Daniel Faber, CEO of Orbit Fab, discusses in-space refueling infrastructure, the economics of fuel depots, viability of asteroid mining, contracting with the DoD, partnership with Astroscale, competition in the satellite servicing industry, and fundraising challenges in the space economy.

In the final Pathfinder episode of the year, Mo brings Payload’s editorial staff into the hot seat(s) to discuss the most significant stories of 2023 and share predictions for 2024!In addition to each team member’s trajectory to Payload, we discuss:The shortage in launch supplyStarship and the mainstream media’s reactionThe Chandrayaan-3 lunar landing (and other Moon-related news)The state of space companies in public marketsOrbital debris and the evolution of policyThe evolution of DoD vs NASA budgetsAnd much more…This episode is brought to you by SpiderOak, a US-based software company that builds space cybersecurity products and solutions for civilian, military, and commercial space operations. Learn more at https://spideroak.com/• Chapters •00:00 - Intro & SpiderOak Ad01:31 - Rachael + Payload04:24 - Jacqueline + Payload05:56 - Jack + Payload09:19 - Jack's Top Story of the Year10:29 - Jacqueline's Top Story of the Year13:28 - Rachael's Top Story of the Year15:01 - Why is it still so hard on the Moon?17:42 - The launch shortage22:21 - Media coverage around Starship29:30 - Is the market spot on with Where Space Companies Should Be Trading?32:20 - Jack's analysis on companies' cash flow34:00 - SpiderOak Ad Break34:47 - Jacqueline's policy stories38:07 - Orbital debris40:56 - Space tugging and de-orbiting market44:14 - The Kessler Syndrome46:35 - Why does the Space Force have a bigger budget than NASA?50:01 - Jacqueline's predictions52:11 - Why Jacqueline believes 2024 is the year for debris53:13 - Rachael's predictions54:46 - Timing of the first commercial Moon landing55:48 - Moon vs Mars58:03 - Jack's predictions59:29 - ULA buyers01:01:58 - Jack's favorite space TV show/book01:03:01 - Rachael's favorite space TV show/book01:03:29 - Jacqueline's favorite space TV show/book• Show notes •Jacqueline's socials — https://twitter.com/jacqfeldscherRachael's socials — https://twitter.com/RachaelZiskJack's socials — https://twitter.com/JackKuhrPayload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspacePathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes• About us •Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers.Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)

Every quarter, Lux Capital, a leading venture capital firm known for investing in hard science and deep tech startups, publishes their investor letter offering a unique opportunity to gain insight into the firm's investment thesis and strategy. The firm has been an early supporter of the space industry with early bets in companies like Relativity Space, Epsilon3, Impulse Space, Astranis, Kymeta, Varda, Planet, and Hadrian.This week’s Pathfinder features a deep dive on the firm’s latest Q3 letter with General Partner Shahin Farshchi. In addition to Shahin’s own background, the conversation covers:Lux’s fundraise success having recently closed Lux 8, a $1.15B venture fundThe firm’s investment thesis emphasizing the importance of non-consensus hypothesesGeopolitical shifts and how they’re impacting long-term investingThe role of media and the importance of informative and nuanced reportingAnd much more…Lux's Q3 Investor Letter: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1s5xiwjG9psi6xRQPsAcI-I7-g6k5Pe--/viewThis episode is brought to you by SpiderOak, a US-based software company that builds space cybersecurity products and solutions for civilian, military, and commercial space operations. Learn more at https://spideroak.com/ • Chapters •00:00 - Guest Intro & SpiderOak Ad01:18 - The Lux 8 fundraise02:33 - Shahin's background06:38 - How was Lux started10:10 - The firm’s structure11:48 - A&D over the next decade15:30 - Investment highlights17:35 - Geopolitical shifts19:57 - A look at American Dynamism23:41 - Do you need to be a scientist to be a deep tech investor?27:03 - A thesis-driven strategy33:05 - Advice for emerging managers39:11 - The role of media42:33 - Starship launch predictions43:17 - The second most valuable space company • Show notes •Lux's website — https://www.luxcapital.com/Lux's socials — https://twitter.com/Lux_CapitalShahin's socials — https://twitter.com/FarshchiMo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislamPayload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspacePathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes • About us •Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers.Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)

Modern engineering teams need to look radically different, at least according to Pari Singh, Founder and CEO of Flow Engineering. Flow, a London and LA-based startup, aims to overhaul traditional engineering approaches with its collaboration platform, specifically tailored for 'new age' hardware teams.Flow provides a collaborative platform for hardware and software teams, streamlining requirements management, integrating with key design tools, and offering advanced visualization for efficient design and compliance.Mo and Pari’s conversations covers a wide array of topics, including:The Flow origin storyThe stagnation of hardware innovationHow systems engineering has evolvedThe ideal modern engineering teamBuilding in LondonAnd much more…This episode is brought to you by SpiderOak, a US-based software company that builds space cybersecurity products and solutions for civilian, military, and commercial space operations. Learn more at https://spideroak.com/ • Chapters •00:00 - Intro & SpiderOak ad01:11 - Flow: from rockets to software06:48 - Was the intention always software?08:12 - Hardware innovation stagnation09:32 - Flow's products today10:32 - New engineering management tools12:38 - Scaling space companies13:55 - Flow's business model14:39 - Other markets Flow is targeting15:40 - The go-to market strategy16:45 - How do you convince clients to adopt a new engineering process?19:29 - Flow's philosophy22:30 - SpiderOak ad break23:14 - Who makes up Flow's customer base?24:06 - The ideal Flow customer25:32 - How has systems engineering changed since the Apollo era?28:48 - What does a modern engineering team look like?33:12 - Will specialization create big enough markets?35:44 - Flow's financing round37:10 - Finance landscape for software companies building for hardware39:15 - What's it like building a team in London?39:58 - What does the world look like if every company is using Flow?42:10 - If Pari wasn't building Flow, what would he be building?42:55 - Companies that excite Pari44:20 - What London football team does Pari support? • Show notes •Flow's website — https://flowengineering.com/Flow's socials — https://twitter.com/flow_engineerPari's socials — https://twitter.com/paritheengineerMo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislamPayload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspacePathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes • About us •Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers.Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)

The US manufacturing industry needs a major overhaul and companies like Machina Labs are helping drive that change. Today’s Pathfinder episode features Ed Mehr, cofounder and CEO of Machina Labs, a startup integrating the latest advancements in robotics and AI to construct next-generation factories. Mehr's prior experience at Relativity includes overseeing the development of Stargate, which was the world’s largest 3D printer at the time.Machina is focused on creating flexible manufacturing systems, where design and material changes can be made seamlessly without the need for extensive hardware alterations. This flexibility is primarily enabled by advanced robotics and AI, encapsulating Mehr's vision of an agile, responsive manufacturing environment. Machina’s flagship product, the "Robotic Craftsman," epitomizes this concept, combining the dexterity of human craftsmen with sophisticated machine learning algorithms.The conversation today delves into the challenges of traditional manufacturing and explores the impact of Machina’s innovations on the space industry. In addition, Ed and Mo discuss:Machina’s origin storyThe state of the US manufacturing industryCommon startup mistakes when building factoriesElon’s manufacturing algorithmAnd much more…This episode is brought to you by SpiderOak, a US-based software company that builds space cybersecurity products and solutions for civilian, military, and commercial space operations. Learn more at https://spideroak.com/• Chapters •00:00 - Intro & SpiderOak Ad 02:02 - What is Machina Labs? 03:07 - The Falcon 9 issue 05:26 - Key product offerings 08:05 - Origin of roboforming 09:16 - Machina’s roboforming 14:24 - Importance of manufacturing in the US 18:06 - Keynote of the business 20:10 - Industries of focus 24:57 - The business model 28:28 - SpiderOak Ad Break 29:15 - Measuring the market size 31:44 - The Machina team 33:12 - Partnership with Nvidia 34:49 - Common manufacturing mistakes 37:48 - Machina’s competition 41:23 - Machina Labs's place in the market 20 years from now 44:02 - Evolution of aerospace manufacturing in the next decade 45:37 - Favorite new manufacturing technologies• Show notes •Machina Lab's website — https://machinalabs.ai/ Machina Lab's socials — https://twitter.com/MachinaLabs_ Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes• About us •Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers.Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)

Hélène Huby, Europe's first privately funded cargo and crew capsule; Nyx vs. Starliner vs. Crew Dragon; Design challenges shifting from cargo to human; The business model; Building and R&D for a space station with and without government aid; The future of space stations and the role of commercial players.

Relativity Space CEO Tim Ellis knows what went wrong during Terran 1’s first flight—and he shared with Payload why he is confident the same thing won’t happen to the startup’s Terran R rocket.What’s next: After the March flight, Relativity announced that it was scrapping Terran 1 development to focus solely on its larger Terran R vehicle.Ellis emphasized that this shift is not merely about scaling size, but also better aligning with market demands ($1.8B Terran R pipeline) and the broader vision of the company.Overall R&D costs should be in the ballpark of ~$1B, Ellis estimated, adding that it is designed to be reusable from the start and carry 23,500 kg to LEO.Brand awareness: In an industry dealing with expensive, long-term projects (i.e., space), it's crucial to inspire and motivate people by focusing on high-effort, creative presentations, Ellis said. The aim is to make Relativity not just a rocket company but a brand that resonates with a broader audience. And music—particularly electronic music—plays a role in the brand's energy, reflecting Ellis's personal tastes.Listen to Pathfinder #0071 for more on Relativity’s future on Mars, whether there’s a rocket larger than Terran R in Relativity’s future, the long-term strategy for 3D printing, and much more.This episode is brought to you by SpiderOak, a US-based software company that builds space cybersecurity products and solutions for civilian, military, and commercial space operations. Learn more at https://spideroak.com/• Chapters •00:00 - Intro & SpiderOak Ad01:09 - The night of the Terran 1 launch05:11 - What went wrong?10:11 - Why not launch Terran 1 again?15:18 - Are investors okay pushing out an orbital proof point?20:38 - Terran R tech specs29:05 - SpiderOak Ad break29:52 - Milestones for Terran R34:31 - Terran R's manufacturing cadence at scale37:46 - Terran R R&D costs (vs Falcon 9)46:13 - 3D printing the Terran R51:34 - The future of 3D printing58:32 - Relativity's marketing strategy01:09:53 - Heavier than Terran R01:14:48 - Relativity & Mars01:15:22 - Tim's favorite musical artists• Show notes •Relativity's website — https://www.relativityspace.com/Relativity's socials — https://twitter.com/relativityspaceTim's socials — https://twitter.com/thetimellisMo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislamPayload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspacePathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes• About us •Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers.Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)

ABL Space is heading back to the pad after a power failure prevented its maiden launch attempt from reaching orbit last January. The company, known for its innovative approach to ground infrastructure by containerizing its launch system, aims to launch its RS1 rocket by the year's end.This week's Pathfinder podcast features Dan Piemont, the cofounder, President, and CFO of the LA-based launch startup. Mo and Dan delve into the lessons learned from the company's initial launch attempt and the improvements made to the RS1 and GS0 ground system. In addition, they discuss:How ABL differentiates itself in the marketCurrent supply/demand dynamics of launchRideshare packaging efficiencyPlans after Flight 2And much more…This episode is brought to you by SpiderOak, a US-based software company that builds space cybersecurity products and solutions for civilian, military, and commercial space operations. Learn more at https://spideroak.com/ • Chapters • 00:00 - Intro & SpiderOak Ad01:56 - Dan’s background02:34 - History of ABL05:05 - What differentiates ABL?08:23 - Regulation surrounding mobile launch systems10:08 - Flight 1, what happened?13:56 - Key improvements on Flight 218:12 - Risks of diving into Block 220:53 - Plans after Flight 221:29 - Increasing launch cadence24:52 - Traction between government and commercial customers26:43 - Is heavier launch in ABL’s future?28:20 - SpiderOak Ad29:07 - Supply and demand dynamics32:56 - Rideshare packaging efficiency42:51 - Lack of high cadence in the industry44:30 - What are investors currently looking for in the market?48:12 - Creating momentum after Flight 1• Show notes • ABL's website — https://ablspacesystems.com/ABL's socials — https://twitter.com/ablspacesystemsMo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes • About us • Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers. Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)

Back in the Pathfinder hot seat is Caleb Henry, Director of Research at Quilty Space. We were privileged to have Caleb join us over a year ago on one of the initial Pathfinder episodes, where he shed light on industry consolidation and the T-Mobile partnership with SpaceX. Today, he rejoins us to delve into a variety of pertinent topics, including: SpaceX vs everyone elseRemote sensing business modelsLEO vs GEO broadband operatorsCapacity shortages across operatorsEffective telecom regulation And much more…This episode is brought to you by SpiderOak, a US-based software company that builds space cybersecurity products and solutions for civilian, military, and commercial space operations. Learn more at https://spideroak.com/ • Chapters • 00:00 - Intro & SpiderOak Ad 01:56 - Caleb’s origin story 04:00 - Transitioning from journalist to research writer 10:08 - How does Quilty choose what to focus on 13:44 - Is SpaceX a monopoly? 18:24 - Supply/demand dynamics of launch 20:39 - Market for small and medium lift launch vehicles 24:42 - SpiderOak Ad break 25:29 - The commercial remote sensing market 30:53 - A commercial remote sensing market big enough for multibillion businesses? 33:57 - Will Starlink make GEO operators obsolete? 40:03 - A shortage of capacity? 42:56 - Would you rather be a LEO or GEO operator? 45:42 - Where should there should be more regulation? 49:56 - What would you be doing if you weren’t in the space industry?• Show notes • Caleb's socials — https://twitter.com/ChenrySpaceMo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes • About us • Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers. Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)

Today’s Pathfinder episode features Leon Alkalai, former Technical Fellow of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL) and now the founder of Mandala Space Ventures. Having spent 32 years at JPL, we dive into his leadership roles for the GRAIL mission in 2007, which mapped the Moon's gravitational field and the Insight Lander in 2012, a first of its kind mission aimed at exploring Mars' deep interior. Leon now runs Mandala, a combination of space venture studio meets venture fund. In addition to all this, Mo and Leon discuss: The history of NASA JPL Commercializing JPL technologies The venture studio approach to space And much more… This episode is brought to you by SpiderOak, a US-based software company that builds space cybersecurity products and solutions for civilian, military, and commercial space operations. Learn more at https://spideroak.com/ • Chapters • 00:00 - Intro & SpiderOak 01:20 - Leon's PhD 01:49 - How did Leon end up at JPL 04:08 - Freshly minted PhD. What's next? 07:55 - JPL & NASA 11:51 - Missions at JPL Leon is most proud of 17:34 - Recovering the gravity of the Moon 21:39 - SpiderOak Ad 27:52 - Mandala Space Ventures 32:08 - The venture studio model 35:15 - Most value added to businesses 37:13 - How to view the industry 39:48 - What you look for in a company and what are some red flags? 41:21 - How does Leon build a team 43:59 - Technology that excites Leon 48:42 - A Starship future • Show notes • Mandala's website — https://mandalaspaceventures.com/Leon's socials — https://twitter.com/DrLeonAlkalai Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes • About us • Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers. Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)