
Inner Life, Talks and Thoughts
Reflections from Mark Vernon on soulful matters including spirituality and psychotherapy, science and religion, consciousness and the divine. For more on see www.markvernon.com
Latest episodes

Apr 21, 2022 • 40min
The Evolution of Religion - our shared sacred story. Interview with Robin Dunbar
The scientific study of religion has produced numerous accounts for the evolutionary origins of a sense of the numinous in Homo sapiens. Robin Dunbar, Professor of Evolutionary Psychology at Oxford, is in the vanguard of plausible theories, not least as explored in his new book, How Religion Evolved and Why It Endures.In this interview, for the Church Times podcast, we explore his ideas and their ramifications:- how the religiosity of Homo sapiens exceeds others Homo species- how mystical experience is the "motor" of religious forms- the role of religion in the emergence of complex societies - why cults exist and the links between religion and violence- how religious diversity offers a shared sacred story for humanity.An audio version of the conversation is online at https://www.churchtimes.co.uk/articles/2022/22-april/audio-video/podcast/robin-dunbar-in-conversation-with-mark-vernon.My essay on trance states and the origins of religions is published by Aeon, at https://aeon.co/essays/how-trance-states-forged-human-society-through-transcendence

4 snips
Apr 15, 2022 • 1h 12min
The Attack On Life and Understanding Our Times. A conversation with Iain McGilchrist and Mark Vernon
Iain McGilchrist and Mark Vernon discuss the impact of overweening bureaucracy and technologies of control on modern society. They explore the legacy of the Covid pandemic, the story modern humanity tells about itself, and fundamental matters like the reality of evil and the meaning of death. The conversation encourages a deeper awareness of nature, the sacred, and life in order to respond more imaginatively to our times.

Apr 11, 2022 • 8min
How meaning might be found in suffering
Each week, on Thursdays, we meet for Idler Drinks online, at which I give a short talk.We're not meeting over Easter, so this is an extra, reflecting on the Isenheim Altarpiece and the extraordinarily moving experience of Marian Partington, to ask how pain might be born when so much of it surrounds us.A written version of the reflection is online here - https://www.idler.co.uk/article/mark-vernons-thought-of-the-week/.

Apr 10, 2022 • 35min
Easter according to William Blake. Resurrection is neither miracle nor mystery
Is the resurrection a miracle? Are the events of Golgotha a mystery? And what of the resurrection of the body and attempts to prove what happened as an historical fact?William Blake argued passionately that treating Easter as a miracle or a mystery entirely misses its significance, which is visionary - a moment when perceptions are cleansed and eternal life becomes manifest.In this talk, I examine his images of the resurrection and crucifixion to see how he saw them as one moment of transformation, then and now.I look particularly at his portrayal of Mary Magdalene and how he realised she participated in resurrection life through her encounter with Jesus.Blake's communication of Easter joy is contagious. He presents us with the end of a golden string, never more needed than now. He desires that all might come to know that "God becomes as we are that we may become as he is."

Mar 30, 2022 • 56min
Mysticism in Christianity - a conversation with James Cooke & Mark Vernon
This conversation is part of the Living Mirrors podcast, hosted by neuroscientist James Cooke, exploring topics like consciousness, science, spirituality, meditation and the renaissance in psychedelic research.

Mar 16, 2022 • 25min
From Trance to Extraterrestrials: Developments in Human Evolution, Robin Dunbar, Simon Conway Morris
A discussion of two new books on human evolution by leading evolutionary biologists, Robin Dunbar and Simon Conway Morris.Dunbar offers a revisionary account of the emergence of religion in Homo sapiens. Conway Morris considers widespread myths in Darwinian evolution, of which he is a leading researcher and advocate.Put together, the books suggest a fascinating glimpse into not only the religious past of humans but the religious future. The trance and mystical states which so captivated our ancestors may transhumanise us again, offering new ways of navigating the cosmos.I wrote an essay for Aeon drawing on Dunbar's ideas here - https://aeon.co/essays/how-trance-states-forged-human-society-through-transcendenceI wrote an essay for Aeon drawing on Conway Morris' ideas here - https://aeon.co/essays/words-have-soul-on-the-romantic-theory-of-language-originA YouTube on the evolution of Homo spiritualis is here - https://youtu.be/0XUWYn8SyT8Details of Robin Dunbar's book are here - https://www.penguin.co.uk/books/316/316135/how-religion-evolved/9780241431788.htmlDetails of Simon Conway Morris' book are here - https://templetonpress.org/books/from-extraterrestrials-to-animal-minds/

Mar 12, 2022 • 34min
William Blake, Albion and War in Europe
I turned to William Blake seeking hope and found a remarkably accurate account of our times and his, lived during the Napoleonic Wars. Albion despairs, but Blake does not. He sees a pathway, denying nothing, towards renewed inspiration.

Mar 11, 2022 • 4min
The spiritual journey of individuals and humanity Pt 2
The second part of my conversation with Jonas Atlas, host of Revisioning Religion about spiritual development. Mark Vernon's latest book takes a deep dive into Dante's Divine Comedy, a classic masterpiece, which, after many centuries, still provides many helpful insights for those who find themselves on a spiritual journey. We place Dante's work in a longer lineage that can be traced to the philosophers of Ancient Greece. Often, those philosophers are presented as purely 'rational' thinkers who's thinking was repressed by early Christianity because it would conflict with a religious outlook on life. Yet, the historical facts paint a different picture. The ideas of the Greek philosophers were not merely precursors of modern science, but were fully embedded in a general search for spiritual development. Even more so, according to Mark, their personal spiritual journeys were connected to larger spiritual developments of human consciousness, in which the emergence of Christianity also played an important role. This leads us to discuss whether or not the spiritual journey of humankind can truly be seen as a form of 'progression', and how Mark assesses contemporary "New Age" ideas about the spiritual growth of humanity.

Mar 10, 2022 • 1h 20min
The spiritual journey of individuals and humanity
A conversation with Jonas Atlas, host of Revisioning Religion about spiritual development. Mark Vernon's latest book takes a deep dive into Dante's Divine Comedy, a classic masterpiece, which, after many centuries, still provides many helpful insights for those who find themselves on a spiritual journey. We place Dante's work in a longer lineage that can be traced to the philosophers of Ancient Greece. Often, those philosophers are presented as purely 'rational' thinkers who's thinking was repressed by early Christianity because it would conflict with a religious outlook on life. Yet, the historical facts paint a different picture. The ideas of the Greek philosophers were not merely precursors of modern science, but were fully embedded in a general search for spiritual development. Even more so, according to Mark, their personal spiritual journeys were connected to larger spiritual developments of human consciousness, in which the emergence of Christianity also played an important role. This leads us to discuss whether or not the spiritual journey of humankind can truly be seen as a form of 'progression', and how Mark assesses contemporary "New Age" ideas about the spiritual growth of humanity.

Mar 4, 2022 • 10min
Spiritual freedom and the light in Ukraine
Witnessing so many Ukrainians responding courageously to the Russian invasion is moving and impressive. There is violence and suffering and death. And yet, in the midst of the undoubted tragedy, there can be detected the distinct presence of hope. Points of light outshine the darkness. What is the source of this faith and powerful resilience?I think it must be the deepest type of liberty, to align yourself with what is good, beautiful and true - a freedom that cannot be taken away from you. It is the freedom of Jesus before the Grand Inquisitor, the freedom of Socrates drinking the hemlock. It is the gateway to the divine within us.It's a fearsome freedom, frightening and awesome. It's the source of the light that can be detected in the darkness descended on Ukraine.