Mile High FI Podcast

Hold onto your hats, friends! Things are off the chain this week – not only is this a surprise bonus episode, we are also coming at you with the undisputed king of the FI movement: Mr. Money Mustache. This episode is a recording of a Q&A that took place at The Extraordinary Event  put on by our last guest – Alan Donegan! The Q&A covered a range of topics, but here are a few highlights: When Pete started Mr. Money Mustache, did he expect it would be the phenomenon that it is? Alan, Carl, and Pete discuss what’s next for them Morning routines (or lack thereof) Internal barriers to FI Is the prospect of making money still motivating? How to convince a partner to get on board with FI Surprises about FI life Mr. Money Mustache Headquarters Katie and Alan Donegan’s Many Enterprises: Rebel Finance School Rebel Business School Alan Donegan’s Podcast Alan Donegan’s Blog ____ ★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★ Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

Carl met Alan and Katie Donegan in Ecuador at one of JL Collins’s Chautauquas in 2016. They’ve been friends ever since. In this interview, we discuss: Alan’s childhood struggles How to build confidence Family trauma Rebel Business School Discovering FIRE Real estate Becoming digital nomads The Donegans’ perfect day Meet Alan and Katie  Katie and Alan are an accomplished, fun-loving couple who have taken the world by storm with their radical approach to starting a business. Alan was someone who yearned to start his own business but was vehemently opposed to the idea of taking on debt to do it. Thus, The Rebel Business School was born. Through the courses taught at Rebel Business School, Alan began teaching people how to launch businesses without taking on any debt. To Alan, the phrase “you’ve got to spend money to make money” is sheer bunk. Both his own successful businesses and the many businesses started by students of The Rebel Business School are proof of it. Katie is a former consultant who left behind the corporate world after achieving Financial Independence. She and Alan now work on The Rebel Business School together. They also put out a podcast, write a blog, and run the Rebel Finance School, which helps teach people both the basics and the advanced aspects of attaining financial success. This couple is ambitious about teaching, helping others, and loving life. They are now full-time digital nomads – a feat they managed successfully even during COVID-19! Our Discussion  We kicked things off with something that felt pretty basic – we asked Alan and Katie to introduce themselves. But Alan reminded us that this can actually be quite tricky when you’re “retired” early and can’t simply rattle off your name and a one-word description of what you do all day. We then took a dive into the deep end and talked about overcoming bullies in childhood. Although Katie’s wit and penchant for sports kept her from being bullied, Alan faced some difficult hurdles in his youth – but the wisdom he now takes away from those early challenges is nothing short of inspiring. Alan told us about how he has learned to build confidence over the years and how helpful it is to go into any situation thinking about how things could go right, instead of getting stuck in a negative feedback loop of fearing how things could go wrong. Alan now thinks to himself: “What if I went into this room full of people and found an amazing friend or an exciting new opportunity”? We also went in depth about public speaking. Carl, Doug, and Alan have all had very positive experiences with Toastmasters and view it as an incredibly powerful confidence-building tool. Alan also highly recommends Presentation Zen by Garr Reynolds and Craig Valentine’s 52 Speaking Tips for fine-tuning your presentation and PowerPoint skills. We then talked in depth about the Rebel Business School. Alan is passionate about debunking the myth that starting a business requires debt, and that passion shines through. We discussed some of the success stories from his business and how the school got started. Alan also told us about the power of taking action – right now! He’s seen so many of his students in the school who want results but hesitate in making the critical moves that would get them there. Katie and Alan then told us how they discovered the FIRE movement. Like many people, their introduction came through blogs. But Alan was also inspired by Tony Robbins’ book Notes From a Friend, which set him on a path towards better financial decision-making. After becoming enamored of the concept of financial independence, Katie and Alan began looking at others all around them and wishing they could help them make better financial choices. So they took action! They started the Rebel Finance School to help people get to full financial literacy and hopefully pursue a path towards financial independence themselves. We wrapped things up by going full circle – back to Alan’s story of his childhood bullies. When asked what he’d say to that bully today, Alan had the best possible answer: he’d simply move on. He no longer has any need to impress anyone or live life on anyone’s terms but his and Katie’s. That’s a pretty powerful way to live your life! Alan and Katie were excellent guests, and we highly recommend you check out their courses, their blog, and their podcast! You’ll walk away with an armload of wisdom, and an earful of their delightful English accents! ____ ★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★ Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500 *Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl interview Sarah and Ray, also known as Waffles On Wednesday. They discuss: The $36,000 bar tab Sarah’s Why of FI: Travel Ray’s Why of FI: Options Taking a 6-month trip to see the world Going back to work Meet Ray and Sarah Sarah (an occupational therapist) and Ray (a tech worker) are a travel-loving, beer-loving, fun-loving couple who have visited more than thirty countries and leveraged the power of financial independence to take a six-month sabbatical traveling all over the globe. In addition to their jobs and running the blog Waffles on Wednesday, they are now parents to a baby girl and have chosen to continue working despite the strength of their financial position. Our Discussion with Ray and Sarah  Ray and Sarah started by telling us the story of the $36,000 bar tab. After discovering the concept of FI, Ray started taking a hard look at their spending trends over the last years. In reviewing a previous year’s credit card transactions, he did the math and realized they had spent a whopping $36,000 in a single year at bars. At the time, Ray and Sarah were living in Los Angeles, with a nice apartment that had a view of the beach. And they were going out to eat and drink virtually every night. But seeing the final tally for all that spending was a wake-up call. They moved to a more modest apartment, began learning how to cook better food at home, and cut back on their nights out. But for Sarah, it took some convincing to cut back on spending because she absolutely loves her job and always has. Sarah owns her own occupational therapy business and loves both her work with young children and the feeling of being an entrepreneur. So the concept of cutting back at first seemed like deprivation for no good reason. Ray, meanwhile, needed no convincing as he didn’t love his tech gig and was craving flexibility and more control over his day-to-day life. Instead of butting heads at an impasse, Ray and Sarah talked deeply about what they wanted out of life. Ray found a blog post he thought Sarah might like about how financial independence could lead to a life of full-time travel. And that caught Sarah’s attention. Sarah is a lifelong learner and has always loved getting to experience other cultures, other styles of work and food and dress and communication. So when she realized that saving money meant more travel, she was all in. In other words, Ray and Sarah thought carefully about their “why of FI” and found a common love that motivated them both to work towards a life full of frugality, but also travel and adventure. As a result of their hard work and dedication, Ray and Sarah were able to flex their financial muscles and take a six-month sabbatical to travel the world in 2019. We talked with Ray and Sarah about which countries they visited, heard some fun stories related to their mutual love of beer, and then finally told us about re-entering the world of work after returning home. Ray was offered a job at a prestigious company that he felt he couldn’t turn down. Sarah has continued her occupational therapy work. She has even discovered in a post-COVID world that she can do her therapy remotely, giving her even greater flexibility. We also talked about the COVID-induced dip in the stock market, and how much better off FI folks were in that situation than those who had never focused on saving or frugality. We wrapped things up by discussing Sarah’s business and the couple’s advice for people toying with the idea of working towards FI. Their advice? Do it. Even if you love your job! You might not love your work forever, and even if you do, the flexibility and freedom to be able to step away when or if you want to is priceless. ____ ★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★ Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500 *Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.                

Doug and Carl interview Chris, the “Indiana Jones” of the FI community. Chris worked in the startup world before leaving to pursue a series of bucket-list adventures including: An archeological dig for a dinosaur Diving for treasure in the Florida keys Learning Muay Thai kickboxing Writing a screenplay Recording an album Meet Chris from Life Outside the Maze  The Financial Independence community has been sorely lacking in treasure hunters and archeologists … until now! Chris, who blogs over at lifeoutsidethemaze.com is someone who gives careful thought to what he wants out of life. After working in the start-up world for most of his career, he and his wife had saved up enough to feel comfortable working for happiness instead of financial gain. But since leaving behind formal work, he has been anything but lazy. Chris brainstormed a list of dozens of  goals he wanted to achieve, experiences he wanted to have, and adventures he wanted to challenge himself with. To  create his epic list, Chris looked back to his childhood loves and then far beyond. So far, he has helped uncover one of the world’s most complete torosaurs, found right here in Colorado, dived for sunken treasure, learned Muay Thai kickboxing, written a screenplay, recorded an album, visited dozens of national parks, climbed Long’s Peak in Rocky Mountain National Park, and he’s done it all while raising two boys. Chris is truly someone to look to for inspiration if you are struggling with boredom in a post-FI life or if you wonder how you’ll fill your days once you do hit FI. Our Discussion with Chris  We had so much to cover with Chris, but we were able to discuss a few of his fascinating adventures in our short time. Chris told us his origin story and how he first began to think seriously about fulfillment when a successful venture capitalist (with a net worth of roughly half a billion dollars) warned Chris that he’d be no happier once he became truly rich. This comment made Chris question his path forward in life, and he and his wife began rethinking their focus and saving. Chris also told us that the first time he walked away from life, he struggled with boredom and depression and eventually went back to work. When Chris felt ready to walk away a second time, he did so with a plan. He created a structure for himself and made a list of adventures and goals he wanted to tackle in life. We delved into the psychology of leaving work behind and how boredom can actually create space for creativity. We then waded into the specifics of Chris’s “bucket list” – a term he uses with hesitation. Chris thinks of it as a life list – things he wants to challenge himself with and enjoy along the way and not something to be mindlessly checked off as we near the end of our time on Earth. But whatever the name for it, Chris’s list of dreams he hopes to achieve (and has already achieved) is nothing short of inspiring. He talked to us about how he became an amateur archeologist, how he got connected with a treasure-diving enterprise, gave us the goods on the coming-of-age story screenplay he’s been working on, talked about his life-long love of music and the album he’s been creating, and his many outdoor adventures. Chris also told us about how he became connected to the FI community and his investing strategy. We also talked about the teaching and mentoring Chris has done, and wrapped things up with a brief discussion of home-brewing. We hope you enjoy hearing about Chris’s many adventures and that it inspires you to make your own list of dreams and get started living them! ____ ★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★ Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500 *Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl interview Kristen Rainey. Kristen is an amazing human who graduated from Princeton, taught in Indonesia, hiked the Appalachian Trail, worked at Google, and so much more. In this episode, Kristen discusses: Spending a week cut off from technology in Katmai National Park Grizzly bears! Holding individual stocks Moving to Bozeman Montana Implementing effective behavioral change while working at Google and beyond Intermittent fasting Enhancing your life through travel Happiness → Check for Northstar Sleep School spots in Sept 2021. Meet Kristen Rainey  We’d have to write a novel to even scratch the surface of Kristen Rainey’s life. She is accomplished, well-read, well-studied, well-traveled, and so much more. She attended Princeton University, where she received a bachelor’s degree in art and archeology, and later Cornell, where she obtained an MBA in Management, and finally Tufts University, where she studied International Business and the Global Food Sector. She has held a high-powered corporate position at Google in the food sector, where she put her skills to work helping Google employees make smarter food choices, among many other responsibilities. On top of all that, she’s an entrepreneur. She’s started her own business related to food sustainability and is currently the founder and CEO of Northstar Sleep School, which helps people live better and healthier lives by improving the qualify of their sleep. She hosts the podcast Northstar Unplugged, and blogs about all things sleep-related, as well. Impressed yet? We haven’t even begun to scratch the surface! Kristen is also quite the world-traveler, and has lived in more than a dozen places, including Indonesia, Paris, Milan, Sri Lanka, Thailand, Morocco, Santa Fe, New York, Lake Tahoe, Bozeman, Portland, White Salmon, and Mexico. She speaks multiple languages and is also an avid skate skier, paddle-boarder, hiker, and swimmer, to name just a few of her athletic pursuits. And did we mention that she’s thru-hiked the Appalachian Trail? No big deal. Just an epic backpacking trip of roughly 2,200 continuous miles. If there’s something Kristen hasn’t done or can’t do, we’ve yet to discover it. Our Discussion with Kristen Having someone with this many interests, passions, and accomplishments on the show is a challenge because there are so many things to cover in so little time! But here are a few topics we managed to squeeze in. Kristen’s Recent Backpacking Trip in Alaska and the Power of Unplugging  We began by discussing her recent 8-day backpacking trip in Alaska. (Be sure to check out the grizzly bear cam of the bears in Brooks Falls, where Kristen went.) Kristen told us about the awesome experience of seeing 47 grizzly bears (47!) chowing down on salmon. We also explored the power of unplugging completely for 8 days straight and discussed generally the importance of unplugging regularly, even when you’re not out in the wilderness. Financial Independence,  Stock Picking (gasp!), and AirBnB Hosting  We then moved on to financial independence and Kristen’s choice to be (mostly) a stock picker rather than an index-fund disciple. She told us about how she has tried to balance accomplishment with happiness in her life. As you can tell from her resumé, she has erred on the side of accomplishment and has trouble making time to truly relax. She talks about her experience hosting AirBnBs and how it can be downright frantic sometimes. She also discusses what life is like in Bozeman, Montana and how she ended up choosing to live there (out of the many places she’s visited and considered living). Habit Changes and Intermittent Fasting Kristen offered us some insight into what she learned at Google about how to help people change their food habits. Even just making the “bad stuff” a little harder to get to can have a huge effect. We also discussed intermittent fasting and the health benefits it can have beyond just burning fat. And we explored tips for those interested in intermittent fasting who have yet to give it a try. Traveling and the Struggle to Choose from the Buffet of Life Kristen examines how her travels have shaped her. She tells us how, through travel, she has become more open-minded and appreciative of other cultures and experiences, how thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail taught her the value of traveling light, and how she got to know herself better through travel and learn that she truly values down time to recharge on her own. We also delved into the difficulty of saying no and how to choose from the many options life has to offer. Kristen recommends the book Essentialism: The Disciplined Pursuit of Less by Greg McKeown. We loved chatting with Kristen and hope you enjoy listening, as well. And when you head over to check out Kristen’s website, make sure to give a listen to Kristen’s interview of Carl on her podcast! ____ ★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★ Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500 *Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl discuss hiking, guitars, and upcoming conferences they’ll be attending including FInCon and EconoMe. They also discuss their recent adventures at Camp FI. Then it’s time to answer some questions (and respond to hate mail) from the listeners. Topics covered include: What phone apps do you like? What are your favorite podcasts? Where does your money go after you die? Do you include your home in your 4% Rule calculations? How does inflation affect the 4% rule? When withdrawing money from your investment portfolio in retirement, should you take a year’s worth of expenses out at a time? Or is it smarter to take it in smaller chunks? And much more! Links: Lex Fridman: Lex Fridman Podcast – Lex Fridman Tim Ferris (Rolf Potts): Rolf Potts on Travel Tactics, Creating Time Wealth, and Lateral Thinking (#41 & #42) Tim Ferris (Arnold Schwarzenegger): Tim Ferriss Interviews Arnold Schwarzenegger on Psychological Warfare (And Much More) (#60) Huberman Lab: https://hubermanlab.com/ Tropical MBA: The Podcast for Location Independent Entrepreneurs FinCon: finconexpo.com EconoMe Conference: economeconference.com (discount code below) ____ ★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★ Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500 *Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Meet M.K. Williams In Episode 17 of the Mile High FI Podcast, Doug and Carl talk to M.K. Williams, who is both an accomplished author herself and a coach who works with other authors to help them launch their books out into the world. She has her own YouTube channel and her own website, both dedicated to teaching authors about the nitty gritty details of what to do after finishing a book (and some motivating tips to actually finish that book in the first place!). She covers everything from how to self publish, how to market, how to narrate your own audiobook, and what tools work well for authors. Her sites are truly a treasure trove for you if you’re already an author or have ambitions to one day put fingers to keys and write your own book! She also discusses how to run your own side hustle. M.K. actually had hers in progress before she pulled away from her corporate career. She left her corporate job on a Friday, and began diligently pursuing her passion projects full-time the next Monday! M.K.’s Passion for FI  Did we mention that M.K. and her husband are also financially independent? M.K. has been part of the FI community for nearly eight years, and she has lots of insight into how to reach the promised land of financial independence. She also talks about what her own Post-FI life looks like, and why for so many of us, FI doesn’t mean leaving work behind altogether but on finding work you’re passionate about and would do for free. We discuss the “Internet Retirement Police” and why, for M.K. she just doesn’t care what anyone else thinks – she and her family are living their best life, and for them, that means continuing to pursue passion projects (which actually make money!) and even traditional work for her husband, because he genuinely loves his job. M.K. also discusses her love for FI, but also notes how she has moved away from completely associating her identity with it. After automating their finances and hitting their FI number, they no longer have to dedicate as much mental bandwidth to money. They are free to refocus that energy into other interests and dreams. Balancing it All With a Baby Girl M.K. and her husband have a baby girl (almost eight months old now) and she talks about the balance of raising an infant while still writing her own books and building her online business that focuses on helping other authors succeed. We delved deep into the power of FI and not having to get up and go to the office daily when you have a little one who needs you basically every minute that she’s not asleep. We wrap things up by discussing whether financial independence has improved M.K.’s overall happiness and whether FI is achievable for anyone. Hope you enjoy this episode and be sure to check out all of M.K.’s great resources for writers! ____ ____ ★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★ Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500 *Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl interview Stephen Baughier, the creator of Camp FI. They discuss: The creation of Camp FI The importance of community Future Camp FIs   Camp FI – Highly recommended! Go if you can…   Join the Mile High FI Club – It’s our email list! ★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★ Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500 *Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl host a panel of three guests and answer audience questions at Camp FI Rocky Mountain. Also on the stage are Lynn (FI Healthcare), Ray (Waffles On Wednesday), and Josh. Lynn talks about financially taking care of relatives Ray goes down a rabbit hole talking about rabbit holes The pros and cons of two-ply toilet paper Carl learns a new word: “manscaping” And much, much more. Links: Camp FI – Highly recommended! Go if you can… FI Healthcare – Lynn’s Site about Health Care options Waffles on Wednesday – Ray’s Blog Join the Mile High FI Club – It’s our email list! ★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★ Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500 *Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.  

Doug and Carl interview Diania Merriam, creator of the EconoMe conference. Diania discusses: Discovering Mr. Money Mustache and getting out of $30,000 in debt Using creativity to adopt a frugal lifestyle Lessons learned (and not learned!) while hiking the El Camino Trail How financial independence allowed her to leave a toxic situation The merits of quitting work even before you’re done saving The real purpose of setting goals The EconoMe conference Links: EconoMe Conference 2021 – Save with Code “1500” *Affiliate Link so I earn a commission if you use the code. Thank you! Optimal Finance Daily The Miracle Morning Tim Urban: Taming the Mammoth Mr Money Mustache: News Flash: Your Debt is an Emergency!! ★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★ Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500 *Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.