
When the Facts Change
Hosted by journalist Bernard Hickey, When the Facts Change is your essential weekly guide to the intersection of economics, business and politics in Aotearoa New Zealand. Presented by The Spinoff together with Kiwibank.Visit kiwibank.co.nz to find out how Kiwibank are making Kiwi better off
Latest episodes

Jan 19, 2023 • 32min
Tory Whanau's plan for transport, housing, and the future of Wellington City
Wellington has a new mayor determined to shake things up. At the beginning of the year, Tory Whanau was a mayoral candidate pitching her ambitious vision for the future of Wellington city. Now, she sits in the top spot and is tasked with turning that vision into a reality. She talks with Bernard, exactly one year on from when they last spoke on the podcast, to discuss economics, housing, and who she would be nervous about becoming the next transport minister. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jan 12, 2023 • 10min
Mini-pod: "Let that sink in"
In a three-episode miniseries over summer Bernard breaks down the quotes from 2022 that changed everything... This episode, Elon Musk confidently strides into Twitter HQ to claim his new seat as CEO holding... A sink? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jan 5, 2023 • 9min
Mini-pod: "Wicked perfect storm"
In a three-episode miniseries over summer Bernard breaks down the quotes from 2022 that changed everything... This episode, Jacinda Ardern blames a "wicked perfect storm" for the cost of living crisis that swept over the entire country. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dec 29, 2022 • 7min
Mini-pod: "Cool the jets"
In a three-episode miniseries over summer Bernard breaks down the quotes from 2022 that changed everything... This episode, Adrian Orr tells New Zealanders to "cool their jets", signalling a dark storm cloud set to loom over the economy. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dec 22, 2022 • 30min
So the economy's a mess... What now?
Well that took a turn, didn't it? With a war in Ukraine, supply chain mayhem and a deadly disease tearing through the workforce, this year was one for the history books. Bernard is joined by Kiwibank chief economist Jarrod Kerr to discuss the previous year, increasing interest rates and what it all means for 2023. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dec 15, 2022 • 46min
Mind the pay gap
Why is it that women still earn less than men across many industries in New Zealand? Economist Isabelle Sim is using groundbreaking research to uncover why the stubbornly high pay gap really exists. She talks with Bernard about how other countries achieve pay equity, working mums, and why transparency is the best way forward. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dec 8, 2022 • 53min
Turning the nation's happiness into data
The Treasury has just published a government mandated report on the overall wellbeing of our country. Typically, a country's success would be measured by GDP, employment rates, and net debt, but this report aims to redefine how New Zealand measures growth. Tim Ng from the Treasury talks with Bernard about how this shifting of the goalposts might affect the future of political investment. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dec 1, 2022 • 39min
Pensioner poverty has changed the retirement debate
We hear a lot about young people struggling with housing affordability, but much less is spoken of how the housing crisis will impact pensioners. A new report shows we're at serious risk of doubling the number of retirees facing rent and mortgage stress by 2048. While the debate around who should get NZ Superannuation and how much they should get has been mostly frozen in time since the late 1990s, the current landscape means the debate has now changed.Retirement Commissioner Jane Wrightson joins Bernard Hickey to discuss how we can keep elderly renters and those still with mortgages out of poverty, what this could mean for NZ Superannuation eligibility and what will happen if nothing changes. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Nov 24, 2022 • 35min
How to share your capital gains
While billionaires build their bunkers in Queenstown, Julie Scott, CEO of the Community Housing Trust is building affordable homes with profits made by new suburb developers. She tells Bernard all about how inclusionary rezoning can be used to make the rapidly expanding region affordable for locals again Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Nov 17, 2022 • 37min
How do we solve our emissions issue?
Methane and nitrous oxide produced by cows and sheep remain the biggest barrier to Aotearoa meeting its emissions reduction goal. Science writer Melanie Newfield talks with Bernard to break down The Government's recent policy announcement and discuss why gassy livestock is so crucial to the country's climate solution. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices