The Experience Edge

In this episode of The Experience Edge, Jochem van der Veer speaks with Bruno Monteiro, VP and Head of Digital Experience at HealthEquity, about what it truly takes to transform large organizations around customer journeys. From implementing journey management at JP Morgan Chase as a "Trojan horse" strategy to now leading an experience-centered transformation in healthcare, Bruno offers sharp, practical insights into how CX leaders can move from theory to enterprise-wide practice.Bruno unpacks the challenges of scaling journey ownership, balancing business metrics with customer intent, and creating visibility through journey architectures. He dives into the need for shared accountability, behavior change, and empathy-building through real customer insights, beyond the limitations of synthetic data and dashboards. For anyone driving or scaling journey-based transformation, this episode is a masterclass.Guest BioBruno Monteiro is the Vice President and Head of Digital Experience at HealthEquity, where he leads digital transformation across web and mobile platforms to help millions of Americans manage their health and wealth. Previously, he was Executive Director and Head of Service Design at JP Morgan Chase, where he pioneered journey-based transformation using the "Experience Object Strategy." He is the creator of UNDesign, a mindset and methodology to dismantle legacy systems and drive systemic change. Bruno also teaches at SVA’s MFA in Design for Social Innovation and is a contributor to the Service Design Network.TakeawaysJourney Management Requires Real Accountability: Journey owners must have end-to-end decision-making power, not just titles.Balance Customer and Business Outcomes: True impact comes from aligning customer needs with measurable business value.Taxonomy is Foundational: Organizations need a shared language around journeys, jobs to be done, and experiences.Start Small, Then Scale: Begin with high-friction, high-volume journeys to prove value and gain traction.Design for Alignment, Not Just Execution: Orchestrating roadmaps across multiple teams and OKRs is key.NPS Isn’t Enough: It's useful for stakeholder buy-in, but real transformation needs layered metrics and operational data.Blueprinting Should Include System Decisions: “Service archaeology” reveals legacy constraints that block innovation.Don’t Just Show the Journey, Make It the Source of Truth: Create accessible, dynamic journey architecture systems.AI Has Limits in Empathy and Intent: Human insight is still essential for identifying emotional and contextual signals.Product Owners Must Evolve: The journey owner role is the next step in aligning teams around end-to-end outcomes.UNDesign Is About Dismantling to Rebuild: Bruno’s methodology encourages questioning, unlearning, and system transformation.Chapters00:00 Intro and the Trojan Horse at Chase 03:07 What it means to lead with journeys 07:33 Jobs to be Done vs. Journeys vs. Experiences 10:28 Journey architecture and taxonomy 14:10 Journey ownership and org structure at Chase 18:18 Accountability and the role of journey owners 21:34 Balancing business and customer outcomes 25:50 Coordinating the journey architecture 28:58 The evolution from product to journey management 34:33 Designing metrics that resonate with the business 39:37 Starting small and building behavior change 42:28 Selecting the first journeys to transform 43:41 Why NPS isn’t enough 46:00 Using layered metrics to reveal friction 50:04 Upskilling product owners for better discovery 51:40 Structuring research around journeys 55:27 AI’s limitations in customer empathy 58:16 Synthetic users and bias in design 01:02:29 AI can support, but not replace, deep research 01:05:27 Building empathy through real customer contact 01:08:16 Final advice and the vision of UNDesign 01:10:17 Where to find Bruno and follow his workLinkedInFollow Bruno MonteiroFollow Jochem van der Veer

Governance Models Every CX Leader Should KnowOne global staffing firm discovered they were solving the same customer problem six different ways across regions. No alignment, duplicated work, eroded trust - not a tooling issue, but a governance issue.In this episode, Jochem van der Veer (CEO of TheyDo) shares what he’s learned about how to structure journey management from working with 50-60 Fortune 500 companies.He breaks down four real-world journey governance models - from Central Command to Full Autonomy - and explains the pros, cons, and trade-offs of each. You’ll hear how organizations move from chaos to coordination, and why your journey operating model is your real CX “operating system.”You’ll learn how to scale journey management without bottlenecks, and why your governance model is the hidden lever behind customer-centric growth.Key InsightsWhy CX transformation often stalls due to operating model failure, not toolsThe four governance models for journey management: Orchestrated, Hub & Spoke, Federated Excellence, and Full AutonomyHow to decide who owns journeys, who governs frameworks, and who decides standardsHow distributed ownership can speed up delivery 50–60% while still keeping alignmentWhy your journey framework should work like a shared data warehouse - one truth, many tailored viewsSubscribe to The Experience Edge for more on journey management, CX strategy, and the future of customer-centric organizations. Like, comment, and share this episode with your team if you’re wrestling with silos or fragmented journeys.#CustomerExperience #JourneyManagement #CXLeadership #DigitalTransformation #BreakingSilos #CustomerCentricity #ExperienceEdge

If you can’t map customer experience to a business metric your CFO already obsesses over, you’re playing the wrong game.”That’s how Bill Staikos - former Global Head of Experience at BNY Mellon and CX leader at American Express, JP Morgan, and Freddie Mac - describes the future of customer experience.In this episode, Jochem van der Veer (TheyDo) reflects on his recent podcast episode with Bill, unpacks what it really means to tie customer outcomes to business results, and why most CX teams are still speaking the wrong language.What You’ll LearnHow to connect CX metrics to growth, risk, and operating leverage, the language of the C‑suiteWhy delight and NPS aren’t enough to earn credibilityA 3‑step shift to translate customer outcomes into business impactHow to earn a seat at the table by proving measurable ROI from experience workWatch next: Bill’s full conversation on The Experience Edge podcast (link below).https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9107GkJD4gSubscribe for more on journey management, CX strategy, and operationalizing customer‑centricity at scale.Like, comment, and share with your team if you’re ready to move from dashboards to boardrooms.#CustomerExperience #CXLeadership #CustomerCentricity #BusinessImpact #JourneyManagement #ExperienceEdge #BNYMellon #CFO #CXStrategy

In this episode of The Experience Edge, Jochem Van Der Veer speaks with Eric Roux, Customer Experience Director at Cisco and co‑founder of the Boston Blockchain Association, about a compelling but underexplored idea: embedding customer experience (CX) into the go‑to‑market engine by forging a tight partnership with sales. They dive into how this alignment enables brands to deliver on promises, orchestrate outcomes, and avoid the “tossing over the fence” trap that many CX organizations fall into.They also cover how CX leaders should build teams that are empowered and adaptive (not just follow the textbook), the nuanced role of metrics and trust, and how AI is starting to play a supporting, but not dominant, role in high‑touch enterprise relationships. Eric shares practical examples of how he’s applied these ideas in enterprise contexts and offers advice for scaling intimacy in consumer or low‑touch environments.Guest BioEric Roux is Customer Experience Director at Cisco, where he leads efforts to tightly integrate CX with sales, ensuring that customer promises made in the pursuit phase are honored through delivery and ongoing value creation. He is also a co‑founder of the Boston Blockchain Association, supporting innovation and connecting emerging tech leaders with funding and mentorship. With a background in consulting and professional services at top firms, Eric brings both strategic depth and hands‑on discipline to the CX space.What you will learnCX and sales must “show up together” and speak with one unified voice to align around customer outcomes.It’s not enough for sales to hand off a customer, real partnership means knowing when CX leads and when sales leads, and stepping in accordingly.The human dimension (listening, relationships, trust) remains central in delivering CX, even more so than methodology and tools.Formalizing CX as a discipline sometimes leads teams to overemphasize frameworks and lose sight of customer reality.High performers in CX don’t need the textbook; they instinctively adapt, experiment, and course‑correct.A strong CX team is built by enabling autonomy, allowing for mistakes, and prioritizing growth and chemistry over rigid structure.In high-touch enterprise environments, CX serves as the orchestrator: in the room with the customer, tying threads together, facilitating alignment.In low-touch or high-volume contexts, CX must lean heavily on measurements, signals, and relationships with stakeholder proxies.AI is a powerful assistant: e.g. refining meeting preparation, automating analysis, but it doesn’t replace judgment, empathy, or orchestration.Metrics can be overdone: choose the ones that matter, set boundaries, and be willing to evolve them over time.Chapters 00:00 Intro & framing: CX + Sales partnership 02:19 Why speak with one voice 04:19 Why many organizations struggle 06:04 Building the partnership: who initiates 08:00 What we lose in formalizing CX 09:17 Team composition & hiring 10:36 Orchestration across CX & Sales 13:13 Example: bringing people into the room 15:19 CX as the central orchestrator 17:42 Low‑touch / high-volume CX challenges 20:19 Distinctions between high-touch & transactional 22:31 Should CX be a department? 24:26 Role of AI in high-touch CX 27:55 Scaling productivity & journey to value 30:30 The expectation shift in delivery 32:16 Trust, consultant role & relationships 33:10 Obsession with metrics 35:20 Working backward from outcomes 36:46 Accountability and cross-domain problems 38:16 Incentivizing CX roles 40:43 Close to the customer in startups 42:59 How to keep intimacy while scaling 45:18 Traits of CX “rock stars” 47:13 Entry-level roles, AI & the future 50:00 Analytics vs. human insight 52:07 Incentives, role design & alignment 52:35 Closing / how to reach Eric LinkedIn & Other LinksFollow Jochem Van Der Veer (TheyDo) Follow Eric Roux Eric's Website Boston Blockchain Association

Watch the Full Video HEREOne global staffing firm discovered they were solving the same customer problem six different ways across regions. No alignment, duplicated work, eroded trust - not a tooling issue, but a governance issue.In this episode, Jochem van der Veer (CEO of TheyDo) shares what he’s learned about how to structure journey management from working with 50-60 Fortune 500 companies.He breaks down four real-world journey governance models - from Central Command to Full Autonomy - and explains the pros, cons, and trade-offs of each. You’ll hear how organizations move from chaos to coordination, and why your journey operating model is your real CX “operating system.”You’ll learn how to scale journey management without bottlenecks, and why your governance model is the hidden lever behind customer-centric growth.Key InsightsWhy CX transformation often stalls due to operating model failure, not toolsThe four governance models for journey management: Orchestrated, Hub & Spoke, Federated Excellence, and Full AutonomyHow to decide who owns journeys, who governs frameworks, and who decides standardsHow distributed ownership can speed up delivery 50–60% while still keeping alignmentWhy your journey framework should work like a shared data warehouse - one truth, many tailored viewsSubscribe to The Experience Edge for more on journey management, CX strategy, and the future of customer-centric organizations.Like, comment, and share this episode with your team if you’re wrestling with silos or fragmented journeys.

In this episode of The Experience Edge, Jochem van der Veer sits down with CX thought leader Stacy Sherman to unpack what it really means to “do CX right.” Stacy draws on her 25+ years of leadership at brands like Verizon, AT&T, Schindler, and more, and shares hard-won lessons in aligning culture, accountability, and cross‑functional execution. Their conversation weaves from the pitfalls of siloed thinking and unmet promise gaps to the art of embedding delight and meaningfully leveraging AI and data in the service of experience.Listeners will come away with a richer understanding of why “customer experience is an inside job,” how to design journeys that bridge internal organization and external expectations, and how to pilot and scale CX initiatives that truly matter to both customers and the business.Guest BioStacy Sherman is an award‑winning CX strategist, author, speaker, and educator with more than 25 years of leadership in brands such as Verizon, AT&T, Schindler, LiveOps, BPO, and Wilton Brands. She holds an MBA and is the voice behind the Doing CXRite podcast. Stacy helps organizations move beyond superficial CX initiatives toward deeply aligned, cross‑functional execution that drives retention, brand advocacy, and meaningful experiences.Takeaways CX is everyone’s responsibility, no matter the function, every role influences the customer experience.Siloed organizations kill consistency, conflicting metrics, goals, and disconnected systems lead to broken promises.“Inside job” mindset, true customer experience begins internally (culture, training, alignment), not just on the front line.Discretionary effort matters, small acts (like helping a customer move goods in the rain) create emotional highs and lasting memory.Blend human + tech, don’t replace one with the other, AI and automation should empower employees, not bypass them.Data is only useful if actionable, voice of customer + voice of employee feedback must translate into prioritized action.Pilot first, scale second, start small, prove value, then expand.Alignment & measurement across teams, linking CX metrics to business goals ensures cross‑functional buy‑in.Close the loop, daily, feedback must flow to the right teams and customers need to see that something happens.Design journeys holistically, consider internal and external touchpoints, handovers, and “pass-over zones” between teams.Leadership orchestration is essential, one “conductor” or team is needed to keep cross-functional alignment moving.Respect content, context & timing, don’t over‑delight everywhere; choose where delight is meaningful and sustainable.Chapters00:00 Intro banter, setting the stage 01:59 Guest formal introduction 03:21 Why CX is often practiced poorly 05:32 Silo issues & misalignment 10:13 “CX is an inside job” 12:46 Discretionary acts that delight 16:25 Bridging online and offline friction 18:18 Designing vs validating experiences 21:03 Moments of emotional delight 24:00 Embedding CX metrics across teams 26:58 Pilot programs & scaling 28:48 Beyond journey mapping 32:11 Orchestration & central leadership 38:42 AI’s role in experience 44:15 Removing silos & consistency 47:42 Where to inject journey thinking 50:09 Scaling feedback loops 53:46 Leadership & execution 55:38 Closing and how to reach Stacy LinkedIn / LinksFollow Jochem van der Veer Follow Stacy ShermanStacy’s website: https://doingcxright.com/Stacy’s podcast: Doing CXRite

In this episode of The Experience Edge, Jochem van der Veer sits down with Blake Morgan, customer experience (CX) futurist and author, to explore what’s stayed true in CX over the past decade, where business leaders often fall short, and how to build a customer-centric culture in a modern, AI-driven world. Blake highlights that while tools and channels have evolved (especially AI), fundamental human needs, being seen, heard, and having problems solved, remain the same. She emphasizes the importance of trust, long-term thinking, and tying CX efforts directly to business outcomes like revenue and customer retention. Throughout, she offers practical guidance on how organizations, especially in the “messy middle” of their structure, can embed CX mindsets, empower frontline and middle managers, link performance metrics to customer value, and begin with low-friction, high-impact actions.Guest BioBlake Morgan is a leading voice in customer experience, known for her role as a CX futurist, author, and speaker. She is the author of The 8 Laws of Customer‑Focused Leadership: New Rules for Building a Business Around Today’s Customer, a framework rooted in research and interviews with top business leaders for making CX central to strategy. Blake is also the founder of the Modern Customer Podcast, an instructor on LinkedIn Learning, and frequently contributes to outlets like Forbes and Harvard Business Review. She helps organizations build trust, elevate customer‑centric culture, and align CX practices with revenue growth.TakeawaysHere are 10–12 key insights from the episode:Humanity still matters. Despite advances in technology and AI, customers still crave human interaction, being greeted, being seen, empathy. Blake MorganTrust is a bank. Every customer interaction is a deposit or withdrawal from trust. Hidden fees, lack of transparency, or making it hard to reach a human cost trust heavily.Short‑term gains vs long‑term relationships. Boards often emphasize short‑term metrics, but Blake argues for balancing immediate profit with sustained customer loyalty and relationship building.Metrics beyond satisfaction. While customer satisfaction, Net Promoter Score, etc., are important, understanding revenue behavior (repeat purchases, referrals, churn etc.) gives stronger causal insight into CX impact.Start small, fix what's broken. Even in large enterprises, you can begin with friction points that frontline employees and customers call out and deliver improvements that matter.Middle managers are pivotal. They often get overlooked but are essential to bridging strategy and execution, coaching teams, and embedding the CX mindset across departments.Think of CX as everyone’s responsibility. It shouldn't live in a silo (a department) but be woven into every function, product, marketing, support, HR, operations.Employee experience mirrors CX. Engaged, empowered employees who understand purpose and feel supported deliver much stronger customer experience.AI as an enabler, not a replacement. Brands like Sephora are using AI to gather richer feedback and personalize content, but only when used thoughtfully, not to replace human connection.Law of the mindset is foundational. From Blake’s “8 Laws” framework, creating a customer experience mindset is the starting point, especially in an environment of rapid change. Blake MorganChapters 00:00 Introduction & What’s Still True in CX02:30 Underestimated Shifts & Trust in CX07:40 Boardroom Perspective & Balancing Short‑ vs Long‑Term11:50 Culture, Performance Metrics & CX Mindset17:20 Employee Experience & Manager Role37:40 AI’s Role: Enhancing or Undermining Emotional Intelligence41:12 Starting Small & Building Momentum44:16 The “Law” to Focus on Now & Closing ThoughtsLinkedInFollow Blake Morgan on LinkedInFollow Jochem van der Veer on LinkedIn

In this episode of The Experience Edge, Jochem Van Der Veer sits down with Santos Subramanyam, Director of Enterprise Products, CX & UX at Macy’s, to explore how customer experience has evolved over time, and what timeless truths still matter. Drawing from Santos’s extensive background in retail, hospitality, automotive, SaaS, and more, they dig into the role of measurement beyond NPS/MPS, the importance of aligning teams around customer journeys, and how AI and data are enabling more real‐time, human‐centred decisions. The conversation is rich with examples, from redesigning checkout flows in store, to localized customer experience, to prototyping with empathy, that illustrate how to build experiences that scale and deliver business outcomes.They also examine what it takes to shift organization culture: elevating customer journey thinking from execution teams all the way up to the C‑suite; storytelling and alignment; and the real work of bringing teams, data, and leadership together. Santos shares both his successes and the friction points, especially around aligning priorities, defining what metrics truly matter, and using small wins and service design to drive momentum.Guest BioSantos Subramanyam is Director of Enterprise Products, CX & UX at Macy’s. He leads large, cross‑functional teams to build scalable design systems, align business and customer outcomes, and use data and AI to optimize customer and colleague experiences. Santos has a diverse industry background, including retail, SaaS, hospitality (notably Marriott), and automotive, and has driven major transformations: boosting metrics like MPS/MPS across tens of thousands of associates, cutting transaction times in stores, modernizing legacy systems with holistic designs, and partnering with business, product, engineering, and data teams for measurable impact. He’s also an advocate for culture, localization, and embedding journey thinking across organizations.TakeawaysPast truths remain valuable , Experiences in physical retail and in‑person interactions still matter; digital cannot fully replace physical touchpoints.Modernizing systems is more than UI , It involves hardware, ergonomics, flow, colleague tools, and the mental model of how people (both customers and employees) interact.Metrics beyond MPS/NPS , Focusing on speed, ease, transparency, transaction times etc., rather than relying solely on MPS as a steering lever.Use service blueprints and Kaizen for discovering inefficiencies (even small ones) in physical + digital touchpoints; small changes can scale into large operational improvements.Storytelling & visualization matter , Enacting journey pain points (via role‑play) or using narrative visuals makes executive alignment easier.Cultural alignment is hard but essential , Organizational culture, leadership mindset, individual KPIs can misalign; aligning around customer journey thinking is an ongoing effort.Influence through small wins , Prove with smaller initiatives to build trust and momentum before big change.Engage stakeholders where they are , Whether legal, product, tech, or operations, find ways to include them in the journey, storytelling, and showing shared value.Chapters 00:00 Intro & Name Pronunciation  03:11 Santos’s Background & What Still Holds True in CX  06:30 The 80‑20 Rule & Localisation in Global CX  12:30 Moving Beyond NPS/MPS: Business Metrics & Speed of Transaction  18:30 Journey Mapping, Service Blueprints & Physical + Digital Integration  23:00 Prioritization, Autonomy & Small Wins  27:40 Organizing Teams Around Outcomes vs Functions  30:50 Storytelling Up the Org & C‑Suite Engagement  38:20 AI Use Cases: Call Center, Conversational Agents, Merchant Tools  50:30 Using Reports, Data, Feedback Loops to Drive Action  57:00 Magic Wand Question: What Would You Change Most?  59:00 What’s Next for Journey Alignment & Final ThoughtsLinkedIn ProfilesGuest: Santos SubramanyamHost: Jochem van der Veer

In this captivating discussion, Bill Staikos, a globally recognized CX leader with over 20 years in financial services and tech, shares insights on the evolution of customer experience. He emphasizes the importance of aligning CX with business strategy and leveraging AI for better orchestration. Bill elaborates on overcoming silos and creating actionable insights to drive real value. He also previews his upcoming podcast, The Multimodal Experience, exploring how emerging technologies will reshape our interactions with brands.

In this special edition of The Experience Edge, we bring together six of our most impactful guests in one powerful narrative, tracing the journey of CX transformation from leadership mindset to system change—and ultimately to measurable business impact.What you’ll learn in this episode:Why vulnerable leadership and cross-functional trust are foundational to CXHow to break down organizational silos to deliver seamless experiencesThe role of content, storytelling, and digital strategy in engaging customersWhy measurement, experimentation, and feedback loops are critical for impactHow AI enables real-time synthesis - and where human empathy still mattersWho should truly own the customer journey (spoiler: it’s not just one team)Featuring standout insights from top CX leaders who’ve led transformations inside complex enterprises, from healthcare to transportation, financial services to tech.Whether you're a CX strategist, product leader, or experience designer, this episode is your fast track to understanding what it really takes to evolve customer experience in 2025 and beyond.Follow Jochem van der Veer on LinkedIn:Explore Journey Management with TheyDo