Mountain & Prairie with Ed Roberson

David Gessner is an author, a professor, and one of the leading contemporary voices on the natural world and the American West. He has written ten books, including “All the Wild That Remains: Edward Abbey, Wallace Stegner, and the American West,” which is one of my all-time favorites and was a former Mountain & Prairie Book Club selection. Thanks to his influences ranging from Henry David Thoreau to Theodore Roosevelt to Wendell Berry, David preaches the gospel of appreciating “place" and protecting our wild landscapes, public lands, and fragile Western ecosystem. • I’ve been a huge fan of David’s work for many years, and have read almost everything he has written. I cannot overstate how much his writing has helped me understand both the history and the modern-day challenges of the American West, as well as the individuals who have shaped the region. Through his masterful prose, he combines history, current events, deep personal insights, and a hilarious sense of humor into amazingly impactful books. Without his writing, my interest in land conservation would be a fraction of what it is today. • David was in Colorado conducting research for a new book focused on public lands, Bears Ears, and Theodore Roosevelt, so we met up in Boulder for our conversation. In a little over an hour, we managed to cover a wide range of topics including public lands, Stegner, Abbey, TR, the idea of “Boomers and Stickers,” and the importance of place. David described how a bout with cancer helped to change his writing style and interests, and how moving to Boulder in his thirties altered the trajectory of his life and career. We discussed his writing process, his coastal writing shack, and how his approach to writing has evolved over the years. As usual, we also touched on favorite books, films, and his most powerful outdoor experience. • Meeting David and having this conversation was a dream come true for me, so many thanks to him for taking the time to chat. There are a lot of resources and other priceless information in this episode, so be sure to check the notes for links to everything. Enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/david-gessner/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED: 2:48 - How David describes his work 3:45 - Where David lives 4:50 - Visit to Boulder and Western road trip 6:40 - Trip around Bears Ears 8:20 - Importance of adventure for writing 16:00 - David’s evolution toward adventure 17:05 - Bout with testicular cancer 24:00 - Lessons learned from cancer 25:45 - Lessons learned from Teddy Roosevelt 30:50 - Upcoming book centered around TR 35:50 - Personal threads that run through David’s books 37:45 - Boomers and Stickers 41:30 - Rawness of the West 43:15 - Importance of the “place” 46:10 - David’s writing shack 48:20 - How David produces so much work 52:00 - Introvert or extrovert 54:00 - Beliefs about the West that have changed over time 1:00:00 - More on the rawness of the West 1:01:15 - Recommended Abbey and Stegner books 1:05:00 - Downsides of TR 1:06:22 - Favorite books about the West 1:07:05 - Favorite films 1:08:50 - Favorite location in the West 1:09:55 - Most powerful outdoor experience 1:12:50 - Request of the listeners

Daniel Vergés is an artist and graphic designer who captures the essence of life in the American West through simple yet amazingly impactful paintings and drawings. Like many of my podcast guests, Daniel grew up obsessed with all things western—but unlike previous guests, Daniel grew up and currently lives in Spain, where he works and creates western-focused art in his rural studio. His life-long love of the West was solidified during the time he spent living and working on the Zapata Ranch, a 103,000-acre cattle and bison ranch located in Colorado’s San Luis Valley. • Despite living so far from the American West now, Daniel’s deep love of and respect for the landscape, people, and history would make you think he’s been here his entire life. Sometimes those of us who live in the West can lose perspective on just what a spectacular place it is, so I enjoyed learning more about Daniel’s perspective as someone who does not physically live here yet is heavily influenced by the West's landscapes and culture on a daily basis. If you ever find yourself getting jaded about life in the West, just listen to the way he describes mountains, prairies, ranches, and bison, then take a look at his art, and you’ll snap right out of it! • Daniel and I had a wonderful conversation that covered everything from life on the Zapata Ranch to his creative process. We chatted about his childhood interest in the West and his impressions of the wide-open spaces and wildlife during his first trip to Colorado. We discussed how the West influences his art, and how he strives for simplicity in his art and life. We talked about his collaborations with other artists, such as former podcast guest Camrin Dengel, and how these partnerships fuel his creativity. Daniel also discussed how his discipline of daily drawing and his passion for creating have driven his success as an artist. And as usual, we covered books, films, favorite places in the West, and much more, so be sure to check the episode notes for links to everything. • And there’s one more piece of exciting news—Daniel created a special painting for the Mountain and Prairie podcast featuring my favorite animal, the bison. It’s a super-cool piece, and I’m honored that he took the time to create something so special for the podcast. We discuss it a bit during our conversation, and I loved hearing how Daniel created it. Check out the podcast webpage to see it-- I set up a little online shop where you can buy shirts and hats featuring the art. There are links on the website to everything, so go check it out! • I know you’ll enjoy this episode. Thanks for listening. ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/daniel-verges/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED 3:00 - How Daniel describes his work 3:30 - Where Daniel lives 4:50 - Daniel’s experience on the Zapata Ranch 7:40 - The West’s influence on Daniel’s art 9:00 - The timeless feeling of the West 10:45 - Teambuilding through branding and ranching 11:40 - First impressions of the West 14:00 - Memorable experience from the ranches 15:40 - Learning horses 18:20 - Daniel describes his art 20:30 - Daniel’s artistic childhood 21:30 - Learning art in university, then self-teaching 24:10 - Slow Artworks 26:10 - How Daniel pushes himself artistically 28:45 - Dealing with creative block 31:30 - Lessons learned from Costa Rica 36:25 - Collaboration with Camrin Dengel and others 38:50 - Mentors and heroes 41:05 - How Daniel’s art has changed 43:50 - Managing social media 46:00 - The podcast artwork created by Daniel 49:00 - Japanese philosophy’s influence on Daniel work 52:05 - Advice to aspiring artists 55:55 - Favorite books 58:50 - Favorite films 1:01:30 - Hobbies, music, running, roping 1:03:20 - Most powerful outdoor experience 1:06:00 - Favorite location in the West 1:07:20 - Best advice 1:10:30 - Request of the listeners

Adam Foss is a world-class hunter who has transformed his passion for wildlife and wild places into a rewarding career in filmmaking and photography. Adam has been obsessed with wilderness adventure for practically his entire life. At age 24, he was the youngest person to take all four species of North American sheep with a bow, an amazing achievement for a hunter of any age. But despite this accomplishment and others, Adam is much more focused on the process of the hunt—spending challenging days in the mountains, forming long-lasting friendships, stewarding public lands, and conserving legendary big game species. • Adam was born in the Canadian Rockies and spent his youth bow hunting with his father and older brother. As he grew older, his hunting trips expanded in geography and complexity, and he has now hunted many of the world’s wildest places for some of the most renowned big game. Adam initially considered a career in wildlife biology, but decided to go the creative route instead—he and his wife are now the owners of Foss Media, a company that creates films and photography for some of the most iconic outdoor brands today. As you’ll hear, Adam is passionate about wildlife, storytelling, and conservation, but he is equally humble, grounded, and grateful for being able to do what he loves on a daily basis. • We caught up over Skype, as Adam and his wife are currently traveling around Canada and the American West working on creative projects. We had a fun conversation and managed to cover a lot in just over an hour. We discussed Adam’s childhood in Canada and the lessons he learned from hunting with his father and brother. We chatted about how Adam values the process of hunting over the end goal of taking an animal and our shared theory that hunting taps into something primal in our human DNA. We talked in detail about conservation, specifically the role of public lands in both the United States and Canada. Adam also offered some wise advice to people who want to learn to hunt but may not have a long-standing connection to the sport. And as usual, we discussed Adam’s favorite books, films, and his most powerful outdoor experience. • This was such a fun conversation, and it’s clear that Adam has thought long and hard about these issues. I really enjoyed getting to know Adam, and I think you will too. ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/adam-foss/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED: 2:58 - How Adam describes his work 7:15 - Adam’s upbringing in Canada 8:50 - Hunting with his dad in the mountains 10:45 - University in British Columbia and more far reaching hunts 12:30 - Adam’s early career goals 14:30 - Lessons learned from hunting with his father 17:45 - Breaking down hunts into manageable peices 20:45 - The mental game of hunting 23:00 - Process over goals 25:45 - Adam’s love of adventure and challenges 27:35 - Influences and mentors 33:15 - Adam’s current goals for a hunt 38:00 - South America trip 39:30 - Hunting as a part of human's DNA 43:15 - Advice to new hunters 48:15 - Importance of public lands 52:15 - Thoughts on wolves and ecological balance 59:30 - Favorite books 1:02:55 - Favorite documentaries 1:05:20 - Most powerful outdoor experience 1:15:00 - Connect with Adam online

Chris Eyer is a true Western polymath. He is probably best known for his work as a mule packer, in which he uses mules to transport supplies into some of Montana’s most remote wilderness areas—he documents the adventures on his extremely popular Instagram account "muledragger." But as you’ll hear in our conversation, mule packing only scratches the surface—Chris is an experienced mountaineer and climber, a former US Marine, a practicing Buddhist, a leather craftsman, and a successful electrical contractor. From his home base in Montana’s Bitterroot Valley, Chris leads a full and fascinating life, working hard and enjoying his connection to the natural world and his animals. • Chris was raised in California, and from an early age was attracted to the outdoors and adventures in wild places. On a backpacking trip during his teens, he came across a team of mules and was immediately entranced—from that moment on, he knew that he wanted to work as a mule packer. As an adult, Chris taught himself the ins and outs of mule packing, a hard-knocks method of learning that’s not for the faint of heart. But through this long and tough self-education, he established incredibly deep relationships with all of his animals-- relationships that have significantly enriched his life in many ways. • As you’d expect from someone with Chris’s diverse set of experiences, we had an extremely wide-ranging conversation. We chat about how he became a mule packer and some of the crazy and scary experiences early in his career. We cover his time in the Marines, and the lessons he learned that carry over into his daily life now. We also discuss his connection to Buddhism and his meditation practice, and how his mindful approach to life and wilderness travel keeps him and his team of animals safe in dangerous situations. Chris also explains the specifics of mules from a biological and temperamental perspective. We discuss Chris’s unique connection to legendary alpinist Conrad Anker, as well as the similarities between packing and climbing. As usual, we hit upon books, films, favorite places in the West, and much more. • There’s a ton of amazing information in this episode, so be sure the check out the episode notes. Hopefully I’ll get Chris back for a part two, because there’s still plenty to discuss. Enjoy! ••• ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED: 2:50 - How Chris describes his work 4:15 - Bitterroot Valley 6:30 - How Chris settled in the Bitterroot 8:10 - The equine “feedback loop” 8:45 - Early days riding horses 9:40 - Influenced by Conrad Anker and Alex Lowe 11:10 - First interaction with a packer 12:15 - Joining the Marines 14:00 - Studying philosophy and religious studies 16:15 - Discovering the Montana wilderness 20:10 - Lessons learned from the Marines 23:40 - Buddhism in Chris’s daily life 27:30 - Life’s constant state of change 29:30 - The way wilderness strips away people’s surface-level differences 31:30 - How to learn to meditate 34:15 - Learning the details of mule packing 36:30 - Scary early experience packing 40:30 - Detailed discussion about mules 45:10 - Misconceptions about mules 47:30 - How Chris selects his mules 50:20 - Control versus letting go 55:20 - Trip with Conrad Anker 1:00:15 - Significance of the Heart W brand 1:03:30 - Favorite books 1:06:40 - Favorite documentaries 1:07:55 - Fun activities 1:10:00 - Most powerful outdoor experience 1:17:00 - Best advice 1:19:30 - Request of the listeners 1:20:30 - Connect with Chris online

Sarah Calhoun is the founder and owner of Red Ants Pants, a Montana-based apparel company that makes high-quality, American-made workwear for women. But Sarah’s business ventures are just the tip of the iceberg—she also started the Red Ants Pants Music Festival, which attracts world-class musicians like Dwight Yoakam and Lucinda Williams. The proceeds from the music festival support Sarah’s third venture, the Red Ants Pants Foundation, an organization dedicated to developing women’s leadership, supporting local farms and ranches, and enriching communities. It’s simply amazing that one person can do this much work! • Sarah was raised on a farm in New England, and spent her early career working as an instructor for Outward Bound. After reading Ivan Doig’s This House of Sky, she packed up and moved to Montana, where she began to turn her idea for Red Ants Pants into a reality. She learned to sew, taught herself the basics of the apparel business, and eventually moved to the small agricultural community of White Sulphur Springs, where Red Ants Pants opened for business. As you’ll hear, selling pants is just one aspect of Sarah’s larger vision—she’s using her company to build community, empower women, and bring together people of differing perspectives and backgrounds. • We had a very interesting conversation, and you’ll be blown away by Sarah’s focus, vision, and the staggering amount she has been able to accomplish. She talks about growing up in New England, and how her family helped to instill her relentless work ethic. She discusses her time teaching at Outward Bound, and how many of the lessons learned in that role have translated to her business. We chat about how the Red Ants Pants business model flies in the face of traditional MBA theories, and how her lack of business experience was actually a strength when starting the company. We also talk about how hard work in the outdoors builds self-confidence, as well as her future plans for the foundation. And as usual, we discuss impactful books, films, and the best advice she’s ever received. • This is a great episode, and I know you’ll enjoy it. There’s a lot here, so be sure to check the episode notes for links to all that we discuss. Enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/sarah-calhoun/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED: 2:45 - How Sarah describes her work 3:55 - Sarah’s personal and professional background 6:00 - Approaching outdoor companies with the idea for Red Ants Pants 6:55 - Moving to White Sulphur Springs 8:40 - The influence of Ivan Doig’s writing 9:45 - Joining the community of White Sulphur Springs 12:00 - Importance of community for Sarah 13:10 - Sarah’s childhood career aspirations 14:20 - Outward Bound 18:00 - Laying the foundation for Red Ants Pants 20:45 - History of Sarah’s work ethic 22:00 - Weathering the financial crisis 25:10 - Sarah’s daily routines 27:45 - Lessons learned over the years 29:35 - Working to expand her comfort zone 31:20 - Red Ants Pants Music Festival 37:20 - Red Ants Pants Foundation 39:30 - Value of hard work in the outdoors 42:55 - Foundation success stories 45:45 - Future plans for the foundation 47:00 - Heroes and mentors 49:50 - Advantages of little business experience 51:00 - Favorite books 53:30 - Favorite films 54:35 - Hobbies 55:20 - Favorite international travel spots 56:00 - Most powerful outdoor experience 58:00 - Favorite location in the West 58:45 - Best advice ever received 59:50 - Request of the listeners 1:00:40 - Story of the name “Red Ants Pants” 1:01:00 - Connect with Sarah online

Becca Skinner is a Bozeman-based photographer, writer, and adventurer whose work has taken her to some of the farthest corners of the globe. Growing up between Colorado and Wyoming, Becca was raised by adventurous and supportive parents who nurtured her love of the outdoors and her artistic endeavors. As a young woman, Becca's genuine interest in social work and helping the less fortunate led to her winning grants to photograph post-Katrina New Orleans and post-tsunami Sumatra. Those experiences, and the body of work they produced, allowed Becca to pursue her passion of photography full time, and her career continues to grow and evolve in exciting ways. • As you’ll hear, Becca has been willing to be single-mindedly focused and take calculated risks to “make it” as a professional photographer. When she did not win a National Geographic Young Explorers Grant the first time she applied, she dusted herself off, re-focused her efforts, and was successful on her second try. After saving enough money, she struck out alone on a 32,000-mile road trip through the American West, living in her car, honing her craft, and continuing to build her portfolio. She has devised methods for staying positive in immensely uncomfortable situations, such as a cold, wet expedition in Vancouver’s coastal backcountry, which we discuss in detail. Despite her success, Becca remains humble and down to earth, and we had a very fun conversation. • We covered a wide range of subjects-- we discussed her childhood in the West and how her family played such a formative role in shaping her career and life. We chatted about her experiences in New Orleans and Sumatra, and how the disaster victims' attitudes toward the catastrophes varied so widely. We discussed her first road trip throughout the West and how she handled being alone for such long stretches. We also talked about the importance of having solid expedition teammates and the challenges of integrating back into day-to-day life after an intense trip. And of course, we covered favorite books, films, and the best advice she’s ever received. • If you don’t already, be sure to follow Becca on Instagram and other social media. Links to everything are in the episode notes. Enjoy! ••• ••• Topics Discussed: 2:50 - How Becca describes her work 3:25 - How Becca describes her photography 4:00 - Growing up in the West 5:15 - Early experiences in the outdoors with her parents 7:30 - First interest in photography 8:40 - Interest in social work and outdoor therapy 11:15 - Post-Katrina New Orleans and takeaways 16:00 - Nat Geo Young Explorers Grant 20:00 - Experience in Sumatra 21:30 - Different attitudes between New Orleans and Sumatra crisis responses 24:00 - Considering photography as a career 25:00 - Leaving on the 32,000-mile road trip 26:15 - Becca’s supportive parents 28:00 - Solitary time in Yosemite 33:20 - Early career 36:30 - End of the road trip 39:15 - Settling in Bozeman 41:20 - Wolves and Yellowstone 44:10 - Spending more nights outdoors than indoors 46:45 - Keeping a positive attitude in tough conditions 48:30 - Picking expedition partners 50:15 - Hardest expedition 53:20 - Being Here film 55:20 - Importance of public lands 57:50 - Favorite books 59:45 - Favorite films 1:00:50 - Unexpected hobbies 1:02:45 - Most powerful outdoor experience 1:04:15 - Favorite location in the West 1:06:00 - Request of the listeners 1:07:05 - Connect with Becca online

Brendan Leonard is a writer and creative whose stories about adventure in wild places have built him a loyal following in the outdoor world and beyond. Whether it’s writing for his blog Semi-Rad, authoring eight books, or making films such as his recent “How to Run 100 Miles,” Brendan combines humor, introspection, and skilled storytelling in an authentic way that strikes a chord with a wide range of audiences. But as you’ll hear, Brendan’s secret ingredient to success in his creative pursuits is his ability to consistently focus in and grind out the hard work, week after week, year after year. • Brendan is an Iowa native who moved West to attend journalism school at the University of Montana. After struggling with alcohol addiction in his youth, the West’s wide-open spaces brought Brendan a much-needed change of scenery and the opportunity for a fresh start. What began as short hikes around Missoula transformed into an all-in obsession with rock climbing that eventually led to writing gigs with Outside, Men’s Journal, Alpinist, and other well-known publications. Brendan is a shining example of how persistence, hard work, and a willingness to bet on yourself can lead to a fulfilling life and career doing what you love. • We had a wide-ranging, fun, and hilarious conversation about his life and career, and we also managed to wander into a few completely unexpected topics. We chatted about Brendan’s “all-or-nothing” personality, and the challenges and rewards associated with being wired that way. We discussed his ability to focus on the process rather than the goal, and how that approach is beneficial when creating or pursuing an outdoor objective. We obviously talked about climbing, but also discussed ultramarathons, specifically his recent experience running a 103-mile race through the Colorado mountains. And as you’ve come to expect, we covered favorite books, films, and a long list of other interesting topics. • This interview was so much fun, and I really appreciate Brendan having me over to chat. I highly recommend his books "60 Meters to Anywhere" and "Make It Till You Make It", so be sure to check those out.. Also, watch his film “How To Run 100 Miles”-- I’ve watched a ton of ultrarunning films, and this one is my favorite. Check the episode notes for links to all of this and more. Hope you enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/brendan-leonard/ ••• Topics Discussed 2:55 - How Brendan describes his work 4:00 - Growing up in Iowa 4:55 - Writing for the college newspaper 6:00 - Applying to journalism schools 7:45 - Falling in love with the outdoors in Montana 10:10 - Discovering rock climbing 12:00 - Deep thoughts on booze 15:35 - Soakers and non-soakers 18:30 - Lessons learned from endurance adventures 21:00 - Importance of process over goals 23:40 - The reality of the creative life 24:40 - Story of Semi-Rad 29:00 - The need for a grinding mentality 32:00 - Strategies for the new media landscape 33:10 - Brendan’s creative hustle 35:30 - Focusing on the art versus the bottomline 36:30 - Today’s work ethic versus five years ago 38:00 - Brendan’s daily routine 40:00 - Creating illustrations 41:35 - Other creatives that inspire Brendan 44:15 - Film inspiration 47:00 - Revisiting old work 49:00 - Dealing with reviews and online feedback 53:00 - Managing social media 55:15 - Importance of public lands and conservation 1:03:00 - Favorite books about the West 1:09:00 - Favorite films 1:12:45 - Surprising activities 1:14:30 - Most powerful outdoor experience 1:18:50 - Favorite location in the West 1:22:00 - Best piece of advice ever recieved 1:27:00 - Request of the listeners 1:29:15 - Connect with Brendan online

Jason Rich is a Utah-based artist whose extraordinary paintings of life in the American West have made him one of the most popular and respected working artists today. Throughout his 20-year career, Jason has won countless awards and is represented by some of the most prestigious galleries in the West. But what is more telling is the respect and admiration he has earned from many of his cowboy artist contemporaries-- as you’ll hear, Jason is amazingly humble, gracious, and grateful for his career in professional art. • Growing up in Idaho, art has been a central part of Jason’s life for as long as he can remember. He was formally educated as an artist, and immediately after graduate school, he committed himself fully to painting professionally. Thanks to his focus, work ethic, and the support of his wife, Jason was able to carve out a niche for himself in the competitive world of Western art. Two decades later, Jason’s popularity continues to grow, which is partly a product of his constant drive to push outside his comfort zone and mature as an artist. • Jason and I had a fun conversation, and we dug into the many aspects of his life as an artist, family man, and admirer of the American West. We discussed his upbringing in Idaho, and how he developed the confidence and skills to go directly from grad school to professional art. We chatted about his techniques for challenging himself as an artist and how his work has evolved over the last two decades. We also talked about his association with the prestigious Cowboy Artists of America, and how spending time with other talented artists has influenced his work. We covered mentors, favorite books, favorite artists, and much more, so be sure to check out the episode notes for a complete list of everything discussed. • Thanks again to Jason for taking the time to chat. Hope you enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/jason-rich/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED 2:20 - How Jason describes his work 3:35 - How Jason describes his art 4:50 - Jason’s childhood 5:40 - Family history in the West 7:00 - Early memories of art 9:30 - Education in art education 10:30 - Decision to pursue art full time 11:00 - Graduate school 12:00 - Transition to professional artist 14:30 - What gave Jason the confidence to pursue art 17:00 - When did Jason know he had “made it” as an artist 21:30 - Jason’s daily routine 25:00 - Jason’s need to push himself artistically 28:55 - Artists that have influenced Jason’s work 31:40 - Humbleness + Discontent 32:20 - Cowboy Artists of America 34:25 - Ensuring historical accuracy 37:40 - Unchanged nature of ranching through the ages 38:10 - Changes in Jason’s art over the last 15 years 42:40 - Approaching art as a business 46:50 - Advice to his younger year old self 49:15 - Favorite books 50:50 - Favorite films 52:45 - Other hobbies 54:55 - Most powerful outdoor experience 56:20 - Favorite place in the West 57:40 - Best advice ever received 58:30 - Request of the listeners 59:45 - Connect with Jason online

Longtime listeners of the podcast will definitely remember my first interview with Jim Howell—he is a rancher and CEO of Grasslands LLC, a progressive ranch management company with operations in the American West, Florida, and New Zealand. Jim was also a co-founder of the Savory Institute, a non-profit organization that espouses the use of holistic planned grazing to restore healthy grasslands around the world. Having worked close to the land his entire career, Jim has a fascinating personal and professional backstory, so I encourage you to listen to our first episode, if you haven’t already. • Knowing that many Mountain & Prairie podcast listeners either work in ranching or are interested in holistic ranch management, Jim and I decided to have a second conversation focused on more of the nitty gritty details of his process for managing ranches. We discuss a wide range of topics, from how Jim and his investors identify ranches as potential acquisitions to their methods for increasing stocking rates while simultaneously improving the health of the grass. We discuss the intense, focused planning that goes into each operation, and Jim explains how his grazing process translates into increased biodiversity and improved ecological health of the entire landscape. This conversation is like a college class in ranch management, only much more fun and engaging. • Our conversation revolves around two of Grasslands’ eastern Montana ranches—the 53,000+/- acre Antelope Springs Ranch and the 38,000+/- acre Cinch Buckle Ranch. My Mirr Ranch Group colleague Duffy Brown and I are working with Jim to market both of these ranches, so we’re familiar with the operations and landscapes and understand the amazing results that Jim and his team have been able to achieve. Both ranches serve as excellent case studies of how holistic management can bolster the health of the grass, increase profitability, and be a true winning proposition for the land, animals, and all other stakeholders. • Even if you don’t have a specific interest in ranches or grasslands, you’ll still get a lot out of this episode. Jim has very wise answers to some of the quick questions that I didn’t ask during our first interview, and he offers plenty of great book recommendations, including one book that Jim thinks every college freshman should read. The episode is packed with great information, so don’t forget to check the episode notes. Jim is a hardworking, curious, humble, and smart guy who has managed to create a fulfilling career that’s making the world a better place, so I know you’ll enjoy the conversation. ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/jim-howell-2/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED: 3:00 - How Jim describes his work 5:20 - Overview of the Savory Institute and Grasslands 8:40 - Grassland’s work in the northern Great Plains ranches 10:40 - Traits of successful ranches that are common across many geographies 12:25 - Cool season grasses of the Northern Great Plains 15:15 - Importance of water on Great Plains ranches 19:25 - History of the cattle business on the Great Plains 24:30 - Increasing stocking rates 26:00 - Increasing grassland health on the ranches 27:10 - Techniques for increasing stocking rates 31:55 - Allowing for sufficient recovery without under-grazing 34:00 - The extra intellectual effort of planned grazing 39:00- The hard lessons of experience 39:45 - Specific tools for managing grazing 45:10 - Evolution of mapping during Jim’s career 46:00 - Improvements to Cinch Buckle and Antelope Springs Ranches 48:45 - Ability to generate profits AND replenishing ecological capital 53:30 - Ranches as an investment for a non-ranching buyers 55:00 - Full-care grazing versus owning cattle 1:00:30 - Upward trajectory of both ranches 1:04:10 - What Jim looks for in employees 1:07:30 - Specific books about grass and holistic ranching 1:11:00 - Best book Jim has read in the last year 1:13:45 - Favorite book of all time 1:16:20 - Best piece of advice Jim’s ever received

Brian Calvert is the Editor-in-Chief of the High Country News, a non-profit media organization that covers the defining stories of the American West. Since 1970, High Country News has been fully committed to in-depth journalism that explores complex relationships between the West's communities, business interests, and the natural world. In our current media climate that seems to celebrate surface-level, hastily written news stories, High Country News remains committed to long-form, well-researched, and nuanced explorations of complicated issues. • Brian is a fourth-generation Wyoming native who grew up in Pinedale at the base of the spectacular Wind River Range. A blue-collar upbringing, a stint in the Army, time working in the oil fields, and years spent overseas as a foreign correspondent have given Brian a unique and valuable perspective into the relationship between people and place. This depth of experience allows Brian to approach Western issues with a curious, patient, and balanced style that is becoming more and more rare in today’s media. • I was on Colorado’s Western Slope for work and stopped by the High Country News office in Paonia to chat with Brian. We had a fascinating conversation about the history of High Country News and how its commitment to in-depth journalism is more important now than ever. We discussed Brian’s upbringing in Wyoming, and why he chose to pursue journalism as a career. We talked about his time spent as a foreign correspondent in places like Cambodia, China, and Afghanistan, as well as the lessons he learned from living in such intense and sometimes dangerous environments. And as you’ve come to expect, we discussed his favorite books, authors, and places in the American West. • There’s a lot to learn in this episode, so please check out the episode notes for links to everything we discuss. Also, please visit the High Country News website or consider ordering a print subscription. Brian and his team are doing important work that deserves support from thoughtful, curious folks like the listeners of this podcast. Enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/brian-calvert/ ••• Topics Discussed: 2:35 - How Brian describes his work 3:15 - History of the High Country News 5:30 - Moving HCN to Paonia 7:00 - HCN’s non-profit model 12:15 - Current shifts in modern journalism 15:30 - Challenges of producing in-depth news in the age of Twitter 21:40 - Thoughts on the rawness and plain-spokenness of the West 24:00 - Brian’s early years in Pinedale 26:25 - Joining the Army and National Guard 27:00 - Desire to write and see the world 28:20 - Adventurous childhood 30:45 - From college to foreign correspondent 33:33 - Working in Cambodia 35:20 - Where Brian was on 9/11 36:30 - Moving back to WY and working in the oil fields 40:55 - Scary events overseas 45:00 - Adjusting to US after life in war zones 47:00 - Learning to surf and surfing as a healing process 49:45 - Being selected for the Ted Scripps Fellowship 51:00 - Opportunity at HCN 53:20 - In-depth journalism in the era of “fake news” 55:25 - Importance of high values in unbiased journalism 1:00:00 - Importance of considering all sides of arguments 1:02:15 - Role of HCN in journalism for a diverse readership 1:05:30 - Favorite books about the West 1:07:50 - The American West as an idea 1:11:30 - Interesting and weird hobbies 1:12:25 - Poetry 1:14:20 - Favorite location in the West 1:15:35 - Best advice ever receive 1:16:00 - Request of the listeners 1:17:00 - Connect with Brian