

No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp
Tokens Media
What does it really mean to live a good life—in our politics, our faith, our work, and our relationships?
On No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp, we explore the ideas, practices, and public debates that shape human flourishing today. Each week you’ll hear thought-provoking conversations with bestselling authors, philosophers, neuroscientists, psychologists, theologians, artists, and political leaders—people wrestling with the biggest questions of meaning and purpose in our time.
Together we ask:
How can religion be a force for healing instead of division?
What does neuroscience reveal about happiness, habits, and productivity?
Where do politics and justice meet the pursuit of the common good?
How do truth, beauty, and goodness help us live well—personally and collectively?
If you care about faith, politics, social justice, science, or the search for meaning, you’ll find courageous, practical conversations here. Because pursuing a meaningful life is no small endeavor—and we’re with you on the road.
Learn more at nosmallendeavor.com.
On No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp, we explore the ideas, practices, and public debates that shape human flourishing today. Each week you’ll hear thought-provoking conversations with bestselling authors, philosophers, neuroscientists, psychologists, theologians, artists, and political leaders—people wrestling with the biggest questions of meaning and purpose in our time.
Together we ask:
How can religion be a force for healing instead of division?
What does neuroscience reveal about happiness, habits, and productivity?
Where do politics and justice meet the pursuit of the common good?
How do truth, beauty, and goodness help us live well—personally and collectively?
If you care about faith, politics, social justice, science, or the search for meaning, you’ll find courageous, practical conversations here. Because pursuing a meaningful life is no small endeavor—and we’re with you on the road.
Learn more at nosmallendeavor.com.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Jun 4, 2024 • 56min
158: Unabridged Interview: Naomi Shihab Nye
This is our unabridged interview with Naomi Shihab Nye.What do scientists and poets both agree on?On this show, we often host guests whose work is in scientific or concrete fields, such as psychology or sociology, which rely on experiments and research to come to helpful conclusions. But such conversations sometimes fall short of the wonder and beauty we experience in everyday life, and for such subjects, we turn to the poets.In this episode, award-winning poet Naomi Shihab Nye corroborates what researchers have confirmed—the benefits of paying attention. She shares abundant wisdom for living a good life through the lens of poetry. Her work has a quality that the best poetry has, that of paying rapt attention to small moments, making meaning and hope out of everyday wonders.Show Notes:Resources mentioned this episodeEverything Comes Next by Naomi Shihab NyePDF of Lee’s Interview NotesTranscript for Abridged EpisodeJOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes, ad-free listening, and discounts on live showsSubscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTubeFollow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTubeFollow Lee: Instagram | TwitterJoin our Email List: nosmallendeavor.comSee Privacy Policy: Privacy PolicyAmazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

May 30, 2024 • 54min
158: Naomi Shihab Nye: The Life Changing Benefits of Paying Attention (Best of NSE)
Award-winning poet Naomi Shihab Nye emphasizes the life-changing benefits of paying attention, offering wisdom for living through poetry. She explores the power of questions, kindness, and cultural diversity, promoting empathy and human connection. Nye's moving poems reflect moments of beauty and humanity, reminding us to cherish small wonders in life.

May 28, 2024 • 49min
157: Unabridged Interview: Kristin Neff
Professor Kristin Neff discusses how self-compassion is more effective than self-esteem for human flourishing. She explains the negative effects of high self-esteem and the benefits of cultivating self-compassion. Kristin shares insights on how self-compassion can help us flourish amidst stress and suffering, with a brief mention of psychiatrist Curt Thompson's research on shame.

May 23, 2024 • 54min
157: Kristin Neff: The Power of Self-Compassion (Best of NSE)
Professor Kristin Neff discusses self-compassion vs. self-esteem, how to cultivate self-compassion, and its benefits in flourishing. She contrasts self-compassion with self-pity, explores interconnectedness, and addresses cultural influences on self-criticism. The podcast emphasizes the transformational power of self-compassion for personal growth.

May 21, 2024 • 2h
156: Unabridged Interview: Amy-Jill Levine
This is our unabridged episode with Amy-Jill Levine.
What happens when you get a self-dubbed “yankee Jewish feminist” talking about Jesus?
Turns out, you get a fascinating conversation leaving folks of all faiths and worldviews with much to think about.
Amy-Jill Levine is a brilliant professor of New Testament, and, perhaps surprisingly, a practicing Jew. In this episode, she uses her knowledge of Jewish culture to highlight common mis-readings of the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus’s stance on societal and gender norms, and how “Christian fragility” can impede one’s ability to address religious and social questions honestly.
Show Notes:
Similar episodes
Amy-Jill Levine: Jewish, Yankee Feminist, New Testament Professor
John Dear: Taking the Beatitudes Seriously
N.T. Wright and the Bancroft Brothers: Theology and Poetry
Jesuitical: How Young Catholics See the World
Resources mentioned this episode
Sermon on the Mount: A Beginners Guide to the Kingdom of Heaven by Amy-Jill Levine
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes
Transcript for Abridged Episode
JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

May 16, 2024 • 54min
156: Amy-Jill Levine: A Jewish Take on Jesus (Best of NSE)
What happens when you get a self-dubbed “yankee Jewish feminist” talking about Jesus?
Turns out, you get a fascinating conversation leaving folks of all faiths and worldviews with much to think about.
Amy-Jill Levine is a brilliant professor of New Testament, and, perhaps surprisingly, a practicing Jew. In this episode, she uses her knowledge of Jewish culture to highlight common mis-readings of the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus’s stance on societal and gender norms, and how “Christian fragility” can impede one’s ability to address religious and social questions honestly.
Show Notes:
Similar episodes
Amy-Jill Levine: Jewish, Yankee Feminist, New Testament Professor
John Dear: Taking the Beatitudes Seriously
N.T. Wright and the Bancroft Brothers: Theology and Poetry
Jesuitical: How Young Catholics See the World
Resources mentioned this episode
Sermon on the Mount: A Beginners Guide to the Kingdom of Heaven by Amy-Jill Levine
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes
Transcription Link
JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

May 14, 2024 • 52min
155: Unabridged Interview: Angela Williams Gorrell
This is our unabridged interview with Angela Williams Gorrell.
What is joy? Is it equatable with happiness, or pleasure, or both? Is it to be found in a career, or a romantic partner, or a religion? And if we were to manage it, would our lives forever be free from sorrow, pain, and suffering?
In this episode, author and professor Angela Williams Gorrell, who was teaching a class on joy at Yale when she lost three people that she loved in a four-week span, describes her personal experience of finding joy amidst loss.
Show Notes:
Similar episodes
Philip Yancey: Where the Light Fell
Azim Khamisa: Ending Violence Through Forgiveness
Kelly Corrigan: How Vulnerability Leads to Connection
William Paul Young: Author of The Shack
Christian Wiman: The Opposite of Faith is Certainty
Resources mentioned this episode
The Gravity of Joy by Angela Williams Gorrell
The Epidemic of Despair
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes - Angela Williams Gorrell
Link to Transcript for Abridged Episode
JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

May 9, 2024 • 54min
155: Angela Williams Gorrell and Miroslav Volf: On Joy and Sorrow (Best of NSE)
What is joy? Is it equatable with happiness, or pleasure, or both? Is it to be found in a career, or a romantic partner, or a religion? And if we were to manage it, would our lives forever be free from sorrow, pain, and suffering?
In this episode, two guests discuss joy, describing both what it is and, perhaps more importantly, what it is not. Author and professor Angela Williams Gorrell, who was teaching a class on joy at Yale when she lost three people that she loved in a four-week span, describes her personal experience of finding joy amidst loss. And Yale theologian Miroslav Volf, himself no stranger to suffering growing up in a war torn country, explains the connection between joy and sorrow.
Show Notes:
Similar episodes
Philip Yancey: Where the Light Fell
Azim Khamisa: Ending Violence Through Forgiveness
Kelly Corrigan: How Vulnerability Leads to Connection
William Paul Young: Author of The Shack
Christian Wiman: The Opposite of Faith is Certainty
Resources mentioned this episode
The Gravity of Joy by Angela Williams Gorrell
The Epidemic of Despair
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes - Angela Williams Gorrell
Transcription Link
JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

May 7, 2024 • 48min
154: Unabridged Interview: Karen Korematsu
Karen Korematsu, daughter of civil rights activist Fred Korematsu, shares her father's story of defying unjust internment during World War II. They discuss the legacy of Korematsu v. United States, origins of courage, reopening of the Japanese American Incarceration case, and pursuit of social justice. An insightful conversation on historical injustices and the importance of standing up for civil liberties.

May 2, 2024 • 54min
154: Eugene Cho and Karen Korematsu: Asian American History is American History (Best of NSE)
What is it like to be an Asian American?
In light of the beginning of AAPI month, we present a re-airing of our episode from 2021 with Karen Korematsu and Eugene Cho, two Asian-Americans with unique stories of grief and hope.
Karen Korematsu tells the story of her father Fred Korematsu, a famed Japanese-American civil rights activist who refused Franklin Roosevelt’s executive order to report to what FDR himself called “a concentration camp” on American soil shortly after the bombing of Pearl Harbor. Eugene Cho discusses his experiences as a Korean-born American immigrant, and how we might learn to love our neighbors in the face of political polarization and racial discrimination.
Show Notes:
Similar episodes
Eugene Cho: Thou Shalt Not Be a Jerk
Elise Hu: Obsessed with Beauty
Resources mentioned this episode
Thou Shalt Not Be a Jerk by Eugene Cho
The Korematsu Institute
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes - Eugene Cho
PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes - Karen Korematsu
Transcription Link
JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows
Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube
Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy
Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices