Martin Shaw, who experienced a visionary journey to Christianity, discusses the reviving interest in Christianity, reconnecting with myths and fairytales, being in the world but not of it, and the importance of stories. He also touches on the new course 'The Skin-Boat and the Star' and the allure of Christ in today's world.

The makers of Seaspiracy and Cowspiracy are back. Christspiracy is another profoundly disturbing film detailing the industrial abuse of our animal kin. Expect more horrific carelessness and exploitation on a mass scale. Only this time, Kip Andersen and Kameron Waters not only go global but look back in time. “This is plausibly the most significant new discovery about Jesus Christ, in the last 2,000 years,” says the blurb.But can that be right? Has justified outrage at the treatment of our fellow creatures got the better of them? Initially, I wasn't convinced. But then Kameron Waters reached out to me and we had this long conversation.See what you think. [Spoiler alert - we thoroughly discuss the Christian details in the film.]For more on Christspiracy see https://www.christspiracy.comFor more on Mark, and his work on early Christianity and Jesus via the ideas of Owen Barfield, friend of CS Lewis, see http://www.markvernon.com/consciousness00:00 Introduction02:20 Where to see the documentary and how04:33 The treatment of animals as a religious concern12:26 The prehistory of hunting, sacrifice and temples21:15 What did Jesus do when cleansing of the temple?34:10 What was the cause of Jesus’s death?44:38 Jesus of Nazareth or Jesus the vegetarian Nazarene?58:37 Kameron’s own Christian journey01:05:42 But did Jesus really not eat fish?01:13:40 Ichthus, Pythagoreans and the 153 fish01:24:00 What did Paul mean by vegetarians are weak?01:31:05 Engaging with the film, engaging with the tradition

Energy is a key organising principle in modern science, the conversation of energy being a grounding and universal law. But what is energy? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon examine the history of the idea and the word. In science, energy is a relatively recently notion, emerging in its current form in the 19th century, drawing much on mechanics. The word itself was coined by Aristotle, in the 4th century BCE, carrying a sense of vital actuality and living presence. That meaning is still remembered in Orthodox theology, which describes the energeia of God. The conversation ranges over the promiscuity of energy in the natural world to the spiritual notion of energy, including the subtle energies of the body. The implications of shaping the idea of energy through mechanical metaphors also has important ramifications, from the descriptions of economics and the efficacy of psychology to the experience of God. Further, the most recent physics argues that energy is not conserved after all as the universe expands.For more conversations between Rupert and Mark see:https://www.sheldrake.org/audios/sheldrake-vernon-dialogueshttp://www.markvernon.com/talks

I talk again with Landon Loftin and Max Leyf about the genius insight of Owen Barfield.The Riddle of the Sphinx (Barfield Press) is a new collection of talks and essays about the great friend of CS Lewis and JRR Tolkien.We discuss Barfield's take on analysis and analogy, Darwinian and other kinds of evolution, the significance of Rudolf Stein, and Barfield's notion of final participation.Landon and Max are the authors of What Barfield Thought.For more on my books, including A Secret History of Christianity, see www.markvernon.com0:00 The new book of talks and essays02:08 Plato, Aristotle and the evolution of analogy and analysis 13:31 Participation and the limits of modern science23:30 Barfield's critique of Darwinian evolution33:47 When the mind changes, the world changes38:03 Evolution as a moving image of eternity42:51 How can we participate in evolution?52:18 Barfield and the significance of Rudolf Steiner01:03:45 Grappling with the esoteric01:10:14 On the way to final participation01:17:16 Barfield on the meaning and revelation

How can Christianity address the climate crisis? Isn’t the objectifying of nature and the drive to improve our lot a secular legacy of Christendom? And isn’t individual conversion more or less irrelevant in a time of systemic crisis?I was delighted to be sent an essay by Gunnar Gjermundsen that asks these questions and more. His insights are wide-ranging, integrating, inspiring and challenging, focusing on a Christianity that is not so much moral as transformative, inviting us to consider again the sayings of Jesus, via theologians such as Maximus the Confessor and psychotherapists like Donald Winnicott.In this discussion we unpack his argument in broadly three moves.First, an analysis of current anxieties that, at heart, are to do with time. A linear view of history has fostered a hope of panicky escape, sacrificing the present for the future as a false substitute for eternity, with devastating consequences for ourselves and the world around us. The problem needs to be addressed at root, which comes in a second section exploring the misunderstanding of eschatology as an event to come and be feared, rather than an unfolding now, to be welcomed. We explore Jesus’s teaching as well as how it came to be so profoundly misunderstood.The third section draws in psychological insights, particularly in terms of considering the schizoid, addictive and dread-filled nature of the modern psyche, and turns again to the Christian tradition and the remarkable notion of the kingdom of God that is near, and being born again.The apocalyptical has become a master metaphor for the contemporary imagination, inducing fatalism and denial. Christianity has a vision to undo this terror via the transformation of our consciousness and experience of time. The apocalyptic is not to come but is an unveiling in every moment, a theosis, of the eternal present.And we can live by that alternative.The essay we are discussing is Living on This Earth as in Heaven: Time and the Ecological Conversion of Eschatology, published in Modern Theology, online - https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/moth.12930Gunnar Gjermundsen works in the Faculty of Theology, University of Oslo - https://www.tf.uio.no/english/people/aca/gunnargj/For more on Mark Vernon’s work, see http://www.markvernon.com

Western liturgies are obsessed with sin. "There is no health in us", or words to that effect, begin and end most services, particularly in Lent.Jesus's wilderness experience was actually about something else - practicing paradise, to use to the phrase of Douglas Christie.It's a time to reorientate attention, not wallow in guilt and re-embed shame. The kingdom is near. Eyes that see, ears that hear, can awaken.

Isaac Newton is best known for his theory of gravity. And yet, the great scientist also insisted: "ye cause of gravity is what I do not pretend to know.” In other words, notions like gravity, and force in general, are deeply mysterious phenomena. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask just what gravity might be. The conversation begins with a feature of gravity that is typically overlooked by physicists, namely that gravity has a speed which is far faster than the speed of light. They consider how gravity might be linked to the notion of levity, a link that can be renewed again. Newton himself was inclined to regard gravity as the divine will in the cosmos and was also influenced by the belief in daemons, particularly the entity called Eros or love. These are go-betweens in the universe, in the case of Eros, attracting all things and securing the many as a whole. Panpsychism and final causes are other themes that arise. Contemplating the mysteries of modern science, often hidden in plain sight, leads naturally to deeply meaningful considerations about the nature of the world in which we live.The paper Rupert mentioned, The Speed of Gravity, can be found here - https://www.intalek.com/Index/Projects/Research/TheSpeedofGravity-WhattheExperimentsSay.htmFor more conversations between us seehttps://www.sheldrake.org/audios/sheldrake-vernon-dialogueshttp://www.markvernon.com/talks

The rituals around death and dying are changing in the UK and across the developed world. Medical care advances, which is for the good, though can mean to a loss of other kinds of wisdom about this facet of life. People’s beliefs and convictions about death are also in a state of flux.The think tank, Theos, has extensively researched this changing landscape, so I was very glad to speak with Madeleine Pennington from Theos about their discoveries, particularly from the perspective of design. This conversation is one of several I am having looking at how designers can foster love in human affairs, personal and social.We discussed the turning away from the ritualisation of death and its effects, the power of rituals to raise aspects of human experience to awareness, and how the grieving process and holding periods of silence can be aided by design.For more on the work of Theos see - https://www.theosthinktank.co.uk Madeleine Pennington has written here too - https://www.theosthinktank.co.uk/research/2023/11/27/love-grief-and-hope-emotional-responses-to-death-and-dying-in-the-uk

A conversation with actor, Jamie Robson, whom I met through the work of Rupert Spira.00:00 Meeting through Rupert Spira03:26 Nondualism and Christian mysticism06:02 Nondualism and acting15:00 Being and doing19:40 Detachment and Meister Eckhart26:48 Two modes of perception in Iain McGilchrist and others32:43 Double vision and a re-enchanted world37:30 UFOs and levitation as cases49:45 Everyday re-enchantment52:07 British Weird Wave film59:33 Cultural shifts?

Born in Nigeria and raised in the UK since the age of 4, Chine McDonald is well placed to explore love in different cultural contexts, and what happens when differences meet.We talked about how differences show up particularly in relation to the practicalities of loving, from house design to how people talk at funerals, as well as wider questions such as images of God and the critiquing and idealising of different traditions.Our conversation is one of many I'm conducting as part of a project looking at how love can be fostered by design, funded by the Fetzer Institute.Chine is Director of the think tank Theos, having previously worked at Christian Aid and as a journalist. She is the author of God is Not a White Man: and other revelations, and regularly contributes to programmes on the radio. She studied Theology and Religious Studies at Cambridge University. For more on Chine - https://www.chinemcdonald.com/For more on Mark - https://www.markvernon.com/