Valley of Depth

How do you test hypersonics from orbit, build drones at the front lines, and map the seafloor with robots?The Space & Defense Update is LIVE from the New York Stock Exchange with Mo Islam and Jack Kuhr, exploring in-space manufacturing, battlefield factories, and the autonomous tech mapping the ocean.Want to learn more about the business of space? Sign up for Payload's free newsletter: https://payloadspace.com/subscribe/Joining us:- Will Bruey, CEO, Varda Space Industries- Dan Magy, CEO, Firestorm- Matt Tirman, CEO, Bedrock OceanWe're digging into Varda's $251M Series D, how its capsules are being used for hypersonic testing, and what's next for manufacturing in orbit.Firestorm breaks down its xCell field microfactories and what it takes to build drones close to the fight.Bedrock explains how autonomous ocean mapping works, why sea mines and subsea cables are back in focus, and where maritime intelligence goes next.Join the conversation live and drop your questions in the chat.#Varda #DefenseTech #SpaceNews

Stoke Space’s approach to full reuse is easiest to understand when you can actually see the hardware. During an exclusive post-Series E tour of the company’s 168,000-square-foot headquarters outside Seattle, CEO Andy Lapsa walks us through the evolution of Nova—from the Hopper demonstrator that first proved Stoke’s second-stage architecture to the flight hardware now being prepared for orbital testing.We cover:- How Stoke is scaling Nova from the three-ton Pathfinder to the 15-ton Block 2- What changes and what stays the same in Block 2’s propulsion architecture- How Stoke plans to ramp Pathfinder production while developing Block 2 in parallel- What remains before Pathfinder ships for final testing and its first orbital flight- Why Stoke is expanding its manufacturing and testing footprint following the $1 billion Series E• Show notes •Stoke’s’ website — https://www.stokespace.com/Stoke’s’ socials — https://x.com/stoke_spaceAndy's socials – https://x.com/AndyLapsaMo's socials — https://x.com/itsmoislamValley of Depth archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/• About us •Valley of Depth is a podcast about the technologies reshaping industry, national security, and the global balance of power.Brought to you by Arkaea Media, the team behind Payload, Tectonic, Ignition, and Decoding Bio, the show covers space, defense, energy, biotech, and the technologies shaping what comes next.We sit down with founders, investors, government officials, scientists, and military leaders to understand what they’re building, why it matters, and where these industries are headed. From new companies and breakthrough technologies to capital, policy, and geopolitics, Valley of Depth goes deep on the forces shaping the future.• Payload: www.payloadspace.com• Tectonic: www.tectonicdefense.com• Ignition: www.ignition-news.com• Decoding Bio: www.decodingbio.com

Andy Lapsa, co-founder and CEO of Stoke Space and a former Blue Origin engineer, explores why launch is still unsolved. He discusses Stoke’s $1 billion raise, the reusable Nova family, liquid-cooled heat shields, and the race to expand launch capacity. They also dive into downmass, orbital compute, in-space manufacturing, and the three flights Stoke must use to prove its vision.

Isaac Roberts, Chief Strategy Officer at Skyways and longtime autonomous logistics operator, discusses Skyways’ long-range V3 cargo eVTOL. He talks about using defense to mature autonomous aviation. He explains why logistics was the company’s wedge, how Skyways outperformed larger rivals, and why FAA rules, not technology, may be the main barrier to scaled commercial drone logistics.

This month, Mo and Jack host a live Space & Defense Update from the NYSE, featuring leading investors and executives: • Erik Kriessmann, Partner at Altimeter Capital • Zach Shore, CEO of Hermeus • Dan Wright, CEO of Armada We discuss the latest developments across space, defense technology, AI infrastructure, hypersonic aviation, edge computing, private-market investment, and the emerging companies building the next generation of critical infrastructure.   About us Arkaea Media is building the definitive media, events, and intelligence platform for the future of the defense industrial base. We deliver high-quality journalism and actionable insights that shape the business, policy, and investment decisions underpinning technically complex and highly regulated industries that influence global security. Our portfolio of publications includes Payload, Tectonic, Ignition, and Decoding Bio. • Payload: www.payloadspace.com • Tectonic: www.tectonicdefense.com • Decoding Bio: www.decodingbio.com

Antares just closed a massive $470M Series C, was welcomed to the Oval Office by President Trump to celebrate becoming the first startup to achieve reactor criticality under the Department of Energy's reactor pilot program, and is now racing toward delivering the first commercial microreactors to the U.S. military. Just three years after being founded, the company expects to surpass $1B in defense contracts while attempting to restart America's nuclear industrial base. CEO Jordan Bramble joins Valley of Depth to unpack what it actually took to build and operate a nuclear reactor in under a year, why Antares believes the military (not hyperscale data centers) is the fastest path to commercial nuclear power, and how microreactors could fundamentally reshape everything from missile defense and remote military installations to space exploration. We also cover: Why achieving reactor criticality is a historic milestone for American nuclear energy How Antares compressed decades of nuclear development into a startup timeline Why the company chose defense as its beachhead market instead of AI data centers The manufacturing, regulatory, and supply chain strategy behind scaling microreactors How nuclear power could enable Golden Dome, space infrastructure, and the next era of national security • Chapters • 00:00 - Trailer 00:54 – Jordan at the White House 02:57 – What does criticality mean? 04:29 – How hard is reaching criticality? 08:48 – What $600M in fundraising will allow Antares to do 09:58 – How did Antares get to criticality first? 12:55 – How the government's approach to nuclear has changed since Jordan's time at the Office of Management & Budget 15:25 – How small modular reactors fit in the nuclear tech landscape 19:02 – Space-based civilian use cases for nuclear 20:57 – Antares's approach to fuel availability and supply chains 25:56 – Electricity in 2027 27:14 – Regulatory hurdles 30:12 – The production line Antares is building 31:33 – The road to 30 reactors a month 33:22 – The data center component 37:22 – Is it just a coincidence that 4 companies reached criticality by the July 4th deadline? 39:48 – How would an investor know if a nuclear company is on the right path? 43:09 – What would Jordan have done differently with Antares? 44:36 – What will Jordan be most proud of about Antares when he's 80?   • Show notes • Antares’ website — https://antaresindustries.com/ Jordan’s socials — https://x.com/jordanbramble Mo's socials — https://x.com/itsmoislam Payload’s socials — https://x.com/payloadspace /  https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace Ignition’s socials — https://x.com/ignitionnuclear / https://www.linkedin.com/company/ignition-nuclear/ Tectonic’s socials  — https://x.com/tectonicdefense / https://www.linkedin.com/company/tectonicdefense/ Valley of Depth archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/   • About us • Valley of Depth is a podcast about the technologies that matter — and the people building them.  Brought to you by Arkaea Media, the team behind Payload (space), Ignition (nuclear energy), Decoding Bio (biotech) and Tectonic (defense tech), this show goes beyond headlines and hype. We talk to founders, investors, government officials, and military leaders shaping the future of national security and deep tech. From breakthrough science to strategic policy, we dive into the high-stakes decisions behind the world’s hardest technologies. Payload: www.payloadspace.com Tectonic: www.tectonicdefense.com Ignition: www.ignition-news.com Decoding Bio: www.decodingbio.com

Ian Cinnamon didn’t set out to build a satellite company. After selling his first startup to Palantir, he became convinced the real bottleneck in space wasn’t launch or payloads, but the spacecraft itself. While rockets were getting cheaper and payloads more capable, satellite buses were still being built like bespoke engineering projects. Apex’s answer was simple in theory and incredibly difficult in practice: turn spacecraft into products. Four years later, Apex is building standardized satellite platforms for commercial and national security customers, with a product lineup that now spans missions from LEO to GEO. We get into whether the satellite bus market is genuinely supply constrained, if standardized spacecraft become commodities or durable technology platforms, and how Starship, proliferated constellations, and rising defense demand are reshaping the economics of spacecraft manufacturing. We also cover: Why Ian believes spacecraft should become products instead of bespoke engineering programs Whether the satellite bus market is actually underbuilt or heading toward oversupply How Apex thinks about manufacturing, vertical integration, and scaling production Why larger satellites may make more sense in a world of cheap launch The capital strategy behind building one of the industry’s fastest-growing companies Check out Valley of Depth #045 on Apple, Spotify, or YouTube. • Chapters • 00:00 – Trailer 00:55 – New CEO of Apex 02:29 – The Apex origin story 05:39 – Partnering with Max Benassi 07:13 – Successes and drawbacks of Apex's first 6 months 08:50 – Apex's current product set 10:36 – Misconceptions about how much mass you need in orbit 12:08 – Is the plan to build larger and larger satellites indefinitely? 13:11 – State of the bus market today 14:52 – Domestically oversupplied, globally undersupplied 16:31 – Apex's biggest opportunities on the commercial and national security side 18:50 – When should a company utilize Apex vs. building their own bus in-house? 19:46 – Apex's moat 21:12 – Juggling the bespoke government customer 22:15 – What the primes having in-house buses says about the market 23:07 – Commoditization of the bus vs. owning the complete mission 26:01 – Apex partnerships 27:27 – How many satellites are you building at a $100B company? 28:10 – Apex's three $200M fundraising rounds 32:05 – Is there another fundraising round incoming? 33:04 – Where Apex needs to be to seriously consider going public 34:58 – The road to 200 satellites per year 35:46 – Who is Apex losing deals to the most? 37:39 – Apex vs. K2 40:27 – How the push for heavy launch will affect Apex 42:15 – Apex's ability to get to space if SpaceX fully cuts commercial launches 44:35 – Is York an under or overvalued business? 46:36 – What keeps Ian up at night? 50:10 – When is Apex launching their own constellation? 51:06 – The missions that Apex could enable 52:30 – Is Ian still excited about asteroid mining?   • Show notes • Apex’s’ website — https://www.apexspace.com/ Ian’s’ socials — https://x.com/IanCinnamon Mo's socials — https://x.com/itsmoislam Payload’s socials — https://x.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace Ignition’s socials — https://x.com/ignitionnuclear /  https://www.linkedin.com/company/ignition-nuclear/ Tectonic’s socials — https://x.com/tectonicdefense / https://www.linkedin.com/company/tectonicdefense/ Valley of Depth archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/   • About us • Valley of Depth is a podcast about the technologies that matter — and the people building them.  Brought to you by Arkaea Media, the team behind Payload (space), Ignition (nuclear energy), Decoding Bio (biotech) and Tectonic (defense tech), this show goes beyond headlines and hype. We talk to founders, investors, government officials, and military leaders shaping the future of national security and deep tech. From breakthrough science to strategic policy, we dive into the high-stakes decisions behind the world’s hardest technologies. Payload: www.payloadspace.com Tectonic: www.tectonicdefense.com Ignition: www.ignition-news.com Decoding Bio: www.decodingbio.com

Soren Monroe-Anderson, CEO of Neros and former FPV drone racer turned defense entrepreneur, explains building low-cost, high-volume drone systems. He discusses why many US drones faltered in Ukraine, lessons from battlefield testing, the China production gap, scaling manufacturing to millions, and the balance between human pilots and autonomy.

Eric Romo spent his early career as employee #13 at SpaceX, left for nearly two decades, and came back to one of the hardest unsolved problems in the space economy: what happens after launch. Getting things to orbit is largely figured out. Moving them once they're there is not. Impulse is now over $1B raised, embedded in the Golden Dome architecture, and with a GEO rideshare program booked out before a first flight. We get into how they got there, why Eric thinks every business model predicated on cheap Starship launch is broken, and what it actually means to be building in-space mobility at the moment GEO becomes a contested domain. We cover: The single Mira flight that changed Impulse's relationship with the Space Force Mira, Helios, and Caravan: three products, three markets but one key through line The Golden Dome partnership with Anduril and what it means to be embedded in that architecture How exposed American GEO assets actually are right now Why every Starship-dependent business model is broke The $4.26B valuation and what has to be true for that number to look cheap in ten years What the Impulse team debates most internally right now   • Chapters • 00:00 – Intro trailer 01:21 – How Eric ended up at Impulse 03:43 – How Eric got to SpaceX and his experience there 05:29 – Why Eric went on a hiatus from the space industry 09:49 – Is Musk focused on Mars or data centers now? 11:46 – Finding his way back to space 14:44 – Reuniting with Tom 17:43 – Why Tom is someone Eric could work for 20:22 – The vision of Impulse that Tom presented to Eric when he joined, and how it's changed 22:07 – Impulse's product set 26:42 – The pivot to GEO 33:13 – Caravan vs. the trend for larger-scale satellites 36:51 – Impulse's second thoughts about the economics of Mira and expanding 39:16 – Mira, the most maneuverable spacecraft in orbit 41:08 – Why does the government care about maneuverable satellites? 42:24 – Competitors and how to win the maneuverability race 45:25 – How exposed are GEO assets today? 47:52 – The biggest market for Impulse 49:39 – Impulse x Anduril 52:03 – Moon and Mars discussion at Impulse 54:02 – How Starship will fundamentally change the industry 1:00:01 – The opportunity for SpaceX competitors 1:03:49 – If Starship solves orbital refueling, will they become a competitive concern for Impulse? 1:05:35 – How Impulse is planning to use their recently raised $500M 1:07:00 – Impulse's existing capital needs, future fundraising, and will Impulse go public? 1:10:08 – How Impulse's products will evolve 1:11:06 – Biggest source of internal debate 1:13:14 – Overrated and underrated space technologies 1:15:56 – What Eric would say to his 23-year-old self at SpaceX 1:16:52 – What Eric does for fun   • Show notes • Impulse’s website — https://www.impulsespace.com/ Eric’s’ socials — https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-romo/ Mo's socials — https://x.com/itsmoislam Payload’s socials — https://x.com/payloadspace /  https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace Ignition’s socials — https://x.com/ignitionnuclear / https://www.linkedin.com/company/ignition-nuclear/ Tectonic’s socials — https://x.com/tectonicdefense / https://www.linkedin.com/company/tectonicdefense/ Valley of Depth archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/   • About us • Valley of Depth is a podcast about the technologies that matter — and the people building them. Brought to you by Arkaea Media, the team behind Payload (space), Ignition (nuclear energy), Decoding Bio (biotech) and Tectonic (defense tech), this show goes beyond headlines and hype. We talk to founders, investors, government officials, and military leaders shaping the future of national security and deep tech. From breakthrough science to strategic policy, we dive into the high-stakes decisions behind the world’s hardest technologies. Payload: www.payloadspace.com Tectonic: www.tectonicdefense.com Ignition: www.ignition-news.com Decoding Bio: www.decodingbio.com

Bridgit Mendler, CEO of Northwood and former FCC Space Bureau staffer, builds shared ground infrastructure for satellite networking. She discusses Prism, scaling to internet-exchange levels, maximizing ground-station utilization, competing with vertically integrated networks, and a major Space Force contract. Short, fast-moving ideas about deployment, business model evolution, and why ground systems matter.