The Allender Center Podcast

Have you ever felt unseen in a place where you were supposed to be known? Or like the more you tried to bring your true self forward, the more you were asked to hide it? Today on the podcast, author Aimee Byrd joins Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen to talk about her new book, Saving Face: Finding My Self, God, and One Another Outside a Defaced Church.  It’s a deeply personal and theological reflection on spiritual abuse, identity, and healing—especially in the wake of church systems that no longer reflect the face of Christ. Together, they explore what it means to reclaim your face—your personhood, your story, your sacred calling. Aimee draws on the rich insight of philosopher Emmanuel Levinas, who wrote that the face is not merely a physical feature, but the place where we encounter both God and one another. To truly see another’s face is to take responsibility for their dignity and to recognize Christ’s presence there. Aimee shares her story of how a system that promised reform instead left her mocked, erased, and dehumanized. In that disillusionment, she came to a painful but powerful realization: we don’t just need reform. We need resurrection. A death to false forms of power, toxic moralism, and spiritual posturing—and a return to humility, presence, and love. This conversation offers an honest look at the loneliness of holding onto your God-given identity when others turn away, the courage it takes to seek the face of God in others, and the deep hope that emerges when we begin to see—and be seen—face to face. Listen to this week’s episode about “Saving Face” with Aimee Byrd, and be sure to pick up a copy of her book at: https://aimeebyrd.com/saving-face/

What if your first addiction wasn’t to a substance, but to someone’s approval? In part two of our conversation with Ian Morgan Cron, we go deeper into the cycle of addiction, codependency, and the hope of recovery. Whether you're struggling with a relationship, a habit, a performance-driven mindset, or just the weight of trying to “be good,” this episode offers a profound invitation: transformation doesn't come from trying harder—it comes from surrender. You'll hear stories about the power of the 12 Steps, why spiritual awakening matters more than willpower, and how our early longings for love and safety often become tangled in the behaviors we’re desperate to change. We talk about ministry, leadership, trauma, boundaries, and what it really means to carry your healing into the lives of others. This isn’t a conversation about fixing people—it’s about engaging your own story so you can show up with greater freedom, compassion, and clarity. Take a breath, take a listen. We hope you’ll hear something that helps you come home to yourself. You can order Ian’s new book here: https://ianmorgancron.com/thefix  Please Note: This episode contains some mature language; listener discretion is advised.  

Underneath every addiction is a deeper ache—and a surprising path to healing. Bestselling author, therapist, and Episcopal priest Ian Morgan Cron joins Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen to share insights from his newest book, The Fix: How the Twelve Steps Offer a Surprising Path of Transformation for the Well-Adjusted, the Down-and-Out, and Everyone In Between. Ian invites us to reconsider the Twelve Steps—not just as a recovery tool for addicts, but as a grace-filled path of spiritual awakening for anyone longing for freedom, connection, and intimacy with God. This conversation is for everyone—not just those who identify as alcoholics or addicts. As Ian says, these steps offer healing to people who struggle with all kinds of attachments and compulsions: workaholism, people-pleasing, tech and porn addiction, codependency, control, food, spending, approval, sports betting… the list goes on. Ian points out that most of us are poly-addicted, caught in multiple patterns that disconnect us from God, ourselves, and each other. So this isn’t about comparing struggles or measuring severity. It’s about asking: Do I want to be free? Do I want to live with more honesty, grace, and surrender?  Whether or not you think you “need” the Steps, this conversation is a compassionate, humorous, and deeply spiritual invitation to let go of self-reliance and move toward the healing you were made for. Listen to Part 1 now, and be sure to come back next week for Part 2. In the meantime, you can order Ian’s new book here: https://ianmorgancron.com/thefix  Please Note: This episode contains some mature language; listener discretion is advised.  

What happens when a woman names harm in her church community—and instead of support, she’s met with silence, suspicion, or even exile?  Too often, the church’s response to abuse and inequity reveals a painful truth: that protecting systems has taken precedence over protecting people. In this powerful and layered conversation, Dr. Andrew J. Bauman joins Dr. Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen to confront the realities explored in Andrew’s new book Safe Church: How to Guard Against Sexism and Abuse in Christian Communities.  Together, they discuss: The cost many women pay for speaking up: isolation, lost community, and spiritual disillusionment How even “progressive” churches can harbor subtle patterns of power and control The stark data that exposes ongoing gender inequity in ministry The personal stories that bring this reality to life—and why representation matters What a truly safe and equitable church could look like This is not just a conversation about what’s broken—it’s a call to build something better. A church where truth is welcomed, not silenced. Where policies protect the vulnerable. Where power is shared, not hoarded. And where the sacred image of God in women is honored, nurtured, and empowered. Whether you’re a survivor, a leader, or someone wrestling with disillusionment, this episode offers a brave and hopeful vision of what the church can become—if we have the courage to tell the truth and move toward change. Related Resources: Order your copy of Dr. Andrew J. Bauman’s SAFE CHURCH: How to Guard Against Sexism & Abuse in Christian Communities. Listen to the Allender Center Podcast episode: “Connections Between Spiritual and Sexual Abuse” Continue to learn with these self-paced online courses from the Allender Center: Spiritual Abuse & Healing Online Course and the Healing the Wounded Heart Online Course

Dr. David C. Wang is a psychologist and pastor, leading the emotionally healthy leaders program at Fuller Theological Seminary. Joining him is Dr. Danielle Zurinsky, a research manager at the Allender Center with expertise in health psychology. They dive into a groundbreaking research project on Narrative Focused Trauma Care, exploring why storytelling can be so transformative. Their conversation reveals the blending of faith and psychology, the importance of personal narratives in trauma recovery, and the vital role of community in healing.

In a compelling conversation, Adam Young, a counselor and author, shares his insights on how unexpected plot twists in our stories can lead to profound healing and transformation. He discusses the importance of revisiting painful past experiences with kindness instead of shame, emphasizing that vulnerability fosters connection and redemption. Adam also highlights the empowering role of storytelling in understanding trauma and encourages embracing our narratives to discover freedom and hope. Get ready to engage your past with courage and compassion!

Pastors today are navigating a complex, demanding, and often overwhelming landscape. Beyond the pulpit, they're expected to show up as counselors, administrators, fundraisers, teachers, building caretakers—and more. Some research even suggests pastors are carrying the weight of 13 different roles. It’s no wonder so many feel stretched thin, exhausted, and alone. Today, Rachael and Dan sit down with Dr. Rose Madrid Swetman, Associate Director of the Center for Transforming Engagement, to name the often-unseen burdens pastors and ministry leaders carry—and to explore what it means to create space for care, support, and more sustainable leadership. Whether you're a pastor, a ministry leader, or someone who walks alongside and loves one, this episode offers a deeply human invitation: to reflect on how we care for ourselves, our leaders, and our communities. You’ll find honest stories, thoughtful wisdom, and tangible practices for cultivating resilience—not by striving harder, but by rooting more deeply in connection: with God, with others, and with the truth that we were never meant to carry it all alone. Related Resources: Feeling overwhelmed or isolated in ministry? You’re not alone. The Center for Transforming Engagement offers tools, support, and community to help you rediscover joy, build resilience, and lead with lasting impact. Find program offerings and resources at transformingengagement.org and find out more about Resilience Circles at transformingengagement.org/circles.  Self-Facilitated Resilience Retreat Guides: Download this free series to focus on three key areas of resilience: People, Practices, and Purpose. These mini-retreats are flexible and self-paced, providing practical tools to navigate life's challenges and strengthen your resilience. Get your free guides at transformingengagement.org/self-facilitated-resilience-retreat-guides. Rose cites the work of Steven Sandage, a Boston University School of Theology professor of psychology of religion and theology, who has found rates of post-traumatic stress disorder symptoms in clergy at levels higher than those in post-deployment military personnel. You can read about that work here: https://www.bu.edu/articles/2022/why-are-so-many-religious-leaders-facing-stress-and-burnout/.  Rose also recommends looking into the work of Abraham Kuypter on public theology. Find more here: https://lexhampress.com/Kuyper

Good Friday is often described as paradoxical—a day of deep sorrow somehow called “good.” In this moving episode of the Allender Center Podcast, Dr. Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen invite us into that paradox, not just as observers of the crucifixion story, but as participants—people whose own stories of betrayal, abandonment, and suffering echo the narrative of Jesus’ final hours. Together, they explore what it means to enter into Good Friday by entering into our own “Fridays”—those dark and disorienting moments of our lives when we've not only been betrayed, but also betrayed others. The conversation invites us to reflect on the intersection between personal pain and collective suffering, and to consider how our experiences of humiliation, violence, and even despair connect us to the story of the cross. But this episode is not one of despair alone. It’s an invitation to sit honestly in the tension of a day when evil seems to win, and yet—somehow—we dare to believe redemption is being forged in the depths of that agony. As Rachael says, it’s a time when we’re forced to confront the death of a dream, the silence between what is and what is promised. And yet, even in the sorrow, there is a movement toward hope. This topic is not easy—but it is so important to engage. We hope today’s conversation offers space to weep, to name, and to consider how our own stories might be met and transformed by the suffering and love of Christ.  

Few relationships shape us like those with our siblings.  Whether you have siblings, share a sibling-like bond with a cousin or family friend, or are a parent navigating sibling dynamics, these relationships often play a significant role in defining our identity. Since so many of our listeners have asked us to explore this topic, today on the Allender Center Podcast, Dan and Rachael are diving deep into the messy, beautiful, and sometimes heartbreaking world of sibling dynamics. In today’s episode, we explore how these dynamics often lead to rivalries, alliances, and, at times, painful wounds that can last well into adulthood.  These sibling roles aren’t just part of our personal stories—they are deeply rooted in ancient patterns. We see these themes echoed in biblical texts, where stories of favor, envy, and scarcity unfold through generations. From Cain and Abel to Joseph and his brothers, the struggles we face with our siblings have a long, storied history. Tune in to gain fresh perspectives on navigating your sibling relationships, create space for growth, and learn how to honor the complex and beautiful stories each of you is living out.  

Sam Jolman revisits the profound themes of his book, exploring how the biblical story of Amnon and Tamar illuminates issues of lust, power, and the generational impacts of trauma. He challenges men to engage with their pasts honestly, advocating for healing through humility and storytelling. The conversation delves into emotional turmoil and the transformative power of literature, urging a deeper understanding of masculinity. Ultimately, it's a call to embrace a sexuality that honors and protects rather than harms.