Real Relationships Real Revenue - Video Edition | Invest in Relationships to Build Your Business and Your Career

Mo asks Angela Meyer: What is your favorite science, step, or story that you learned from GrowBIG Training or The Snowball System? Angela’s favorite strategy is the Give to Get. Giving somebody value or knowledge they didn’t have before is a great way to start off a relationship. If you continue to show interest in someone personally, and not just professionally, and provide them value that can help them grow their career, they are going to care about you. You have to break someone out of the rut of working with someone else if it’s not you. Building trust and deepening the relationship in the beginning is crucial to starting things out. Angela has seen a number of her former colleagues help clients and prospects by summarizing the science on particular issues like climate change, sustainability, and environmental compliance. There is a big difference between forwarding an article to a client and talking the person through the content. The hardest thing is asking for the business, which is why you should simply ask for the next step. No is just another answer. You have to be able to explain more and give more so that eventually the answer is going to be yes. You can’t assume your client is going to read and consume the content you send them. You have to ask them for the opportunity to explain how it’s helpful and why you sent it to them.     Mentioned in this Episode: GrowBIGPlaybook.com MeyerVorst.com Angela Meyer, PhD, PE on LinkedIn

Mo asks Angela Meyer: What is your personal definition of business development? Angela doesn’t use the term business development. In her previous position she was the Vice President of Client Services. She wanted to avoid the term business development because she’s in the relationship business and not selling to people. Unless you’re selling a commodity, no matter how smart you are, without building a relationship and providing value for a client and gaining their trust, you’ll never get the business. Angela got her first job at the age of 13 working at an amusement park. She believes that everyone should work in service when they are younger because it teaches you essential relationship skills. You need a complete skill set and not just technical chops. If you want to improve you have to continue to expand past your current role. Angela loves the business development process because it’s an opportunity to grow herself, the brand reputation of the firm she’s working with, and her knowledge of how she can help clients. It’s okay to not like it or to be afraid because it comes with the territory. If you grow your relationships one client at a time, those people will help you grow your career. Your raving fans will open doors for you to walk through. The way that Angela likes to learn about new areas she needs to be able to sell is setting up a Google alert for it. When Angela has a client that would be interested in a topic she’s reading about, she’ll forward the article to them. As she’s gotten older, Angela makes use of a CRM to remind her of information and things she needs to do. Combining those two methods together works very well. When you’re a highly skilled technician, it can be challenging to see things outside your focus. Don’t feel like you have to do everything alone. You can pair up with other people in your organization and share skills and ideas.     Mentioned in this Episode: GrowBIGPlaybook.com MeyerVorst.com Angela Meyer, PhD, PE on LinkedIn

Mo asks Angela Meyer: When was the time that you realized that business development was worth focusing on? Angela’s background is in mechanical engineering and it was during her graduate education while working with her professor where she learned the communication skills to be a great consultant. After beginning her career, Angela got a lot of hands-on experience in the business side of things while working with the CEO of a forensic engineering company. That’s where she learned that in order to be a great consultant, she couldn’t just be running calculations, she had to become good at developing relationships. Angela always thought that she was a good speaker and communicator, but after giving a presentation on a case study that she had worked on and not being able to answer the questions from the audience, she knew she had some room to improve. After seeing a recording of herself during a presentation, Angela knew that if she was going to be good at business development, she was going to have to improve her communication skills. Soft skills turn into hard results. Angela improves incrementally by watching people do great work and trying to learn from them. The other aspect is putting it into practice. You have to try and fail. If you don’t try, you don’t learn. If you don’t ask, you don’t get. From Angela’s perspective, she has multiple failures, but she uses those failures to learn and get better. You can’t rely on your company to train you to become a better, more well-rounded consultant. The presentation training class that Angela attended was the best $150 she spent. If you’re not willing to put yourself out there and try to build a relationship, you might as well stay in the back office. Start with your network that you know or see everyday. Create a list of all the people you’ve worked with over the past six months and see when the last time you connected with them without talking about the project. It’s about getting the next small win and developing the relationship and building your network.     Mentioned in this Episode: GrowBIGPlaybook.com MeyerVorst.com Angela Meyer, PhD, PE on LinkedIn

Craig Budner talks about the key lessons he’s learned as the Global Strategic Growth Partner at K&L Gates. Find out about how Craig secured a multi-billion dollar company’s key litigation case way before the opportunity to pitch came up, the innovative way Craig generates leads that creates incredible value for the prospect at the same time, and why you shouldn’t be afraid to fail.   Mo asks Craig Budner: When did you realize that business development is good? Craig’s brother was a litigator and from an early age had his own firm. This taught Craig the necessity of creating a brand and cultivating referral sources in order to grow the firm. Craig took a slightly different path from his brother in that he joined one of the firms in Texas. It was there that he created the relationships and connections that made him realize the value of being an advisor to someone and not just on legal issues. After creating a relationship with one of the firm’s important executive clients, a partner encouraged Craig to run with what he was doing. During his associate days, Craig learned the value of doing a great job for clients and nurturing relationships. When he understood that clients were actual multiple sources of revenue, and that if he could cultivate relationships with people directly in his path of work delivery, he started to get the first call. He was being trusted by the people in charge of important projects, and that gave him the opportunity to do more fun kinds of work. How do you advise others to think about business development? Demystifying business development is the first step. The characteristics of good parents, friends, and listeners are the characteristics that make a good business developer. It’s not about the money at the end of the line, it’s about growth and learning, and getting better at putting yourself in the shoes of someone else. What do you think about mutually beneficial relationships? You have to be a better listener than a talker to develop deep relationships. If you’re always thinking about what you’re going to say, you’re not going to get enough information out of that relationship to make it mutually beneficial. Think about how you can be helpful to that person. You can leave a positive impression on that person by reflecting back that you have heard them and you’re going to try to advance their issue.   Mo asks Craig Budner: What is your personal “why” when it comes to growth? Craig’s father always had a history book in his lap and Craig was brought up in a culture of learning, so learning is at the core of why he does what he does. At a global law firm like K&L Gates, if you’re not sensitive to the fact that people grow up in different cultures and with different languages it’s not as much fun. The more perspective that Craig can have with what people are going through makes him better in his leadership role. How do you motivate yourself when things get tough? People are busy. Don’t assume a lack of response is about you. Craig burns off steam in a productive way most of the time, either by reading, meditating, or exercise. People, when they need you, are going to be responsive. What are your favorite ways to stay in touch? Craig is a fan of interacting over the phone. There are a number of social cues that you can miss via email. If it’s a warm relationship, a phone call to check in when there is some down time is ideal. The closer the relationship, the more likely a phone call will help you achieve that raving fan/trusted advisor status.   Mo asks Craig Budner: What is your favorite science, step, or story that you learned from GrowBIG Training or The Snowball System? Craig’s favorite module was on lead execution. That section of the program led to the idea of creating round table conversations instead of the usual webinars. The ability for clients to listen to their peers is incredibly valuable. It doesn’t matter what industry they are in, there are always parallel problems they are trying to solve. When Covid hit, they shifted the round table conversations online. The way that GrowBIG framed lead generation led to the idea of the Client Connect program that advances clients when they want to get more granular after a round table. It became a natural progression for a lead to move further down the line. Lead generation isn’t mysterious. It should be predictable and there should be a number of things you do every day or week to result in X number of conversations. What are your best tips to make those kinds of round table events successful? The big tip is to make the guest feel comfortable. Without that there are going to be a lot of introductions and not a lot of substance. Craig does a lot of homework on the participants so the conversation goes beyond the basics. It’s also confidential. Getting repeat participants helps new people by showing them they can learn more by jumping into the conversation. Craig also makes sure that the focus is on the clients who are driving the conversation. There are almost always issues that the participants haven't had time to address that you can provide value for and that makes them very receptive to a follow up. How do you make the offer to have a one-on-one conversation? Usually there is some indication on a topic a participant wants to talk more about. Craig usually follows up with an email within a day or two. One key element is asking participants how the roundtables could be better afterward.   Mo asks Craig Budner: What is a business development moment that you’re particularly proud of? Craig’s story involves one of the biggest matters of litigation that he’s handled. As a relatively young lawyer, Craig had to convince the client that they could trust Craig and his team with a multi-billion dollar company’s litigation against one of the top litigation companies in the world. It was about convincing him that Craig and the company worked the way he needed a firm to work along the way on other cases. The client had to evaluate the team’s behavior over time in prior cases. It’s often the things you do when it’s not showtime that matters. It’s how you treat the relationship with care, giving more than you’re taking, and how you reflect listening skills. The client saw that Craig’s team worked very well together as a cohesive team when the stakes were high. The bigger deals are won before the opportunity arises. Learning about the pressures the client was under and the goals of his position was key to developing the relationship that ultimately led to the opportunity to represent him. Treating everyone on the client’s team with respect and making sure that he saw other members of Craig’s team perform at a high level was key. Creating opportunities for interaction with the client’s team definitely added value. Craig’s team offered him a Hot 5, a weekly summary of the legal brushfires the client was facing, whether or not Craig’s team was handling them. Being in the trenches with the client and over delivering for them gave Craig the edge when the big litigation revealed itself.   Mo asks Craig Budner: If you could record a video about business development and growth and send it back to your younger self, what would it say? Craig would tell his younger self to not be afraid to fail. Have conversations with people that you may not be ready to start. Be willing to interface with people to learn their stories. It’s when you’re worried that you may not look good by asking people about their lives, that’s when you are missing an opportunity to grow and get better. Divorce yourself from the outcome. Business development is what occurs before the pitch. It’s better to be curious than it is to think of the things to say. When you’re curious you figure out how to further your journey. You control whether you make the ask, and whether you listen carefully and grow from what you hear. You don’t control whether someone is interested. Go to the conversation to grow.     Mentioned in this Episode: GrowBIGPlaybook.com craig.budner@klgates.com K&L Gates Client Conversations Podcast

Mo asks Craig Budner: If you could record a video about business development and growth and send it back to your younger self, what would it say? Craig would tell his younger self to not be afraid to fail. Have conversations with people that you may not be ready to start. Be willing to interface with people to learn their stories. It’s when you’re worried that you may not look good by asking people about their lives, that’s when you are missing an opportunity to grow and get better. Divorce yourself from the outcome. Business development is what occurs before the pitch. It’s better to be curious than it is to think of the things to say. When you’re curious you figure out how to further your journey. You control whether you make the ask, and whether you listen carefully and grow from what you hear. You don’t control whether someone is interested. Go to the conversation to grow.     Mentioned in this Episode: GrowBIGPlaybook.com craig.budner@klgates.com K&L Gates Client Conversations Podcast

Mo asks Craig Budner: What is a business development moment that you’re particularly proud of? Craig’s story involves one of the biggest matters of litigation that he’s handled. As a relatively young lawyer, Craig had to convince the client that they could trust Craig and his team with a multi-billion dollar company’s litigation against one of the top litigation companies in the world. It was about convincing him that Craig and the company worked the way he needed a firm to work along the way on other cases. The client had to evaluate the team’s behavior over time in prior cases. It’s often the things you do when it’s not showtime that matters. It’s how you treat the relationship with care, giving more than you’re taking, and how you reflect listening skills. The client saw that Craig’s team worked very well together as a cohesive team when the stakes were high. The bigger deals are won before the opportunity arises. Learning about the pressures the client was under and the goals of his position was key to developing the relationship that ultimately led to the opportunity to represent him. Treating everyone on the client’s team with respect and making sure that he saw other members of Craig’s team perform at a high level was key. Creating opportunities for interaction with the client’s team definitely added value. Craig’s team offered him a Hot 5, a weekly summary of the legal brushfires the client was facing, whether or not Craig’s team was handling them. Being in the trenches with the client and over delivering for them gave Craig the edge when the big litigation revealed itself.     Mentioned in this Episode: GrowBIGPlaybook.com craig.budner@klgates.com K&L Gates Client Conversations Podcast

Mo asks Craig Budner: What is your favorite science, step, or story that you learned from GrowBIG Training or The Snowball System? Craig’s favorite module was on lead execution. That section of the program led to the idea of creating round table conversations instead of the usual webinars. The ability for clients to listen to their peers is incredibly valuable. It doesn’t matter what industry they are in, there are always parallel problems they are trying to solve. When Covid hit, they shifted the round table conversations online. The way that GrowBIG framed lead generation led to the idea of the Client Connect program that advances clients when they want to get more granular after a round table. It became a natural progression for a lead to move further down the line. Lead generation isn’t mysterious. It should be predictable and there should be a number of things you do every day or week to result in X number of conversations. What are your best tips to make those kinds of round table events successful? The big tip is to make the guest feel comfortable. Without that there are going to be a lot of introductions and not a lot of substance. Craig does a lot of homework on the participants so the conversation goes beyond the basics. It’s also confidential. Getting repeat participants helps new people by showing them they can learn more by jumping into the conversation. Craig also makes sure that the focus is on the clients who are driving the conversation. There are almost always issues that the participants haven't had time to address that you can provide value for and that makes them very receptive to a follow up. How do you make the offer to have a one-on-one conversation? Usually there is some indication on a topic a participant wants to talk more about. Craig usually follows up with an email within a day or two. One key element is asking participants how the roundtables could be better afterward.     Mentioned in this Episode: GrowBIGPlaybook.com craig.budner@klgates.com K&L Gates Client Conversations Podcast

Mo asks Craig Budner: What is your personal “why” when it comes to growth? Craig’s father always had a history book in his lap and Craig was brought up in a culture of learning, so learning is at the core of why he does what he does. At a global law firm like K&L Gates, if you’re not sensitive to the fact that people grow up in different cultures and with different languages it’s not as much fun. The more perspective that Craig can have with what people are going through makes him better in his leadership role. How do you motivate yourself when things get tough? People are busy. Don’t assume a lack of response is about you. Craig burns off steam in a productive way most of the time, either by reading, meditating, or exercise. People, when they need you, are going to be responsive. What are your favorite ways to stay in touch? Craig is a fan of interacting over the phone. There are a number of social cues that you can miss via email. If it’s a warm relationship, a phone call to check in when there is some down time is ideal. The closer the relationship, the more likely a phone call will help you achieve that raving fan/trusted advisor status.     Mentioned in this Episode: GrowBIGPlaybook.com craig.budner@klgates.com K&L Gates Client Conversations Podcast

Mo asks Craig Budner: When did you realize that business development is good? Craig’s brother was a litigator and from an early age had his own firm. This taught Craig the necessity of creating a brand and cultivating referral sources in order to grow the firm. Craig took a slightly different path from his brother in that he joined one of the firms in Texas. It was there that he created the relationships and connections that made him realize the value of being an advisor to someone and not just on legal issues. After creating a relationship with one of the firm’s important executive clients, a partner encouraged Craig to run with what he was doing. During his associate days, Craig learned the value of doing a great job for clients and nurturing relationships. When he understood that clients were actual multiple sources of revenue, and that if he could cultivate relationships with people directly in his path of work delivery, he started to get the first call. He was being trusted by the people in charge of important projects, and that gave him the opportunity to do more fun kinds of work. How do you advise others to think about business development? Demystifying business development is the first step. The characteristics of good parents, friends, and listeners are the characteristics that make a good business developer. It’s not about the money at the end of the line, it’s about growth and learning, and getting better at putting yourself in the shoes of someone else. What do you think about mutually beneficial relationships? You have to be a better listener than a talker to develop deep relationships. If you’re always thinking about what you’re going to say, you’re not going to get enough information out of that relationship to make it mutually beneficial. Think about how you can be helpful to that person. You can leave a positive impression on that person by reflecting back that you have heard them and you’re going to try to advance their issue.     Mentioned in this Episode: GrowBIGPlaybook.com craig.budner@klgates.com K&L Gates Client Conversations Podcast

Hacking our own habits to accomplish more was a theme throughout season 2 and we are highlighting some thoughts from Dorie Clark, Todd Henry and Ron Tite in this recap episode.   Be sure to check out their full episodes: How to Hack Our Own Habits to Focus on Growth Activities, Even When We’re Busy, with Dorie Clark - video.realrelationshipsrealrevenue.com/s2e4 How to Hack Our Own Habits to Accomplish More, with Todd Henry - video.realrelationshipsrealrevenue.com/s2e118 How to Hack Our Own Habits to Accomplish More, with Ron Tite - video.realrelationshipsrealrevenue.com/s2e136