudes Seriously: John Dear
Resources mentioned this episode:
The West Wing Cathedral Scene
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes
Transcription Link
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Stitcher | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
Become a Member: Virtual Only | Standard | Premium
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Shop No Small Endeavor Merch: Scandalous Witness Course | Scandalous Witness Book | Joy & the Good Life Course
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jan 16, 2024 • 2h 19min
138: Unabridged Interview: James Lawson
This is our unabridged interview with James Lawson.
The US Civil Rights Movement, like Gandhi's Indian Independence Movement, was famously set apart by its employment of non-violent resistance methods. But have you ever wondered how such a movement was possible on so large a scale?
In this episode, we are honored to have the man who Martin Luther King Jr. called friend, mentor, and the very conscience and architect of the Civil Rights Movement: Reverend James Lawson.
Now in his 90’s, he discusses the United States’ past and present, and what it took to organize a whole population across the country to fight back without throwing a punch.
“We started the public desegregation of the nation,” he says, “and we did it without hating anybody.”
Show Notes
Similar episodes:
Eddie Glaude: On James Baldwin’s America
Dr. Fred Gray: Doing Justice Alongside MLK and Rosa Parks
Martin Sheen: Actor and Activist
Resources mentioned this episode:
Fellowship Of Reconciliation (F.O.R.)
Rev. James Lawson’s Church: Holman United Methodist
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes
Transcript for Abridged Episode
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Stitcher | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
Become a Member: Virtual Only | Standard | Premium
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Shop No Small Endeavor Merch: Scandalous Witness Course | Scandalous Witness Book | Joy & the Good Life Course
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jan 11, 2024 • 55min
138: James Lawson: The Architect of the United States Civil Rights Movement (Best of NSE)
The US Civil Rights Movement, like Gandhi's Indian Independence Movement, was famously set apart by its employment of non-violent resistance methods. But have you ever wondered how such a movement was possible on so large a scale?
In this episode, we are honored to have the man who Martin Luther King Jr. called friend, mentor, and the very conscience and architect of the Civil Rights Movement: Reverend James Lawson.
Now in his 90’s, he discusses the United States’ past and present, and what it took to organize a whole population across the country to fight back without throwing a punch.
“We started the public desegregation of the nation,” he says, “and we did it without hating anybody.”
Show Notes
Similar episodes:
Eddie Glaude: On James Baldwin’s America
Dr. Fred Gray: Doing Justice Alongside MLK and Rosa Parks
Martin Sheen: Actor and Activist
Resources mentioned this episode:
Fellowship Of Reconciliation (F.O.R.)
Rev. James Lawson’s Church: Holman United Methodist
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes
Transcription Link
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Stitcher | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
Become a Member: Virtual Only | Standard | Premium
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Shop No Small Endeavor Merch: Scandalous Witness Course | Scandalous Witness Book | Joy & the Good Life Course
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jan 9, 2024 • 57min
137: Unabridged Interview: Angela Duckworth
What do Olympic athletes, world-class artists, elite academics, and successful business executives have in common? Ivy League psychologist Angela Duckworth has spent her career researching this question, closely studying those folks at the top of their respective fields who are considered “high achievers.” Surprisingly, it turns out neither talent nor genius is the answer. “The common denominator,” she says, “is grit.”
In this episode, Angela Duckworth explains what she means by “grit,” discusses why it is such a crucial determinant for success, and offers highly practical methods for developing grit in one’s own life.
Show Notes
Similar episodes:
Time Management for Mortals: Oliver Burkeman
What it Takes to Live a Good Life: Meghan Sullivan
Resources mentioned this episode
Grit by Angela Duckworth
Character Lab
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes
Transcript for Abridged Episode
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Stitcher | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
Become a Member: Virtual Only | Standard | Premium
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Shop No Small Endeavor Merch: Scandalous Witness Course | Scandalous Witness Book | Joy & the Good Life Course
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jan 4, 2024 • 54min
137: Angela Duckworth: Is Grit the Secret to Success? (Best of NSE)
What do Olympic athletes, world-class artists, elite academics, and successful business executives have in common? Ivy League psychologist Angela Duckworth has spent her career researching this question, closely studying those folks at the top of their respective fields who are considered “high achievers.” Surprisingly, it turns out neither talent nor genius is the answer. “The common denominator,” she says, “is grit.”
In this episode, Angela Duckworth explains what she means by “grit,” discusses why it is such a crucial determinant for success, and offers highly practical methods for developing grit in one’s own life.
Show Notes
Similar episodes:
Time Management for Mortals: Oliver Burkeman
What it Takes to Live a Good Life: Meghan Sullivan
Resources mentioned this episode
Grit by Angela Duckworth
Character Lab
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes
Episode Transcript
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Stitcher | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
Become a Member: Virtual Only | Standard | Premium
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Shop No Small Endeavor Merch: Scandalous Witness Course | Scandalous Witness Book | Joy & the Good Life Course
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jan 2, 2024 • 1h 6min
136: Unabridged Interview: Elise Hu
This is our unabridged episode with Elise Hu.
What is beauty, and what role should it play in our lives?
Beauty has long been seen as one the three “transcendentals” (along with truth and goodness) which have been valued at all times, in all places, by all cultures. But these days, the word “beauty” is often equated with standards of bodily presentation that, in an increasingly globalized and technological world, are reachable only by extreme measures of constant labor or cosmetic surgery.
In this episode, Elise asks the question we’re all thinking: is that version of beauty good for us? She discusses her experience in a beauty-obsessed Korean culture, its effects on both women and men, and what a healthy relationship with beauty might look like.
Show Notes:
Similar episodes
The Price of the Pursuit of Pleasure: Anna Lembke
Thou Shalt Not Be a Jerk: Eugene Cho
Resources mentioned this episode
Flawless by Elise Hu
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes
Transcription Link for Abridged Episode
Join NSE+ Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
Become a Subscriber: NSE+
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dec 28, 2023 • 54min
136: Elise Hu: Obsessed With Beauty (Best of NSE)
What is beauty, and what role should it play in our lives?
Beauty has long been seen as one the three “transcendentals” (along with truth and goodness) which have been valued at all times, in all places, by all cultures. But these days, the word “beauty” is often equated with standards of bodily presentation that, in an increasingly globalized and technological world, are reachable only by extreme measures of constant labor or cosmetic surgery.
In this episode, Elise asks the question we’re all thinking: is that version of beauty good for us? She discusses her experience in a beauty-obsessed Korean culture, its effects on both women and men, and what a healthy relationship with beauty might look like.
Show Notes:
Similar episodes
The Price of the Pursuit of Pleasure: Anna Lembke
Thou Shalt Not Be a Jerk: Eugene Cho
Resources mentioned this episode
Flawless by Elise Hu
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes
Transcription Link
Join NSE+ Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
Become a Subscriber: NSE+
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dec 27, 2023 • 55min
132: Unabridged Interview: Tom and Tony Bancroft
Twins Tom and Tony Bancroft grew up sharing a small bedroom, trying to out-draw each other. Today, they have long careers under their belts working for Disney, Warner Brothers, and many more esteemed animation studios.
Their life’s work is a testament to the power of passion, imagination, faith, and brotherhood. In this episode, they discuss how they became animators at the world’s most famous companies, what it’s like to be storytellers for the masses, and what their faith has meant to them over the course of their lives.
Show Notes:
Similar episodes
Johnnyswim: Reality TV, the Cuban Revolution, and a Disco Queen Mother
Drew Holcomb: Fighting Dragons and Singing at Loss
Resources mentioned this episode
The Bancroft Brothers Animation Podcast
Join NSE+ Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
Become a Subscriber: NSE+
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Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
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Dec 26, 2023 • 52min
135: Unabridged Interview: Heather Holleman
This is our unabridged episode with Heather Holleman.
How important is it to be a good conversationalist?
In an age of widespread loneliness, close relationships are at a premium, and it’s harder than ever to find common ground, even with those we spend time with on a daily basis. According to Heather Holleman, this is due in part to the fact that we have lost the ability to have what she calls “good conversations.”
“Good conversations create personal closeness,” she says. “When you have good conversations, it could intervene in the loneliness epidemic.”
In this episode, she discusses her book “The Six Conversations: Pathways to Connecting in an Age of Isolation and Inactivity,” in which she offers loads of practical tips for becoming better listeners, talkers, question askers, and ultimately, human beings.
Show Notes:
Similar episodes
Robert Waldinger and Marc Schulz: Lessons from the World’s Longest Scientific Study on Happiness
Kelly Corrigan: How Vulnerability Leads to Connection
Curt Thompson: The Power of Being Known
Resources mentioned this episode
The Six Conversations by Heather Holleman
Transcript for Abridged Episode
Join NSE+ Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
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Become a Subscriber: NSE+
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Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


